Guest guest Posted April 6, 2000 Report Share Posted April 6, 2000 Greetings Advaitins: It is time to rejuvenate Gita discussions so that we can participate and learn. Let me start with the first three of the current verses under discussion - Verses 2.26 to 2.28. I hope to see greater participation in the Gita Satsang discussions. This is a great opportunity for all of us to focus on the divine message regarding true divine nature. atha cAinaM nityajAtaM nityaM vA manyase mRtam tathApi tvaM mahAbAho nAinaM Socitumarhasi 2.26 In verse 2.26, Lord Krishna shows His compassion for Arjuna and takes all necessary steps to console him. He tells him that it is unreasonable for Arjuna to worry even under the incorrect assumption that the Atman is subject to birth and death. The Lord gives us hints on how to deal with smart (those who assume that they are but in reality are not!) people. A thorn can be removed using another thorn but later both are discarded. In Vedanta, logic is used to extract the logic and finally the logic need to be discarded! jAtasya hi dhruvo mRtyur dhruvaM janma mRtasya ca tasmAdaparihArye 'rthe na tvaM Socitumarhasiq 2.27 The verse 27 is a continuation of the argument to reemphasize the conclusion. Ignorant people hold the faulty view that the soul constantly undergoes birth and death with no scope for liberation. In reality, soul is never born and will never die! The sages and seers of the Upanishads are quite consistent in their declarations including their statement - "Vedas have no beginnings and end." Lord Krishna tells Arjuna again that there is no logical justification for his worries even under the (incorrect) scenarios imagined. The word `Tasmat', again, is indicative of cause. By using the expression "over the inevitable" along with it, it has been shown that according to this view there being no escape from birth and death, no possibility of alteration in or deviation from that course of events, it was useless to grieve over it. Therefore, from this point of view as well, it was improper for Arjuna to indulge in grief. avyaktAdIni bhUtAni vyaktamadhyAni bhArata avyaktanidhAnAnyeva tatra kA paridevanA 2.28 The word `Bhutani' in this verse stands for beings in general. By applying to it the adjective `Avyaktadini' it has been shown that before birth they had no connection with their present bodies, By the word `Avyaktanidhanani', it has been shown that in the end, that is, after death too they would maintain no connection with these gross bodies. The word `Vyaktamadhyani' expresses the idea that during the intermediate period alone, viz, from birth to death, they are manifest and maintain relation with their bodies. By the words "What occasion, then, for lamentation?" the Lord intends to say that just as the dream world is non-existent before and after the dream, it is during the dream alone that the dreamer has a semblance of relation with it, even so one has no cause to lament for bodies with which one is connected only during the intermediate stage, and not permanently. In the Mahabharata, Stri-Parva, Chapter 2, Vidura also gives expression to a similar sentiment: "Those whom you now regard to be your own, came from an unseen state, that is, before birth they were unmanifest, and they have become unmanifest again. Therefore, in reality, neither are they yours, nor are you theirs. What is the occasion, then, for lamentation?" These three verses beautifully illustrate the fallacy of human thought process that lead to human misery! We seem to assume that we are the most intelligent beings and pay a heavy price for that assumption. All assumptions come along with a logical frame work but good logical framework with inappropriate assumptions will also lead to human misery! The entire Gita develops a logic to get rid of logic and go beyond logic! Regards, Ram Chandran Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 6, 2000 Report Share Posted April 6, 2000 Our imaginative mind always finds innovative ways to get worried. One of our friend is a worrying type and in reality no one is responsible for his worries. For few years, everything was going well - he had promotions, good spouse and family members. But he was looking sad. I asked him what is the reason for his sadness? He said that he is worried that some bad thing is going to come because everything was going well for a long time! How do we change such a behavioral attitude? It is not easy, one has reprogram one's mind to accept events without worrying about unforeseen outcome. Such outcomes are likely and most of the time they are beyond our control. When Dr. Radhakrishnan visited USA during Kennedy's presidency, the white house made an elaborate arrangement to have an outdoor reception. But suddenly the rain came and President Kennedy said apologically that the cermony has to conducted on a smaller scale inside. Dr. Radhakrishnan, a great philosopher said, "we have no control over the events such as rain. But we can control its consequences by using an umbrella." What a beautiful statement from the statesman and this incident was widely reported by the media at that time. The subtle message of Gita is that 'human liberation' is nothing more than removing the ignorance and prepare to accept the reality of life! Everthing else that we think is a dream and we need to wake up from such dreams! Let us wake Up!! Ram Chandran Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 7, 2000 Report Share Posted April 7, 2000 Namaste, The very first mantra of Isavasya Upanishad! : iishaavaasyamida.n sarva.n yatki~ncha jagatyaa.n jagat.h . tena tyaktena bhu~njiithaa maa gR^idhaH kasyasviddhanam.h .. Regards, s. >Ram Chandran <ramvchandran >advaitin >advaitin >Re: Bhagavad Gita Verses 26 to 28 for discussion >Fri, 7 Apr 2000 09:34:00 -0700 (PDT) > >The sages and seers of the Upanishads understood the >reality of life as follows: > >"Life is a bridge, enjoy while crossing and don't >dream to build a castle on it!" > >regards, > >Ram > > >--- Anand Natarajan <anandn wrote: > > > > Can you explain what you mean by reality of life ? > > > > Regards, > > Anand > ____ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 7, 2000 Report Share Posted April 7, 2000 Can you explain what you mean by reality of life ? Regards, Anand On Thu, 6 Apr 2000 09:29:07 Ram Chandran wrote: >The subtle message of Gita is that 'human liberation' >is nothing more than removing the ignorance and >prepare to accept the reality of life! A FREE web-based e-mail service brought to you by the PC World Technology Network. Get your FREE account today at http://www.myworldmail.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 7, 2000 Report Share Posted April 7, 2000 The sages and seers of the Upanishads understood the reality of life as follows: "Life is a bridge, enjoy while crossing and don't dream to build a castle on it!" regards, Ram --- Anand Natarajan <anandn wrote: > > Can you explain what you mean by reality of life ? > > Regards, > Anand Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 7, 2000 Report Share Posted April 7, 2000 Bhagawad Gita is the greatest answer to the day to day life! It is the most useful book on managerial decision making. A man who can manage his personal life can become quite successful in profession also. A successful professional does not necessarily mean that he is a successful father; a successful husband; a responsible citizen... I believe that profession is goal oriented, and life is emotion oriented. Life revolves around wife, children, teachers, relatives, kith and kin... Profession revolves around success and failure. We work in order to earn money; we need money in order to live life peacefully; peace for somebody means having a nice wife, behaving children, a beautiful home. For some other peace means some thing higher. What ever is the meaning of peace, as it changes from individual to individual, one can find a way of achieving it through BhagawadGita. Know thy self! It is most important. For example, you bought a great four wheeler by spending a lot of money, and you ignored to read the manual then it is going to be a waste! if you are not aware of the strengths/weaknesses of your car then you may not be confident on driving in to unknown regions! You will restrict your movement.... Same way, every body has undergone a lots of births/death in order to gain a suitable body with great intellect (in order to understand/discuss the great Advaita). In deed, we are all blessed with great body/mind/intellect. I believe that "Bhagawad Gtia is a manual for the mortal vehicle, with an immortal driver". We should know the full strength of ourselves. Then only we can face life fearlessly; we can tread in to unknown regions, with a sheer will power! You have to be fearless, fear raises out of weakness, Gita says "arise you are not weak" understand that. Most of the times we are not aware of our own inner weaknesses. It is said "in order to test the gold put it in fire". When confronted with certain situations only we will come to know that we can act in that way! Arjuna was such a bewildered person, till the moment he confronted with the real situation, he was under the impression that he can do very well in the battle.. Understand the importance of Gita in day to day life. Personally, Gita is the answer to most of my troubles... I feel at peace the moment I take gita in to my hands and start reading. --- Original Message ----- Ram Chandran <ramvchandran <advaitin > Thursday, April 06, 2000 7:29 PM Re: Bhagavad Gita Verses 26 to 28 for discussion > Our imaginative mind always finds innovative ways to > get worried. One of our friend is a worrying type and > in reality no one is responsible for his worries. For > few years, everything was going well - he had > promotions, good spouse and family members. But he > was looking sad. I asked him what is the reason for > his sadness? He said that he is worried that some bad > thing is going to come because everything was going > well for a long time! How do we change such a > behavioral attitude? It is not easy, one has reprogram > one's mind to accept events without worrying about > unforeseen outcome. Such outcomes are likely and most > of the time they are beyond our control. > > When Dr. Radhakrishnan visited USA during Kennedy's > presidency, the white house made an elaborate > arrangement to have an outdoor reception. But > suddenly the rain came and President Kennedy said > apologically that the cermony has to conducted on a > smaller scale inside. Dr. Radhakrishnan, a great > philosopher said, "we have no control over the events > such as rain. But we can control its consequences by > using an umbrella." What a beautiful statement from > the statesman and this incident was widely reported by > the media at that time. > > The subtle message of Gita is that 'human liberation' > is nothing more than removing the ignorance and > prepare to accept the reality of life! Everthing else > that we think is a dream and we need to wake up from > such dreams! Let us wake Up!! > > Ram Chandran > > ------ > GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds! Get rates as low as 2.9% > Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR and no hidden fees. Apply NOW! > http://click./1/936/3/_/489436/_/955038545/ > ------ > > Discussion of the True Meaning of Sankara's Advaita Vedanta Philosophy focusing on non-duality between mind and matter. Searchable List Archives are available at: http://www.eScribe.com/culture/advaitin/ To from the list, send Email to <advaitin- > For other contact, Email to <advaitins > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 7, 2000 Report Share Posted April 7, 2000 Greetings Anand: Thanks for asking the right question at the right time and this is part of reality. Also when we someone asks the right question at the wrong time, or wrong question at the wrong time, they are also parts of the reality of life. Let me try with a small stroy to illustrate what is the reality of life: A young college graduate and got his first job in a small company. He found the job boring and his boss quite demanding. He was forced to get up early in the morning and went to bed late in the night. He didn't even get enough time to eat his lunch or dinner. He was very frustrated and went to his grandfather for advice. He had great respect for his grandpa because he was always busy doing something or other in the house and was always cheerful. His grandfather listened to his grandson's complaints patiently for few hours. Finally, grandpa said: son, don't worry about your present conditions in the job; you continue with your present employer and continue with your good working attitude; and in five years you everything will become normal and you will have no more problems! The grandson was thrilled to hear the words of grandpa and asked him, what will happen after five years? Grandpa said without excitement - son, in five years, you will get used to what you are doing; you will learn to accept the reality of your life and work. I faced exactly the same situation and I went to my grandfather; and he told me the same that I am telling you! Grandson got the message right and square and thanked his grandpa for his advice. Each one of us sometime or other face this situation and go to somebody and they reply that these problems are universal and they are not unique. After losing the wallet in the local fair, we go home miserably; however, when the neighbor tells a similar story, our misery disappers. The wallet in all probability will never return unlike the misery! This is also part of the reality of life! There is another story about Lord Buddha. Once a lady came to Buddha with a dead child in her hand. She told him that is her only child and she wants him to revive the life of the child. Buddha told her to bring a spoon of water any house where the family did not face death. She went around the whole city of million families and never could find a house without facing death. At the end, she understood the message of Buddha and never went back to him. She understood the reality of life instantaneously! regards, Ram Chandran --- Anand Natarajan <anandn wrote: > > Can you explain what you mean by reality of life ? > > Regards, > Anand > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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