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namaste.

 

I am trying to understand Chandogya upanishad vi.3.2.

It says

 

seyaM devataikshata, hantAham imAs tisro devatA anena

jIvenA'tmAnA'nupravishya nAmarUpe vyAkaravANIti

 

S. Radhakrishnan's translation is

 

That divinity thought, 'Well, let me enter into these three

divinities by means of this living self and let me then develop

names and forms.'

 

[The three divinities referred are the living beings having

only three origins: those born from an egg, born from a living

being, born from a sprout.]

 

Now, my question is:

 

Is there creation from HiraNyagarbha to the minutest mosquito

or even the unmoving things, and *then* brahman entered into

these, or is it, brahman transforms itself into each of these

things (of name and form) by mAyA? i.e., did the creation take

place and *then* name and form emanated or is this a simultaneous

process?

 

Or, put in other words:

 

How did this *entry* (referred in Ch. u. iv.3.2) take place?

Is this "entry" post-creation?

 

or, is by the *entry*, it is meant just like snake "entered"

the rope, i.e. as we mistake the rope for a snake? i.e.

snake has "entered" the rope?

 

Any clarifications?

 

 

Regards

Gummuluru Murthy

---

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Namsate Murthy-Ji,

 

If I may ask you to rephrase your question in general terms,

without any reference to the upanishad it might help

providing a better answer. For when a question regarding

say a topic like creation, is posed the way you have posed

your question, one is forced to answer it within the framework

that the Rishi of the particular quote had in mind. Thus

limiting the scope of the inquiry.

 

Regards

Shrinivas

> I am trying to understand Chandogya upanishad vi.3.2.

> It says

>

> seyaM devataikshata, hantAham imAs tisro devatA anena

> jIvenA'tmAnA'nupravishya nAmarUpe vyAkaravANIti

>

> S. Radhakrishnan's translation is

>

> That divinity thought, 'Well, let me enter into these three

> divinities by means of this living self and let me then develop

> names and forms.'

>

> [The three divinities referred are the living beings having

> only three origins: those born from an egg, born from a living

> being, born from a sprout.]

>

> Now, my question is:

>

> Is there creation from HiraNyagarbha to the minutest mosquito

> or even the unmoving things, and *then* brahman entered into

> these, or is it, brahman transforms itself into each of these

> things (of name and form) by mAyA? i.e., did the creation take

> place and *then* name and form emanated or is this a simultaneous

> process?

>

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On Fri, 28 Sep 2001 sgadkari2001 wrote:

> Namsate Murthy-Ji,

>

> If I may ask you to rephrase your question in general terms,

> without any reference to the upanishad it might help

> providing a better answer. For when a question regarding

> say a topic like creation, is posed the way you have posed

> your question, one is forced to answer it within the framework

> that the Rishi of the particular quote had in mind. Thus

> limiting the scope of the inquiry.

>

> Regards

> Shrinivas

>

 

namaste shri Shrinivas-ji,

 

I see your point. My question arose out of my attempt to

understand ch.u. statement and hence the question is put

that way.

 

Any comment you may have in a much more general perspective,

I am sure, will be useful for the over-all understanding.

 

Regards

Gummuluru Murthy

--------------------------------

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Namaste Murthy Garu,

 

The three devataa-s refer to the three elements - fire,

water and earth; and not to the creatures. [Radhakrishnan -Principal

Upanishads, p. 450 [Allen & Unwin, 4th impression 1974]; there is a 19

line explanation after the translation.

 

The mantra is also taken up in Brahmasutra Bhashya

II:iii:17; II:iv:20; and III:ii:6 & 21.

 

Regards,

 

sunder

 

 

advaitin, Gummuluru Murthy <gmurthy@m...> wrote:

>

> namaste.

>

> I am trying to understand Chandogya upanishad vi.3.2.

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advaitin, Gummuluru Murthy <gmurthy@m...> wrote:

>

> S. Radhakrishnan's translation is

>

> That divinity thought, 'Well, let me enter into these three

> divinities by means of this living self and let me then develop

> names and forms.'

>

> [The three divinities referred are the living beings having

> only three origins: those born from an egg, born from a living

> being, born from a sprout.]

>

 

Namaste Shri Murthy-Ji,

 

I do not have access to Chandogya upanishad, hence can't

refer to the context of this quote, however Shri Suder-Ji's

interpretation of the three divinities as elements seems

very appropriate.

> Now, my question is:

>

> Is there creation from HiraNyagarbha to the minutest mosquito

> or even the unmoving things, and *then* brahman entered into

> these, or is it, brahman transforms itself into each of these

> things (of name and form) by mAyA? i.e., did the creation take

> place and *then* name and form emanated or is this a simultaneous

> process?

>

> Or, put in other words:

>

> How did this *entry* (referred in Ch. u. iv.3.2) take place?

> Is this "entry" post-creation?

>

> or, is by the *entry*, it is meant just like snake "entered"

> the rope, i.e. as we mistake the rope for a snake? i.e.

> snake has "entered" the rope?

>

> Any clarifications?

>

 

Now once we interpret the divinities as elements, we can

read it as:

That divinity thought, 'Well, let me enter into these

elements, by uniting this living self with them. With

the elements under control, I can then create any object

of name and form'.

 

This quote seems to be directed at students of yoga aspiring

to conquer elements rather than an account of Hiranyagarbha's

creation.

 

Since I have not referred to the Upanishad, I may be wrong.

 

Warm regards

Shrinivas

 

p.s.

 

A Note on Hiranyagarbha's creation:

This topic needs more attention from students of Vedas.

A modern Vedist faces a serious problem. There is an

account of creation in Puranas, there is this theory

of creation proceeding from sound, there is the Sankhya

description of creation. Plus there is evidence from

cosmology pointing at something like a big bang model,

there is irrefutable proof in support of evolution,

there are reasons to believe that several billion

years ago earth did not exist, statements like "there

was water all over before creation" need a major

re-interpretation if not rejection. A modern student

of Vedas has to address all these issues satisfactorily

if he is to be taken seriously.

 

I will try to post something on this topic. If members

of this forum are interested we can hopefully make some

progress on this issue.

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