Guest guest Posted June 1, 2004 Report Share Posted June 1, 2004 Raghavaji, Hari Om! Namaste! Brilliant topic to kick start a discussion on vasanas. It is so interesting I can't resist with out adding more to your points :-) Before going in to the subject we have to see the model of Jeeva. "Two birds are on the branch of a tree, one is indulged in eating a fruit and the other is watching it! " if we understand this upanishadic (mundaka) statement, the model becomes clear. Even modern day psychologists (Sundar-ji can confirm it!) say that there is an observing self in us. During extreme traumas we seperate ourselves from us and watch us undergoing the trauma. We can clearly see ourselves in certain situations. The observing self is the purusha (the watching bird) and the indulging self is the prakriti (eating bird). Vasanas (casual body), Ego, Intellect, Mind and all other things come in to the indulging self. Through sadhana the Seer gains the power of stop identifying with the indulging bird and start identifying with the observing bird. Vasanas are the goading factors for indulgance! To certain extent we can say that moksha (liberation) is when the observing bird thinks that it has had enough with the indulging bird and parts company! The mejastic cosmic drama of life and death of the indulging bird and the ever attached observing bird continues till the observing bird stops observing. I would like to quote a beautiful statement from Katha Upanishad here: "Oh Nachiketa! It is imperceptible by senses; it is hidden with in our souls; it dwells in the cave of our hearts, it is very subtle, very deep, old and ancient. It existed before the beginning of creation, and still exists, and it will exist through all eternity. If you wish to know this you must practice Yoga, practice concentration, meditation, and must enter in to samadhi, and there you must come face to face with that which is eternal and immortal. Then you shall be able to realize that, and after realizing the eternal truth, you shall arise above phenomena! pleasure and pain, sorrow and misery, happines and unhappyness. Whoever has realized that immortal nature, has become perfect, has gone beyond good and evil, virtue and vice, heaven and hell, all duality and relativity, and has transcended all the laws which govern the phenomenal nature." Coming to the points of reincarnation: a) a) How long does it take one to reincarnate ? Madhava: It is of two types: vanchita (wanted) avaanchita (never wanted) Seers, yogis and Gods (e.g. Vishnu) come down using Vanchita reincornation. All other beings like myself comedown with avanchita reincarnation. Again applying the analogy of Observing and indulging birds - a seer who takes vanchita incarnation is a like the observing bird - who knows completly about the indulging bird's instatiable indulgance, still goes along with it! Where as others who take Avanchita reincarnation are like the indulging bird which keeps haplessly hoping from one branch of the tree to the other branch, driven only by the sheer force of insatiable hunger (vaasanas). The indulging soul is like a dreamer who hops from one dream to the other. How long does it take to switch for a dreamer from one dream to the other, so long it takes for a soul to reincarnate. It is as swift as a desire, swifter than a panting dove or a hunting panther! Reincarnating speed is mesured in manovega (momentum of mind) b) Where does one reincarnate ? Depends on what kind it is, vanchinta or avanchita! c) Why does one reincarnate ? Helpless stupidity. d) How long is the next journey after reincarnation ? Madhava: While commenting on Garuda purana my teacher told me that birth is swift and immediate. It takes four months (to be a part of a rice plant) soul enters in to the human body as the food consumed. It is difficult to explain but definitely nobody hangs in the ether or sky. They are born within no time. Droped as rain and sucked by roots, or breathed from air through plant leaves, it starts with vegitation. At the lowest level of nature. e) What is the single and most important lesson to be learned that was scheduled or is being scheduled now ? Madhava: IF YOU DO WHAT YOU ALWAYS DID, YOU WILL GET WHAT YOU ALWAYS GOT... There will never be any change! f) What does one do in the intermittent time between births ? Not even a nano second. Interesting discussion! Thank you for sharing your thoughts. Yours, Madhava Raghavarao Kaluri [raghavakaluri] 28 May 2004 18:38 kuntimaddisada Cc: advaitin-owner Reincarnation and Vasanas - Some thoughts Dear Sir, Since I do not have Ramji's email-id, I am sending this way to be considered for posting to Advaitin list. With Love, Raghava - - - - - - - - - - -- -- - - - - -- Namaste. Here are some thoughts on reincarnation and vasanas, not necessarily in order or with accuracy. a) How long does it take one to reincarnate ? b) Where does one reincarnate ? c) Why does one reincarnate ? d) How long is the next journey after reincarnation ? e) What is the single and most important lesson to be learned that was scheduled or is being scheduled now ? f) What does one do in the intermittent time between births ? I will try and ponder over them at surface. All are requested to pitch in with details and insights. c) Why does one reincarnate ? As we know, the single driving force behind everything one does or does not do is, 'Vasanas'. It is like a pilot to an airplane while one's body is like an airplane. b)Where does the airplane land ? (Where is the next reincarnation ?) If things go well, it will land in a proper runway which is conducive to its landing. This is like reincarnation. An airplane will not land normally on trees. Birds land on trees. Thus, innate vasanas decide where one will land next. a)How long does it take between births ? An airplane will stay/move in the skies until the correct runway and city are reached. Sometimes, the airplane may need to stay in the sky for a long time hovering over the city until things are conducive for landing. f) What does one do in the intermittent time between births ? No clue. Probably, things which are like what we do in dreams. g) Where do Vasanas reside ? Seems Vasanas do not reside anywhere. Vasanas themselves reincarnate ? Then, Physical memory and records of previous births must be different from Vasanas, like a trail of smoke when a rocket is fired. This implies, anyone can see anyone else's all previous births. Edgar Cayce used to call these, 'Akashic Records'. e) Lot of times, we see similar thinking people living in proximity. They together, live out a collective vasana, it seems, with a collective interdependancy to fulfil their individual life's purposes. For eg. Set of Musicians, Set of dancers, Set of scientists, Set of politicians, Set of <xyz> where xyz is a living-phenomenon. f) Interestingly, a city also may have a vasana. It has a starting, it is sustained over a long period and undergoes many many changes depending on how the people lived in it. In brief, it has a history and lives. All together, it may be called a 'Vasana' for the city. g) where does the 'vasana' of the city of #f reside ? Interestingly, we might just laugh it off. Are human Vasanas also, any different ? Don't have clue. Please contradict, support or add. I will watch now on. With Love, Raghava ______________________ India Matrimony: Find your partner online. http://.shaadi.com/india-matrimony/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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