Guest guest Posted August 22, 2002 Report Share Posted August 22, 2002 A basic question. Krishna tells Arjuna that he ought not to have the "sense of doership": that Arjuna should submit to the higher power and recognize that he is being controlled by the higher power. So how does Karma play a role in this context? If I am to surrender to the "higher power" and give up my sense of doership, should I not work out my past karma by ownership of my past/current action? Excuse me if I am not clear in my questions as I am confused! regards, Niranjan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 23, 2002 Report Share Posted August 23, 2002 Namaste Niranjan. My understanding: Your past karma will work out on its own without your having any ownership over it. Your karma after surrender to the Lord will be unbinding, done with prasAdabuddhi, as an offering to the Lord, i.e. you will continue to perform actions to achieve legitimate ends in an attitude of worship; however, whatever the result of such actions (exactly what you wanted, more, less or just the opposite), you will accept them with eqanimity, without complaints, as prasAda coming from the Lord. Regards. Madathil Nair _______________ A-- In advaitin, Niranjan Konduri <niranjan@u...> wrote: > So how does Karma play a role in this context? If I am > to surrender to the "higher power" and give up my sense > of doership, should I not work out my past karma by > ownership of my past/current action? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 23, 2002 Report Share Posted August 23, 2002 Niranjanji Let me try a quick and short reply to your question on Doership. It is not only the doership that is to be negated but also the 'experiencership' (bhoktA = experiencer, bhoktRtvaM =experiencership) that is to be negated. When both are negated your question does nolt arise. praNAms to all advaitins profvk ===== Prof. V. Krishnamurthy My website on Science and Spirituality is http://www.geocities.com/profvk/ You can access my book on Gems from the Ocean of Hindu Thought Vision and Practice, and my father R. Visvanatha Sastri's manuscripts from the site. Finance - Get real-time stock quotes http://finance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 23, 2002 Report Share Posted August 23, 2002 advaitin, Niranjan Konduri <niranjan@u...> wrote: > > A basic question. Krishna tells Arjuna that he ought > not to have the "sense of doership": that Arjuna should > submit to the higher power and recognize that he is being > controlled by the higher power. > > So how does Karma play a role in this context? If I am > to surrender to the "higher power" and give up my sense > of doership, should I not work out my past karma by > ownership of my past/current action? Namaste, One of the strategies to extract answers to questions like yours is to see if the answer is 'embedded' in the Gita itself. Choose the verse(s) that comes closest to your understanding as an answer. Learn it by heart, chant it as often as you can, tnink about it as deeply as you can, listen to the audio recording. It will lead you to other verses that will deepen your understanding. Not enough has been emphasised of the potency of the 'mantras' embedded in the Gita. Even if you fail to get an intellectual grasp, your conduct will begin to show the effect. Just as examples: Gita 11:33 , 18:46 tasmaattvamuttishhTha yasho labhasva jitvaa shatruun.h bhuN^.hkshva raajya.n samR^iddham.h . mayaivaite nihataaH puurvameva nimittamaatraM bhava savyasaachin.h .. 11\.33.. or yataH pravR^ittirbhuutaanaa.n yena sarvamidaM tatam.h . svakarmaNaa tamabhyarchya siddhi.n vindati maanavaH .. 18\.46.. It is easy to imagine that an intellectual understanding will necessarily change one's perspective to a spiritual one; but it will still need effort to put it into practice. Regards, Sunder Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 24, 2002 Report Share Posted August 24, 2002 > advaitin, Niranjan Konduri <niranjan@u...> wrote: > > > > A basic question. Krishna tells Arjuna that he ought > > not to have the "sense of doership": that Arjuna should > > submit to the higher power and recognize that he is being > > controlled by the higher power. > > > > So how does Karma play a role in this context? If I am > > to surrender to the "higher power" and give up my sense > > of doership, should I not work out my past karma by > > ownership of my past/current action? Shree Niranjan, can you see contradition in your question - please examine it again. Giving up the doership means that I am never a doer but the doing is being done by Prakriti by the power of the Lord - PrakRiti eva ca karmaani kriyamaanaani sarvashhaH| - all actions are being done by prakRiti alone. That is clear understanding of the actual state of affiars that Krishna wants to Arjuna to recognize the facts. Giving up the sense of doership is like my giving up the presidentship of the United states or million dollars in the neighbourhood bank. How much of effort is involved in giving up that which I never owned to start with! The sense of doership is not actual or factual but only a notional and If that is factual - Giita or no Giita - there is no way one can give up. Now you see the fallasy of your next question that follows - you ask - if I give up my sense of doership ...should I not work out my past karma!- Where is then the question of working out past or present or future karma-s? When I was never a doer to start with where is the question of giving up - Is not something like giving up my million dollars that never owned to start with. akrathaahma abhooktaaham aham eva aham avyayaH - I am never a doer nor an enjoyer I am that inexhaustible existence-consciousnes-bliss. The dropping notions can occur only when the truth of myself is recognized - till then it is only 'idea' of giving up. It is like we do aarati every day - tana mana dhana sabkuch teraahai ... the body, mind and all the wealth is all yours - and then we repeat the same thing next day again. Once it is surrendered to the Lord there is no question of again surrendering it - How can one surrender twice - unless the first time we did not surrender but only threated to surrender - We cannot give the same thing as gift twice to the same person. Giving up the notions occurs with clear understanding of the truth. Till then - the performe action to the best you can but offer that as prayer to the Lord That is naivadyam or kainkaryam- The result of the action comes from the Lord and whatever that comes from the Lord is prasaad as Shree Nairji has discussed. That makes the mind non-reactive and it is only the mind that is non-reactive that is capable of learning from its mistakes - the greatest mistake is assuming doership when it is not there to start with! Hari OM! Sadananda ===== What you have is His gift to you and what you do with what you have is your gift to Him - Swami Chinmayananda. Finance - Get real-time stock quotes http://finance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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