Is Detachment the key to liberation?

[Guest guest]

Namaste:

 

Swamini Satyavratananda provides some excellent references (Katha

Upanishad and Gita Chapter 15)in her discourse in support of the

summary statement that Detachment is the key to liberation. In the

concluding paragraph she states that "Attachment to the Lord" is the

only path for developing detachment to toward the world. This is a

profound statement and I invite those interested to contemplate on

this important statement and share their thoughts,

 

Warmest regards,

 

Ram Chandran

> Detachment, key to liberation

>.........

> The following verse makes it clear that man can cut

> asunder the firmly rooted tree with the axe of dispassion.

> He should strive for the supreme state— liberation from rebirth.

> This is possible by surrendering to the Supreme Being from whom the

> eternal cosmos has streamed forth. The human predicament is

> succinctly portrayed in a few verses to stress that it is possible

> for man to overcome bondage by developing detachment towards the

> world.

[Guest guest]

advaitin, "Ram Chandran <rchandran@c...>"

<rchandran@c...> wrote:

> Namaste:

>

> Swamini Satyavratananda provides some excellent references (Katha

> Upanishad and Gita Chapter 15)in her discourse in support of the

> summary statement that Detachment is the key to liberation. In the

> concluding paragraph she states that "Attachment to the Lord" is

the

> only path for developing detachment to toward the world. This is a

> profound statement and I invite those interested to contemplate on

> this important statement and share their thoughts,

>

> Warmest regards,

>

> Ram Chandran

>

> > Detachment, key to liberation

> >.........

> > The following verse makes it clear that man can cut

> > asunder the firmly rooted tree with the axe of dispassion.

> > He should strive for the supreme state— liberation from rebirth.

> > This is possible by surrendering to the Supreme Being from whom

the

> > eternal cosmos has streamed forth. The human predicament is

> > succinctly portrayed in a few verses to stress that it is

possible

> > for man to overcome bondage by developing detachment towards the

> > world.

 

Namaste,

 

This is a highly commendable sadhana but not Advaitic, it is part of

the process, surrender/saranagathi and nishkarma karma. It is

visishtadvaitic or even dvaitic.

 

Sankara said in reference to death, that it is a separation from our

desires/attachments. No attachment no death, as simple as

that.....ONS...Tony.

[Guest guest]

Namaste.

 

Complete 'Detachment' may lead to liberation eventually, but during

the transition period, the path seems rough. A stone remains a

stone - completely detached [borrowed/modified example from Swami

Vivekananda]. The path seems like a desert with hot sand and no

water.

In contrast, 'Attachment to the Lord' is like a beautiful

garden. 'Attachment to the Lord' is more smooth, enjoyable compared

to 'all detachment'.

'Attachment to the Lord' is also 'detachment' from those things of

the world that are false/unreal and attachment to those that are

real/true.

Whereas in 'detachment' we are on our own, in the case

of 'attachment', we take one step and the other takes 10 steps.

 

In my humble opinion, Sir.

 

Regards,

Raghava

 

advaitin, "Ram Chandran <rchandran@c...>"

<rchandran@c...> wrote:

> Detachment is the key to liberation. In the

> concluding paragraph she states that "Attachment to the Lord" is

the

> only path for developing detachment to toward the world. This is a

> profound statement and I invite those interested to contemplate on

> this important statement and share their thoughts,

>

[Guest guest]

Sri Krishna Premi, a well known exponent of Bhagavatam and Gita in

South India comments that it is easier for the human mind to practice

attachment rather than detachment.

 

Just as growing child naturally loses interest in childhood toys when

it becomes (grows), spiritual growth gradually makes one (aspirant)

detatched to the world.

 

Attachment to the Lord (Prema Bhakti) is one means. But there are

others - especially the practice of meditation. I have made reference

to this in previous posts

advaitin/message/15057.

 

When the mind gets increasing joy from within by the practice of

meditation it slowly stops going outside to the world in search of

joy

 

regards

Sundar Rajan

 

 

 

 

advaitin, "Ram Chandran <rchandran@c...>"

<rchandran@c...> wrote:

> Namaste:

>

> Swamini Satyavratananda provides some excellent references (Katha

> Upanishad and Gita Chapter 15)in her discourse in support of the

> summary statement that Detachment is the key to liberation. In the

> concluding paragraph she states that "Attachment to the Lord" is

the

> only path for developing detachment to toward the world. This is a

> profound statement and I invite those interested to contemplate on

> this important statement and share their thoughts,

>

> Warmest regards,

>

> Ram Chandran

>

> > Detachment, key to liberation

> >.........

> > The following verse makes it clear that man can cut

> > asunder the firmly rooted tree with the axe of dispassion.

> > He should strive for the supreme state— liberation from rebirth.

> > This is possible by surrendering to the Supreme Being from whom

the

> > eternal cosmos has streamed forth. The human predicament is

> > succinctly portrayed in a few verses to stress that it is

possible

> > for man to overcome bondage by developing detachment towards the

> > world.

[Guest guest]

Namaste.

 

Let us get down to core business from good and bad news.

 

True detachment is not a key to liberation. It is nothing but

liberation.

 

He who effectively distinguishes between the real and transitory

without being affected by the latter is liberated. Till then, he has

only a false notion that he is bound and limited and the rest of the

world is separate from him although he is ever full andliberated.

True detachment is the ability to make this distinction and live it

without being affected by the transitory world. Like the meditator,

who remains in himself despite the thoughts that cross his mind, the

truly detached remains liberated from the sway of impermanent objects

of the world although he `sees' them. Being in himself, he is then

free and liberated like the lotus leaf that remains ever undrenched

despite being in water and rain or like sage Narada who flits between

worlds unaffected by what is going on in them

 

The supreme knowledge that I am always myself and full despite the

seeming world I see outisde is, therefore, true detachment or

liberation. With such knowledge becoming permanent, the false notion

of binding, limitation and inadequacy completely evaporates. All the

scriptural procedures and the scriptures themselves that lead us to

such knowledge belong to the transitory world. When true detachment

results, even they lose their significance, the knowledge of one's

Oneness consumes separation and one realizes that he himself is

knowledge without a subject, object and knowing, and there was

actually nothing for him to free from.

 

Thus, liberation or true detachment is just a permanent shift of

focus and not a far away destination to reach.

 

Pranams.

 

Madathil Nair

[Guest guest]

Namaste:

 

I agree that an attitude of 'detachment' can help us to prevent the

potential emotional outbursts due to 'good and bad news.'

 

First we should recognize that both 'detachment' and 'liberation' can

arise in the relative and absolute contexts. 'Absolute Detachment'

becomes (merges or superimposes) 'Absolute liberation.' Also relative

detachment provides relative liberation. We do perceive the

appearance of 'detachment' as the key to liberation. All that we need

is the key to `detachment' and with that key, we can get the

byproduct, `liberation.'

 

As practical vedantins, we do practice 'relative detachment' while

pursuing our daily life. Sri Raghava and Sri Sundar had made some

excellent remarks relating spiritual maturity and `detachment.' As we

grow, we do learn the `art of detachment' knowingly and unknowingly

since time (age) plays an important role in the process of

detachment.

 

Let us pose the question, "Is the process of detachment rough and

difficult?" The answer is definitely yes, provided we understood the

question correctly and completely. Our problem is our `ignorance' and

we don't know `who we are?' Essentially `I' is always detached but we

seldom identify us with `I.' Consequently, we have the

fundamental `identification' problem. We attach to the `roles' that

we play as father, mother, friend, teacher, student, foe and fail to

recognize the `transitory' nature of those roles. The witness `I' is

permanent (changeless) and is always detached from the roles. When we

recognize our `True' identity, we are detached and liberated. In

other words, the key to `detachment' and `liberation' is Self-

realization.

 

Warmest regards,

Ram Chandran

 

advaitin, "Madathil Rajendran Nair

<madathilnair>" <madathilnair> wrote:

> Namaste.

>

> Let us get down to core business from good and bad news.

>

[Guest guest]

Namaste Ramji.

 

I should have included the following in my post #15807. Your

mentioning the roles we play and Shri Vaidyanath Iyer's subsequent

stress on devotion served as reminders.

 

Yes. Devotion indeed is the easiest route for aspiring advaitins.

That exactly is the reason Sankara composed so many beautiful hymns.

 

In this context, I am reminded of Sw. Dayananda Sarasthy-ji's

teaching. We play roles like father, brother, friend, employee,

employer, enjoyer etc. etc. When a true devotee plays such roles,

there is an obvious differnece in attitude. He does so as a devotee-

father, devotee-brother, devotee-friend and so on. Everything that he

does then originates from a locus - devotee. Thus, devotee becomes

an integrating factor for the roles to sustain. A unity in apparent

multiplicity is now appreciated. More than half the match is already

won.

 

When such an attitude is married to advaitic knowledge, then the

ishtadevata (Deva, Devi, Lord, Christ or Buddha) is identified as

Consciousness and everything is truly surrendered at His/Her feet.

Legitimate actions are then performed with legitimate desires with an

attitude "yatetchasi thaTa kuru" (The action has been performed.

Please grant the results as you consider fit.) This truly is

the "karmanyeva adhikaraste..." of ShrImad Bhagawad Geetha. The

actions or results then don't bind the devotee as the Lotus Feet of

the Lord or Devi are fully responsible for them. He thus remains the

undrenched lotus leaf at His/Her Lotus Feet wherefrom the samsAra,

which is just a manifestation of His/Her Will, is witnessed without

subjective involvement.

 

The unflinching abhyAsa of such saparya results in the full flowering

of true detachment which is nothing but liberation. The advaitin

thereby becomes the very Lotus Feet where he is lodged or, in other

words, the Lotus Feet simply consume his separate identity. He will

then spontaneously sing : "Agre pashyami" a la our Shri

Bhattathiripad in Shrimad NArAyanIyam.

 

With proper understanding and conviction that roles are just

transitory to which we cannot reasonably hope to cling to, is

detachment a very rough road to take? I don't think so. It will

flower spontaneously. Why bother so much about the stones and thorns

on the road even before the journey is undertaken? Isn't that itself

a worry or doubt about the result? It is time we all left such

worries and doubts at the Lotus Feet where they rightly belong. The

Lotus Feet are truly pathless!

 

Pranams.

 

Madathil Nair

 

advaitin, "Ram Chandran <rchandran@c...>"

<rchandran@c...> wrote:

We attach to the `roles' that

> we play as father, mother, friend, teacher, student, foe and fail

to

> recognize the `transitory' nature of those roles.

[Guest guest]

Namaste.

 

I can't just resist posting this addendum from MahishAsuramardini

Stotram to my preceding post on this topic:

 

padakamalam karuNaanilaye varivasyati yonudinam sushive ||

ayi kamale kamalaanilaye kamalaanilayah sa katham na bhavet ||

tava padameva param padamityanushiilayato mama kim na shive ||

jaya jaya he mahishAsuramardini ramyakapardini shailasute... || ||

 

Oh, benevolent and kind consort of Lord Shiva, if one resides at Your

Lotus Feet day in and day out, then, Oh, Kamala, the resider of the

Lotus, how will he not himself be your lotus abode?

Oh, auspicious consort of Lord Shiva, is there anything else that I

can yearn for other than constantly knowing that Your Lotus Feet are

the highest goal to be achieved? Victory over victory be Thine, Oh,

Daughter of the Himalaya with beautiful braids, the vanquisher of

MahishAsura!

 

Is there any better way for us to constantly remind us of our real

nature than singing this verse (by Sankara) unto glory!?

 

Pranams.

 

Madathil Nair

[Guest guest]

Namaste:

 

We all recognize the importance and inevitability of playing

different roles at different moments of our life. Time is cyclical

withour beginning or end and the roles that we play also cyclical

because 'I' is changeless! Life is the comic drama where we act in

different roles and 'Atman' is the witness/director of the cosmic

drama. The entire drama doesn't produce (real) outcome but we do have

illusory visions of the consequences of our actions. The Lord

pointout to Arjuna in Gita that "Attach your body/mind/intellect

fully to the action and simultaneously detach them from the

distractions of the consequences of those actions."

 

The bottom line of the message is:

"work for work-sake and not for your-sake!"

 

This is only possible for the person with the highest order of

spiritual maturity. The entire Gita describes how to achieve that

spiritual maturity for Jivas who come from different background and

belief. We do need to recognize that no one else can change our

attitude and it is upto us to start the process, the path and

starting points are likely different.

 

The best (only) way to detach our attention from one 'role' is to

assume a different role and move on. The spirtiual growth can help us

to move us from taking 'roles' that require higher and higher

spiritual maturity. If we imitate and take the 'role' of the Lord as

our starting point, we should surrender (superimpose) our identity to

the Lord. Then our 'work' will be tuned to work-sake instead of our-

sake. Another way is cultivate the 'Prasada buddhi - treat the

consequences of our action as His gift.' This is the essence of Karma

Yoga and all our actions become spontaneous.

 

Saying, 'I am surrendering to the Lord' needs to be accompanied with

action with no selfish motives along with the vision of seeing the

Lord through every being of the universe!

 

Warmest regards,

 

Ram Chandran

[Guest guest]

advaitin Shri Ramchandranji wrote:"work for work-sake and not

for your-sake!"

 

 

Hari Om,

 

 

True, but the content of the work can differ depending on how the

situation is perceived. That is why Knowledge and devotional attitude are

equally important. I think that detachment is one of the keys, not the only key

to liberation. Otherwise detachment can become an excuse for non-performance or

below par contribution.

 

 

The fact is, life is complicated and needs to be handled as the situation

demands. The need to go through scriptures by one self or through participating

in satsangs like this one cannot be short circuited. One has to take efforts.

 

 

Actions, even if detached, must be based on right knowledge of the goal and

milestones.

Pranams

 

 

P.B.V.Rajan

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[Guest guest]

advaitin, "pbvrajan" <pbvrajan@i...> wrote:

> advaitin Shri Ramchandranji wrote:"work for work-

sake and not for your-sake!"

I think that detachment is one of the keys, not the only key to

liberation. Otherwise detachment can become an excuse for non-

performance or below par contribution.

> The fact is, life is complicated and needs to be handled as the

situation demands. The need to go through scriptures by one self or

through participating in satsangs like this one cannot be short

circuited. One has to take efforts.

> Actions, even if detached, must be based on right knowledge of the

goal and milestones.

 

Namaste,

 

It is possible to think in terms of detachment being a

culmination of progressive non-attachment.

 

To take Gita as a reference point, verse 2:62 succintly points

out the dangers of 'sanga'- attachment. It even warns, in 2:47, not

to be attached to 'inaction' (akarmaNi).

 

[18:9-12 are also especially relevant].

 

v. 6:3 gives the injunction for action:

 

aarurukShormuneryogaM karma kaaraNamuchyate .

yogaaruuDhasya tasyaiva shamaH kaaraNamuchyate .. 6\-3..

 

Numerous other verses can be cited which contrast 'prasakta'

and 'asakta' actions.

 

The attachment can be to the action itself or to its

pleasurable results:

 

eg.

na dveshhTyakushalaM karma kushale naanushhajjate .

tyaagii sattvasamaavishhTo medhaavii chhinnasa.nshayaH .. 18\-10..

 

te taM bhuktvaa svargalokaM vishaalaM

kShiiNe puNye martyalokaM vishanti .

evaM trayiidharmamanuprapannaa

gataagataM kaamakaamaa labhante .. 9\-21..

 

The goal is clearly stated in verse 18:49:

 

asaktabuddhiH sarvatra jitaatmaa vigataspR^ihaH .

naishhkarmyasiddhiM paramaa.n sa.nnyaasenaadhigachchhati ..

 

 

 

Regards,

 

Sunder

[Guest guest]

>

> Namaste,

>

> It is possible to think in terms of detachment being a

> culmination of progressive non-attachment.

>

>

Are we talking here Vairagya that is considered second in the series

of four-fold qualifications (Sadhana Chatusya Sampath)?

 

If that is the case I am not sure one can actually 'practice'

detatchment.

Detatchment is the natural result of true Viveka or discrimination

(first of the four). Viveka according to commentators arises when

there is a unshakable conviction as to the transitory nature of the

world. Deep Devotion gradually makes one attach to the 'real' and

realize the transitory nature of the world thus resulting in

detatchment..

 

Sri Edmond posted an interesting reply sometime ago in this context

advaitin/message/12937

 

regards

Sundar Rajan

[Guest guest]

advaitin, "Sundar Rajan <avsundarrajan>"

<avsundarrajan> wrote:

> >

> > It is possible to think in terms of detachment being a

> > culmination of progressive non-attachment.

> >

> >

> Are we talking here Vairagya that is considered second in the

series

> of four-fold qualifications (Sadhana Chatusya Sampath)?

>

> If that is the case I am not sure one can actually 'practice'

> detatchment.

>>

> Sri Edmond posted an interesting reply sometime ago in this context

> advaitin/message/12937

 

Namaste,

 

Prof. V.K. posted an equally or more interesting reply in the

very next message #12938!

 

vairaagya is being dispassionate, not emotionally swayed by

events, not feelig attached to objects of desire, : Gita -

 

....abhyaasena tu kaunteya vairaagyeNa cha gR^ihyate.....6:35

.....indriyaartheshhu vairaagyaM....................... 13:9

.....vairaagyaM samupaashritaH..........................18:52

 

If we take this in the context of the two verse below;

 

yastvindriyaaNi manasaa niyamyaarabhate.arjuna .

karmendriyaiH karmayogamasaktaH sa vishishhyate .. 3\-7..

 

tasmaadasaktaH satataM kaaryaM karma samaachara .

asakto hyaacharankarma paramaapnoti puurushhaH .. 3\-19..

 

asakta and vairaagya would appear as identical, and a practical

prerequisite for the removal of 'adhyaasa', the sole condition for

wisdom or liberation.

 

Regards,

 

Sunder

[Guest guest]

Namaste.

 

I am afraid we are simply skirting the core of the issue by trying to

contrast words like detachment, non-attachment, vairagya etc.

 

When a beggar realizes that he has just inherited a fortune, will he

continue to beg? No. He will simply throw his begging bowl away to

grab the wealth, like the railway coolie in the advertisement who

throws the luggage on to the head of the owner and dances his way to

claim the lottery bonanza. Of course, even then, he may show signs of

his beggarly habits, which will slowly vanish as he lives like other

rich men. That involves a little abhyAsa. Finally, he gains

spontaneity in his rich status.

 

Similarly, if I have nitya-anitya viveka (knowledge resulting from

the discrimination between what is permanent and what is

impermanent), I don't have any reason to hold on to the begging

bowl. I have every reason to dance like the porter. Then I know

that I am permanent and don't need the bowl of the impermanent. If I

can't do away with the bowl, then it simply means that I have still

not achieved the viveka and all my claims to the contrary are vain.

Then, I am in need of further doses of scriptural logic and

contemplation.

 

However, even after I am fully convinced of my nitya status, the

beggarly tendencies may remain in me for some time more as in the

case of the beggar. That is perhaps why some masters ask us to

deliberately live like jeevanmuktas. Then all vrittis are performed

from the point of view of my permanent status as advised in the

Bhagwad Geeta. Having an ishtadevata eases the process wherein the

deity is seen as the permanent Me. This is abhyAsa whereby my

knowledge that I need not cling on to the impermanent bowl becomes

natural and spontaneous or, in other words, it simply consumes me.

The bowl is there of course but I know the real worth of it. This,

I believe, is true detachment. Call it liberation as it fully

liberates one from the tyrannizing idea that there was a need for

liberation at all, the permanent being always liberated and never

beggarly. Then, where was the beggar. That is adhyAsa.

 

Pranams.

 

Madathil Nair