Guest guest Posted December 14, 2004 Report Share Posted December 14, 2004 Namaste lordofthemystic: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> advaitin, "lordofthemystic" <lordofthemystic> wrote: > > advaitin, "dennis_travis33" > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > Namaste, > > > > how to study....the truth....Brahman....the Self? > > > > yes, it's possible to study endless scriptures.... > > maybe the truth can be found in there... > > The Truth can never be found in the Scriptures for the Scriptures are > not True themselves. The truth is being and being is the only place to find it. <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Can you please clarify and enlighten us what do you mean by the above statement? If there is no truth in our ancient text then what do propose we do with them? AS if BORI incidence was not bad enough? > > > > it's also possible to follow the words of some Gurus.... > > maybe the truth can be heard and realized there...if this Guru is > > (realy) realized... > > No Guru can tell you the truth. The realized would never claim to be > a Guru. I AM, I am not a Guru. The realization requires Self to > become Aware of what it already is. Guru's are book writers and money > collectors, like preachers, deluded in the illusion. > > Please elaborate, explain and enlighten all of us. I bow to thee "Oh !! the lordofthemystic" !!! ???? with this "MYSTIC" oblation. I am totally confused with these statements. With sincere apologies to the group if I am totally missing something !! Regards, Dr. Yadu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 15, 2004 Report Share Posted December 15, 2004 --- Shailendra Bhatnagar <bhatnagar_shailendra wrote: > > lordofthemystic <lordofthemystic wrote: > > The Truth can never be found in the Scriptures for the Scriptures are > not True themselves. The truth is being and being is the only place > to find it. These kind of half-baked statements are rather dangerous. This site is meant for discussing Advaita philosophy as propounded by Shankara. What Shankara wrote was commentaries on Scriptures not on half-baked statements. All pervading Truth can never be found anywhere including in the above statements. At the same time truth can be found everywhere since it is everywhere too. The above statement requires elaborate analysis and scriptural support for the analysis. Truth cannot be established by any pramaaNa or means of knowledge but of all the means of knowledge Scripture alone is that comes close to reveal the truth by implication. Sir, I have to request you on behalf of the moderators to refrain from these kind of half-baked statements. If you have something to discuss - do so by all means, respecting the tradition and the scope of this list serve. Sorry to be harse. Hari OM! Sadananda ===== What you have is destiny and what you do with what you have is self-effort. Future destiny is post destiny modified by your present action. You are not only the prisoner of your past but master of your future. - Swami Chinmayananda Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 15, 2004 Report Share Posted December 15, 2004 Thank you Nairji. I believe Sri Ramji has elaborated in more detail for the benefit of Sri LOTM and the rest of us. If we look at the actual lives of sages, we see that although all have different paths, there are the common elements of intense desire to know the truth, devotion to God and love for God, devotion and love for Guru, study of scriptures, inquiry, etc. From a practical point of view, these cannot be dismissed. Of course, as Sri LOTM said, "Truth is Being". No one is arguing against that. But to minimize scriptural knowledge is not necessary, as that is a valid path that has stood the test of time, thousands of years. Even Sri Ramana spent most his time explaining and discussing the meaning of works like Vivekachudamani to people and translated many of the ancient works and commentaries (See the Collected Works of Sri Ramana for more translations). So these words that come to us in the form of scriptures from our ancient and modern sages are of such overwhelming beauty and clarity that one is held spellbound at the depth of their understanding. A Self-Realized Sage is in a position to fully understand scriptures and give their benefit to others. Self is indeed beyond all types of worldly knowledge. But some types of knowledge are more helpful than others for Self-Recognition. In the beginning, the Self looks far away and the picture is hazy. The Upanishads tell us the Self is closer than our own breath. It is by the Grace of the Self that we come across the purest teachings of Advaita. By Grace, we come to the teachings of the Guru. By Grace we understand the meaning of scriptures and then clarity emerges slowly like butter emerges from milk. The Grace that gives everything ultimately reveals It Self to be the Self. I feel very fortunate to be in the company of people on the Advaitin list who have drunk deeply of the wisdom of Upanishads and feel that indirectly by reading their words here I benefit from their wisdom. I enjoyed very much Prof Krishnamurthy's essays on Sri Krishna that he posted on HS sometime back and wanted to thank him from my heart in case I forgot to that earlier. With much gratitude and love Harsha _____ Madathil Rajendran Nair [madathilnair] Wednesday, December 15, 2004 2:37 AM advaitin Re: to study Brahman Well timed and worded, Harshaji. Hope the Lord listens to you and Dr. Yaduji. Madathil Nair _______________ advaitin, "Harsha" wrote: > Dear LOTM: > You should read the Advaitin list charter with care and reflect on whether > it is consistent with your purpose for being here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 15, 2004 Report Share Posted December 15, 2004 advaitin, "ymoharir" <ymoharir> wrote: > > Namaste lordofthemystic: > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > advaitin, "lordofthemystic" > <lordofthemystic> wrote: > > > > > > The Truth can never be found in the Scriptures for the Scriptures > are > > not True themselves. The truth is being and being is the only > place to find it. > <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< > > Can you please clarify and enlighten us what do you mean by the > above statement? Dr. Yadu, simply ask yourself who is studying the Scriptures? Just as good, ask yourself who is writing the Scriptures? If you now begin to think of other men and women, some who have passed before you and penned their thoughts for the benefit of you and mankind, then you are believing that you are the body and other people(bodies) have left you some of their thoughts to put you on the right track. This is the delusion of Self in the illusion of a physical World. The Scriptures serve to pull your attention away from the truth. The Truth is "I AM" and "I" cannot be written, read or understood. Understood by who? "I AM" all that there is. If the answer to the above questions is "I AM"(not the body), then the so called physical World, Scriptures included, will disappear like the mirage that they are. Advaitin list moderator to Sri lordofthemystic: Sir, can you please ask yourself, 'where did I get the answers to the question raised by Dr. Yadu?' Also please ask yourself: "why should I participate in any discussions if I believe in what I say?" Aren't you not self-contradicting by joining this list and participating in discussions? Don't you agree that you just need to contemplate (for ever) and completely avoid making any expression? > If there is no truth in our ancient text then what do propose we do > with them? AS if BORI incidence was not bad enough? Everything you call "ancient" is present consciousness. Free yourSelf and do whatever you will. Advaitin list moderator to Sri lordofthemystic: Don't you need to free yourself before you preach? By the where did you get this idea? > > > it's also possible to follow the words of some Gurus.... > > > maybe the truth can be heard and realized there...if this Guru is (realy) realized... >> No Guru can tell you the truth. The realized would never claim to >> be a Guru. I AM, I am not a Guru. The realization requires Self >> to become Aware of what it already is. Guru's are book writers >>and money collectors, like preachers, deluded in the illusion. > Please elaborate, explain and enlighten all of us. Guru - A spiritual master, preceptor; one who removes the darkness of ignorance. When aware, is there one to master or ignorance to remove? Where? Quote from above "if this Guru is (really) realized...". Advaitin list moderator to Sri lordofthemystic: Sir, can you please explain where did you get the definition of 'Guru.' Is it by any chance from a scripture? what is your definition of a scripture? I have to agree that you are indeed the 'lord of lord of the mystic!' Final Note: Please read the following statement from advaitin list's Senior Moderator Sri Sadananda: "These kind of half-baked statements are rather dangerous. This site is meant for discussing Advaita philosophy as propounded by Shankara. What Shankara wrote was commentaries on Scriptures not on half-baked statements. Sir, I have to request you on behalf of the moderators to refrain from these kind of half-baked statements. If you have something to discuss - do so by all means, respecting the tradition and the scope of this list serve. Sorry to be harse." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 15, 2004 Report Share Posted December 15, 2004 Namaste all, Dear Shailendraji, I concur with you in refuting most of the views expressed by LOTM regarding Scriptures, Guru etc. > Sir, Where and how did you learn about Self and being ? Nobody is born with knowledge of Self ? > > thanks, > Shailendra Shailendraji, LOTM may or may not be born with knowledge of Self :-) However, there are people who ARE born with the knowledge of Self. They are called Nittyasiddhas. Shuka is an example. The following story by Shri Ramkrishna substantiates this: " There was a shoal of fish in a pond. The fishermen cast their net. Most of the fish got caught. Some of them just pushed themselves deeper in the mud without making any effort to get out of the net. They are the Baddha Jivas (bound souls). Some of them struggled free of the net with valiant effort. They are the Mumukshus and Jivanmuktas (seekers and enlightened souls), but some of the fish never got caught! They are the Nittyasiddhas." With best wishes, Ravi Dr. Ravindra S. Shivde, Shivde Hospital, Old Pandit Colony, Nasik 422002 Maharashtra, India Phone (0253)2578019, (0253)2315725 Telefax (0253)2570519 mobile 9823053441 E- Mail: shivde Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 16, 2004 Report Share Posted December 16, 2004 Namaste Ram Chandran, thank you for your message.... you wrote "I am Brahman is the ultimate reality and it can't be understood by > just saying "I am Brahman." The scriptures provide `unwritten > lessons' to recognize this fact. Those who live by the 'yagna > spirit' by serving the humanity spontaneously and unselfishly can > only see the Brahman within. The rule is quite simple: Do everything > possible with your body, mind and intellect for the happiness of > everyone surrounding you, and then you will be able to recognize > the "Brahman" within. The true happiness is possible only when > everyone is happy and those who recognize this fact are able to > recognize the truth that "I am the Brahman." yes....as we all agree ....the ultimate reality can't be understood by just saying "I am Brahman"... different "doors" to Brahman......Bhakti,Jnana,Karma,Raja...and many others... only knowing the way to Brahman...to ourSelf...is not enough.... we need to enter....with body mind intellect....i mean...in Whole... I beleive the one who realized Brahman....FEEL it in Whole of his/her Being....in every part of body ......and know, without any doubt.....about the own Liberation like many others...i'm doing my best to reach It. In some discussions....there are emotions coming up....if somebody tell something with other opinion....if somebody enjoy on another way....the truth Brahman.......i mean, not by the deep reading of some scriptures.... The scriptures and the words of some Realized people like Ramana and Ramakrishna have also much influence on me....i Love this people for their Being....for their Presence.....infinite Presence......and for what they ARE. Yes...it's difficult to Love all the people in same way....as i see here in the group.... And it's necessary to make the "difference" between "real and unreal".....until we enter one day completely in Self...Brahman I beleieve that a realized person don't has any big emotions.... why...? everything became Real in his/her life.....nothing anymore which could be worth....to "fight for"..... but...endless reasons.....to Love....everybody and everything....... Even if i know that most of people here in the Advaitin Group....have different path than myself....and mainly "react" on "scripture" words....i accept their personal choice and path..... how it's possible to walk through infinity....if the mind is attached to some emotions and the emotions to the mind ...and intellect....and so on.... Regards wish you a nice day and path...."liberated" from any illusion and emotions.... with love Marc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 16, 2004 Report Share Posted December 16, 2004 Namaste Lordofthemystic, you wrote: "The Scriptures serve to pull your attention away from the truth. The Truth is "I AM" and "I" cannot be written, read or understood. Understood by who? "I AM" all that there is." ....first time i hear that the scriptures serve to pull the attention away from the truth... ....do you have a kind of "allergic disease"...in "to pull the attention"....on anything? as everything IS...as you ARE.... why do you don't accept yourSELF?....or do you beleive that any BEING is different from each? Regards Marc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 16, 2004 Report Share Posted December 16, 2004 advaitin, "dennis_travis33" <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > Namaste Lordofthemystic, > > you wrote: List Moderators' Note: Lordofthemystic has quit the group, and will not be answering any questions addressed to him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.