Vedanta and poetry? Can the song be separated from the singer?

[Guest guest]

Mani-ji,

 

I aked a rhetorical question - Is ishwara real?

 

Of course ! so is Ishwari!!!!

 

to a parama Bhakta as well as a parama jnani - 'all is real' in all

three states of waking, dream and deep states.

 

Sarvam BraHma Mayam

 

Sarvam Vishnu Mayam

 

Sarvam Shakti Mayam!

 

AND WHAT ABOUT Jagat-Janani? the one who gives birth to this world?

 

"The word `Isha' not only signifies Ishwara the lord but also jIva

limited by antaHkaraNa. She is the presiding deity and manollasini

for both of them denoted by the term `tat' and `tvam' respectively in

the `tattvamasi' statement, but the words `tat' and `tvam' being

taken with out there respective attributes as omniscience and the

like and the ignorance and the like. When the two limitations are

discarded on examination of the import of `tattvamasi' she manifests,

shining as the basic, unchanging consciousness, the underlining

unity."

 

(Aravind Krishna -www.ambaal.org)

 

Somebody commented in a private e-mail - one should not mix Vedanta

with poetry? well, our Acharya himself loved to convey simple

vedantic truths through the beautiful medium of Lyrical poetry! Dry

intellect is not certainly my cup of tea.... I relate more to

imagery , visual and auditory as well as beautiful similies and

powerful metaphors and the alluring sounds of ALLITERATIONS... i

started loving the image of Mahisasuramardini only after hearing M.S.

SUBBALAXMI'S MELODIOUS rendering of Adi Shanakara's '

MAHISARAMARDINI STOTRA-"ayi giri nandini ...."

 

and the ANNAPURNASHTAKAM of adi shankara?

 

Mata cha parvati devi pita devo maheshvarah

Bandhavah shivabhaktashcha svadesho bhuvanatrayamh

 

TWO SIMPLE LINES - contains a universal truth!

 

Mother is Parvati ; Father is Shiva

all the devotees of siva are my relatives and all the three worlds

are my country.

 

How can one attain Brahma Jnana WITHOUT contemplating on one's

beautiful form of an ISHTADEVATA? how many of us are capable of doing

the "atma-vichara" method of the jnanis? who am i? not me!!!! my

mind wanders a million miles a minute!!!

 

When I think OF Mahavishu , I see him lying in the ocean of milk (

ksheera sagara ) with the beautiful Mahalaxmi at his feet and Adi

sesha's hood as an umbrella and Narada with his veena in the

background .. what a sight to behold of the Cosmic couple!

 

When I think of Sri Madurai Meenakshi Amman, i see this beautiful

lady wearing an emerald green saree decked in all fine jewellery with

a green parrot on her right shoulder , surrounded by Kadamba trees?

 

Of Course, don't even remind of MOhana KRishna, Muthukrishna, Murali

Krishna - MY MIND TRAVELS STRAIGHT TO BRINDAVANA and all i hear is

the melodious sound of flute !!!

 

and Bholenath Shambhu? oh! as a dancer , i love his form as Nataraja

the best! my feet start dancing to the beat of his drums !

 

and Professor Vk-ji mentioned about Devi Saraswati a few posts ago.

Yes! the Lady in white , sitting on a Lotus, with the celestial veena

in her two hands, a book in the other hand, a meditation mala in

another - She is a Jnana Swarupini - mere contemplation of this image

is enough to throw oneself into a trance ...

 

And vk-ji mentioned 'shraddha' ! a forgotton word -

 

Shraddvan Labhate Jnanam!

 

BOTTOM LINE IS 'FAITH AND DEVOTION' -without which the spiritual path

is difficult to tread!

 

My friends! i know Vedantis always associate Devi worship with

Tantric Shaktism . but in reality, can you seperate Ishwara from

Ishwari? can you separate an image from its reflection? Pratibha and

pratibimba? Vimarsha and Prakasha?

 

Adi shankara sings in his ARDHA-NAREESHWERA stotra

 

prapa~ncha sR^ishhTyunmukhalaasyakaayai

samasta samhaaraka taaNDavaaya |

jagajjananyai jagatekapitre

namaH shivaayai cha namaH shivaaya || 7 ||

 

Swami Sivananda translates this verse thus ...

To Her whose dance marks the creation of the World

To Him whose dance indicates the total destruction of everything in

this world

To HER who is the World MOTHER

To HIM who is the FATHER of the Universe

that is, to Gauri and Shiva, our prostrations!!!!!

 

and, one last point ...

 

Krishna tells Uddhava in the Bhagavata:

 

vaidikas tantriko misra

iti me tri-vidho makhah

trayanam ipsitenaiva

vidhina mam samarcaret

 

"One should properly worship Me by selecting one of the three methods

by which I receive sacrifice that is suitable for oneself: Vedic,

tantric or mixed."

 

SO, advaitins ! There is no hard and fast rule as to how one

approaches GOD/ESS ....

 

ALL PATHS LEAD TO THE DIVINE !

 

Devi herself is called chitagnikunda - fire pit of consciousness !!!!

 

in the long run, without 'poetry' i will be dead!

 

why do you think all religious texts are called 'song'

 

Bhagwat GIta

 

Ashtavakra Gita

 

Avadhuta Gita

 

Gita Govindam

 

The soul sings eternally in the presence of God-realization!!!!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

advaitin, "Chittaranjan Naik"

<chittaranjan_naik> wrote:

> Namaste Shri Mani-ji,

>

> advaitin, "R.S.MANI" <r_s_mani> wrote:

>

> > If the person asking whether Ishwara is real or not,

> > or doubting whether Ishwara is real or not, is real,

> > then Ishwara is real. If the person asking this is

> > unreal, who is asking this, an unreal cannot ask.

>

> I like the way your answer is articulated. And of course, I agree

> with it. :-)

>

> Warm regards,

> Chittaranjan

[Guest guest]

Dear AdiMa,

 

advaitin, "adi_shakthi16" <adi_shakthi16>

wrote:

> Somebody commented in a private e-mail - one should not mix Vedanta

> with poetry? well, our Acharya himself loved to convey simple

> vedantic truths through the beautiful medium of Lyrical poetry! Dry

> intellect is not certainly my cup of tea.... I relate more to

> imagery , visual and auditory as well as beautiful similies and

> powerful metaphors and the alluring sounds of ALLITERATIONS...

> Of Course, don't even remind of Mohana KRishna, Muthukrishna,

> Murali Krishna - MY MIND TRAVELS STRAIGHT TO BRINDAVANA and

> all i hear is the melodious sound of flute !!!

 

 

Dear AdiMa, I am inspired by your post to write these words...

 

 

Reason is the means to reach the Heart, but poetry is the very song

of the Heart. Reason roams about in arid desert sands, but poetry

sings of raptures of the dark night!

 

Isn't reality a Living Reality?

 

Reality is not merely Sat, nor is it merely Chit, but it is also

Ananda. And Its living waters is Love. Isn't love the essence of

poetry? Doesn't it reflect even in mortal hearts a little of the

ineffable sweetness of Ananda?

 

In the deep wells of Reality, there is an intimate connection between

love, poesis and freedom. It emerges through the chandelier of our

earthly existence as love and poetry – as expressions of the

ineffable freedom in the core of our being. For love is the

fundamental need of man and woman to breathe a freer air, to give

free reign to the essence of poetry in life. It cares not for wealth

or fame; it waits not for reason to unravel its complex fabric; it is

a gifted moment of carefree abandon. It responds to the soul's need

to soar above the gravity of life's occupations and disabuse itself

of the pragmatism of business and the meticulous air of scientific

scholarship. It is a momentary revelation of the poetical in the

ground of our being, a hint of the mystical night that awaits the

virgin soul!

 

Love and regards,

Chittaranjan

[Guest guest]

wow! Chitta!

 

I thought you are just a Philosopher ( that too a vedantic) and now i

realize you are a POET too! That is the beauty of god-consciouness -

the soul sings and the heart dances ! smiles!

 

Chitta writes...

 

(In the deep wells of Reality, there is an intimate connection

between love, poesis and freedom. )

 

 

and Chitta, how Our BELOVED Rabindranath Tagore captures this

sentiment in the following poem ...

 

 

Let thy love play upon my voice and rest on my silence.

Let is pass through my heart into all my movements.

Let thy love like stars shine in the darkness of my sleep and dawn

in my awakening.

Let it burn in the flame of my desires.

And flow in all current of my own love.

Let me carry thy love in my life as a harp does its music, and give

i it back to thee at last with my life.

 

 

-from The Crossing

 

As you Nobel Laurette Rabindranath Tagore was A POET, PHILOSOPHER,

PAINTER and in fact what we call a well-rounded Personality. In this

poem, He is professing his Love for the Divine.

 

ps now that the Moderators have been gracious enough to extend

the 'real and the unreal' discussion to August and may be even

September , we can expect many more days of wonderful discussions. By

this time, our beloved Nairji will also be back and i am sure , he

will weave the 'PURNAMIDAM' topic into this debate on Real and

Unreal. Without Purnamidham , Real will be 'adhoora-idam' (

incomplete) ' I am also delighted Maniji is going to take up the

challenge of dicsussing "Athathato Moksha Jigyasa' - that ought to be

interesting. Maniji has a great sense of humor and has the uncanny

knack of making complex vedantic truths sound simple!! I cannot wait

for Our Bhaskar-ji !!! he will be sensational on "!'Adhyaropavada'!

and Greg-ji! Our vedantic counsellor - i expect great things from him

on ' Practice of vedanta' ! His group on 'Non-dual philosophy' is

already a great hit.

 

best wishes

[Guest guest]

Dear Adi-Ji:

 

In my opinion one of the reasons why the poetry has been important

for vedic seers is the following:

 

1. Due to lack of written material, (storage - Paper & printing)

they must have been forced to weave their knowledge into

the "LYRICS". It is always easier to remember poetry rather than "a

prose text".

 

2. To ensue the correctness and integrity of the text various kinds

of recitation procedures were adopted (ghana paaTha etc), smahitaa

recitation. That is also one of the reasons why same suuktaa can be

found in all the four vedic texts (with some minor variations).

Actually these minor variations gives use the clue for their

individual death of understanding of these wonderful compositions.

 

3. Originally there was only one veda. Veda vyaasa separated the

specific R^icaa that were suitable for signing and classified it

as "saama". R^icaa & mantra that were useful for performing the

yaj~naa were included in to yajurveda.

 

I am sure learned scholars will be able to shed more detailed

explanation from their perspective but this is my simplistic

explanation.

 

In conclusion, poetry is intimately connected with our vedic

philosophy. I have also found some examples that document the

totally opposite as well. Some of the mantras in the passion and

zeal for reciting into the lyrics format have actually lost the

meaning of the text.

 

Finally, it is what we understand from the text is of the essence and

not the delivery vehicle (which is important in its own rights as

well).

 

Regards,

 

Yadunath

 

advaitin, "Chittaranjan Naik"

<chittaranjan_naik> wrote:

> Dear AdiMa,

>

> advaitin, "adi_shakthi16"

<adi_shakthi16>

> wrote:

>

> > Somebody commented in a private e-mail - one should not mix

Vedanta

> > with poetry? well, our Acharya himself loved to convey simple

> > vedantic truths through the beautiful medium of Lyrical poetry!

Dry

> > intellect is not certainly my cup of tea.... I relate more to

> > imagery , visual and auditory as well as beautiful similies and

> > powerful metaphors and the alluring sounds of ALLITERATIONS...

>

> > Of Course, don't even remind of Mohana KRishna, Muthukrishna,

> > Murali Krishna - MY MIND TRAVELS STRAIGHT TO BRINDAVANA and

> > all i hear is the melodious sound of flute !!!

>

>

> Dear AdiMa, I am inspired by your post to write these words...

>

>

> Reason is the means to reach the Heart, but poetry is the very song

> of the Heart. Reason roams about in arid desert sands, but poetry

> sings of raptures of the dark night!

>

> Isn't reality a Living Reality?

>

> Reality is not merely Sat, nor is it merely Chit, but it is also

> Ananda. And Its living waters is Love. Isn't love the essence of

> poetry? Doesn't it reflect even in mortal hearts a little of the

> ineffable sweetness of Ananda?

>

> In the deep wells of Reality, there is an intimate connection

between

> love, poesis and freedom. It emerges through the chandelier of our

> earthly existence as love and poetry – as expressions of the

> ineffable freedom in the core of our being. For love is the

> fundamental need of man and woman to breathe a freer air, to give

> free reign to the essence of poetry in life. It cares not for

wealth

> or fame; it waits not for reason to unravel its complex fabric; it

is

> a gifted moment of carefree abandon. It responds to the soul's need

> to soar above the gravity of life's occupations and disabuse itself

> of the pragmatism of business and the meticulous air of scientific

> scholarship. It is a momentary revelation of the poetical in the

> ground of our being, a hint of the mystical night that awaits the

> virgin soul!

>

> Love and regards,

> Chittaranjan

[Guest guest]

A small correction.

>>>> individual death of understanding <<<<<

 

should read

 

"individual depth of understanding ............"

 

Regards,

 

Yadunath

 

advaitin, "ymoharir" <ymoharir> wrote:

> Dear Adi-Ji:

>

> In my opinion one of the reasons why the poetry has been important

> for vedic seers is the following:

>

> 1. Due to lack of written material, (storage - Paper & printing)

> they must have been forced to weave their knowledge into

> the "LYRICS". It is always easier to remember poetry rather

than "a

> prose text".

>

> 2. To ensue the correctness and integrity of the text various

kinds

> of recitation procedures were adopted (ghana paaTha etc), smahitaa

> recitation. That is also one of the reasons why same suuktaa can

be

> found in all the four vedic texts (with some minor variations).

> Actually these minor variations gives use the clue for their

> individual death of understanding of these wonderful compositions.

>

> 3. Originally there was only one veda. Veda vyaasa separated the

> specific R^icaa that were suitable for signing and classified it

> as "saama". R^icaa & mantra that were useful for performing the

> yaj~naa were included in to yajurveda.

>

> I am sure learned scholars will be able to shed more detailed

> explanation from their perspective but this is my simplistic

> explanation.

>

> In conclusion, poetry is intimately connected with our vedic

> philosophy. I have also found some examples that document the

> totally opposite as well. Some of the mantras in the passion and

> zeal for reciting into the lyrics format have actually lost the

> meaning of the text.

>

> Finally, it is what we understand from the text is of the essence

and

> not the delivery vehicle (which is important in its own rights as

> well).

>

> Regards,

>

> Yadunath

>

> advaitin, "Chittaranjan Naik"

> <chittaranjan_naik> wrote:

> > Dear AdiMa,

> >

> > advaitin, "adi_shakthi16"

> <adi_shakthi16>

> > wrote:

> >

> > > Somebody commented in a private e-mail - one should not mix

> Vedanta

> > > with poetry? well, our Acharya himself loved to convey simple

> > > vedantic truths through the beautiful medium of Lyrical poetry!

> Dry

> > > intellect is not certainly my cup of tea.... I relate more to

> > > imagery , visual and auditory as well as beautiful similies and

> > > powerful metaphors and the alluring sounds of ALLITERATIONS...

> >

> > > Of Course, don't even remind of Mohana KRishna, Muthukrishna,

> > > Murali Krishna - MY MIND TRAVELS STRAIGHT TO BRINDAVANA and

> > > all i hear is the melodious sound of flute !!!

> >

> >

> > Dear AdiMa, I am inspired by your post to write these words...

> >

> >

> > Reason is the means to reach the Heart, but poetry is the very

song

> > of the Heart. Reason roams about in arid desert sands, but poetry

> > sings of raptures of the dark night!

> >

> > Isn't reality a Living Reality?

> >

> > Reality is not merely Sat, nor is it merely Chit, but it is also

> > Ananda. And Its living waters is Love. Isn't love the essence of

> > poetry? Doesn't it reflect even in mortal hearts a little of the

> > ineffable sweetness of Ananda?

> >

> > In the deep wells of Reality, there is an intimate connection

> between

> > love, poesis and freedom. It emerges through the chandelier of

our

> > earthly existence as love and poetry – as expressions of the

> > ineffable freedom in the core of our being. For love is the

> > fundamental need of man and woman to breathe a freer air, to give

> > free reign to the essence of poetry in life. It cares not for

> wealth

> > or fame; it waits not for reason to unravel its complex fabric;

it

> is

> > a gifted moment of carefree abandon. It responds to the soul's

need

> > to soar above the gravity of life's occupations and disabuse

itself

> > of the pragmatism of business and the meticulous air of

scientific

> > scholarship. It is a momentary revelation of the poetical in the

> > ground of our being, a hint of the mystical night that awaits the

> > virgin soul!

> >

> > Love and regards,

> > Chittaranjan