Real and the Unreal

[Guest guest]

Namaste, All Advaitins

 

To my earlier posting, may I add :

 

Unreal need not be negated, as it is unreal.

 

Real cannot be negated.

 

What one can negate is something which is neither real nor unreal. The doubt is

in the knowledge as to whether world is real or unreal. So only the knowledge

needs to be corrected and it is not necessary nor it is possible to

negate/efface the world. On rising of self knowledge, the notion about Aham,

Idam and Iswara, i.e. about myself or I, the world and Iswara, gets replaced (?)

by Knowledge. And as Arjuna said “Nashto Mohaha smrudhi labdhwa” i.e. one’s

confusion/doubt gets cleared, once and for all, and one continues to interact

with the world but with the right knowledge that the world makes me neither

happy nor unhappy, as I am happiness and Poornam itself.

 

Warm Regards, Hari Om

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Respected Brother Mani ,

 

Let me first tell you that i have always enjoyed your contributions

to this list for your fresh perspectives on many subjects. Thank you,

once again for the posts on the 'Real and the Unreal.'

 

If you may recall, at the very outset of this discussion, i asked a

question why this is Topic labelled 'Real and the Unreal' ? (why not

Real versus unreal?) please ponder over this deeply !!

 

Something cannot be both 'real' and 'unreal' - it has to be one or

the other !!! are you with me, so far?

 

Maniji- you state "Mithya is not unreal"

 

what is "mithya" ?

 

It is not I ( the limited being that I am) who says this...

 

It is our beloved ADI SHANKARA BHAGVADAPADA HIMSELF WHO PROCLAIMS AND

SUMS UP VEDANTA IN THESE THREE CRISP APHORISMS ...

 

(a) Brahma Satyam, (b) Jagat Mithya, and © Jivo Brahmaiva naparah.

 

NOW, WHAT IS 'SATYAM' ?

 

WHAT IS 'MITHYAM' ?

 

Satyam is -"Truth" and Mithyam is "Untruth"

 

What is "Truth" ? are there Many Truths?

 

The word "Truth" has many synonyms and is used differently in

different contexts.

 

1) True means "firm" -

 

2) True means "Stable"- .

 

3) True means -"constant"

 

4) True means "faithful"

 

5) True means " loyal"

 

6) True means "righteous"

 

7) True means ***Real****

 

8) True means " ideal"

 

9) True means "integrity"

 

and last but not least 10) True means "veracity"

 

s. maniji! there are "truths" and "truths" ! Ultimate Truth! Logical

Truth! Moral Truth ! Vedic Truth ! Vedantic Truth ! etc etc....

 

But Ultimately there is only

 

one Truth - ekam 'sad

 

Viprah bahuda vadanti- sages call it by different names.

 

AND THIS TRUTH IS " braHman alone is Real" and this Truth will set

you me and everyone else "free" ! am i right or wrong?

 

Now the word"mithya" - opposite of "true " is untrue! opposite of

real is "unreal" ...

 

Now what is "maya" - Maya is something that cannot be measured( from

the root word "ma" .)

 

I am sure you would have read Kenji's brilliant exposition on "Maya"

in the Vedas? what is this vedic *Maya *which later gave rise to

*Maya *in Vedanta?

 

In the vedic sense "Maya is the MOther and Measure of all things" and

the Mind. ! She is not inexistent "Ilusion" !

 

" Maya is a semantic ancestor of the greek mala, the midwife or wise

woman ("sage-femme" in french) who makes the mother give birth,

through the science of maieutics whose moral equivalent is taught by

Socrates." (kenji would love this !!!)

 

How did "maya" become "mithya"? "See the parallel between Maya and

Mithya, both of which are held to be delusional and unreal while they

in fact enshrine the ultimate imaginal truth as Aristotle emphasized

when he equated the philomythos to the philosopher. Maya is the great

mithya or the web of mythos."

 

KenjI explained beautifully by quoting various Rig Vedic Suktas that

How Maya is the supernatural power with mysterious and wondrous

skils -the cosmic energy of the Vedic Gods ... He quoted Rig VEDA 6-

47-16 AND 6-45-16 and addressed it as *Maya-Bhi* creative art of GOD.

 

Kenji gave a beautiful description of How Indra deva transforms into

many forms like clouds, thunder etc "Rupam Rupam prati rupo

bababhuva"

 

Maya in Prakriti is thus a formless and subtle being of Light (rig

veda 7-33-4) !

 

Maniji- there are many names and forms of 'reality'

 

1) emprical reality - world of forms and names as in the vedas

 

2) absolute reality - no manes , no forms

 

Maya - hides the Truth and misrepresents the Truth !

 

so Rope looks like Snake - hiding the truth

 

and since maya is hiding the truth , you jump over the rope thinking

it is snake - this is misrepresentation.

 

 

SO, WHAT IS THE NEXT STEP? Befriend Maya; get to know her

intimately ; surrender to her - for Maya has two aspects , Vidya and

Avidya! VIdya maya liberates; avidya maya binds you!

 

Our beloved Shankaracharya says ...

 

"He exists verily in two parts, on account of which, the two could

become husband and wife.Therefore, this space is ever filled up

completely by the woman (or the feminine principle) surely."

 

Do not treat "maya" as "yama" -something to be shunned ! She is to be

embraced and won over!!!! smiles!!!!

 

Samuel Coleridge

 

What if you sleep, and what if in your sleep you dreamed, and what if

in your dream you went to heaven and there plucked a strange and

beautiful flower, and what if when you awoke you had the flower in

your hand? Ah, what then?" -

 

Until the dawn of Knowledge of the Self, MAYA IS AS REAL AS THE SUN

BEHIND THE CLOUDS.

 

 

 

 

 

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