Guest guest Posted March 23, 2001 Report Share Posted March 23, 2001 namaste shri Sandeepji, I congratulate you for your enthusiasm and for the different outlook brought in. I echo shri Dennis Waite's comment that, may be, a slower presentation of your thoughts may be digestible. Also, I have a particular concern with the language. As moderator of this List, I am concerned about the cavalier usage of the language. I give examples below from your postings of the past two days: You described upanishadic sages as singing farmers; you say gItA as the song of Krishna to keep control; you say amr^itAnubhava as *prattling* of jnaneshwar, etc. Such usage of language can cause uneasiness to members. May be that is your style of writing. But you should be aware of the other members who hold the gItA with the highest esteem; who regard highly the upanishadic sages as the seers of Truth. 'prattling' is a word used in the english language in a derogatory way as the expression of a deluded. Such a cavalier usage of the language is not acceptable on this List. This is a List for serious seekers of the Truth. I do hope you will re-read your messages before posting and correct/replace any unrequired words. This is in no way to curb your enthusiasm of posting. Please treat this as a lecture hall on advaita and be considerate of the listeners and of the sages of the ancient times and their teachings. Regards Gummuluru Murthy ----- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 23, 2001 Report Share Posted March 23, 2001 Hiya Gummuluru, - Gummuluru Murthy advaitin Friday, March 23, 2001 11:51 PM language used in the postings namaste shri Sandeepji, I congratulate you for your enthusiasm and for the different outlook brought in. I echo shri Dennis Waite's comment that, may be, a slower presentation of your thoughts may be digestible. San: Fine. Your wish is my command.<s> Also, I have a particular concern with the language. As moderator of this List, I am concerned about the cavalier usage of the language. San: LOL. I liked the phrase "cavalier usage of language". My dear friend, the biggest illusion is that there is something in and about the phenomenal world, the Leela to be serious about. Enjoy the leela and your role in it. It was put up for your show, by you. I give examples below from your postings of the past two days: You described upanishadic sages as singing farmers; San: That was exactly what they were. Total householders, following whetever was their talent was, to make a living. OK all of them were not farmers, but at that time agriculture was more of less 100% of the national activity (not that there was a nation at that time). And all bromides were sang and conveyed from mouth to ear, preserved through oral singing. All texts, all scriptures today are the edited "versions" of these pristine songs. you say gItA as the song of Krishna to keep control; San: No. I said, the song of Krishna to Arjun, was subsquently recorded and in that recording, the intrepretations came into recordings and this set of pages, has been used to establish and perpetuate control by Organised Religion. Same thing for the Bible, and the Koran. The symbol is never the thing and yet the symbol has become the controller. Let's take the Gita. What is typically the essence of of it, taken today. Usually two tenets Do your karma, don't lust for the fruits of your karma (paraphased) And yet isn't it somehwere, left unnoticed, uncorrupted by the subsequent translators "Shivo Bhokta, Shivo Bhojya Shivo Karta, Shivah Karmah, Shivah Karanatmakah" Meaning... Shiva is the experiencer ands the heighest object of experience. Shiva is the sadhak and Shiva is the sadhna and teh goal of sadhna. To know this is to be Shiv. What is the other modern tenet of Gita that power brokers of Organised Religion peddle "Parivartan he Sansar can niyam haya" (Phonetic translation of the Hindi) Meaning, Change is the essence of Life. Hilarious, There is a show , a dream in which there is an apparent change". In essence the term change or no-change themselves are not relevant. Why? In Oneness (a conceptual term), who is changing to what. Further for Oneness to affirm that it also not-chnaging, to whom can even this be affirmed. Thus both terms of change and no-change have to be transcended. That is why, a concept was offerred The absence of presence and the absence of the absence of presence." Incidentally, my comments on Gita are in reference to the Bhagwad Gita. Ashtavakra's Gita or Avadhut Gita, well, they are just Dobeeeeee Do beeeeee Dooooooo. Or even Ladeeee daaaaaa deeeeee. They go so much deeper. There are no compromises, no corruptions, becuase the perpetuaters of Organised Religion saw these did not have the mass appeal. you say amr^itAnubhava as *prattling* of jnaneshwar, etc. San: LOL. You picked the "word" and missed the splendour of the prattling. No doubt appropriate. Indeed it is a prattling, including what is appearing through the entity "Sandeep" on this List. What do I mean to convey through that term? Anything said, or conveyed by whichever means, by anybody to somebody, anywhere, at anytime, ever, is a concept. Such usage of language can cause uneasiness to members. May be that is your style of writing. But you should be aware of the other members who hold the gItA with the highest esteem; San: Any unease, please direct them towards this end. I will happy to "unease" them further. <LOL> My submission, look for the essence, not the symbol. Look at the moon, not the finger pointing to the moon. who regard highly the upanishadic sages as the seers of Truth. San: My calling them singing farmers disqualifies them ? In fact they, by being exactly what they were, point to a bigger truth. That Truth can be found standing in front of the washing machine, in the market place as well, as in the vale of green mountain. 'prattling' is a word used in the english language in a derogatory way as the expression of a deluded. San: Derogation is never in the word, any word. It is the mind of the receipient. If I called you a fool, Gummuluru,and you became angry, all that has happened, is that you have lended a truth to my statement. Otherwise how can an iota of a ripple disturb your consciousness? If I called Krishna or Jesus or Mohammed the biggest idiots that walked this planet and the Bajrang Dal or VHP want to break my head or the Christian missionaries wished to damn me to eternal Hell or the Muslim fanatics issue a fatwa to behead me for blasphemy on me, really what is happening? What is happening is that all of them accept that Krishna, Jesus or Mohhamed become idiots by my saying so. LOL. Such a cavalier usage of the language is not acceptable on this List. San: See what I have meant to convey by the usage of the word "prattling". If after that, it is still not acceptable, and being "your" List, I think Dennis will get his desires fullfilled quite soon. I am sorry Gummuluru, you or anybody or for that matter even Sandeep have no say on the manner in which, whatever comes up, comes up, through this entity. This is a List for serious seekers of the Truth. San: Seriousness (of any kind, about anything) is a disease. Remember the dude Jesus prattling "It is the child who will enter my Dad's pad". I do hope you will re-read your messages before posting and correct/replace any unrequired words. San: No. There is no volition to do so, my friend. And you have the full right to disallow these posts, appearing on this List. If that is to happen, that will happen, no matter what Sandeep or Gummuluru,does or does not. Are you getting me Gummuluru? This is in no way to curb your enthusiasm of posting. San: "My" entusiasm????? Please treat this as a lecture hall on advaita and be considerate of the listeners and of the sages of the ancient times and their teachings. San: Ahaaa Gummuluru, It's too late for this entity to be reverential to anything in phenomenality. I am too busy enjoying the splendour of the show, both the profanity and the profoundity, which I put on for for myself. Who is the other, that I must revere? As the dude Dattatreya prattled in Avadhut Gita <g> How can I salute the Self, which is indestructible, which is all Bliss, which in Itself and by Itself pervades everything, and which is inseparable from Itself? I alone am, ever free from all taint. The world exists like a mirage within me. To whom shall I bow? To whom shall I bow Gummuluru? Cheers Sandeep Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 24, 2001 Report Share Posted March 24, 2001 advaitin Shree Sandeep Chatterjee wrote: > It's too late for this entity to be reverential to anything in phenomenality. > I am too busy enjoying the splendour of the show, both the profanity and the profoundity, which I put on for for myself. > > Who is the other, that I must revere? > > As the dude Dattatreya prattled in Avadhut Gita <g> > > How can I salute the Self, which is indestructible, which is all Bliss, which in Itself and by Itself pervades everything, and which is inseparable from Itself? > > I alone am, ever free from all taint. The world exists like a mirage within me. To whom shall I bow? > > > To whom shall I bow Gummuluru? > > Cheers > > Sandeep Dear Respected Sir, Lord Krishna greeted each visitor by putting the visitor in a very high pedestal. Jesus washed the feet of the seekers. Swami Vivekananda did the same. Sister Nivedita took a broom and cleaned the streets of Calcutta. All this they did not just because to be humble, but because there is greater bliss and greater heroism in so doing. When one's own Self is Bliss, and so long as the mirage still exists within one, to one's own Self shall one bow. In my humble opinion, Sir. With Love, Raghava Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 24, 2001 Report Share Posted March 24, 2001 THIS IS MY FIRST AND LAST POSTING TO THIS ENTITY "SANDEEP". ALL MY COMMENTS ARE IN CAPITALS AND THERE ARE THREE POINTS ADDRESSED. Geetha > Indeed it is a prattling, including what is appearing through the entity "Sandeep" on this List. IS THIS LIKE AN OUJI BOARD OR SOMETHING? > San: > > Any unease, please direct them towards this end. I will happy to "unease" them further. <LOL> > > My submission, look for the essence, not the symbol. > Look at the moon, not the finger pointing to the moon. SOME OF US WHO HAVE LESS LEISURE TIME ALLOTTED TO US CANNOT SEE THE MOON UNLESS WE FOCUS ON THE FINGER POINTING IN THAT DIRECTION FIRST , AND - SO LET US. IF YOU AGREE YOUR SYMBOLS ARE NOT ESSENTIAL MAYBE YOU DO NOT NEED TO POST THEM? > > Such a cavalier usage of the language is not acceptable > on this List. > > San: > > See what I have meant to convey by the usage of the word "prattling". > > If after that, it is still not acceptable, and being "your" List, I think Dennis will get his desires fullfilled quite soon. > > I am sorry Gummuluru, you or anybody or for that matter even Sandeep have no say on the manner in which, whatever comes up, comes up, through this entity. I THINK YOU ARE FEIGNING TOTAL "NO CONTROL OVER MY PRATTLINGS" BY ASSIGNING IT TO SOME UNFATHOMABLE "WHATEVER" THAT MANIFESTS THROUGH THIS ENTITY CALLED "SANDEEP". I THINK YOU WANT TO BE SENATIONAL, IRREVERANT, AND DO NOT CARE FOR THE OTHERS LISTENING TO THE LISTINGS , THAT YOU ARE VERY CONSCIOUS OF EVERYTHING YOU SAY-YOU JUST DO NOT WANT TO ACCEPT RESPONSIBILITY FOR YOUR ACTIONS. IT APPEARS THAT YOU ARE SAYING YOU ARE AT A LEVEL WHERE WHATEVER YOU SAY IS NON VOLITIONAL- IT'S GOING TO COME OUT NO MATTER WHAT FROM ANY ENTITY AND NO ONE HAS CONTROL OVER WHAT COMES OUT . BUT ITS NOT! EVERYTHING IS COMING OUT OF THIS "ENTITY' THAT IS YOU. I DON'T BELIEVE YOU HAVE REACHED THE LEVEL OF WHATEVER THIS "ONENESS" IS TO BE ABLE TO HIDE BEHIND "OH DID I JUST SAY THAT I DID NOT EVEN KNOW I SAID IT". YOU ARE STILL AMONGST THE REST OF US MORTALS- ACCEPT IT AND FOLLOW THE RULES WE MORTALS MUST FOLLOW. Sir, > This is a List for serious seekers of the Truth. > > San: > > Seriousness (of any kind, about anything) is a disease. > > Remember the dude Jesus prattling "It is the child who will enter my Dad's pad". > > > > I do > hope you will re-read your messages before posting and correct/replace > any unrequired words. > > > San: > > No. > There is no volition to do so, my friend. > > And you have the full right to disallow these posts, appearing on this List. > If that is to happen, that will happen, no matter what Sandeep or Gummuluru,does or does not. > > Are you getting me Gummuluru? > > This is in no way to curb your enthusiasm of posting. > > > San: > > "My" entusiasm????? > > > Please treat > this as a lecture hall on advaita and be considerate of the listeners > and of the sages of the ancient times and their teachings. > > > San: > Ahaaa Gummuluru, > > It's too late for this entity to be reverential to anything in phenomenality. > I am too busy enjoying the splendour of the show, both the profanity and the profoundity, which I put on for for myself. > > Who is the other, that I must revere? > > As the dude Dattatreya prattled in Avadhut Gita <g> > > How can I salute the Self, which is indestructible, which is all Bliss, which in Itself and by Itself pervades everything, and which is inseparable from Itself? > > I alone am, ever free from all taint. The world exists like a mirage within me. To whom shall I bow? > > > To whom shall I bow Gummuluru? > > Cheers > > Sandeep I THINK YOU ARE BOWING TO YOURSELF AND ENJOY ALL THIS ATTENTION. THE DANGER IN BELIEVING AND RECOGNIZING "I ALONE AM, FREE FROM ALL TAINT" AND THAT I DON'T HAV TO REVERE ANYONE IS, I BELIEVE THE HIGHEST FORM OF EGO BUILDING - WHICH I THINK MAKES YOU FEEL THAT YOU CAN SAY AND DO WHAT YOU WANT. NONE OF US ON THIS LIST CAN DO THAT, BECAUSE THOSE THAT CAN IDENTIFY THEMSELVES WITH THE "ONENESS" WILL NOT BE ABLE TO SAY "I ALONE AM, EVER FREE FROM TAINT ETC." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 24, 2001 Report Share Posted March 24, 2001 Hi Geetha, - Nirbhay and Geetha advaitin Sunday, March 25, 2001 12:20 AM Re: language used in the postings THIS IS MY FIRST AND LAST POSTING TO THIS ENTITY "SANDEEP". ALL MY COMMENTS ARE IN CAPITALS AND THERE ARE THREE POINTS ADDRESSED. Geetha Since that was the last communication to teh entity "Sandeep", may that entity thank you for your time and effort to respond back.<s> Cheers Sandeep Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 24, 2001 Report Share Posted March 24, 2001 Hi Raghava, Thank you for your words. - raghavakaluri advaitin Saturday, March 24, 2001 09:25 PM Re: language used in the postings <SNIP> Dear Respected Sir, Lord Krishna greeted each visitor by putting the visitor in a very high pedestal. Jesus washed the feet of the seekers. Swami Vivekananda did the same. Sister Nivedita took a broom and cleaned the streets of Calcutta. All this they did not just because to be humble, but because there is greater bliss and greater heroism in so doing. San: I don't agree with your conclusion, but let's take it as it is. So you are saying, that these dudes did what they, cleaning the streets, washing the feet, because there was something "higher" in these acts, "greater" bliss, "greater" heroism? And not that the very beingness of these dudes were such, that they were helpless to be or to act or to do otherwise. The same game. Do charity here, so that place in Swarg is reserved. A transaction. A bargain-hunt. There is no "higher" or "lower" bliss. Bliss IS or IS-not. And it has nothing to do whatsoever with an external act of doing. It is to do with one's beingness which can be blissfull or not. Out of a blissful beingness, whatever acts that gets done can only be in bliss whether it is washing somebody's feet or kicking Arjun's ass (figuratively speaking). When one's own Self is Bliss, and so long as the mirage still exists within one, to one's own Self shall one bow. San: True. And when the mirage no longer exists then? In my humble opinion, Sir. With Love, With a bow. Cheers Sandeep Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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