Guest guest Posted December 18, 2001 Report Share Posted December 18, 2001 Namaste: After writing my thoughts in the earlier post, I recognize that my discussion needs additional clarifications. Let me start with some examples. Suppose we are standing on the banks of a river and suddenly, a child fell on the river. Someone immeditely jumps on the river and saves the child. This action is free from selfish desire if it is spontaneous. A spontaneous action is free from lingering effects of such an action. When the flower blooms, it does not expect any praise any one and it does not conduct a cost/benefit analysis of its action. The saving of the child brings internal happiness to the actor and also externally everyone around the banks of the river including the parents, relatives and friends of the child are also happy. Spontenity implies that the attitude of the actor before and after the karma is unaffected. Also the child and everyone else is not obligated to return favors to the actor. The karma as exhibited above will qualify as Karma Yoga and there will be no lingering effects. There was a disturbance of peace when the child fell and peace can be reestablished by Karma Yoga described as above. After the act, if the actor demands favors from the society (parents, relatives, friends and others)there will be lingering effects and peace is permanantly disturbed. Karma and Dharma All acts of Karma are subject to within the confinement of established Dharma. Suppose a mother pushes the child into the river and someone jumps to save the child. By saving the child the person may be happy but the mother who wanted to get rid of the child may be unhappy. Then what should the actor do under those circumstances? Really speaking there are no conflict in this situation because the actor is bounded by the Dharma and accordingly he should choose to save the child. The Dharmic rules demand that the duty of the mother is to protect the child. The same Dharma expects the mother to feel happy with the child rather than without the child. In other words, all karmas are fully synchornized with the Dharma. In Bhagavad Gita, Dharma is fundamental and Karma without following the Dharma is always forbidden. The primary objective of the Mahabharat war is to reestablish Dharma and this is why Bhagawan insisted Arjuna to fight the war. It should be also pointed out that Dharma consists of Societal Dharma and Individual Dharma (Swadharma). The Swadharma is defined by the individual (within the Societal Dharma) to suit individual constraints, circumstances and also time. The rules of Dharma for a child, a handicapped or a sick person etc. are different from the general societal Dharma. warmest regards, Ram Chandran Note: I have to admit the above discussion is still complete and let me request the silent scholars to continue the discussion. advaitin, "ramvchandran" <rchandran@c...> wrote: > Namaste Narendraji: > >.. All Jivamuktas > have to conduct their daily duties (nithya karmas), however their > actions will not have the `lingering effects.' In other words, they > conduct their karmas (actions) without karma (free from the effects > of their actions). To conclude, the Jnanis (Karma Yogis) are able > > get liberated from the effects spelled out by the `karma theory.' > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 19, 2001 Report Share Posted December 19, 2001 ============================================================= This article is emailed to you by Ram Chandran ( rchandran ) ============================================================= Source: The Hindu (http://www.hinduonnet.com) Miscellaneous - Religion Unique exemplar of bridal mysticism CHENNAI, DEC. 20. Among the auspicious qualities of the Supreme Being His easy accessibility (Saulabhya) becomes paramount in man's redemption from bondage. Human beings cannot revel in God's excellences unless He deigns to allow Himself to be approachable. Saints and mystics emphasise this trait very much from their own experiences. Of the several manifestations of the Almighty it was during His incarnation in human form as Krishna that He was most accessible. He chose to be born in the cowherd community of Gokul and spent the better part of His childhood and youth there. His childhood deeds have spurred the imagination and devotion of every devotee who has been drawn to them. Lord Krishna has also inspired mystics, especially Azhwars, to experience the unique form of bridal mysticism, in which all the souls are considered as female in relation to the Supreme Being, who is the only man (Purushottama). While Nammazhwar and Tirumangai Azhwar also have revelled in this form of mysticism, in Andal's case this emotion was natural. Her hymns, the Tiruppavai and the Nacchiar Tirumozhi, are thus exceptional works in the genre of bridal mysticism. Her advent and spiritual ministry also testify to this. If the other Azhwars were steeped in the bliss of God experience by constantly remembering Him, in the case of Vishnuchitta, Andal's father, the Almighty remembered him. God singled him out for a special favour when Bhu Devi, His consort, manifested in the world as Andal to spread the glory of love and devotion to the Lord, said Kalyanapuram Sri R.Aravamudan in his Harikatha. Inspired by the Bhagavata Purana which describes the childhood deeds of Lord Krishna, Vishnuchitta's experience of God took on the form of parental love (Vatsalya) and his hymn of benediction on Him earned him the sobriquet ``Periazhwar''. He performed service to the deity of his native village Srivilliputtur by adorning Him with flower garlands from the garden he tended. And, it was under a Tulasi plant in his garden that he found Andal as a babe and started lavishing his love on Her. Named as Goda, She grew up listening to the glory of Lord Krishna and identified Herself totally with the Gopis and declared She would wed only the Lord and not any human. The turning point in Her life came when She was caught red-handed by Her father for wearing the garland meant for the deity. What Periazhwar thought was a sacrilege became Her privilege when the Lord demanded the garland worn by Her. The hymns Tiruppavai and the Nacchiar Tirumozhi describe Her spiritual experiences. Copyrights: 1995 - 2001 The Hindu Republication or redissemination of the contents of this screen are expressly prohibited without the consent of The Hindu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 20, 2001 Report Share Posted December 20, 2001 Namaste, Although inadequate to comment authoritatively on this matter, this and subsequent verses have formed a major part of my own meditation on the Gita. I understand from this that the difficulty arises through the confusion that arises when one, through performing actions, begins to believe that he is the cause of the action, the doer, that he can, therefore, influence in some way the outcome of that action. Only the supreme can, in fact, DO anything, in the sense that all outcomes are possible. The conditioned entity has only a limited range of possibilities available, depending on individual karma and subject to physical laws. Only the supreme is beyond this. However, we have been gifted with (limited) intelligence with which we can attempt to break free of the never ending cycle of action and reaction. Sri Tejomayananda's conclusion that one must have an objective, and have that objective always before him if one is to lead a fruitful life, is correct in that the appropriate use of intelligence is to use it to approach the supreme and to free ourselves from samsara. This motive is not, to my mind, selfish. It is right action, right motive. To achieve real intelligence, to know the self and to know the supreme, benefits not only the individual entity, but all living entities. Alana > > jaynkbali [sMTP:jaynkbali] > Tuesday, 18 December 2001 19:09 > advaitin > Re: Article sent from The Hindu > > respected scholars of the group > > Lord Krishna has said in adhayaya 5 shloka 12 > > 'He who works with a selfish motive, being attatched to fruit of > actions through desire, gets tied down.' > > you may refer this shloka in > http://in.geocities.com/gitabykrishna/index_text.html > > and then > > > ``Anyone who wants to lead a fruitful life must > > have a vision before him and must engage in action with the > > objective of realising this vision,'' was how Swami Tejomayananda > > summed up the Gita way of life. > > now > > 'To act with an eye on ojective' > > is this not a selfish motive > > i am confused; > > can any body help > > nkbali > > > > advaitin, thehindu@v... wrote: > > This article summarizes the view points from Bhagavad Gita by Swami > Tejomayanandaji, the current Head of the Chinmaya Mission. Swamiji > forcefully argues that Arjuna's problem was mostly due to the fact he > didn't have a vision for the Mahabharat War. Lord Krishna through the > conversation helps Arjuna to realize the vision. With the vision, the > mission became quite for Arjun. > > > > warmest regards, > > > > Ram Chandran > > ============================================================= > > This article is emailed to you by Ram Chandran ( rchandran@c... ) > > ============================================================= > > Source: The Hindu (http://www.hinduonnet.com) > > > > Man's action must be guided by vision > > > > CHENNAI, NOV. 20. ``Anyone who wants to lead a fruitful life must > > have a vision before him and must engage in action with the > > objective of realising this vision,'' was how Swami Tejomayananda > > summed up the Gita way of life. The Bhagavad Gita is one of the > > most popular scriptural texts. Its importance is well- > > acknowledged but a person who wants to follow it must pause and > > consider what the Gita means to him to translate its teachings > > into his life. To have a vision and not engage in action amounts > > to a daydream, whereas, action without a vision will tantamount > > to groping in the darkness. > > > > Without visualising what an individual wants to achieve in his > > life, if he engages in action he will drift aimlessly. The > > problem with Arjuna was that he lacked a vision. He had only > > action in his mind when he came to the battlefield, vengeance to > > be precise, to rout the Kauravas and get back the kingdom. But, > > when he stood before the Kaurava army, just when the war was > > about to begin he developed cold feet. Totally shattered seeing > > all his relations arrayed in battle, his bow slipped from his > > hand and his mind was in a whirl. He told Lord Krishna that there > > was no point in coveting a victory that would be the end of his > > kinsmen. > > > > In his discourse, Swami Ishwarananda said it was lack of vision > > that made Arjuna withdraw from action but providentially Lord > > Krishna was by his side to steer him through his dilemma. Arjuna > > then submitted to the Lord beseeching Him, ``My natural > > disposition is vitiated by a sense of pity and my mind is in > > utter confusion regarding my duty. Tell me with certainty what > > will lead to my good; I am Your disciple. Instruct me, who have > > taken refuge in You.'' The majority go about performing actions > > in day-to-day life mechanically without reflecting on where they > > are heading or even on what they are doing. Maybe a crisis > > occasionally shakes their complacence to contemplate on the > > meaning of life. There are some moments of wisdom as during a > > Satsangh (in the company of saints) and endeavour to lead a > > fruitful life but no sustained effort in that direction. > > > > We are familiar with action but not with the intention behind our > > actions. This was the reason for Arjuna's dilemma and the Lord > > who knew his problem did not tell him not to fight. Instead, He > > wanted Arjuna to realise that it was his intention (vengeance) > > which was not right. He engaged him in a long conversation so > > that he would gain the right vision and gave him the choice to > > act rightly. > > > > Copyrights: 1995 - 2001 The Hindu > > > > Republication or redissemination of the contents of this screen are > expressly > > prohibited without the consent of The Hindu > > > > Discussion of Shankara's Advaita Vedanta Philosophy of nonseparablity of > Atman and Brahman. > Advaitin List Archives available at: > http://www.eScribe.com/culture/advaitin/ > To Post a message send an email to : advaitin > Messages Archived at: advaitin/messages > > > > Your use of is subject to > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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