Guest guest Posted June 10, 2003 Report Share Posted June 10, 2003 Benjamin wrote: Of course, I might point out that the entire saga ... Jesus, apostles, and all ... might be mythical, i.e. stories that arose over time. (A key source of doubt for me is that, according to my research, it seems very much there are no reliable witnesses or historical accounts until at least 150 years after the events. But let's not get pedantic.) Hello Benjamin, Hello Benjamin, What you are saying about 150 years being a sufficent length of time for the erosion of detail in a story and the rounding off of the facts to a convenient myth betrays an anachronistic assimilation of our modern times to the ancient world. Pre general literacy and the aide memoire of the book and without the sensory assault of continual information memories were extremely keen. In the hierarchical tradition of those days there were specialists in the retelling of tribal sagas during the long winters. These were passed on from father to son often in verse form or full of alliteration and assonance to make them memorable. 150 years is a trifling length of time in that virtually timeless continuum. Example: Schilemann going on internal evidence from the Odessey looked for Troy and found it. Biblical archeologists looking for places mentioned in the Bible find them where they are supposed to be. In India this ancient tradition is still intact though certain saints and sages of Bharath felt that it was flagging. I have no doubt that the Ramayana and the Mahabharatha hold intact real history. A real true actual Krishna. Probably. Best Wishes, Michael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 10, 2003 Report Share Posted June 10, 2003 advaitin, ombhurbhuva <ombhurbhuva@e...> wrote: > Benjamin wrote: > Of course, I might point out that the entire saga ... > Jesus, apostles, and all ... might be mythical, i.e. > stories that > arose over time. (A key source of doubt for me is > that, according to > my research, it seems very much there are no reliable > witnesses or > historical accounts until at least 150 years after the > events. But > let's not get pedantic.) > > Hello Benjamin, > > In India this ancient tradition is still intact though > certain saints and sages of Bharath felt that it was > flagging. I have no doubt that the Ramayana and the > Mahabharatha hold intact real history. A real true > actual Krishna. Probably. > > Best Wishes, Michael Namaste M et al, At this time and earlier in India and elsewhere there was writing as well. What about the ossuary of Jesus's brother James, which now seems to be exactly from that time, according to scientists. It mentions Jesus or Jeshua. There is no doubt that the further one goes back the bigger the myth component. However cross referencing with Cayce I find the mixtures and other beings in the Ramayana to be likely and not metaphoric or just animal. I still have not resolved the concept of Avatar in my mind. I still think it is something like the Buddhist concept of Bhodisattva or Buddha waiting in the Tushita Heaven to take birth. This is somewhat analogous to the Kali Yuga Avatar, which isn't due for about another 400,000 years I believe. So where I am at, looking at the Gita and Krishna talking of remembering all his previous lives, is that an Avatar was once a person, which seems to be a tradition in the Avatars of Vishnu anyway. So to me spirituality started with belief and faith and then moved to enquiry, but I still think relatively and talk absolutely sometimes ha ha ah ah. The concept of Jivan mukta is easier to accept than the concept of avatar. For to me there is no interference in karma from Saguna. What does anyone make of this? I have visited Ammachi several times in different countries so I find it interesting. I'm not a devotee per se though. Ananda Veethi. "The Divine Mother with bright, gentle, hands, Caressed my head, With bowed head, I told Mother, That my life is dedicated to Her. Smiling, She became a Divine Effulgence, And merged in me, My mind blosomed, Bathed in the many-hued Light of Divinity, And the events of millions of years gone by, Rose up within me, Thenceforth, Seeing nothing as separate from my own Self, A Single Unity, and merging in the Divine Mother, I renounced all sense of enjoyment."....Ammachi. My take is this is a description of a mergence with the Sakti energy, at least...........ONS....Tony. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 10, 2003 Report Share Posted June 10, 2003 Namaste. I am not annoyed by the J-word. If you go through my previous posts on this List, I adore J and have found advaita in His experience on the Cross. I was only wondering if the question Jesus or Krishna "really" existed is worth the trouble of looking into by an advaitin, to whom both the so-called "really existing" things as well as myths are there because HE IS. Madathil Nair ____ advaitin, Benjamin Root <orion777ben> wrote: > > Don't be annoyed to hear the J-word! The issue is not Jesus per se > but myths. That is why I quickly changed the subject to Krishna, > where the same questions arise. How do we know how much is > 'mythical' in the story of Krishna? It is an age old question for > all inquiring minds. Do you have any interesting ideas? > > Well, you did previously say that everything happens because 'I am'. > But could you be a bit more specific? If Krishna is real, then it > happens because 'I am'. And if Krishna is a myth, then it happens > because 'I am'. This doesn't answer whether Krishna is real or myth. > And does it matter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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