What is Ego?

[Guest guest]

First of all thanks to Ram Chandran for giving publicity to my

encounter with Dr. Radhakrishnan in 1961 when he was, if I recall right, the

Vice-President of India. Yes, what he said burned right into my memory. His

words were " A little bit of Science takes you away from Religion and a

little more of it will take you right back to it".

 

Turning to the subject (!) of ego: I have understood it the way

Gurudev Sw. Chinmayananda taught it using his "BMI" Chart- namely it is the

PFT. Gurudev used to say that ego is the "er" in the Perceiver, Feeler and

Thinker, and incidentally also in Performer. If "OM" is the real thing in

that chart, the PFT is the "truly" unreal. .

 

When I perceive something, the act, or experience, of perception

cannot be denied. But to proclaim on this basis "I am perceiving" introduces

an unwarranted, superfluous entity called "I" in the picture. This usage of

words is a mere convenience,or habit, of language which has perhaps persisted

ever since language was invented. This , I see (-pardon "me" for following

the habit; it is so convenient to use-) as the reason why "i" is dismissed as

a mere notion in vedanta and also has no basis in objective scientific.

 

As Sadananda points out, its use in phrases such as "I did ..." is

also superfluous.

 

I have noted for sometime with interest how, when we write abstract

for scientific articles, we avoid using active verbs such as "I found" or "I

will show". Instead we prefer using passive equivalents such as "It was

found" or "It will be shown". Perhaps, there is a feeling even in scientific

community that the latter way of describing alone can be strictly justified.

This is the way some mahatmas, such as Tapovan, also preferd to describe

their perceptions, feelings, thoughts and actions.

 

Of course in Vedanta we do not mince words and say clearly that this

"i" or ego is unreal, even by the standards of the relative unreality of BMI

and OET.

 

So, what does PFT stand for?

 

Purely Fictitious Entity!

 

Hari Om!

[Guest guest]

On Mon, 17 May 1999, Ram Chandran wrote:

> Ram Chandran <chandran

>

> During Sunday Satsang Discussions (Currently we are discussing Gita,

> Chapter 8) one of the members in our group asked - What is Ego? The

> question was further elaborated as follows: Vedanta says that Ego is the

> barrier for Self Realization. But in real life, don't we need the ego

> to conduct our personal, family, social and official obligations. How

> can we conduct our duties without any self-esteem? Does no ego mean not

> to develop self-esteem, not to have fame and wealth? What is the goal

> of life and what is the role of ego in daily life? How do we explain the

> discrepencies if any?

>

 

namaste.

 

Let me put my understanding here; this may have been influenced by the

TaittirIya upanishad which I am presently reflecting on.

 

Ego is the thinking that I am the doer and I am the enjoyer, the kartA

and the bhoktA. But, what is this I that thinks that it is the doer

and/or the enjoyer ? If we try to pin it down, it is not there; thus

it is just not real.

 

Let me bring the TaittirIya upanishad into this thought. Because of

mAyA, the Atman, the Consciousness is viewed as covered by the five

koshAs: the annamaya, prANamaya, manomaya, vijnAnamaya and Anandamaya.

The Consciousness identifies itself with any of these five koshAs and

the ego has its origin. Our level of understanding of ourselves depends

on with what koshA we (the Consciousness) are identifying ourselves with

(all identifications of course being unreal and a result of mAyA).

Ultimately, we negate all the koshAs and identify ourselves only with

the Consciousness, the Atman. That is the I.

 

It is interesting, as our knowledge of ourselves improves, or even in the

case we are the dullest so that our identification is only with the gross,

our terminology of usage of words is, for example: my office, my house,

my children, my body, my thought, my mind, my buddhi, my pleasure,

my sorrow and so on. This "my" refers to jeeva, the individualized

Consciousness. That means, even in the dullest case, we see up to the

individualized jeeva. This jeeva, the Consciousness associated with

the embodiment provide the base for the ego. Once we negate the jeeva,

the ego disappears and only Consciousness remains.

 

Shri Ram Chandran refers in the above quoted post "... But in real life,

^^^^^^^^^^

don't we need the ego to conduct our personal ...."

 

Isn't there only one life, which is real or unreal depending on what our

Consciousness is identifying with ? Although I will be crucified for

saying this, let me say it in any case: Is our life any more real than

the life of a TV character or of a character in a movie projected on a

screen ? King Janaka's lament (in AshhTAvakragItA ?) comes to mind:

He says: Should I worry of the MithilA burning now or of MithilA burning

in my dream of yesterday (or words to that effect).

 

I will touch on other topics of discussion, brought up by Shri Ram

Chandran, in a latter post.

>

> Hari Om!

>

> Ram Chandran

> List Moderator

>

 

Regards

Gummuluru Murthy

------

[Guest guest]

namaste

 

atmabhavana (self-feeling) is always experienced.

as the term implies, it is the vibrant essence

emanating the Atman. Therefore, everyone is

nothing but the Self itself.

 

The ahamkar (ego) is a false idea overlay on the

Atman, like the snake in the rope. therefore

it has no intrinsic reality. quite the contrary,

it is enemy number one to Self-realization.

 

as such, and as soon as this is recognized, it

should be eliminated ASAP, via the same way it

appeared: in and through the Mind.

 

this time through *de-programming* the Mind:

in the application of surrendering the ego

[bhaktiyog] or inquiry into the nature of ego

[jnanayog].

 

atmasakshat hangs in the balance.

 

(procrastination in this context may be regarded

as poison candy.)

 

 

OM namah Sivaya

[Guest guest]

Hello,

 

This is quite a discussion that you propose.

 

Rather than the ego being the barrier to self-realization perhaps it is our

perception of ego's impulses and our acting upon these impulses as well as

our reactions to other's egos that present the barrier. Patanjali's sutras

state 'yogas citta vrtti nirodhah' 'the restraint of the mind stuff is

yoga'. Learning to restrain the mind leads to learning to restrain the ego

and until one is fully realized the restraint is used to keep the 'cosmic

trickster' in its place.

 

 

1. At a certain point there is a definite difference spiritual life being

more concerned with higher goals and coming out in church, temple or yoga

class etc. The material life would be led with the concerns of money, work

and survival. Once spirituality is embraced and integrated there is no

difference. The spirit simply moves through the play of material existence.

 

2. To accept happiness is to accept unhappiness spirit exists outside of

this realm. Nor does spirit need success since spirit just is itself.

 

3. A self-realized being should by their very presence be able to uplift the

vibration of wherever he happens to be but that does not mean that such a

being is responsible to cure society of its various dramas. It would seem

that if the karmas of certain people lead them to be helped by a

self-realized being then that will happen however it is may be incorrect to

not allow someone the freedom and opportunity to work through their own

'issues'.

 

4. Why does learning advaita have to exclude the choice of participating in

helping out others?

 

5. I would agree with the Gita on this one we all have our own dharma to

fulfill. Realized saints and sages can work through teaching, healing,

parenting and loving others to assist others. If one is on this planet

there is a role to be played. The difference would be that a realized being

can do it without attachment understanding that he is not actually the doer

simply the actor.

 

Namaste,

Linda

 

 

I suggest the list members to focus on the following issues in addition

to the question related to Ego:

 

(1) What is the distinction between spiritual life and material life?

(2) What is the spiritual understanding of Success and happiness?

(3) What is the role of a self realized person in a society infected

with poverty, sufferings, diseases, calamities, etc.?

(4) Should we not direct our attention in removing conflicts, jealousy,

anger, hatred, etc. rather than spending our time in learning advaita?

(5) what is role of 'realized' saints and sages in removing conflicts,

jealousy, anger, hatred, etc.

(6) ................................. (other additional issues)

 

 

I strongly recommend a complete open discussion (without any prejuidice

whatsover) with an open mind. Since these issues are diverse, the

opinions are likely diverse and consequently, we should show compassion

while listening carefully before we jump into our own conclusions.

Everyone has the right to disagree with other view points but such

disagreements can be expressed fully focused on the subject matter.

 

I invite all of you to participate and contribute your ideas in

resolving these issues. Some of you may feel there are no issues, then

plese tell us why do you think so?

 

Hari Om!

 

Ram Chandran

List Moderator

 

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[Guest guest]

> (1) What is the distinction between spiritual life and material life?

> [Madhava Replies:]

> As I see it: Nothing.

>

> (2) What is the spiritual understanding of Success and happiness?

> [Madhava Replies:]

> Even this will pass away.

>

> (3) What is the role of a self realized person in a society infected

> with poverty, sufferings, diseases, calamities, etc.?

> [Madhava Replies:]

> As Sri Adisankara pointed out they come and go like "vasanta kAla".

> If the so-called community, where they are living, is suffering from

> the so-called poverty, sufferings, diseases they will react in their

> own way, like Sri Gandhi, Sri Vinoba Bhave and many other did...

>

> (4) Should we not direct our attention in removing conflicts,

> jealousy,

> anger, hatred, etc. rather than spending our time in learning advaita?

> [Madhava Replies:]

> Angrer, hatred etc. arise only because of the duality. We have to

> always remember the Geeta Vakyas: "sarvabhootastha mAtmAnaM,

> sarvabhootAni cAtmani", "sunicaivaSva pAkEca panDitAH

> samadarSanaH"....

>

> learning advaita is the only solution to get rid of all conflicts. In

> that way, by spending time on learning advaita we are removing

> conflicts, jealousy, anger and hatred, etc. I WOULD NEVER CONSIDER

> THAT IT IS WASTING OF TIME. Learning advaita is the only education.

> That is the answer to all our questions.

>

> "adhyAtma j~nAna nityatvaM tavaj~nAnArtha darSanaM

> Etat j~nAnamiti prOktaM aj~nAnaM yatatOnyathA ||" - Geeta

>

>

> (5) what is role of 'realized' saints and sages in removing conflicts,

> jealousy, anger, hatred, etc.

> [Madhava Replies:]

> nothing

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks Ram for an excellent article on Ego.

Hari Om!

Sadananda

 

 

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[Guest guest]

Ego is a complex and confusing term for a spiritual person. A total

denial of ego indicates the dominance of ego of the highest order. Any

admission of ego also reinforces its presence. Ego is exposed when we

try to justify our action using intellectual measures of good, bad,

right, wrong, etc.. Ego emerges when a person identifies cause and

results of any action. Ego starts build up when the mind starts with

the sensual perception. The True Human Nature has divine ancestry and

is free from ego. Dr. Radhakrishnan beautifully elaborates the context

of the dialog that took place between the human intellect (Arjun) and

the universal consciousness (Lord Krishna). “The distress of Arjuna is

a dramatization of a perpetually recurring predicament. Man on the

threshold of higher life, feels disappointed with the glamour of the

world and yet illusions cling to him and he cherishes them. He forgets

his divine ancestry and becomes attached to his personality and is

agitated by the conflicting forces of the world. Before he wakes up to

the world of spirit and accepts the obligations imposed by it, he has to

fight the enemies of selfishness and stupidity, and overcome the dark

ignorance of his self-centered ego. It is the evolution of the human

soul that is portrayed here. There are no limits of time and space to

it. The fight takes place every moment in the soul of man,” (The

Bhagavad Gita, S.Radhakrishnan, Published by Blackie & Son Publisheres

Pvt. Ltd. Bombay, India, page 95, second paragraph )

 

Bhagavad Gita uses subtle dialogs between the intellect and

consciousness to educate the human beings the value and purpose of their

life. The essence of Gita is to emphasize that everyone has to cross

the bridge of human life and while crossing, everyone needs to learn to

enjoy the life without building castles! Gita points out that the world

is an infinite dimensional matrix filled with actors with interconnected

actions. The human perception has limitations to measure and judge the

efforts and the results. Everyone misconceive their roles, their

importance and the consequences of their actions. These impressions

cause plurality and create illusions of likes and dislikes, good and

bad, pain and pleasure and right and wrong.

 

Bhagavan Sri Krishna insists that peace, happiness, discriminating

intelligence and concentration can be realized only by freeing the mind

from sensory perceptions. Gita gives the guidance for the realization

or rediscovery of True Human Nature. Gita asserts that it is achievable

by everyone who is willing to take the necessary efforts with discipline

and dedication. The message of Gita is to ascertain that that the

sensory perceptions are barriers for realizing divinity. A byproduct of

sensory perception is “Ego” which distracts human intelligence from

creative thinking. The word "Ego" in Vedanta, implies

misidentification of "SELF” by body and subtle body (body, mind and

intellect). This misconception can be removed only through spiritual

practice (sadhana). Ego in Vedanta is not self-esteem and Vedanta does

not deny self-esteem. Self-esteem is a necessary ingredient and a

motivating factor for spiritual sadhana. Brahman represents the

pendulum standstill without any motion. Jiva, the manifested Brahman

characterizes the pendulum in motion. The motion can’t stop without

efforts and spiritual sadhana is necessary for Jiva to become

standstill. The Hindu scriptures carefully avoids the question, “when

and why did the pendulum start the oscillation?” According to Shankara’s

Advaita Philosophy, the oscillating pendulum is due to our imagination

and is an illusion!

 

Spirituality represents divine presence and divinity is beyond human

comprehension. No single definition of spirituality may be acceptable

to everyone. Categorization, classification and ranking of spirituality

are unspiritual. In simplest terms, spirituality is an experience of the

presence of divinity in one’s heart. It represents the reestablishment

of True Human Nature. The true human nature calls for every human being

to do their duties spontaneously with a steady mind without looking for

rewards. In spiritual life, everyone accepts their role without

hesitation and performs the duties without looking for rewards. There is

a clear distinction between ‘not looking for rewards’ and ‘rewards.’

Spiritual life will lead to the highest goal in life and is guaranteed.

According to Vedas, if the rules are not broken, the reward is

automatic. Ego emerges if the spiritual person starts an analysis of

the rewards of his/her actions. When the spiritual person disregards

the presence and the importance of other participants in the nature, ego

enters the mind filled with thoughts. The spiritual person become

arrogant and the divinity along with peace disappears from his/her

heart. The emerging materialistic person entertains egoistic desires to

fill his emptied heart.

 

The situation is beautifully portrayed in Bhagavad Gita, Chapter I.

The mind of Arjun is seized by by emotion, ego, ignorance and

stupidity. Arjun is overwhelmed by emotion and self-pity and collapses

down on the seat of his chariot. He throws down his bow, arrow and

dignity. He momentarily forgets his True Human Nature and desperately

asks for outside help. Instantaneously, ignorance, selfishness,

self-centered ego, emotion and stupidity takes charge of his

personality. He separates himself from his true human nature and

neglects his obligation to fight the war. Fortunately, the flash of

light from his subconscious mind emerges to give all the necessary

guidance to fight his freedom from emotion, ego and ignorance and to

save the human soul. The rest of the seventeen chapters of Gita

describes Arjuna’s transformation to the spiritual path. The dialog

between Arjun and Bhagavan continues until it ends in chapter 18. At

the end of the long dialog, the Lord asks Arjun whether his ignorance is

dispelled? ( Bhagavad Geeta: Chapter XVIII, Verse 72 ). Arjun replies

that he has regained his wisdom and True Human Nature (Bhagavad Geeta

Chapter XVIII, Verse 73).