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Dear Friends,

 

I am new member of this group. I strive to understand

the Vedas and

am here to share with you some of my views. I will

begin by posting

this note wherein I raise a few questions.

 

Vedas is the eternal knowledge on all aspects of life.

Human life

can be characterized as a series of goals and the aim

of the Vedic

knowledge is to guide us in attaining these goals.

Understanding of

Vedas in turn rests on an understanding of Vedanta. It

is my conviction

that a solid understanding of Vedanta is the

foundation for obtaining

insights into the workings of the Nature, which

orchestrates the

play of life. What I would like to understand is, why

is the Vedanta

community, which comprises of some of the finest

minds, with understanding

of the Self, not very active in practical aspects of

Vedas ?

For example, with an understanding of Vedanta, from

the higher point

of view that a vedist has, it should be possible from

him/her

to develop a better approach to solutions to some of

the challenging

questions that face us.

 

Examples:

 

1. How would a Vedist go about finding cure to deadly

diseases like

Cancer, Aids etc.

 

2. How would a Vedist go about finding a cure to the

problem of Violence ?

 

3. What would a Vedist do to bring stability and

peace, say, in India ?

 

4. How should a Vedist go about to tackle poverty and

bring about economic

prosperity ?

 

5. What should a vedist do to reduce or stop natural

disasters like

earthquake, cyclones ....

 

6. What should a vedist do to protect the environment

?

 

Does this elite community feel that an understanding

of Vedanta followed

by insight into the Vedas, has nothing to offer on

these aspects of human

life that are impediments to human goals ? I see a lot

of theory of Vedanta

being discussed. And I am not denying the importance

of the theory. But

I don't quite agree with the "only theory and no

practice" point of view.

Vedanta has the reputation of being THAT KNOWLEDGE,

which when known,

EVERYTHING ELSE is known. I see little of that

EVERYTHING ELSE being

discussed by Vedantists. I fail to see why not apply

the principles of

Vedanta to address day to day problems like the ones

listed above ?

 

Imagine a situation, where the whole scientific

community is busy explaining

the subtleties and different philosophical points of

view regarding

the laws of physics and hardly anyone is researching

into applying these

laws to tackle the day to day needs of the society via

Engineering.

Are we sure this is not the state of affairs today in

the arena of Vedic

Knowledge ?

 

Regards

Shrinivas Gadkari

 

 

 

Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Messenger

http://phonecard./

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Dear Srinivas,

Here is an attempt to give you a mundane answer. Pardon me if it is too

obvious.

 

Vedantins are not necessarily social reformers or nation-liberators. To say

they are not practical and have done little to uplift society is rather

unfair. Many in this Advaitin's group (who discuss Vedanta) are great

scientists, engineers, doctors etc. themselves with great accomplishments in

their respective areas of expertise which is probably serving humanity

already! But that is not what they are discussing in this group.

 

For that matter, neither the physicist,chemists, mathematicians, scientists

of many ilk, economists, statesmen, or politicians, some of whom talk so

much of uplifting human kind in the form of independence, democracy etc.

etc., have really changed the fundamental problems of humanity, such as

violence, aging, dying, warring, polluting, etc. Einstein's great scientific

theories, proved much later to be true through experiments, did not solve

any of the same problems you are mentioning.

 

Vedanta is the study, understanding, and liberation of the "self" and

therefore is very much subjective. If large number of people can liberate

themselves from their "selves" through subjective and intense enquiry within

themselves, most world problems will vanish. They may even control or

postpone natural disasters!

On the other hand, science is the study and understanding of the material

world and universe around us and thus claims to be objective. It satisfies

our intellect and incidentally benefits humanity technologically, but rarely

transforms people from violence to non-violence, etc.

 

Since many of the Advaitin group members (as I have indicated earlier) are

already contributing to the scientific and other objective material

improvement of humanity, their quest for "liberation of self" as an adjunct

to their life should really be lauded.

-- Vis

---------------------

 

-

"Shrinivas Gadkari" <sgadkari2001

<advaitin>

Monday, July 23, 2001 3:27 PM

A few Questions

........I raise a few questions.

>

>What I would like to understand is, why

> is the Vedanta

> community, which comprises of some of the finest

> minds, with understanding

> of the Self, not very active in practical aspects of

> Vedas ?

> For example, with an understanding of Vedanta, from

> the higher point

> of view that a vedist has, it should be possible from

> him/her

> to develop a better approach to solutions to some of

> the challenging

> questions that face us.

>

> Examples:

>

> 1. How would a Vedist go about finding cure to deadly

> diseases like

> Cancer, Aids etc.

>

> 2. How would a Vedist go about finding a cure to the

> problem of Violence ?

>

> 3. What would a Vedist do to bring stability and

> peace, say, in India ?

>

> 4. How should a Vedist go about to tackle poverty and

> bring about economic

> prosperity ?

>

> 5. What should a vedist do to reduce or stop natural

> disasters like

> earthquake, cyclones ....

>

> 6. What should a vedist do to protect the environment

> ?

>

> Does this elite community feel that an understanding

> of Vedanta followed

> by insight into the Vedas, has nothing to offer on

> these aspects of human

> life that are impediments to human goals ? I see a lot

> of theory of Vedanta

> being discussed. And I am not denying the importance

> of the theory. But

> I don't quite agree with the "only theory and no

> practice" point of view.

> Vedanta has the reputation of being THAT KNOWLEDGE,

> which when known,

> EVERYTHING ELSE is known. I see little of that

> EVERYTHING ELSE being

> discussed by Vedantists. I fail to see why not apply

> the principles of

> Vedanta to address day to day problems like the ones

> listed above ?

>

> Imagine a situation, where the whole scientific

> community is busy explaining

> the subtleties and different philosophical points of

> view regarding

> the laws of physics and hardly anyone is researching

> into applying these

> laws to tackle the day to day needs of the society via

> Engineering.

> Are we sure this is not the state of affairs today in

> the arena of Vedic

> Knowledge ?

>

> Regards

> Shrinivas Gadkari

>

>

>

> Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Messenger

> http://phonecard./

>

>

>

> Discussion of Shankara's Advaita Vedanta Philosophy of nonseparablity of

Atman and Brahman.

> Advaitin List Archives available at:

http://www.eScribe.com/culture/advaitin/

> To Post a message send an email to : advaitin

> Messages Archived at: advaitin/messages

>

>

>

> Your use of is subject to

>

>

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On Mon, 23 Jul 2001, Shrinivas Gadkari wrote:

> Dear Friends,

>

> I am new member of this group. I strive to understand

> the Vedas and

> am here to share with you some of my views. I will

> begin by posting

> this note wherein I raise a few questions.

>

> [...]

> What I would like to understand is, why

> is the Vedanta

> community, which comprises of some of the finest

> minds, with understanding

> of the Self, not very active in practical aspects of

> Vedas ?

> For example, with an understanding of Vedanta, from

> the higher point

> of view that a vedist has, it should be possible from

> him/her

> to develop a better approach to solutions to some of

> the challenging

> questions that face us.

>

 

namaste shri srinivas-ji,

 

welcome to the List. I like to put my understanding on

your question.

 

If we are genuine and serious students of vedAnta, we are

blessed with sAdhanacatuShTayam.

 

Part of it is nityAnityavastuviveka. The so-called problems

of the jagat are anitya. They come and go and are not real

problems. All these can be traced to avidyA and that is the

only one that need to be solved.

 

Another part of sAdhanacatuShTayam is vairAgya, dispassion.

shri shankara defines vairAgya in aparokshAnubhUti as follows:

 

The indifference with which one treats the excreta of a crow -

such an indifference to all objects of enjoyment from the

realm of brahma to this world (in view of their perishable

nature), is verily called pure vairAgya.

 

Thus, what are called worldly problems are not of interest

to a pure vedAntin. At least, that is my understanding of

*why* vedAntins (advaitins) are indifferent to what are

called worldly problems.

> [...]

>

> Regards

> Shrinivas Gadkari

>

 

Regards

Gummuluru Murthy

--

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Namaskar Shrinivas and Others.

 

I think I understand one of your main questions which was as follows

> Vedanta has the reputation of being THAT KNOWLEDGE,

> which when known,

> EVERYTHING ELSE is known. I see little of that

> EVERYTHING ELSE being

> discussed by Vedantists. I fail to see why not apply

> the principles of

> Vedanta to address day to day problems like the ones

> listed above ?

 

I used to have the same question for some time. The problem with the

question is that when it is said that by knowing atma everything else

is known, there is an implied meaning. If taken literally, it is not

true.

 

Knowledge of atma or consciousness is radically different from other

kinds of knowledge.

 

Regular knowledge is knowledge of attributes. The object is never

known, only its attributes are. For example, if I say, I know my

hand - it means that I know its shape color texture size etc. It is

always a knowledge of attributes of the object.

 

Atma or consciousness has no parts or attributes- so atma knowledge

is not a knowledge of its attributes. It is actually a realization of

the atma at once. It is not knowledge in the mundane sense of the

word.

 

Interestingly enough, no object can also be really known because its

attributes have attributes themselves in an unending chain. The truth

is that the object is also actually atma and its attributes are

mithya.

 

So you see, atma knowledge is a knowledge of the true nature of

things. It does not give one any mundane knowledge.

 

To gain mundane knowledge of things - the scientific method is the

best way to go. So to answer your questions about how a vedist would

this or that - he would do it like a normal man would.

 

Perhaps the only difference is that the vedist will have a serene

mind because he also knows the truth of the matter.

 

 

Varma.

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Namaskar.

 

Swami Vivekananda considered the problems of poverty, slavery, and

illiteracy to be very important

 

Sri Rama, Raja Janak though that the problems of the weak and poor

are important.

 

The list of vedantins dedicated to human upliftment is endless.

 

One anecdote (from my teacher's teacher) comes to mind:

 

The king and his vedanta teacher went to the jungle for an evening

out. The teacher was talking about satya and mithya, when a lion came

out of nowhere. The teacher said to the kig, "Run! as fast as you

can." Both the king and teacher ran. The teacher ran faster than the

king. However, they both reached and climbed a tall tree. After

catching his breath the king asked, "Teacher. You said that

everything is mithya. Then why did you run and make me run from the

mithya lion."

The teacher said, "O King! you are very wise. But when did I say that

our running was satya. Our running was also mithya." ;-)

 

Moral of the story: For a mithya problem use a mithya solution.

 

 

Varma

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