SEPTEMBER TOPIC: "THE PLACE OF PRACTICE IN ADVAITA-VEDANTA"

[Guest guest]

advaitin, "ymoharir" <ymoharir> wrote: It

is the

> aatmasaaxaatakaa (self experience) that results in the erosion of "I-

> ness" and all the dvita-bhaavana disappears. Then he continues to

> say that lack of such knowledge of ultimate truth (tri-kaala-

> abadhita) is avidyaa and the dissolution of this avidyaa is moxa.

 

Namaste,

 

The stirring personal experiences expressed by many so

far, points to the crucial role of 'samskaras' in the unfolding of

spiritual wisdom. Greg-ji's question about how one who has 'no

feeling' for God should start the quest was asked by a visitor to Sri

Ramakrishna. Here is how he

answered:

 

http://www.hinduism.fsnet.co.uk/namoma/kathamritam/chapter_09/k09_2_Apr_08_1883.\

htm

 

DEVOTEE: "How can I develop love for God?"

 

MASTER: "Repeat His name, and sins will disappear. Thus you will

destroy lust, anger, the desire for creature comforts, and so on."

 

DEVOTEE: "How can I take delight in God's name?"

 

MASTER: "Pray to God with a yearning heart that you may take

delight in His name. He will certainly fulfil your heart's desire."

 

So saying, the Master sang a song in his sweet voice, pleading

with the Divine Mother to show Her grace to suffering men:

 

O Mother, I have no one else to blame:

Alas! I sink in the well these very hands have dug.

With the six passions for my spade,

I dug a pit in the sacred land of earth;

And now the dark water of death gushes forth!

How can I save myself, O my Redeemer?

 

Surely I have been my own enemy;

How can I now ward off this dark water of death?

Behold, the waters rise to my chest!

How can I save myself? O Mother, save me!

Thou art my only Refuge; with Thy protecting glance

Take me across to the other shore of the world.

 

The Master sang again:

 

What a delirious fever is this that I suffer from!

O Mother, Thy grace is my only cure.

False pride is the fever that racks my wasted form;

"I" and "mine" are my cry. Oh, what a wicked delusion!

 

My quenchless thirst for wealth and friends is never-ceasing;

How, then, shall I sustain my life?

Talk about things unreal, this is my wretched delirium,

And I indulge in it always, O Giver of all good fortune!

 

My eyes in seeming sleep are closed, my stomach is filled

With the vile worms of cruelty.

Alas! I wander about absorbed in unmeaning deeds;

Even for Thy holy name I have no taste, O Mother!

I doubt that I shall ever be cured of this malady.

 

Then the Master said: " 'Even for Thy holy name I have no taste.'

A typhoid patient has very little chance of recovery if he loses all

taste for food; but his life need not be despaired of if he enjoys

food even a little. That is why one should cultivate a taste for God's

name. Any name will do -- Durga, Krishna or Siva. Then if, through the

chanting of the name, one's attachment to God grows day by day, and

joy fills the soul, one has nothing to fear. The delirium will

certainly disappear; the grace of God will certainly descend..............

 

"Always keep your mind fixed on God. In the beginning you must

struggle a little; later on you will enjoy your pension."

 

[it is worth noting that the only books Sw. Vivekananda carried with

him were the Gita and Imitation of Christ byThomas a Kempis].

 

 

Regards,

 

Sunder

[Guest guest]

Namaste Sundaer-Ji:

 

> The stirring personal experiences expressed by many so

> far, points to the crucial role of 'samskaras' in the unfolding of

> spiritual wisdom.

> Sunder

 

Yes, bhakti does play a very crucial role that contributes to the

advancement of that individual. That is why I had mention the

pruraaNic representation of bhakti (mother) having two sons (j~naana

and vairaagya). I intrepret this as bhakti leads the saadhakaa to

realization, and the road-map of that is via j~naana.

 

bhakti makes even the violent representations of vedi and gods as

loving deities. In normal vyavahaarika lives one would be sacred of

these representations, however, bhakti, shraddhaa is capable of

transforming the violant representations into loving characters.

Godd examples of this is "kaali-Maa" and "gaNesha".

 

Here we were discussing the role of bhakti in advita therefore I had

to give the quotation from sureshvaraacaarya.

 

The end point for all the process is ultimately advita. The most

desired bhakti is ananya-bhakti that is becomming one with the diety.

 

As far as I understand, shankaraacharya wrote many stotra of various

deities only after realization of advita.

 

In conclusion, bhakti has a tremendous role to play that leads to

realization regardless of the chosen deity.

 

saint tukaaraama says -

 

"tukaamhaNe yethe.n naahii.n bhinnabhaava . bhakta toci deva

devabhakta .. 3324 .."

 

tulasidaa in his raamacaritamaanasa also talks about ananya bhakti.

 

so ananya jaake asi mati na Tara{}i hanuma.nta |

mai sevaka sacaraacara ruupa svaami bhagava.nta || raamacarita

maanasa kiShkindhaakaaNDa 3 ||

 

Here, prabhu raamacandra explains to hanumaana the ananyatva of

bahkti. He recommends the serving of all beings as bhagavaana by

being their bhaktaa.

 

Theses thoughts were emphasized by saint tukaaraama, he says - "je je

dekhili bhuuta te te maanije bhagavanta". Meaning – See God in

everything and respect everything as being God.

 

But at the end of the day it is the realization of such knowledge and

then practicing it into our personal lives.

 

Regards,

 

Yadunath

[Guest guest]

This is what written by Sri Rajaji in a book on Bhagavad Gita.

 

It is well known that physical characteristics and mental traits are

passed on from parents to children. This heredity does not explain

what is sought to be explained by the law of Karma. Bodies are shaped

by heredity, but not souls. The Soul has no father or mother, but is

self-existent. Any Soul may be lodged in any body in which it has

earned the fitness to function. Bodies are only tenements provided

for souls even as engineers may build in similar or varying types for

citizens to choose to live in, according their needs. A house may be

improved or even damaged by the occupant. The next person who comes

into the tenements does so because it suits his own condition. A

father may ruin the coming sons body, but which soul is to come as

that son depends on the stage reached in the Karmic evolution of that

Soul. When a son is born to parents he appears to inherit their

physical and mental characteristics, but in reality what he inherits

is his own previous life's accumulation, by reason of which he is

embodied as son to such parents. The aurasa (asuras) son is such only

in the physical body. In the Soul, even an aurasa son is, so to say,

but an adopted son. The law of heredity does not dispense with or

interfere with the operation of the law of Karma.

 

Prahalda is a good example to quote. Even though he was born as

asuras son he was a devote bhakta of Sri Hari Narayana. He always

remembered him and attained mukti. If knowledge gained by reading

books does not get transformed into wisdom then such knowledge is

useless itself.

 

This is from the autobiography of Swami Sivananda of Rishikesh.

O Mahadeva, O Kesava

By the sword of Thy Grace

I have cut off all my bonds

I am free, I am blissful

All desires have disappeared

Now I aspire nothing

But Thy blessed Feet

I have lost all my thoughts

In Thee, O Narayana.

 

I had Thy wondrous vision

I was lost in ecstasy

I was at once transformed

I was drowned

In the Divine Consciousness

In the ocean of bliss

Hail, Hail, O Vishnu, My Lord.

The Maya-made world has vanished now

Mind has totally perished

The Ego has been entirely powdered

The watertight compartments have been broken down

Names and forms disappeared

All distinctions and differences have melted

Old Jivahood has entirely fused

The flood of Truth, Wisdom and Bliss

Has entered everywhere in abundance

Brahman alone shines everywhere

One homogenous Joy-essence pervades everywhere

I have become That. I have become That.

Sivoham. Sivoham. Sivoham.

 

Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa used to offer insight into such finer

points of spiritual life to his devotees, which are invaluable

guidelines to an ardent aspirant.

Once he pointed out that there was no human being who did not err or

quarrel with others but an upright person would repent and apologise

for his lapse to the concerned person.

The saint advised that if the apology was not accepted he should

submit the same to God and seek His pardon. By developing such an

attitude it is possible to retain peace of mind in daily life and

also avoid committing the same mistake again. There are bound to be

many situations in day-to-day life, which can easily destroy one's

peace of mind. By turning to God the mind will quickly regain its

tranquility. Hence it is necessary to constantly stay attuned to

thoughts relating to the Lord so that it becomes one's second nature

to turn to Him whenever in distress. Sri Ramakrishna used to put it

metaphorically, "Hold on to God with one hand and engage in the world

with the other."

[Guest guest]

advaitin, Greg Goode <goode@D...> wrote:

> Thanks profvk-ji for the charming and informative real-life

examples, which also bear Ranjit-ji's question. This is the kind of

post I was hinting that maybe someone, perhaps Sri Vaidyanathan,

might give on bhakti as well.

dear friends,

i am thankful for mr Greg Goode for giving me the oppertunity to

express my thought on Bhakti.

 

In Hinduism which is a way of living for all. It is said that there

are four stages of spiritual discipline an individual is required to

undergo during his life in this world. Though this is strictly

followed in the case of those who were borne as Brahmin, there is no

bar for others to follow this for their spiritual upliftment during

this birth. It is said that the spiritual education for a Hindu

starts right from the birth. The moment he reaches the age of six he

enters a stage called Brahmacharya during which he is to learn the

vedas and spiritual texts from his guru. He is to keep reciting this

till he attains perfection. Then comes the stage of grahastasrama

during which he is supposed to wed a suitable girl and live with her

for life. He can continue his spiritual education and still run the

family from the support he gets from others. The teachings in Gita

that is karma yoga is meant for this type of people who after

Brahmacharya chose to lead a life with a woman. Then he is supposed

to enter Vanaprastha a stage where he prepares himself for Sannyasa.

This he does after performing his duties to the family he brought up

during grahastasrama. During this stage he is not supposed to leave

his wife but both should perform this. That is why you will find in a

Hindu family the family ties are given more importance and a couple

live for years together as husband and wife. Not that in other

religious beliefs this is not there but in Hinduism, which is a way

of life, a lot of importance, is given for this.

 

If an individual is advanced in the sadhana then he can take up

Sannyasa from Brahmacharya stage itself and continue. this depends

upon the level the soul has reachedin the evoulution. Then he has to

follow the Gyana yoga as described in Gita. The Bhakti yoga is ment

for all those who opted the life of Grahastasrama and want to still

progress life. If you see many saints like Ramadas, Thyagaraja and

others have reached lord by pure Bhakti. That is why in Hinduism you

will find lot of gods in various forms and shapes. It gives an

individual to choose his own Ishta devata and have steadfast devotion

in it.

 

When I was a child say around ten years, I was taken to a house in

Waltair now Vishakapatnam in Andhra Pradesh in India. There lived a

pious man by name Mr Krishnamurthy. He had established an idol of

Maruthy in his house and was doing daily poojas. Bhajans used to be

held every Tuesday, Thursday, and Saturday. I used to attend it

regularly with my father who was a good singer. Mr Krishnamurthy use

to do poojas by invoking the moola mantra of this deity. During the

bhajans he use to himself sing and others use to participate in that.

After the bhajans are over if we see the prasads (vadas in this case)

you will find it had been bitten already by some one. Once when I

asked him the reason for this he said that it is Hanuman who is

moving around and doing all these leelas to show his presence.

Initially many people had doubts about these types of incidents. But

since I also wondered to see this phenomenon I used to ask him many

questions and he use to answer them to my satisfaction. I had no

doubts about the presence of a god there as in vedas it is said that

you can invoke a particular god. But now as a child I had this

experience, which made my resolve towards approaching a particular

path easier. It is again the initial education one had during his

childhood which makes them either believe or otherwise about a

particular god. I have no doubt that my joining the defense forces as

an officer which was with the blessings of this god. I even visit

this place during my postings at Vizag. Mr Krishnamurthy has passed

away but the education he had given to many people still attracts

them to come there. Though the miracles do not happen now when some

one else is doing the poojas but still many people around this place

visit for spiritual satisfaction.

 

pranams

cdr bvn

[Guest guest]

Concerning the current discussion of shravana, manana and

nidhidhyasana, I am struck by a correspondence with Bhartrihari's

analysis of vaikhari, madhyama and pashyanti.

 

1. Shravana is objective hearing of the words expressed, thus

corresponding to "vaikhari vak" or the elaborated articulation of

speech.

 

2. Manana is interpretation of the words by thinking about them, thus

corresponding to "madhyama vak" or the mediating process of mind that

functions in between the outside words and the inner consciousness

which they express.

 

3. Nidhidhyasana is taking the interpretation where it rightly points,

to its inmost source of consciousness, which is quite beyond the mind.

Thus nidhidhyasana corresponds to "pashyanti vak" or the seeing

principle of speech. It is from there that all words are spoken out;

and it's back there that all meanings must be taken in.

 

In short, the threefold distinction here is essentially that of body,

mind and consciousness. It is the same distinction that is shown by

the three states of waking, dream and deep sleep.

 

What Bhartrihari demonstrates is that all usage and transactions in

the world are the speaking of a consciousness that stays always

unaffected and incorruptible, through all the changes and

degenerations that appear to outward sight. And the practice he

recommends is the right analysis of speech, so as to come finally back

to the unmixed truth of knowing. This is pointed out, through an acute

three-level description of how speech is used, in the Vakyapadiya and

its vritti commentary, stanza 1.41. A transliteration and free

translation is given below. There is a tradition that attributes the

commentary to Bhatrihari himself, but as usual this is somewhat in

dispute by scholars.

 

Though Bhatrihari makes a specific mention of only three levels, a

fourth level was later added, with the name 'para' or 'beyond'.

Students of advaita should not find much trouble here. By this

addition, all that happens is that the name 'pashyanti' or 'seeing' is

then used in a slightly degraded way to mean the 'witness', and

consciousness itself is described by the name 'para'. This is merely

an elaboration of terminology, which is useful for some purposes. I

mention it only because the more elaborate, four-level terminology is

better known, and it may give an impression that Bhartrihari somehow

stopped short. As I read the Vakyapadiya, I don't interpret it like

that. I would rather say that for his purposes, he preferred the

simpler terminology, with 'pashyanti' or 'seeing' used to mean

consciousness and not just witnessing.

 

If mistakes are noticed in the translation below, I'd be grateful to

be corrected, since my reading of Sanskrit is rather limited and thus

liable to errors.

 

Ananda

 

____________________

____________________

 

 

Three levels of speech

-- from Bhartrihari's 'Vakyapadiya'

===================================

 

 

1.142

-----

 

vaikharyA madhyamAyAsh ca pashyantyAsh cai 'tad adbhutam .

aneka-tIrtha-bhedAyAs trayyA vAcaH paraM padam ..

 

The word that's spoken is threefold.

It consists of 'vaikhari',

of 'madhyama' and 'pashyanti'.

And it has many different ways

of crossing over differences.

But where it ultimately stands

must be amazing to the mind.

[it's only reached where mind, confounded,

has completely disappeared.]

 

>From 1.142 vRtti

----------------

 

paraiH saMvedyaM yasyAH shrotra-viShayatvena

pratiniyataM shruti-rUpaM sA vaikharI .

 

'Elaborated' speech, called 'vaikhari'

is jointly known, concertedly

with others who are listening.

It is the form that's heard

through its objective sound --

particular, restricted to each case.

 

shliShTA

 

Connected, it thus touches upon

other things, which make it

liable to be interpreted.

 

vyakta-varNa-samuccAraNA

prasiddha-sAdhu-bhAvA bhraShTa-saMskArA ca .

 

It is articulated variously,

through varied syllables

and other ways that colour its

expression -- both in well-established

modes and in formations that

have come to be degenerate.

 

tathA yA 'kShe yA dundubhau yA veNau (yA) vINAyAm

 

That is the case when it is

manifested in an axle spinning

round, or in a drum, or in

in a flute or a stringed instrument.

 

ity aparimANa-bhedA .

 

Its differentiation thus

is spoken of as infinite --

beyond all measure and compare.

 

madyamA tv antaH saMniveshinI

 

But there's another form of speech,

called 'madhyama' or 'in between'.

It's sitting place is back within.

 

parigRhIta-krame 'va buddhi-mAtro-'pAdAnA .

 

As it appears, it's a succession

of replacing states -- with each

restricted to a passing moment,

and the whole successive process

made of nothing else but mind.

 

sA tu sUkShma-prANa-vRtty-anugatA

 

However, that must go together

with the subtle functioning

of energy that is expressed

in all activities of life.

 

krama-saMhAra-bhAve 'pi

 

And here, there is a mode in which

succession gets to be withdrawn.

 

vyakta-krama-parigrahai 'va keShA~n cit .

 

For, as succession manifests,

it's just a wrapping that's put on.

This is what some would say of it.

 

pratisaMhRta-kramA saty apy abhede

 

But where succession is withdrawn

what there remains is being, in

the absence of all differences.

 

samAviShTa-krama-shaktiH pashyantI .

 

There, all succession is contained,

at rest, in the unmanifested

potency of 'pashyanti' --

the principle of 'seeing' that

is manifested in all speech.

 

sA calAcalA pratilabdha-samAdhAnA cA

 

That is continual activity --

found in complete absorption

where it stands, returned within.

 

'vRtA vishuddhA ca ,

 

It is just that which is obscured,

in itself completely pure.

 

sanniviShTa-j~neyA-'kArA pratilInA-'kArA nirAkArA ca ,

 

In it, all form is known contained,

all form is utterly dissolved.

No made-up form can there appear.

 

parichinnA-'rtha-pratyavabhAsA saMsRShTA-'rtha-pratyavabhAsA

prashanta-sarvA-'rtha-pratyavabhAsA ce

 

It comes into appearance by

dividing objects from each other,

by connecting them together,

and at last when each of them

has come to peace in which they all

are finally and utterly dissolved.

 

'ty aparimANa-bhedA .

 

It's thus that it may be described --

seen differentiated forth,

beyond all measure and compare.

 

tatra vyAvahArikIShu sarvAsu vAg-avasthAsu vyavasthitaH

sAdhv-asAdhu-pravibhAgaH puruSha-saMskAra-hetur ekeShAM .

 

Concerning this variety,

in all transacted usages

and states of manifesting speech,

there is an established distinction

of right use from wrong. As some

would say, that is the motivating

force which drives our human

cultivation and development.

 

parantu pashyantI-rUpam anapabhraMsham

asaMkIrNaM loka-vyavahArA-'tItam .

 

But here it must be understood

that pashyanti -- in its own seeing

mode -- is utterly unmixed

and unconfused, untouched by all

corrupted use. It is itself

beyond all usage in the world.

 

tasyA eva vAco vyAkaraNena sAdhutva-jnyAna-labhyena

vA shabda-pUrveNa yogenA 'dhigamyata

 

Just what it is may be approached

through the analysis of speech,

attaining to the truth of knowing.

Or through yoga, joining back

into the primal source of speech.

 

ity ekeShAM AgamaH . ...

 

It is thus spoken of by some

who follow what has come from it....

 

>From 1.142 vRtti, quoting some Agama stanzas

-----------

 

sthAneShu vidhRte vayau kRta-varNa-parigrahA .

 

"Arranged in their respective places,

different elements of speech

are carried, spoken, in the air.

 

vaikharI vAk prayoktRINAM prANa-vRtti-nibandhanA ..

 

"That forms elaborated speech.

It's a recording, carried out

through acts of living energy

that functions forth from those who speak.

 

kevalaM buddhy upAdAnA krama-rUp'-AnupAtinI .

 

"Mind in itself is made of forms

that follow on successively,

replacing what has gone before.

 

prAN'-AvRttim atikramya madhyamA vAk pravartate ..

 

"The functioning of living energy

is thereby left behind,

as mediating speech goes on

with its continued functioning.

 

avibhAgA tu pashyantI sarvataH saMhRta-kramA .

 

"But seeing is that partless essence

always present, everywhere.

In it, succession is absorbed.

 

svarUpa-jyotir ev' AntaH sUkShmA vAg anapAyinI .. ...

 

"There's only light in its true nature,

as it is itself, within.

That is a subtle speaking where

no disappearance can be found....

 

prApt'-oparAga-rUpA sA viplavair anuSha~NgibhiH .

 

"It reaches its conditioned form

by mixing it, with a variety

of differing disturbances

that seem to float on it.

 

vaikharI sattva-mAtr' eva guNair na vyavakIryate .. ...

 

"But that, which seems elaborated,

is pure being in itself.

It is untouched, quite unaffected

by its show of qualities...."

[Guest guest]

Namaste Shri Anandaji,

 

advaitin, Ananda Wood <awood@v...> wrote:

> Concerning the current discussion of shravana, manana and

> nidhidhyasana, I am struck by a correspondence with Bhartrihari's

> analysis of vaikhari, madhyama and pashyanti.

 

 

A brilliant post full of Light. Sri Shankaracharya in the commentary

on Brahma Sutra Bhashya (II.i.6.17) says: "The condition in which

name and form become evolved is different from the condition in which

name and form are not so evolved." The sutra itself says that the

word (existence and) non-existence is "from a standpoint of a

difference in characteristics"

 

Both in the Mahabhashya of Patanjali and the Vakhyapadiya of

Bhartrahari we find the same theme that the object denoted by the

word is the same in the different stages of pashyanti, madhyama and

vaikhari. This seems to indicate how the mystery of seeming

difference between Brahman and the world comes about through name. It

would appear that these stages are themselves the mystery of

difference when in truth the object denoted by the word in all the

different stages is the same.

 

First there is shravana, and then there is manana. Vaisvanara merges

into Taijasa when the sameness of objects is seen between vaikhari

and madhyama in manana, and then Taijasa merges with Prajna when the

sameness of objects is seen between madhyama and pashyanti in

nidhidhyasana, and then Taijasa merges in Turiya when the sameness of

objects is seen between pashyanti and para in the Pure Light of

Turiya. No limitation of jada is seen in Its brilliance because it is

seen in its true nature as Pure Light -- because its material cause

is Light Itself.

 

 

Warm regards,

Chittaranjan