What renunciation means to you

[Guest guest]

Namaste:

 

Profvk has provided an example to illustrate Gita's message

renunciation. Let me add some additional points on the basis of my

understanding.

 

I wish that Sharmaji provided a brief summary of his understanding of

the term, `renunciation' based on his reading of the commentaries that

he referred. Without any reference point, examples and discussions

become difficult and complicated. I have no option other than to make

some theoretical elaboration of the term `renunciation' from Gita's

point of view. Hopefully, this elaboration will become useful to those

members who are not familiar with the term and the context.

 

One of the central theme of Gita is the renunciation of all thoughts

on the fruits of action while performing an action. This is stated on

clear terms in Chapter 2, verse 47 one of the most quoted verse of

Gita (description of Karma Yoga)

 

karmany evaa'dhiharaste maaphalesu kadaacana

maa karmaphalahetur bhur maate sango'stv akarmani

 

Your right is to work only and never to the fruit thereof. Let not you

focus your attention on the fruit of action, no you divert your focus

to `inaction.' The subtle message of the Lord is - "renounce the

thoughts on the fruits of action." The farmers who farmers spread the

seeds on the ground have the rights only to work hard for three to

five months and the yield is always uncertain and it depends on so

many other factors including the weather. Whether they like it or

not, they have to accept whatever yield they get at the end of the

crop period. If the farmers didn't spread the seeds on the ground

(inaction), they certainly will not get any yield. The fruit

`karmapala' is the crop yield at the end. Action (karma) is the

spreading of the seed on the ground. Karma yoga essentially theorizes

the universal principle behind any action.

 

"Why should we renounce the thoughts on the fruits of any action that

we undertake?" is a legitimate question and it requires further

explanation. Let me give some examples:

 

1) Competitive examination 2) Competitive sports

In both the cases, the participant's efforts should be fully

dedicated in the preparation. Those who divert their attention to the

outcome (success or failure) will reduce their efforts!

 

In every situation in our life, we need to understand that our rights

are limited and consequently we do not possess the authority to

dictate the fruits of our action. Every action always comes along with

the fruits (results) and our action alone does not determine the

fruits. We are just an infinitesimal part of the Cosmos where the

fruits are determined by all the actors (visible, invisible, direct

and indirect). Vedavyasa uses the Mahabharat to dramatize Lord's

message in clear terms. Arjun who is supposed to fight the war

(action) diverted his attention from fighting the war to the

consequences of the war (fruits of action). Instead of renouncing the

thoughts on the fruits of the action, he wanted to renounces fighting.

This is the worst case scenario that we should avoid and that is the

subtle message of `renunciation.' The Lord just warns us that to avoid

the human tendency to renounce the action and instead He advises that

we should renounce the thoughts on the result. Never put the cart in

front of the horse is the message of the Lord!

 

I ask member of the list to take a moment and contemplate on all the

major actions that was undertaken by you including your efforts and

your frame mind while completing those actions. I wouldn't be

surprised if the following reflections come from one or more of the

list members:

1. I wish, that I applied for that job or taken the other job instead

of my present job!

2. It was bad on my part to think that mathematics/computer is not the

right subject for me!

3. It was really foolish on my part to stop going to the fitness

center using some flimsy reasoning!

Let me leave the rest others' imagination.

 

Jnana-Karma-Samnyasi Context:

 

Lord defines the Jnana-Karma-Samnyasi in verse 1 of chapter 6 as

 

Sri Bhagavaan uvaaca

anaasritah karmaphalam kaaryam karma karotyah

sa samnyaasi ca yogi ca na niragnir na caakriyah

 

The Blessed Lord said:

He who performs his bounden duty without depending on the fruits of

action-he is a samnyasin and a Yogin; not he who (has renounced) is

without fire and without action.

 

The yogin with the knowledge gives up all action by knowledge by

knowing that Atman is not the DOER. To make this even clearer, Lord

Krshna said that the fire of knowledge, (jnana-agni) destroys all

karmas. Although the Lord says nothing in this verse about

renunciation of attachment, and speaks only of giving up dependence on

the fruit of actions, the former should be taken as implied in the

latter type of renunciation. All enjoyments of this world and the

next, such as the possession of a wife, progeny, wealth, honor, fame

and the enjoyments of heaven etc., should be treated as included in

the fruit of actions. Whatever an ordinary man does, he does it with

reference to a particular motive or fruit. That is why his actions

throw him repeatedly into the whirligig of births and deaths.

Therefore, regarding all enjoyments of this world and the next as

transient, momentary and a source of suffering, one should wholly give

up attachment, the sense of possession and the desire for fruit. This

is what is meant here by renunciation of dependence on the fruit of

actions. The Ideal Yogi of Gita (Samnyasi) is the one who having

renounced all activities remains constantly engaged in meditation and

whose mind is altogether free from evils like the sense of possession,

likes and dislikes, lust and anger, and who has thus given up all

thoughts of the world. In the preceding verse the Lord called such a

Yogi who does duties without reference to the fruit as a Samnyasi.

 

Once again, the Lord's message is subtle but very powerful. Our

problem is the ego - I am the doer and consequently I deserve the

fruits. The one and only way to renounce the fruits of action is by

renouncing the doer-ship. The Samnyasi who renounces the doer-ship

becomes the stithaprajna (person with the stable mind) or Jnanayogi.

Such a Yogi conducts his/her duties without any vibrations in the mind

and all his/her actions are completely detached from the fruits of

those actions. It should be pointed out that thoughts are the

vibrations of the mind and with no vibrations, there will be no

thoughts implying - inaction. What the Lord says here is that actions

that are propelled by the fruits of the actions will continue without

any end! On the contrary when actions are completely freed from the

fruits of actions, they get self immolated. The essence of the message

is that spontaneous actions without mind vibrations alone is the true

path for liberation and it is accomplished by the renunciation of

doer-ship.

 

Are there practical life examples? Yes, plenty of examples are

feasible and let me allow others to try before I offer my examples.

 

Warmest regards,

 

Ram Chandran

 

advaitin, "sksharma" <sksharma> wrote:

>

> Hi,

>

> One of the key messages of Gita is that of "renunciation". I have

> read a few commentaries on what it means but I still have trouble

> understanding how renunciation translates or can be applied in

> everyday life. I would like to know from members what renunciation

> means to them in their lives or rather in their struggle towards the

> greater goal. I am not looking for a theoretical elaboration of the

> concept.

>

> Thanks,

> Suresh

[Guest guest]

Namaste to all -

--- ramvchandran <rchandran wrote:

> Are there practical life examples? Yes, plenty of

> examples are

> feasible and let me allow others to try before I

> offer my examples.

>

 

I would like to offer some examples.

 

1) Einstein for example, for his research work, may

have imagined the whole cosmos in his little thoughts;

he may have become the light rays in his thoughts to

understand more of them. Who knows, he may precisely

even have reached the brink where thoughts may go as

far. In all his endeavour, he never would have thought

about success/failure of his research. He was involved

in his dharma without concentrating on the results.

 

2) There are lots of great

artists(musicians,painters,etc) in every town and

village. Greatness is not necessarily fame. It is more

of bliss with one's work - be it art or selling

flowers at traffic lights or watching falling of snow.

All such men and women, derive bliss out of performing

their dharma well without eye for results. On a

Saturday or during lunch times, some areas are full of

people and we also see a few musicans as well. They

have a hat in front of them and are performing on

their muscial instruments very melodiously. Though the

hat is meant for offering coins from bystanders to the

performers, the artists are unaware of who drops how

much and are immersed in their music.

 

There are many many such examples. When we see a

performer with a smile on his/her face while

performing, we can be sure that the person knows

something about the principle practically.

 

Kind Regards,

Raghava

 

 

 

 

 

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[Guest guest]

Namaste:

 

The renunciation spelled out in Gita has multiple dimensions and we

can comprehend its complete significance only by reading the entire

Gita. Let me now take up the third aspect of renunciation below.

 

Renounce the Three Gateways to Hell

 

trividham narakasyedam dvasram nassanam aatmanah

kaamah krodhas tathaa lobhas tasmaad etat trayam tyajet

Chapter 16, Verse 21

 

There are three gateways to hell, by which ones self-ruin is brought

about lust, anger and greed; therefore let these three be renounced.

In the next verse (16,22) the Lord says by renouncing these three

gates of darkness, we can see the light (reach the highest goal of

Self-realization)

 

There are warning signals about how to avoid making poor judgment on

our likes and dislikes. True happiness does not come from that which

at first is like nectar, but which in the end becomes, indeed, venom.

Self-control leads fourth happiness, though in the beginning it is

hard and bitter (Chapter 18 verses 36 to 38).

 

Here is a list of prescribed items for us to renounce:

Lust, Greed, Anger, Hatred, selfish desire, ego, fear, mental

agitation, grief, excitement,

 

Lord also suggests a list of qualifications for one to be His Devotee:

He who has no hatred, and is a friend of all living things, full of

compassion, without the feeling of "I" or "Mine" balanced in pleasure

and pain, and ever forbearing. Content always and yoked to the Sprit,

self-controlled, resolute, with emotion and understanding dedicated to

Me, he is My devotee, and is dear to Me. He who does not cause

perturbation to other beings, and who is himself not perturbed at the

world, who is free from the agitation of joy, anger and fear, he is

dear to Me. He who desires nothing, is pure, right-minded,

passionless, unruffled, has renounced all worldly plans, he, My

devotee, is dear to Me. He who does not lie or hate, who does not

grieve or long for anything, who has given up looking on things as

welcome and unwelcome, such a devotee is dear to Me. The qualities of

His devotees are once again emphasized in chapter 14, verse 25: (The

same in honor and calumny, the same to friend and foe; having

abandoned all worldly undertaking such a one is declared as having

overcome natural propensities)

 

The Lord asks us to renounce the path to darkness and adore the path

of heaven. The path to heaven is to choose to be His devotee by

meeting the qualifications laid down by the Lord and tearing down the

curtain that prevents the light!

 

warmest regards,

 

Ram Chandran

[Guest guest]

Namaste:

 

I belive that another important aspect of renunciation may be useful

and this focuses on the spiritual growth of the seeker. I earnestly

request other members to participate in this discussion because it can

help all of us to get more benefits from this satsangh.

 

Let me start with an example: when parents go to a toy store with

younger kids, the attraction for a newly released toy vastly differ

between parents and their children. The children feel that they have

have those toys irrespective of the price of the toy and without them,

they will be miserable. But the same toys didn't excite the parents

and they don't show any excitments. On the contrary, the parents

instantly become a yogi and preaches the children that the pleasure

that accrue from those toys are temporary and not everlasting. They

even illustrate how they were able to survive without those toys

during their childhood days! The moral of this story is that toys as

such are not the problem and we are the problem and focus. Adulthood

invariably help us to grow spiritually, some grow faster, other grow

slower. With the spiritual growth, we are able to physically renounce

certain objects of sensual pleasure. The divine within us help us to

grow spiritually and seek for objects that produce long-lasting peace

and happiness and help us to abandon those objects which only produce

temporary pleasure.

 

There is a mystical unexplainable element that we don't know that is

responsible for our transformation from 'human' to divine. Implicitly,

advaita philosophy recognizes that it is His Grace that is

fundamentally responsible for us to understand and recognize the true

divine identity. Another way of looking at it is that we have

temporary insanity or memory loss problem and when did that happened,

we don't know. But when we get our memory back, our divinity is

reestablished and we come the realized soul with the ever lasting

peace. In Gita, there is evidence in support for this point of view.

In chapter 18, verse 72, Lord Krishna asks Arjun whether he has

removed his delusions and illusions? Verse 73 contains Arjun's reply

and he uses two profound words: "Smrtir Labdha" (memory regained).

The subtle message of Advaita is that Divinity is the rule of the

nature and there is one Divinity, most import, there is ONLY DIVINITY.

 

Look at the nature. Spontaneity is rule of the Nature and every

species other than the human beings follows this rule. For human

beings, Nature is the best and only training ground to understand

spontaneity. Spontaneously, the flowers bloom, the rivers flow from

the top of the mountain through the plains to the ocean and all

species (other than the human beings) act according to the command of

the nature. All actions and outcomes are spontaneous whether we like

them or dislike them and whether we agree or disagree. The question

of `renunciation' is our own illusion! What did we have when we enter

this world? Why should we even think that we have `renounced' some of

our precious possessions? The only thing that we need to renounce is

the illusionary that of renunciation. This is also only possible with

His Grace!

 

Warmest regards,

 

Ram Chandran

 

 

advaitin, "ramvchandran" <rchandran@c...> wrote:

> Namaste:

>

> The renunciation spelled out in Gita has multiple dimensions and we

> can comprehend its complete significance only by reading the entire

> Gita. Let me now take up the third aspect of renunciation below.

[Guest guest]

--- ramvchandran <rchandran wrote:

> Look at the nature. Spontaneity is rule of the

> Nature and every

> species other than the human beings follows this

> rule. For human

> beings, Nature is the best and only training ground

> to understand

> spontaneity. Spontaneously, the flowers bloom, the

> rivers flow from

> the top of the mountain through the plains to the

> ocean and all

> species (other than the human beings) act according

> to the command of

> the nature. All actions and outcomes are

> spontaneous whether we like

> them or dislike them and whether we agree or

> disagree. The question

> of `renunciation' is our own illusion! What did we

> have when we enter

> this world? Why should we even think that we have

> `renounced' some of

> our precious possessions? The only thing that we

> need to renounce is

> the illusionary that of renunciation. This is also

> only possible with

> His Grace!

>

 

Namaste Shree RamJi and namaste all.

Indeed very beautifully stated.

 

I am also of the opinion that there is nothing that is

our own to renounce anyway. Getting deluded into

thinking that something is one's own is cause of all

misery.

 

Waking-dreams-deepsleep ----- is collectively within,

Vaisvanara--Hiranyagarbha-Iswara.

 

Hence, renouncing to me consists primarily in

identifying what is one's own and what is not and

enjoy that which permeates all.

 

With Love,

Raghava

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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