Guest guest Posted May 21, 2003 Report Share Posted May 21, 2003 Namasthe, I joined the list recently and read the mails i recive every day and it is a great learning experience.I am greatful to the moderators and immensely benefit from the group discussions. I have something important to say: 1.There is a certain amount of difference in reading books and having discussion forums like this. This kind of discussion forums help in bringing out doubts and in clarifying them too.It brings a set of different points of view as well. All of us get back to the common roots called veda . when that is the case ,all discussion whether it comes from sadananda ji or jai ji is relevant and is a value addition to the learning process. Ranjeet ji wrote: >I am not against Sadanandaji's Advaita or Jayji's >Dvaita or Benjaminji's Buddhism nor do I have any >strong inclination towards them. Personally I've nothing against Jayji's messages and I feel that >it improves my thought process a lot. What is the >use of the intellect and philosophy if you keep on agreeing all that you hear? With Jayji's messages I'm able to see the 2 sides of the coin.. I second Ranjeet ji in this stand point. 2.Tech conferences are held to share and discuss the same science ...fortunately no scientist with a *different idea* with valid proof and sufficient mastry (evidently) is pointed at and pronounced irrelavant and stamped as fit to be ignored. > I still would like to thank him for exemplifying some words & >verses that could only be imagined >'Fools dwelling in darkness, wise in their own conceit, and puffed up >with vain knowledge, go round and round, staggering to and fro, like >blind men led by the blind." Whoever wrote this should please find better use for upanishats is my modest request, than to insult a scholarly person like jai ji, by doing it you have also insulted the entire rishi-paramparaa who gave us those upanishats. 3.When i read a few mails of a few people addressing towards jai ji i felt that it shows a very immature behaviour which does not suit the high standard and pedastal this forum represents to me . people with Jnana,Bhakthi and vairagya..should be open for differences , open for discussions(not arguments) and we should all be able to justify and test ourselves again and again and way again for our own fittedness in what we have learnt and achived.After all poorva paksha nirakarana is a way of shuddhi(purification) and vrudhii( advance) in vedantha. 3. Every question however so called mundane raised by any body has to be answered as it is our accountability to the entire Bharatiya vidhya parampare it self .No question is foolish and we have no place for such condemns in our vedantha. There is no need to feel threatened or violated and posting again and again against jai ji is not right.Yes, sometimes we do tend to feel inadequcies and we do not know certain answers , which are over come by gurukrupa and more focussed learning and better understanding of what sada ji rightly mentions as a strong linage of acharyas and their works. 4.Our Acharyas in all the thrimathas are called jagadgurus ..and yes, they deserve to be called that.Who are we to narrow it down? let us work on ourselves better instead. A more matured and tolerent atmosphere has to develope.I wish it will all be some day called vedantha forums instead of advaitha , vishita dwaita, or dwaita as it is all indeed from the same roots and it is all vedantha finally. Science grew from poisoning aristotle to open forums.Unfortunately for us philospohy has degraded from forums and open discussions to..irrelanvant ..get into your own so called group, he said so..she said so belief systems... shrinking process! let us try ..we are doing our little bit..but let us try better next time..!for our own sake. 5.Some of the questions raised by Shri jay ji is sometimes answered by 'words cannot describe it.' Well, through my study process yes i have known that words cannot describe the nirguna brahman ..or the number of gunas are so high that yet again words cannot describe him if the vedoktha brahman is saguna indeed... yes words cannot describe!.. however Acharya Shakara, Acharya Ramanuja and Acharya Madhva have written bhashyas...and with words!!!.. Why??? I do not belive any of us are yet so advanced to realise wordlessness in absolutism.It is just that our own limitations within us make us fail for words when asked to speak or sometimes it is an intellligent quote when we do not know the answers. let us go back learn more..for there is always lots to learn..atleast for us all ..i trust..and not be contented with saying it is beyond words. It isan honest recommendation that should aid all our learning process . Keep jay-ji's emails coming along with other mails . well, Jnana is a part of sadhana ..and our rishis strived for years, decades, and janmas to attain it and not in vain..They did it all with preethi(love), aadara(respect) and sneha (friendliness) towards the jnana moorthi(satyam-jnanam-anantam-brahma). This feeling of love , respect andfriendliness towards jnana and jnana sadhana is termed as bhakthi. When we reread this para we see the insepreable link between Bhakthi andJnana at any point of realisation. so let us not call jnana dispensable.For jnana moorthi(lord) is not dispensable either. This vedic definition also fits appropriately into any bhakthi movement of haridasas sahithya of karnataka, maharashtra, alvars and nayannars , santh kabir , chaithanya,and other worth mentioning . It satisfactorily also defines our personal equation with gamya,jneya, guru(parabrahman). Thus the indespensable jnana and bhakthi are like two strong intertwined veins making our climb higher possible. we are all students of vedantha.Let us kindle and rekindle the unending enthusiam to learn more instead of bringing ego conflicts and getting irritated(we are people who are supposed to learn to control our kama krodha moha mada maadsarya). let us get into real spirit of vedantha .This is not intended to hurt anybody I applogise if unintentionally i have hurt any one this is only an attitude check for all of us! Pranams regards Ramya Koppa The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 22, 2003 Report Share Posted May 22, 2003 Hari OM! Blessed Ramyaji, You have written a long email but there was nothing about Bhakthi and Jnana in that, this goes into worldliness, and differences and making comments on postings. During Advaitic discussions we will feel that individuals are really fighting through words, but that is only exchange of ideologies, But nothing in this world which cannot be answered through ADVAITA VEDANTA! Only thing, people should have a clear & pure mind to perceive the ideas. if you really think, there you cannot make any differences, difference of opinions, views, counter arguments all are in the intellectual and mental level. Being an advaitic list which is mainly for Sri Shankaracharya's advaitic philosophy, we all will accept any point from any other acharayas, there is no doubt about it. But when sombody convinces about some argument, then pointing to Acharyas ironically is not the correct type of learning! This is the Human weakness, their the worldly mind comes,There is an intention behind it. Even this is also from the intellectual and mental level. First the mind has to be purified through continous sadhana, no amount of reading, or no amount of arguments, or counter arguments, will disturb a purified and alert mind! Actually, real prayers with a pure mind are always answered, Like Pujya Gurudev, Swami Chinmayanandaji rightly said. "Bhakthi and Jnana is like two wings of a Bird, If one wing is not there the Bird cannot fly". So the foremost and the ultimate thing required is Purifying the mind, otherwise, any amount of discussions, arguments, satsangs, will not help, this will be a lip service, only, there will always be a partition, between different personalities,in our own bosom! With Love & OM! Krishna Prasad --- Ramya Koppa <ramya_s_koppa wrote: > Namasthe, > I joined the list recently and read the mails i recive > every day and it is a great learning experience.I am > greatful to the moderators and immensely benefit from > the group discussions. > I have something important to say: > > 1.There is a certain amount of difference in reading > books and having discussion forums like this. > This kind of discussion forums help in bringing out > doubts and in clarifying them too.It brings a set of > different points of view as well. All of us get back > to the common roots called veda . > when that is the case ,all discussion whether it comes > from sadananda ji or jai ji is relevant and is a value > addition to the learning process. > > Ranjeet ji wrote: > >I am not against Sadanandaji's Advaita or Jayji's > >Dvaita or Benjaminji's Buddhism nor do I have any > >strong inclination towards them. Personally > I've nothing against Jayji's messages and I feel that > >it improves my thought process a lot. What is the > >use of the intellect and philosophy if you keep > on agreeing all that you hear? With Jayji's messages > I'm able to see the 2 > sides of the coin.. > > I second Ranjeet ji in this stand point. > > 2.Tech conferences are held to share and discuss the > same science ...fortunately no scientist with a > *different idea* with valid proof and sufficient > mastry (evidently) is pointed at and pronounced > irrelavant and stamped as fit to be ignored. > > > I still would like to thank him for > exemplifying some words & > >verses that could only be imagined > >'Fools dwelling in darkness, wise in their own > conceit, and puffed up > >with vain knowledge, go round and round, staggering > to and fro, like > >blind men led by the blind." > > Whoever wrote this should please find better use for > upanishats is my modest request, than to insult a > scholarly person like jai ji, by doing it you have > also insulted the entire rishi-paramparaa who gave us > those upanishats. > > 3.When i read a few mails of a few people addressing > towards jai ji i felt that it shows a very immature > behaviour which does not suit the high > standard and pedastal this forum represents to me . > people with Jnana,Bhakthi and vairagya..should be open > for differences , open for discussions(not arguments) > and we should all be able to justify and > test ourselves again and again and way again for our > own fittedness in what we > have learnt and achived.After all poorva paksha > nirakarana is a way of shuddhi(purification) and > vrudhii( advance) in vedantha. > 3. Every question however so called mundane raised by > any body has to be answered as it is > our accountability to the entire Bharatiya vidhya > parampare it self .No question is foolish and we have > no place for such condemns in our vedantha. There is > no need to feel threatened or violated and posting > again and again against jai ji is not right.Yes, > sometimes we do tend to feel inadequcies and we do not > know certain answers , which are over come by > gurukrupa and more focussed learning and better > understanding of what sada ji rightly mentions as a > strong linage of acharyas and their works. > > 4.Our Acharyas in all the thrimathas are called > jagadgurus ..and yes, they deserve to be called > that.Who are we to narrow it down? let us work on > ourselves better instead. > A more matured and tolerent atmosphere has to > develope.I wish it will all be > some day called vedantha forums instead of advaitha , > vishita dwaita, > or dwaita as it is all indeed from the same roots and > it is all vedantha finally. Science grew from > poisoning aristotle to open forums.Unfortunately > for us philospohy has degraded from forums and open > discussions to..irrelanvant ..get into your own so > called group, he said so..she > said so belief systems... shrinking process! > let us try ..we are doing our little bit..but let us > try better next time..!for our own sake. > > 5.Some of the questions raised by Shri jay ji is > sometimes answered by 'words > cannot describe it.' > Well, through my study process yes i have known that > words cannot describe the nirguna brahman ..or the > number of gunas are so high that > yet again words cannot describe him if the vedoktha > brahman is saguna indeed... > yes words cannot describe!.. > however Acharya Shakara, Acharya Ramanuja and Acharya > Madhva have written > bhashyas...and with words!!!.. Why??? > > I do not belive any of us are yet so advanced to > realise wordlessness in absolutism.It is just that our > own limitations within us make us > fail for words when asked to speak or sometimes it is > an intellligent quote when we do not know the answers. > let us go back learn more..for there is always lots to > learn..atleast for us > all ..i trust..and not be contented with saying it is > beyond words. It isan honest recommendation that > should aid all our learning process . > Keep jay-ji's emails coming along with other mails . > > well, Jnana is a part of sadhana ..and our rishis > strived for years, decades, and janmas to attain it > and not in vain..They did it all with preethi(love), > aadara(respect) and sneha (friendliness) towards the > jnana moorthi(satyam-jnanam-anantam-brahma). > This feeling of love , respect andfriendliness > towards jnana and jnana sadhana is termed as bhakthi. > > When we reread this para we see the insepreable link > between Bhakthi andJnana at any point of realisation. > so let us not call jnana dispensable.For jnana > moorthi(lord) is not dispensable either. > This vedic definition also fits appropriately into any > bhakthi movement of haridasas sahithya of karnataka, > maharashtra, alvars and nayannars , > santh kabir , chaithanya,and other worth mentioning . > It satisfactorily also defines our personal equation > with gamya,jneya, guru(parabrahman). Thus the > indespensable jnana and bhakthi are like two strong > intertwined veins making our climb higher > possible. > > we are all students of vedantha.Let us kindle and > rekindle the unending enthusiam to learn more instead > of bringing ego conflicts and getting irritated(we are > people who are supposed to learn to control our kama > krodha moha mada maadsarya). let us get into real > spirit of vedantha .This is not intended to hurt > anybody I applogise if unintentionally i have hurt any > one this is only an attitude check for all of us! > Pranams > > > regards > Ramya Koppa > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > http://search. > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2003 Report Share Posted May 23, 2003 Yes, I would agree that the Advaitin moderators have always been very open and flexible and yet done an excellent job in keeping the discussions focused on Advaita Vedanta as taught by Sri Shankracharya and other Sages and seers (according to the list charter). Although it is not possible to act in a way that pleases everyone all the time (even Sri Krishna was unable to do it), the moderators of this list Sadaji, Ramji, Sunderji, Gregji, Murthyji, Frankji and others have always treated posters with respect, courtesy, warmth, and friendship. If the moderators make decisions or judgments regarding the direction and content of discussions, my feeling is that it is done for all our benefit or at least for the benefit of majority of the members. Since being on the list can be like a sadhana or lead to sadhana or be educational in some way and since the moderators do it voluntarily, we should support their selfless efforts. Love to all Harsha Ramya Koppa wrote: > Namasthe, > I joined the list recently and read the mails i recive > every day and it is a great learning experience.I am > greatful to the moderators and immensely benefit from > the group discussions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2003 Report Share Posted May 23, 2003 Dear Krishna pasadji, Please do reread my email to find contents on jnana and bhakthi .More essentially the purport of my email is not towards arguments but about having a more tolerent atmosphere and openness to growth. And essentially practicing all that we preach. yes, your comment is well taken krishna prasad ji, I liked your blessed ramya statement. thanks regards Ramya Koppa --- Krishna Prasad <rkrishp99 wrote: > Hari OM! > > Blessed Ramyaji, > > You have written a long email but there was nothing > about Bhakthi and > Jnana in that, this goes into worldliness, and > differences and making > comments on postings. During Advaitic discussions we > will feel that > individuals are really fighting through words, but > that is only > exchange of ideologies, But nothing in this world > which cannot be > answered through ADVAITA VEDANTA! Only thing, people > should have a > clear & pure mind to perceive the ideas. > > if you really think, there you cannot make any > differences, > difference of opinions, views, counter arguments all > are in the > intellectual and mental level. > > Being an advaitic list which is mainly for Sri > Shankaracharya's > advaitic philosophy, we all will accept any point > from any other > acharayas, there is no doubt about it. But when > sombody convinces > about some argument, then pointing to Acharyas > ironically is not the > correct type of learning! This is the Human > weakness, their the > worldly mind comes,There is an intention behind it. > Even this is also > from the intellectual and mental level. > > First the mind has to be purified through continous > sadhana, no > amount of reading, or no amount of arguments, or > counter arguments, > will disturb a purified and alert mind! > > Actually, real prayers with a pure mind are always > answered, Like > Pujya Gurudev, Swami Chinmayanandaji rightly said. > > "Bhakthi and Jnana is like two wings of a Bird, If > one wing is not > there the Bird cannot fly". > > So the foremost and the ultimate thing required is > Purifying the > mind, otherwise, any amount of discussions, > arguments, satsangs, will > not help, this will be a lip service, only, there > will always be a > partition, between different personalities,in our > own bosom! > > With Love & OM! > > Krishna Prasad > > --- Ramya Koppa <ramya_s_koppa wrote: > > Namasthe, > > I joined the list recently and read the mails i > recive > > every day and it is a great learning experience.I > am > > greatful to the moderators and immensely benefit > from > > the group discussions. > > I have something important to say: > > > > 1.There is a certain amount of difference in > reading > > books and having discussion forums like this. > > This kind of discussion forums help in bringing > out > > doubts and in clarifying them too.It brings a set > of > > different points of view as well. All of us get > back > > to the common roots called veda . > > when that is the case ,all discussion whether it > comes > > from sadananda ji or jai ji is relevant and is a > value > > addition to the learning process. > > > > Ranjeet ji wrote: > > >I am not against Sadanandaji's Advaita or Jayji's > > >Dvaita or Benjaminji's Buddhism nor do I have any > > >strong inclination towards them. Personally > > I've nothing against Jayji's messages and I feel > that > > >it improves my thought process a lot. What is the > > >use of the intellect and philosophy if you keep > > on agreeing all that you hear? With Jayji's > messages > > I'm able to see the 2 > > sides of the coin.. > > > > I second Ranjeet ji in this stand point. > > > > 2.Tech conferences are held to share and discuss > the > > same science ...fortunately no scientist with a > > *different idea* with valid proof and sufficient > > mastry (evidently) is pointed at and pronounced > > irrelavant and stamped as fit to be ignored. > > > > > I still would like to thank him for > > exemplifying some words & > > >verses that could only be imagined > > >'Fools dwelling in darkness, wise in their own > > conceit, and puffed up > > >with vain knowledge, go round and round, > staggering > > to and fro, like > > >blind men led by the blind." > > > > Whoever wrote this should please find better use > for > > upanishats is my modest request, than to insult a > > scholarly person like jai ji, by doing it you > have > > also insulted the entire rishi-paramparaa who gave > us > > those upanishats. > > > > 3.When i read a few mails of a few people > addressing > > towards jai ji i felt that it shows a very > immature > > behaviour which does not suit the high > > standard and pedastal this forum represents to me > . > > people with Jnana,Bhakthi and vairagya..should be > open > > for differences , open for discussions(not > arguments) > > and we should all be able to justify and > > test ourselves again and again and way again for > our > > own fittedness in what we > > have learnt and achived.After all poorva paksha > > nirakarana is a way of shuddhi(purification) and > > vrudhii( advance) in vedantha. > > 3. Every question however so called mundane raised > by > > any body has to be answered as it is > > our accountability to the entire Bharatiya vidhya > > parampare it self .No question is foolish and we > have > > no place for such condemns in our vedantha. There > is > > no need to feel threatened or violated and posting > > again and again against jai ji is not right.Yes, > > sometimes we do tend to feel inadequcies and we do > not > > know certain answers , which are over come by > > gurukrupa and more focussed learning and better > > understanding of what sada ji rightly mentions as > a > > strong linage of acharyas and their works. > > > > 4.Our Acharyas in all the thrimathas are called > > jagadgurus ..and yes, they deserve to be called > > that.Who are we to narrow it down? let us work > on > > ourselves better instead. > > A more matured and tolerent atmosphere has to > > develope.I wish it will all be > > some day called vedantha forums instead of > advaitha , > > vishita dwaita, > > or dwaita as it is all indeed from the same roots > and > > it is all vedantha finally. Science grew from > > poisoning aristotle to open forums.Unfortunately > > for us philospohy has degraded from forums and > open > > discussions to..irrelanvant ..get into your own so > > called group, he said so..she > > said so belief systems... shrinking process! > > let us try ..we are doing our little bit..but let > us > > try better next time..!for our own sake. > > > > 5.Some of the questions raised by Shri jay ji is > > sometimes answered by 'words > > cannot describe it.' > > Well, through my study process yes i have known > that > > words cannot describe the nirguna brahman ..or > the > > number of gunas are so high that > > yet again words cannot describe him if the > vedoktha > > brahman is saguna indeed... > > yes words cannot describe!.. > > however Acharya Shakara, Acharya Ramanuja and > Acharya > > Madhva have written > > bhashyas...and with words!!!.. Why??? > > > > I do not belive any of us are yet so advanced to > > realise wordlessness in absolutism.It is just that > our > > own limitations within us make us > > fail for words when asked to speak or sometimes it > is > > an intellligent quote when we do not know the > answers. > > let us go back learn more..for there is always > lots to > > learn..atleast for us > > all ..i trust..and not be contented with saying it > is > > beyond words. It isan honest recommendation that > > should aid all our learning process . > > Keep jay-ji's emails coming along with other mails > . > > > > well, Jnana is a part of sadhana ..and our rishis > > strived for years, decades, and janmas to attain > it > > and not in vain..They did it all with > preethi(love), > > aadara(respect) and sneha (friendliness) towards > the > > jnana moorthi(satyam-jnanam-anantam-brahma). > > This feeling of love , respect andfriendliness > > towards jnana and jnana sadhana is termed as > bhakthi. > > > > When we reread this para we see the insepreable > link > > between Bhakthi andJnana at any point of > realisation. > > so let us not call jnana dispensable.For jnana > > moorthi(lord) is not dispensable either. > > This vedic definition also fits appropriately into > any > > bhakthi movement of haridasas sahithya of > karnataka, > > maharashtra, alvars and nayannars , > > santh kabir , chaithanya,and other worth > mentioning . > > It satisfactorily also defines our personal > equation > > with gamya,jneya, guru(parabrahman). Thus the > > indespensable jnana and bhakthi are like two > strong > > intertwined veins making our climb higher > > possible. > > > > we are all students of vedantha.Let us kindle and > > rekindle the unending enthusiam to learn more > instead > > of bringing ego conflicts and getting irritated(we > are > > people who are supposed to learn to control our > kama > > krodha moha mada maadsarya). let us get into real > > spirit of vedantha .This is not intended to hurt > > anybody I applogise if unintentionally i have hurt > any > > one this is only an attitude check for all of us! > > Pranams > > > > > > regards > > Ramya Koppa > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > http://search. > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > http://search. > > ------------------------ Sponsor > > Discussion of Shankara's Advaita Vedanta Philosophy > of nonseparablity of Atman and Brahman. > Advaitin List Archives available at: > http://www.eScribe.com/culture/advaitin/ > To Post a message send an email to : > advaitin > Messages Archived at: > advaitin/messages > > > > Your use of is subject to > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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