Neo Advaita

February 28, 2002

Hullo Greg and Namaste

Boy, you really thrashed the "neo-advaita" movement. "concepts from advaita such

as "consciousnessyour true naturebeingblisshappiness" are used and

watered-down."

Watered down eh? Like a milkman who adds water to the baby's milk, or a publican

who adds water to the good brew. Wouldn't there be some regulation against that,

under the consumer protection statutes?

"And many of them return to doing therapy when the satsang gig doesn't pay off."

Gig, eh? Like a third-rate rock singer who is only in it for the money and the

groupies and the drugs.

Greg, you are a master of invective. Are you a journalist, perhaps?

And which of the two whom I mentioned, Sri Krishna Menon or Francis Lucille, is

most worthy of your Samurai-like evisceration?

Francis is a mate of mine, but of course you are perfectly entitled to trash him

if you want to.

But what do you know of him? Have you ever attended any retreats with him? Have

you ever had a sincere discussion with him? Have you really, in the course of

such a discussion, found him to be shallow and lacking in subtlety?

But let's pass on to Krishna Menon. I have in front of me a book entitled

"Spiritual Discourses of Sree Atmananda, part one. Underneath the title it is

written, Duly Approved by Sree Atmananda.

I copy from the introduction by Nitya Tripta:

"He had a two-fold mission in life. The first part of it - in his own words -

was to expound the highest Truth, the ultimate Reality, in a manner and language

understandable even to the kitchen maid. It is the belief of most men and

pundits that a high proficiency in Sanskrit is the first pre-requisite of

knowing the Truth. They believe also that the Truth can be expounded only in

high-sounding and abstruse philosophical terms, technicalities and

terminologies. The numerous vedantic sastras of a cosmological type (or course

with rare exceptions) have contributed much to the growth of this pernicious

superstition. Sree Atmananda, who was not a Sanskrit Scholar himself, has

successfully dispelled this wrong notion, both by His writings and His

discourses. His two books, "Atmadarshan and Atmanirvriti, written originally in

Malayam verse and which expound the ultimate Truth from various standpoints, are

limpidly clear and simple. Most of the verses are written in the briefest and

simplest rhythm. They are so natural they read like poetic prose. The English

rendering of the two books by the author himself, though not in verse form, is

equally simple and clear. Abstruse Sanskrit terminology has been avoided. He

expounded the ultimate Truth even to illiterate women and children in simple

Malayam language, and to great lawyers, scientists and philosophers from home

and abroad in simple and elegant English.

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The second part of his mission was to re-establish the dignity of the

householder and his birthright to strive and to be liberated, while still

remaining a householder. Since the time of Sree Sankara the fold of Sanyas began

to be looked upon with particular respect and regard by the people. Inflated by

this undeserved title for reverence, some of these Sanyasins began to assert and

proclaim that liberation is the monopoly of Sanyasins alone and that the

householder is not even eligible for it. In their wild fury (strong language

that, W) they even forgot the undeniable fact that the founders of the spiritual

heritage of India were most of them householders (Sree Janaka, Sree Vasishta,

Sree Vyasa, Sree Rama, Sree Krishna, and the authors of the Upanishads). The

aphorism, Tatwamsi, which is being meditated upon by every Sanyasin, was first

composed and expounded by the householder-sage Uddalaka, to his son and disciple

Swetaketu. There is no data for any argument in favour of the Sanyasins' stand;

but their capacity for mischief cannot be gainsaid. Therefore a solitary yet

glowing example in the course of several centuries often becomes necessary to

blot out such superstitions. Such was the life of Sree Atmananda the Sage. He

was an ideal Police Officer,

(upright and fearless, who ruled his subordinates as well as the criminals under

his charge by love and love alone) and an ideal Guru to his disciples in all the

continents of the world.

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He asserted that one's own perspective alone had to be set right. He always

stressed the point that the answer to any question of an objective nature was

never complete until it was ultimately applied to the subject; and the question

had to be disposed of in the light of the ultimate Reality - the Self.

Greg, that is language much stronger than I would use. But I would make this

point, that if I were looking for someone to guard me if I walked through a

dangerous district I would much prefer to have someone who actually knew how to

fight and run and handle tricky situations without losing his cool. I would not

want someone who, though he had written books on the conduct and psychology of

combat, couldn't fight, couldn't shoot and whose knees turned to water at the

first hint of danger. There are those who know and do and are, and there are

those who only know the theory. I think theory is good, I love it, but it comes

a pretty poor second.

Cheers

Warwick

Original posting

Shri Warwick - you said something interesting the other day. That you learned

most of what you know about advaita from dialogues with Francis Lucille and by

reading Krishna Menon. The former I have known since 1995, and the latter is my

Advaita sat-guru. So I think I might know where you're coming from in looking

at this forum.

There are two different kinds of approaches that are called "advaita" -- the

formal, and the Westernized "neo-advaita."

The formal advaita Vedanta is based on the scriptures, and is represented by

Shankara's teachings. It is the basis for this mailing list. And

traditionally, before one embarks upon the study of this formal discipline,

there are years and years of spiritual practice (usually in Hinduism). Indeed,

in the text called TATTVA BODHA, Shankara gives a list of characteristics for

the ideal beginning student of advaita Vedanta. Those characteristics are

thought to be the outcome of good upbringing and the assiduous practice of

spiritual devotion, selfless service, meditation and study. All those practices

and the psychological/physical benefits therefrom make for better understanding

once the student begins to study advaita vedanta. They really, really help!

Once the person studies advaita, it is heavily based on textual study,

meditation and contemplation. As well, one is often encouraged to continue the

practices that one had followed earlier on the path. New meanings and insights

will develop from these very same practices, as they are seen in ever brighter

light.

The Westernized "neo-advaita" is the moniker for the satsang movement, one of

whose representatives is Francis Lucille. In the satsang movement, concepts

from advaita such as "consciousnessyour true naturebeingbliss"

"happiness" are used and watered-down. Texts are perhaps referred to, but with

warnings not to take anything too seriously. Students are often told to stop

reading books, stop conducting spiritual practices, and the concerns are often

different, more based on how the student *feels* rather than what is real. The

satsang movement is often populated by teachers who, ten years previously, were

therapists. And many of them return to doing therapy when the satsang gig

doesn't pay off.

In both these branches of "advaita," the notion of enlightenment is different,

as well as virtually all the steps along the way. Often, teachers in one of the

approaches aren't really aware of how the other one functions. I suspect that

if you are used to one, the other one seems a bit odd!

Gotta go now!

Om!

--Greg

You wrote:

About the kinds of Advaita....