Re:Metaphors -their strengths and weaknesses .

[Guest guest]

Durga-ji observes

 

(On the above subject, that of metaphors, or drshtantas, she says

that they are useful, to illustrate a particular point, and that

they also have their limitations.

(SNIP)

My teacher used the wave/ocean metaphor to explain what she meant by

limitation of the drshtanta. That drshtanta is used only to show

that the truth of the ocean and the wave is water, nothing more. )

 

Thank you so much for sharing this.

 

Yes, Wave and the Ocean - Another popular metaphor used in Vedanta as

well as Sufism.

 

Once Sri Poonjaji ( a disciple of Sri Ramana) was asked by a

disciple...

 

Question- Since coming to you I realize that I am not really this

individual and am pure Being.

How can this illusion of individuality arise?

 

Answer:

The Ocean cannot stay alone

and so the notion of wave is created.

When waves rise Ocean loses nothing

and when waves fall Ocean gains nothing.

Samsara, the illusion, Maya, the play,

is the wave on the Ocean of Nirvana.

Waves are not separate from the Ocean,

rays are not separate from the Sun,

You are not separate from

Existence-Consciousness-Bliss.

This is a reflection of That.

 

Is this not beautiful?

 

HOWEVER,

 

Durgaji makes another interesting point

 

( A misunderstanding of that drshtanta would be, "Oh, I am a wave,

made of water, a small part of the big water of the ocean, and

therefore my little wave self must someone "merge" with the big Self

of the ocean. This is an incorrect use of the drshtanta.

What is being pointed to, is that the truth of the wave and the

truth of the ocean is water, nothing more. Thus your Self and the

Self of Ishwara are the same, and in no way is one larger or

smaller, (because of course size doesn't apply).

 

well, i am not competent or qualified to comment on this

understanding of this drshanta ................

 

To me, Your understanding of this Drshanta is based on Adwaitha.

Because the wave and the ocean are basically the same thing. Hence,

there is something else that is the wave as well as the ocean — it is

the water. This is Adwaita — the wave and the ocean, that is you and

the Lord are one. In other words — You are BraHman.

 

Ask someone who believes in Dwaita Philosophy. HE/SHE will say a wave

is a wave and an ocean is an ocean and because they are different

there can be no equation between them.

 

AND a Vishista Adwaitan will say , the wave is not different from the

ocean, but a part of it, and without the ocean the wave cannot exist.

 

and so on and so forth.

 

SO,which interpretation is correct. In the Ultimate analysis ,

everything depends on your own experience.( anubhava or better still

anubhuti) !!!

 

Durga-ji, it is my pleasure to bring to you this third verse from

Adi Sankara's Shatpadi Stotra ...

 

 

Oh! Protector! Even with the difference (between You and me) passing

off, I become Yours but You do not become mine. Indeed (though there

is no difference between the waves and the ocean) the wave belongs to

the ocean but nowhere (never) does the ocean belong to the wave. (3)

 

Once Lord Rama asked Vir Bhakta Hanuman: "Hanuman, what attitude do

you cherish towards Me?"

 

Hanuman answered : "O Rama! When I think I am the body, You are the

Master and I am Your servant, when I think I am the jivatman

(embodied individual soul), You are the whole and I am a part ; but

when I have the Knowledge of Reality, I see that you are I and I am

You."

 

and one final point Durga-ji makes

 

If used correctly, by a skillful teacher, drshtantas are

very useful in knocking off ignorance, and in pointing to the

Truth .

 

yes! Indeed!

 

but i am still intrigued by the 'barren woman's son' metaphor!!!

 

VandHya putra?

 

how much of it is relevant in today's world ? specially in the U.S.A

where science and technology has advanced so much !!!

 

and then what about the Bible ?

 

there is not one Barren woman but *SEVEN* of them and all of them got

children at some point...

 

now, how about that for a MET-A-PHOR?

 

Smiles !!!! this is also an Adwaitic Maya !!!!

 

 

Hari Aum Tat Sat !!!!