Guest guest Posted January 11, 2000 Report Share Posted January 11, 2000 Greetings Vijayalakshmi and Ram, Thank you for addressing my questions concerning free will, Karma and the Vedanta. I only came to study the Upanishads and the Gita after I had already found the spiritual path that works for me, namely that outlined by Spinoza's _Ethics_ which can be summed up in the formula 'all things follow from the necessity of the divine nature' (this means ALL things without exception). The staggering imaginative vision of the Gita has always seemed to me to affirm this but I freely admit that my reading is idiosyncratic and that I am entirely self-taught (and hence probably misguided on many points). My reason for joining the list to see how much common ground there is between us and although I am quite sure that there will always be fundamental differences too this doesn't bother me in the least. Radhakrishnan does not answer my question concerning the chariot metaphor. Can anyone suggest any other sources? > Here's yet another question: Arjuna is > the Lord of the Chariot and Krishna the > Charioteer. Did Vyasa have the chariot > metaphor of the Katha Upanishad in the > back of his mind? (Considering that one > of the most famous verses in Chapter II > of the Gita is lifted directly from this > Upanishad). > Regards, Patrick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 11, 2000 Report Share Posted January 11, 2000 Greetings Patrick: Thanks for your reply and your willingness to listen with an open mind. As a list moderator, I appreciate your cooperation and looking forward to your comments and questions. Here is my understanding of the metaphor that you described from Katha Upanishad> Katha Upanishad: Chapter 3 SELF as a rider in a chariot (The Witness) Body is the chariot. Intellect is the charioteer. Mind is the brake. Horses are the senses. The paths of the chariot are the sense objects. The destination is Brahman! When the mind is under control, the chariot is under control, the horses can be directed through the right path to reach the destination. The rider (SELF) just witnesses the journey of life without any attachment. (Back seat drivers are also supposed to trust the driver witness - please do not direct the driver when and how to accelerate, turn and apply the brakes!) Though the chariot, charioteer, the horses and the intellect (Arjun) and the SELF (Krishna) are present, but the metaphor is not identical to the above description in Katha Upanishad. In Bhagavad Gita, the intellect was in distress and the mind was cluttered with illusions. The intellect was looking for guidance inwards through Atma Vichara to get out of the imaginary misery caused due to the illusory mind. The conversation between Arjun (intellect) and Krishna (consciousness) is an illustration of our own daily struggle (war) of meeting the challenges in our life. When we purify mind and free it from illusions (ignorance), the intellect gets the guidance from the SELF to enjoy our life and conduct our duties without misery. Regards, Ram Chandran Patrick Kenny <pkenny > >Greetings Vijayalakshmi and Ram, > >Thank you for addressing my questions >concerning free will, Karma and the >Vedanta. >......... >Radhakrishnan does not answer my >question concerning the chariot >metaphor. Can anyone >suggest any other sources? > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 11, 2000 Report Share Posted January 11, 2000 Hari Om, Greetings Patrick, I am glad that you are now able to know other opinions about karma. This list was created only to help everybody to understand Vedanta and Advaita in their own way. Nobody can expect others to understand and follow a doctrine in the same way as theirs. Each individual reaches the culminating point through his own path. Coming to your opinion, I am very eager to know what you mean by "all things follow from the necessity of the divine nature". Pls. do explain. Also, I am not a scholar in Advaita and Vedanta... I just had the same doubts as you did once upon a time, and had suggested what I had read so that you may benefit from it. Hari Om Tatsat Viji. --- Patrick Kenny <pkenny wrote: > Greetings Vijayalakshmi and Ram, > > Thank you for addressing my questions > concerning free will, Karma and the > Vedanta. I only came to study the > Upanishads and the Gita after I had > already found the spiritual path that > works for me, namely that outlined by > Spinoza's _Ethics_ > which can be summed up in the formula > 'all things follow from the necessity of > the divine nature' (this means ALL > things without exception). The > staggering imaginative vision of the > Gita has always seemed to me to affirm > this but I freely admit that my reading > is idiosyncratic and that I am entirely > self-taught (and hence probably > misguided on many points). > My reason for joining the list to see > how much common ground there is between > us and although I am quite sure that > there will always be fundamental > differences too this doesn't bother me > in the least. > > Radhakrishnan does not answer my > question concerning the chariot > metaphor. Can anyone > suggest any other sources? > > > > Here's yet another > question: Arjuna is > > the Lord of the Chariot > and Krishna the > > Charioteer. Did Vyasa > have the chariot > > metaphor of the Katha > Upanishad in the > > back of his mind? > (Considering that one > > of the most famous > verses in Chapter II > > of the Gita is lifted > directly from this > > Upanishad). > > > Regards, > > Patrick > Talk to your friends online with Messenger. http://im. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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