Guest guest Posted July 23, 2001 Report Share Posted July 23, 2001 Dear Friends, I am new member of this group. I strive to understand the Vedas and am here to share with you some of my views. I will begin by posting this note wherein I raise a few questions. Vedas is the eternal knowledge on all aspects of life. Human life can be characterized as a series of goals and the aim of the Vedic knowledge is to guide us in attaining these goals. Understanding of Vedas in turn rests on an understanding of Vedanta. It is my conviction that a solid understanding of Vedanta is the foundation for obtaining insights into the workings of the Nature, which orchestrates the play of life. What I would like to understand is, why is the Vedanta community, which comprises of some of the finest minds, with understanding of the Self, not very active in practical aspects of Vedas ? For example, with an understanding of Vedanta, from the higher point of view that a vedist has, it should be possible from him/her to develop a better approach to solutions to some of the challenging questions that face us. Examples: 1. How would a Vedist go about finding cure to deadly diseases like Cancer, Aids etc. 2. How would a Vedist go about finding a cure to the problem of Violence ? 3. What would a Vedist do to bring stability and peace, say, in India ? 4. How should a Vedist go about to tackle poverty and bring about economic prosperity ? 5. What should a vedist do to reduce or stop natural disasters like earthquake, cyclones .... 6. What should a vedist do to protect the environment ? Does this elite community feel that an understanding of Vedanta followed by insight into the Vedas, has nothing to offer on these aspects of human life that are impediments to human goals ? I see a lot of theory of Vedanta being discussed. And I am not denying the importance of the theory. But I don't quite agree with the "only theory and no practice" point of view. Vedanta has the reputation of being THAT KNOWLEDGE, which when known, EVERYTHING ELSE is known. I see little of that EVERYTHING ELSE being discussed by Vedantists. I fail to see why not apply the principles of Vedanta to address day to day problems like the ones listed above ? Imagine a situation, where the whole scientific community is busy explaining the subtleties and different philosophical points of view regarding the laws of physics and hardly anyone is researching into applying these laws to tackle the day to day needs of the society via Engineering. Are we sure this is not the state of affairs today in the arena of Vedic Knowledge ? Regards Shrinivas Gadkari Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Messenger http://phonecard./ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 23, 2001 Report Share Posted July 23, 2001 Dear Srinivas, Here is an attempt to give you a mundane answer. Pardon me if it is too obvious. Vedantins are not necessarily social reformers or nation-liberators. To say they are not practical and have done little to uplift society is rather unfair. Many in this Advaitin's group (who discuss Vedanta) are great scientists, engineers, doctors etc. themselves with great accomplishments in their respective areas of expertise which is probably serving humanity already! But that is not what they are discussing in this group. For that matter, neither the physicist,chemists, mathematicians, scientists of many ilk, economists, statesmen, or politicians, some of whom talk so much of uplifting human kind in the form of independence, democracy etc. etc., have really changed the fundamental problems of humanity, such as violence, aging, dying, warring, polluting, etc. Einstein's great scientific theories, proved much later to be true through experiments, did not solve any of the same problems you are mentioning. Vedanta is the study, understanding, and liberation of the "self" and therefore is very much subjective. If large number of people can liberate themselves from their "selves" through subjective and intense enquiry within themselves, most world problems will vanish. They may even control or postpone natural disasters! On the other hand, science is the study and understanding of the material world and universe around us and thus claims to be objective. It satisfies our intellect and incidentally benefits humanity technologically, but rarely transforms people from violence to non-violence, etc. Since many of the Advaitin group members (as I have indicated earlier) are already contributing to the scientific and other objective material improvement of humanity, their quest for "liberation of self" as an adjunct to their life should really be lauded. -- Vis --------------------- - "Shrinivas Gadkari" <sgadkari2001 <advaitin> Monday, July 23, 2001 3:27 PM A few Questions ........I raise a few questions. > >What I would like to understand is, why > is the Vedanta > community, which comprises of some of the finest > minds, with understanding > of the Self, not very active in practical aspects of > Vedas ? > For example, with an understanding of Vedanta, from > the higher point > of view that a vedist has, it should be possible from > him/her > to develop a better approach to solutions to some of > the challenging > questions that face us. > > Examples: > > 1. How would a Vedist go about finding cure to deadly > diseases like > Cancer, Aids etc. > > 2. How would a Vedist go about finding a cure to the > problem of Violence ? > > 3. What would a Vedist do to bring stability and > peace, say, in India ? > > 4. How should a Vedist go about to tackle poverty and > bring about economic > prosperity ? > > 5. What should a vedist do to reduce or stop natural > disasters like > earthquake, cyclones .... > > 6. What should a vedist do to protect the environment > ? > > Does this elite community feel that an understanding > of Vedanta followed > by insight into the Vedas, has nothing to offer on > these aspects of human > life that are impediments to human goals ? I see a lot > of theory of Vedanta > being discussed. And I am not denying the importance > of the theory. But > I don't quite agree with the "only theory and no > practice" point of view. > Vedanta has the reputation of being THAT KNOWLEDGE, > which when known, > EVERYTHING ELSE is known. I see little of that > EVERYTHING ELSE being > discussed by Vedantists. I fail to see why not apply > the principles of > Vedanta to address day to day problems like the ones > listed above ? > > Imagine a situation, where the whole scientific > community is busy explaining > the subtleties and different philosophical points of > view regarding > the laws of physics and hardly anyone is researching > into applying these > laws to tackle the day to day needs of the society via > Engineering. > Are we sure this is not the state of affairs today in > the arena of Vedic > Knowledge ? > > Regards > Shrinivas Gadkari > > > > Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Messenger > http://phonecard./ > > > > Discussion of Shankara's Advaita Vedanta Philosophy of nonseparablity of Atman and Brahman. > Advaitin List Archives available at: http://www.eScribe.com/culture/advaitin/ > To Post a message send an email to : advaitin > Messages Archived at: advaitin/messages > > > > Your use of is subject to > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 24, 2001 Report Share Posted July 24, 2001 On Mon, 23 Jul 2001, Shrinivas Gadkari wrote: > Dear Friends, > > I am new member of this group. I strive to understand > the Vedas and > am here to share with you some of my views. I will > begin by posting > this note wherein I raise a few questions. > > [...] > What I would like to understand is, why > is the Vedanta > community, which comprises of some of the finest > minds, with understanding > of the Self, not very active in practical aspects of > Vedas ? > For example, with an understanding of Vedanta, from > the higher point > of view that a vedist has, it should be possible from > him/her > to develop a better approach to solutions to some of > the challenging > questions that face us. > namaste shri srinivas-ji, welcome to the List. I like to put my understanding on your question. If we are genuine and serious students of vedAnta, we are blessed with sAdhanacatuShTayam. Part of it is nityAnityavastuviveka. The so-called problems of the jagat are anitya. They come and go and are not real problems. All these can be traced to avidyA and that is the only one that need to be solved. Another part of sAdhanacatuShTayam is vairAgya, dispassion. shri shankara defines vairAgya in aparokshAnubhUti as follows: The indifference with which one treats the excreta of a crow - such an indifference to all objects of enjoyment from the realm of brahma to this world (in view of their perishable nature), is verily called pure vairAgya. Thus, what are called worldly problems are not of interest to a pure vedAntin. At least, that is my understanding of *why* vedAntins (advaitins) are indifferent to what are called worldly problems. > [...] > > Regards > Shrinivas Gadkari > Regards Gummuluru Murthy -- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 24, 2001 Report Share Posted July 24, 2001 Namaskar Shrinivas and Others. I think I understand one of your main questions which was as follows > Vedanta has the reputation of being THAT KNOWLEDGE, > which when known, > EVERYTHING ELSE is known. I see little of that > EVERYTHING ELSE being > discussed by Vedantists. I fail to see why not apply > the principles of > Vedanta to address day to day problems like the ones > listed above ? I used to have the same question for some time. The problem with the question is that when it is said that by knowing atma everything else is known, there is an implied meaning. If taken literally, it is not true. Knowledge of atma or consciousness is radically different from other kinds of knowledge. Regular knowledge is knowledge of attributes. The object is never known, only its attributes are. For example, if I say, I know my hand - it means that I know its shape color texture size etc. It is always a knowledge of attributes of the object. Atma or consciousness has no parts or attributes- so atma knowledge is not a knowledge of its attributes. It is actually a realization of the atma at once. It is not knowledge in the mundane sense of the word. Interestingly enough, no object can also be really known because its attributes have attributes themselves in an unending chain. The truth is that the object is also actually atma and its attributes are mithya. So you see, atma knowledge is a knowledge of the true nature of things. It does not give one any mundane knowledge. To gain mundane knowledge of things - the scientific method is the best way to go. So to answer your questions about how a vedist would this or that - he would do it like a normal man would. Perhaps the only difference is that the vedist will have a serene mind because he also knows the truth of the matter. Varma. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 24, 2001 Report Share Posted July 24, 2001 Namaskar. Swami Vivekananda considered the problems of poverty, slavery, and illiteracy to be very important Sri Rama, Raja Janak though that the problems of the weak and poor are important. The list of vedantins dedicated to human upliftment is endless. One anecdote (from my teacher's teacher) comes to mind: The king and his vedanta teacher went to the jungle for an evening out. The teacher was talking about satya and mithya, when a lion came out of nowhere. The teacher said to the kig, "Run! as fast as you can." Both the king and teacher ran. The teacher ran faster than the king. However, they both reached and climbed a tall tree. After catching his breath the king asked, "Teacher. You said that everything is mithya. Then why did you run and make me run from the mithya lion." The teacher said, "O King! you are very wise. But when did I say that our running was satya. Our running was also mithya." ;-) Moral of the story: For a mithya problem use a mithya solution. Varma Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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