RamChandranJii : gItAsatsang: Atha Shrimad Bhagwad Gita

[Guest guest]

AaDarniya RamChandranJii Pranam

 

 

>First, I want to congratulate you for your willingness to contribute

>to Gitasatsang and I hope others will follow your with the same

>entusiasm and interest.

 

 

Thanks a Lot Sir.

>I believe that you have a challenging

>task ahead of you to bring substantial evidence and references to

>support your observations.

 

 

I will try my level best to say something without getting confused. My

problem is that I am too young in this field and my brain works fast than my

fingers that is why they sometimes create unwanted noise!!! But I hope all

of you will tolarate me for some more days.

 

>Finally, I am also wondering whether it is wise on our part to focus

>our attention on issues such as:

>

>Did Ramayan or Mahabharat has any historical relevance?

>Did Buddhism have strong influence in Ramayan, Mahbharat and Gita?

>I am sure that you will agree that as a philosophical discussion

>group, our focus should be to look for insights and guidance from

>Ramayan, Mahabharat and Gita.

 

 

I do agree that we should not prove the Historical quality of Mahabharat and

Ramayan and Gita but to understand the Philosophical thought projected by

these epics I feel that certain assumtions should be known to the concerned.

I belive that scientific study does not depend on Bhavna or sentiments. I do

not force and have no intentions thereof that every one should belive the

way I do.

Most of the times 'Belief','Faith' 'Traditions' make you to loose all your

Logic and Reason. We belive Mahabhart and Ramayan and then we search

archeological evidences to support. While producing evidences we are usually

baised. And as regards to the stream of the group I suppose we have to clear

all the doubts and reach to a conclusion at the earlist so as to retain the

focus on the philosophical insights only. But in doing so if we make

references as this then I suppose it should be a welcome change. As I told

earlier I am too young in age as well as in Knowledge.So such errors are

likely to occur that are direct reflections of my intellctual emptyness. I

am told by my father that it is not sufficient that one should respect

elders but it is equally important to see to it that one is not respected by

the elders(That is why I requested not to attached 'Ji' with my name). While

in the group if I go away from the principles of the group then you must

check and put me in the direction. I hope you wont mind doing that. That way

we will learn and tomorrow make other Youngstrs to learn!!!!

>On the otherhand, there is substantial

>archeological evidence to support the historical background of Ramayan

>and Mahabharat.

 

 

Say for example I write a Story(Epic) with the theme based around White

House. I discribe the palace with clinical details and create a plot with a

main character as Mr.Raju Deshmukh and his family.Suggesting that he was

born from Sun God without Human Father. Now what has happened is that I have

taken all references of White House that are factual but the plot around it

is fictional. So after thousand of years people will get historical i.e.

archeological evidences in the form of White House and hence it will be

belived that Mr.Raju Deshmukh did live in WhiteHouse and people at that

time had direct contact with Gods. Or Some Neo-Scientists after thousand

years will declare that thousand years back our forefather knew how to get

progeny with out Human Father and even ruled America!!!!. Hence my point is

that we should decide the Historical quality of an epic based on the

contents that appeal to our reason and logic. If we belive that it is not a

literally work then we we may get swayed away.

>It is quite conceivable that some of the incidents

>described in Ramayan and Mahabharat may not be believable by looking

>with our modern vision.

 

I agree that it is quite conceivable had it been quantified to few some!!!

Here we observe that entire Ramayan and Mahabharat is full of such stories.

Nothing can be understood without 'beliving' it to be as it is. We try to

reason it out and we have a problem right from the begining. If allowed I

will list numerous incidents from both the epics that are beyond logic and

reasoning. One has to belive them without arguments.

>warmest regards,

 

Say Aashirvad Sir ; I need it for my unseen worst period.

 

 

 

Thanks a Lot for your Time and Space.

 

Prabodh Vekhande

 

>Discussion of Shankara's Advaita Vedanta Philosophy of nonseparablity of

Atman and Brahman.

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[Guest guest]

Please consider the following remarks. -(IN BOLD BELOW)

geetha

-

softbit <softbit

<advaitin>

Saturday, March 03, 2001 4:42 AM

Re: RamChandranJii : gItAsatsang: Atha Shrimad Bhagwad

Gita

 

>

> AaDarniya RamChandranJii Pranam

>

>

>

> >First, I want to congratulate you for your willingness to contribute

> >to Gitasatsang and I hope others will follow your with the same

> >entusiasm and interest.

> Thanks a Lot Sir.

>

> >I believe that you have a challenging

> >task ahead of you to bring substantial evidence and references to

> >support your observations.

>

> I will try my level best to say something without getting confused. My

> problem is that I am too young in this field and my brain works fast than

my

> fingers that is why they sometimes create unwanted noise!!! But I hope all

> of you will tolarate me for some more days.

>BEING YOUNG IN THIS FIELD MAYBE THERE HAS NOT BEEN SUFFICIENT TIME DEVOTED

BY YOUR MIND INTO SOME OF THE QUESTIONS- THAT THESE ARE ALSO THE THOUGHTS OF

MANY OTHERS WHO BEGIN THEIR STUDY AND REALIZE DIFFERENTLY LATER?

>

> >Finally, I am also wondering whether it is wise on our part to focus

> >our attention on issues such as:

> >Did Ramayan or Mahabharat has any historical relevance?

> >Did Buddhism have strong influence in Ramayan, Mahbharat and Gita?

> >I am sure that you will agree that as a philosophical discussion

> >group, our focus should be to look for insights and guidance from

> >Ramayan, Mahabharat and Gita.

>

> I do agree that we should not prove the Historical quality of Mahabharat

and

> Ramayan and Gita but to understand the Philosophical thought projected by

> these epics I feel that certain assumtions should be known to the

concerned.

> I belive that scientific study does not depend on Bhavna or sentiments. I

do

> not force and have no intentions thereof that every one should belive the

> way I do.

YES SCIENTIFIC STUDY DOES NOT DEPEND ON BHAVNA OR SENTIMENTS. THERE ARE

CERTAIN ISSUES THAT ARE BEYOND THE "SCIENTIFIC" (TO THE LIMIT SCIENCE IS

UNDERSTOOD TODAY). IN UNDERSTANDING AND APPRECIATING RELIGION (O SOME

EXTENT THAT IS WHAT WE ARE DOING) WE HAVE TO HAVE SOME AMOUNT OF BHAVNA OR

SENTIMENT.

> Most of the times 'Belief','Faith' 'Traditions' make you to loose all your

> Logic and Reason. We belive Mahabhart and Ramayan and then we search

> archeological evidences to support. While producing evidences we are

usually

> baised. And as regards to the stream of the group I suppose we have to

clear

> all the doubts and reach to a conclusion at the earlist so as to retain

the

> focus on the philosophical insights only. But in doing so if we make

> references as this then I suppose it should be a welcome change. As I told

> earlier I am too young in age as well as in Knowledge.So such errors are

> likely to occur that are direct reflections of my intellctual emptyness. I

> am told by my father that it is not sufficient that one should respect

> elders but it is equally important to see to it that one is not respected

by

> the elders(That is why I requested not to attached 'Ji' with my name).

While

> in the group if I go away from the principles of the group then you must

> check and put me in the direction. I hope you wont mind doing that. That

way

> we will learn and tomorrow make other Youngstrs to learn!!!!

BELIEF, FAITH AND TRADITIONS ARE MOVING TARGETS AND VERY INDIVIDUAL AND

PERSONAL. MANY A TIMES THE BELIEF, TRADITION AND FAITH HAVE EVOLVED FROM A

SOUND LOGIC AND REASON BUT GET DISTORTED IN PASSAGE - AND THAT IS WHAT WE

MUST GUARD AGAINST AS WE UNDERTAKE THIS PATH OF INQUIRY.

RESPECT IS GAINED BY ONE'S ACTIONS AND NOT BY BEING YOUGER OR OLDE ALONE. A

PERSON CAN BE RESPECTED FOR SOME QUALITIES AND NOT FOR ANOTHER, SO IT IS

OKAY FOR YOU TO BE RESPECTED BY AN ELDER, AND YOU ARE ALLOWED TO ACCEPT IT.

JUST BE WORTHY OF THAT RESPECT.

> >On the otherhand, there is substantial

> >archeological evidence to support the historical background of Ramayan

> >and Mahabharat.

>

> Say for example I write a Story(Epic) with the theme based around White

> House. I discribe the palace with clinical details and create a plot with

a

> main character as Mr.Raju Deshmukh and his family.Suggesting that he was

> born from Sun God without Human Father. Now what has happened is that I

have

> taken all references of White House that are factual but the plot around

it

> is fictional. So after thousand of years people will get historical i.e.

> archeological evidences in the form of White House and hence it will be

> belived that Mr.Raju Deshmukh did live in WhiteHouse and people at that

> time had direct contact with Gods. Or Some Neo-Scientists after thousand

> years will declare that thousand years back our forefather knew how to get

> progeny with out Human Father and even ruled America!!!!. Hence my point

is

> that we should decide the Historical quality of an epic based on the

> contents that appeal to our reason and logic. If we belive that it is not

a

> literally work then we we may get swayed away.

>

IF VED VYAS AND VALMIKI WROTE THESE EPICS IN THE SAME MANNER AS THE STORY OF

MR. DESHMUKH WILL, WE WILL NOT KNOW IF THEY WERE ACTUAL OCURRENCES OR NOT.

UNFORTUNATELY THE METHODS THAT ARCHAELOGISTS AND HISTORIANS USE ARE BASED ON

DEDUCTION FROM EVIDENCES BEFORE THEM. THERE IS NO OTHER WAY. ONE CAN

CHOOSE TO NOT TORMENT ONESELF BY TAKING THE TEACHINGS THAT ARE PRESENT AND

PUT IT TO USE FOR THE BETTERMENT OF ONESELF. ONE CAN ALSO CHOOSE TO HAVE

FAITH, BELIEF AND TRADITION AND PRACTISE IT WISELY. IF YOU CAN BELIEVE THAT

VED VYAS EXISTED AND WROTE SUCH A COMPLICATED STORY, THEN CAN YOUR MIND ALSO

STRETCH ITSELF TO THINK THAT MAYBE IT WAS HISTORY ? CAN ONE NEGATE ALL THE

HOLY PLACES AND PLACES OF INTEREST RELATING TO KISHNA'S CHILDHOOD OR RAMA'S

TRAVELS AS BEING FIGMENT OF ONE'S IMAGINATION? I THINK IT DOESN'T MATTER-

WE HAVE LIMITS ON OUR UNDERSTANDING AS WELL AS OUR INSTRUMENTS AND THE ONLY

THING WE CAN DO IS DERIVE THE POSITIVE ENERGY FROM THESE STORIES AND BETTER

OURSELVES TO PEACEFULLY COEXIST. MAYBE THERE ARE THOSE THAT HAVE THE FAITH

THAT KNOW FOR A FACT THAT THESE THINGS REALLY HAPPENED BUT CANNOT PROVE IN

"LOGIC AND REASON" FORM TO OTHERS!

iNCIDENTALLY, GENE CLONING AND ANIMAL CLONING EXPERIMENTS MAY MAKE YOUR

'DESHMUKH" STORY BE BELIEVABLE, BUT AS LONG AS THE STORIES ARE TEACHING

PEOPLE TO BE "GOOD", IT WON'T MATTER!

>It is quite conceivable that some of the incidents

> >described in Ramayan and Mahabharat may not be believable by looking

> >with our modern vision.

>

> I agree that it is quite conceivable had it been quantified to few some!!!

> Here we observe that entire Ramayan and Mahabharat is full of such

stories.

> Nothing can be understood without 'beliving' it to be as it is. We try to

> reason it out and we have a problem right from the begining. If allowed I

> will list numerous incidents from both the epics that are beyond logic and

> reasoning. One has to belive them without arguments.

>

TAKE THE LESSONS FROM THOSE STORIES AND TRY TO BENEFIT FROM THEM

>warmest regards,

>

> Say Aashirvad Sir ; I need it for my unseen worst period.

>

GOD BLESS YOU AND GIVE YOU ANSWERS

>

> Thanks a Lot for your Time and Space.

>

> Prabodh Vekhande

>

>

> >Discussion of Shankara's Advaita Vedanta Philosophy of nonseparablity of

> Atman and Brahman.

> >Advaitin List Archives available at:

> http://www.eScribe.com/culture/advaitin/

> >Please Note the New Changes at the Mail Server

> >For details, visit: /local/news.html

> >Post message: advaitin

> >Subscribe: advaitin-

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> >

> >

> >

> >Your use of is subject to

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

>

> Discussion of Shankara's Advaita Vedanta Philosophy of nonseparablity of

Atman and Brahman.

> Advaitin List Archives available at:

http://www.eScribe.com/culture/advaitin/

> Please Note the New Changes at the Mail Server

> For details, visit: /local/news.html

> Post message: advaitin

> Subscribe: advaitin-

> Un: advaitin

> URL to Advaitin: advaitin

> File folder: advaitin

> Link Folder: advaitin/links

> Messages Folder: advaitin/messages

>

>

>

> Your use of is subject to

>

>

>