Nirvikalpa samAdhi in shankara's advaita vEdAnta- PART-II

[Guest guest]

praNAms to all truth seekers

Hare Krishna

 

Sri Shankara bhagavadpUjyapAda sadgurubhyo namaH

Sri SatchidAnandEndra Saraswathi paramagurubhyo namaH

Sri Ashwatha NarayaNa Avadhani sri gurubhyo namaH

 

In the earlier mail, I've tried to convey that shankara classified jnAna

into two groups..i.e. vastu tantra jnAna & puruSha tantra jnAna. former is

strictly object oriented & should be realized *as it is* & latter is

efforts oriented & results can be modified by the *will* of the performer.

As already said, knowing this method according to shankara siddhAnta is

mandatory for every sincere follower of bonafide shankara saMpradAya. Today

(Monday) when I was looking at the mails I was in pain to see some

sarcastic statements on these two type of jnAna-s. Now, kindly let me make

an attempt to show this difference which is quite evident in shankara

siddhAnta.

 

First, we will have a look at shankara's observation on kartru tantra

...Shankara in the 2nd sUtra *janmAdyasya yaTha* commentary says "

puruShAdhInAtmalAbhatvAccha kartavyasya kartuM akartuM anyaThA vA kartuM

shakyaM laukikaM vaidikaNcha karma! yathA ashvEna gacchati, padbhyAM

anyaThA vA na vA gacchati iti..."

 

The action which always has its origin in the will of doer/performer. He

will hold complete sway on this action say he can do it or he may not do it

or he can do it in othe way. Shankara gives above the example of a person

who wants to travel from one place to another...By using his will he can

cover that distance either on foot, or he can opt for horse riding (motor

cycle, car, bus etc.) or he can drop the idea of travelling itself.

Likewise in *vaidika karma* also there are *utsarga* (general condition -

sAmAnya niyama), vikalpa ( the feeling of either *this* or *that* ) and

apavAda ( exceptional rules or special rules). In short, kartru tantra

means that action which is completely in control with the doer's body &

senses. Let that be our empirical dealings through outer senses

(bAhyEndriya-s) or internal organs' (antarindriya) dominated upAsana,

dhyAna ...all these internal, external actions can be put under single

compartment i.e. kartru tantra.

 

Second, now, we will have a look at shankara's observation on vastu

tantra..again, in the same 2nd sUtra continues to say : " vikalpanAstu

puruShabhuddhyapEkshAH, na vastuyAthAtmyajnAnaM puruShabhuddhyapEkShaM! kiM

tarhi *vastu taNtramEva* tat! na sthANau yEkasmin sthANurvA puruShaH anyO

vA iti tattvajnAnaM bhavati! tatra purushaH anyO vA iti mithyAjnAnaM!

sthANurEva iti *tattva jnAnaM*! vastu tantratvAt! yEvaM bhUta vastu

viShayANAM prAmANyaM vastu tantraM!!

 

What does this vastu tantra mean?? that knowledge which is completely in

control of vastu / object (vastu adhIna) & cannot be influenced by the will

of its cognizer is called vastu tantra. This knowledge to be realized *as

it is* as an object really *is* & this perception knowledge cannot be

influenced by the will & wish of its cognizer. For example, the

*whiteness* of milk is inherent in milk, if we want to have the knowledge

of the milk I have to obtain that knowledge by invariably cognizing the

*whiteness* of the milk. I cannot have the knowledge of milk thinking

deliberately as red or black!! Since anything other than white of the milk

is mere mithyAjnAna only. This is what shankara says in above commentary.

He says here the true nature of object not dependent on intellect of its

cognizer & this cognition should take place strictly in accordance with *as

the object is* because the knowledge here is entirely under the control of

object (vastu adhIna) & importantly not in the hand of perceiver to modify

the knowledge as per his will & wish. Shankara give here example of sthANu

(short tree). In a dull light one may think about this *short tree* as a

man standing or this may be a tree or this may be a pillar etc. etc. this

assumptions (agrahaNa) shankara says is not tattva jnAna of sthANu. This

doubt or misconceptions whether this is man, pillar or something else is

called mithAjnAna & the realization of *this is sthANu* is tattva jnAna.

Here this knowledge of *sthANu* *as it is* (yaThArTha jnAna) is called as

*tattva jnAna*. Likewise for whatever already existed objects (yEvam bhUta

vastu viShyayANAM ..see above) the pramANa is vastu trantra jnAna ...that

which follows the true nature of objects (vastu) is called *vastu tantra

jnAna*.

 

In our scriptures we can find both vastu trantra as well as purusha tantra.

The mention of karma-s, upAsana-s, dhyAna, vidhi para & nishiddha

(injuctions & prohibitions) are all kartru tantra. But when shruti talks

above brahma jnAna it ispurely based on vastu tantra only & by not any

menas it is advocating purusha tantra. Because parabrahman tattva is

nothing but the very nature of ours which cannot be modified by using the

weapons of time & space & this svarUpa of ours is ever existing &

everlasting entity. Shankara by continuing the above bhAshya vAkya

confirming the same by saying : " tatra yEvaM sati brahma jnAnamapi vastu

tantramEva! bhUta vastu viShayatvAt... since this jnAna of our true nature

is not an adventitious thing, the knowledge of this svarUpa CANNOT BE THE

*VISHAYA* that can be enjoined through body or senses ( both organs of

internal & external).

 

Here we may get one doubt. In our day to day transactions it is well known

fact that first we acquire knowledge & then we utilize that knowledge

practically to see the fruits of this knowledge. Likewise, in shAstra-s

also there is knowledge about brahman, after gaining this knowledge one

should enter into samAdhi to have the *practical* experience of this

knowledge (this is what post shankara advaita Acharya-s emphasized) then

only one can have the *complete fulfillment* of his knowledge. BUT

shankara categorically declares * NO* even from the mere knowledge (shAstra

vAkya janita jnAna) one can reap the rich dividends directly without making

it karmAnga & experiencing *special* trance in samAdhi.

 

Shankara in the sUtra tattu samanvayAt (1-1-4) clearly says : " yadapi

uktaM - kartavya vidhyanupravEShaM antarENa vastu mAtraM ucchyamAnaM

anarThakaM syAt *sapta dveepa vasumatI" ityAdivat iti! tat parihrutaM : *

rajjuriyaM, nAyaM sarpaH iti vastu mAtra kaThanEpi prayOjanasya druShtatvAt

(iti)!!

 

How beautifully shankara says jnAna is neither karmAga nor it is a

mysterious state's strange experience!! He tells "one may argue what is

the use of mere showing the place in the map?? to get the knowledge of

that place one should go to that place...etc...no this rule cannot be

generalized...because *ropes' yaThArtha jnAna that it is not snake is

enough to have *the true knowledge* of rope..here nothing can be done after

the dawn of true knowledge of *rajju*..Similarly in the dream we may get

scared by the perception of some night mares but after waking we realize

that this dream is mere appearance not real..here also the jnAna of

*dream's mithyatva* is enough to realize that our suffering in dream is

*mithya* ( dont pick me here for saying dream is mithya & waking is

satya...just an analogy:-))

 

In the brahma jnAna also this type of jnAna i.e. (a) you are the *tenth*

man (b) you are brahman © thou art that etc. etc. is enough for a

uttamAdhikAri of shAstra-s to realize his true nature...shankara says in

the same sUtra bhAshya (1-1-4) brahma bhAvascha mOkshaha, mundaka shruti

says brama vit brahmaiva bhavati, chAndOgya says tatvamasi etc. it never

ever said you are brahman ONLY in *samAdhi* :-))

 

I humbly request all prabhuji-s to read thoroughly the commentary of

shankara on the 4th sUtra where shankara explicitly deals with the

differences between vastu tantra & purusha tantra jnAna.

 

The kartru tantra jnAna which is used in dhyAna & upAsa are basically of 4

types...they are :

 

(a) saMpadrUpa bhAvana

(b) adhyAsarUpa bhAvana

© kriyAyOga nimitta bhAvana

(d) karmAnga saMskArarUpa bhAvana

 

We have to study in detail what exactly these purushatantra bhAvana-s & how

it is differs from vastu tantra brahma jnAna. For the sake of brevity I am

just giving gist of these upasana-s according to shankara advaita...Kindly

refer in detail the references given in detail for the complete commentary

of shankara.

 

(a) saMpadrUpa bhAvana :

 

Taking similarities in two things & doing upAsana on one thing as another

though it has lower qualities when compared to other is called saMpadrUpa

bhAvana. For example doing upAsana on manOmayAtma..(bruhadAraNyaka 3-1-9:

"anataM vai manO ananthA vishvEdEvAH anatamEva sa tEna lOkaM jayati..) Here

we have elevated manOmayAtman taking sAmya (similarity) between inifinite

nature of sankalpa & vikalpa of mana with infinite vishvEdEva..shastra asks

us to do upAsana on these vruttis as vishvEdEva..here shastra gives us end

result also that upAsaka's attainment of vishvElOka ...but brahma jnAna is

NOT LIKE THAT..shankara in sUtra (1-1-4) : * na cha idam brahmAtmaikatva

vijnAnaM saMpadrUpaM.

 

(b) adhyAsarUpa bhAvana :

 

As said in earlier mail, taking one thing & thinking it as something else

without disturbing its intrinsic qualities is called adhyAsarUpa

bhAvanOpAsana. (kindly dont think this is adhyAsa of *adhyAsa*

bhAshya..contextually this has different meaning here)...shankara says

about this type of adhyAsa in sUtra (3-3-9) as : "tatra adhyAsO nAma

dvayOrvastunOH anivartitAyAmEva anyatarabhuddau anyatara

bhuddhiraddhyasatE! yasmin itabuddhi raddhyasyatE anuvartata yEva tasmin

tadbhddhihi adhyastEtavabhuddhAvapi! yathA nAmni brahma buddhaU

adhyasyamAnAyAmapi anuvartata yEva nAma buddhihi na brahHmabhudhyA

nivartatE! yathA vA pratimAdiShu vishNvAdidhuddhyAdhyAsaH!!

 

Thinking sAligrAma as vishNu, linga as shiva bhagavAn, Sri chakra as mAta

etc. etc. comes under this category..does brahma jnAna like this ?? Again

shankara says NO!! brahma jnAna IS NOT adhyAsarUpa bhAvana. Shankara in

(1-1-4) : " na cha adhyAsa rUpaM! yathA manO brahmEtyupAsIta, AdityO

brahmEtyAdEShaH iti cha mana AdityAdiShu brahmadruShtyadhyAsaH... (kindly

read the translation works you have with you for the understanding of these

bhAshya vAkya-s)..

 

© kriyAyOga nimitta bhAvana

 

This basically deals with similarity in *action* between two different

things..thinking one thing for another considering sAmya in its action.

example : vAyu & prANa..coz.of their action of saMvarga in praLaya & deep

sleep respectively...BUT brahma jnAna is NOT THIS *kriya yOga nimitta

bhAvana*..shankara in sUtra bhAshya (1-1-4) : "nApi

vishiShtakriyAyOganimittaM" vAyurvAva saMvargaH (chAndOdya 4-3-3) itivat!

 

(d) karmAnga saMskArarUpa bhAvana :

 

This is relates to vEda-s karma kAnda where the doer thinks by observing

some injuctions in hOma / yagna *some saMskAra* will take place in

him...shankara gives here the example of AjAvEkShaNa ( seeing reflection of

one self in ghee plate) by seeing his face in ghee plate the hOma kartru

thinks that he gained some samskAra etc. Is our brahma jnAna like this??

shAnkara says NO...sUtra bhAshya (1-1-4) says : " nApi AjyAvEkshaNAdi

karmavat karmAnga saMskArarUpaM.

>From the above it is evident the shruti vAkyas which say tattvamasi, ahaM

brahmAsmi, ayamAtma brahma etc. etc. is not the kartru tantra pradhAna

vAkyas it is not the product of any human effort it is purely vastu tantra

jnAna where jnAni realizes his true svarUpa as it is without *modifying*

its svarUpa as per his will & wish. So, what shankara says about jnAna is

not purusha tantra jnAna, nor its a type of mystic feeling in trance, nor

its like seeing vishNu in sAligrama..

 

Again, see shankara on 1-1-4 : " nanu jnAnaM nAma mAnasIkriyA! na!

vailakshNyAt! kriyA hi nAma sA yatra vastusvarUpanirapEkShaiva chOdyatE

purushachittavyApArAdhInA cha!!

 

Further it is important to see that shankara equates dhyAna to kartru

tantra sAdhana which most of us thinking indispensable for attaining NS.

where as jnAna which is direct means to brahma jnAna is not kartru tantra &

it is entirely based on vastu tantra...those who are still thinking both

dhyAna & jnAna are same are requested to read carefully what shankara says

on dhyAna & jnAna here :

 

" dhyAnaM chintanaM yadyapi mAnasaM, taThApi puruShENa kartum, akartuM

anyaThA vA kartum shakyaM!! puruShatantratvAt! jnAnaM tu pramANa janyaM!

pramANam cha yaThabhutavastu vishayaM! ataH jnAnaM kartum akartuM anyaTha

vA kartuM *aShakyaM*! kEvalaM vastu tantramEva tat, na chOdanAtaNtraM nApi

purusha tantraM, tasmAt mAnastvEpi jnAnasya mahat vailakshaNyaM!!

 

WITHOUT KNOWING THIS VITAL *vailakShaNyaM* we are generously equating vastu

tantra jnAna & purusha tantra jnAna & declaring that PY's NS/AS is nothing

but vastu taNtra jnAna as embedded in shruti....do we doing justice to our

bhagavadpAda's bhAshya vAkya-s here???

 

Sorry, this mail already become lengthy...I think I've to switch over to

PART-III to deal with the following :

 

(a) PY's samAdhi Vs Atmaikatva jnAna of Shankara

(b) sushupti vivEka according to shankara

© Shankara's usage of terminologies of PY (dhAraNa, dhyAna, samAdhi ) in

prasthAna trayi bhAshya

(d) gaudapAda's asparSha yOga or manOnigraha yOga & how it differs from

pAtanjali's *chitta vrutti nirOdha*

 

Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!

bhaskar

[Guest guest]

praNAms Sri Bhaskar-ji

 

 

 

advaitin, bhaskar.yr@i... wrote:

 

First let me complement on your Bhakti towards Our Common Guru Sri

Sankara. Having come from a different 'background' I have only begun

to appreciate the tremendous intellect and astounding Spirituality

of His message more recently. One of these days I will also learn

Sanskrit so I can read scholarly writers like yourself.

 

Sri Bhaskar:

>> praNAms to all truth seekers

He tells "one may argue what is

the use of mere showing the place in the map?? to get the knowledge

of

that place one should go to that place...etc...no this rule cannot be

generalized...because *ropes' yaThArtha jnAna that it is not snake is

enough to have *the true knowledge* of rope..here nothing can be

done after

the dawn of true knowledge of *rajju*..

>>

>>

In the brahma jnAna also this type of jnAna i.e. (a) you are the

*tenth*

man (b) you are brahman © thou art that etc. etc. is enough for a

uttamAdhikAri of shAstra-s to realize his true nature...

>>

 

IMHO Your last statement "enough for a

uttamAdhikAri of shAstra-s to realize his true nature" contains the

crux of the differences of opinion we have seen in these discussions.

 

If your contention is that the uttamAdhikari does not need

nidhidhyasana and upon Shravana itself can realize his true

nature, we both are in complete agreement.

 

However it is quite another thing to say Dhyana and Samadhi (which

is what is meant by the term "nidhidhyasana" according to the

Prasthana Traya as explained in my previous message

http://www.escribe.com/culture/advaitin/m25074.html) is not needed.

 

If a Sadhaka can realise his true nature just by Shravana why would

Bhagavan talk about a yoga bhrasta and rebirth ?

 

What would be the reason for Bhagavan's

words "anekajanmasamsiddhastato yati param gatim..6.45"?

Attaining perfection through many births, thereby acheives the

highest Goal.

 

So for majority of the Sadhakas (not uttamAdhikaris) , the

scriptures clearly emphasise the importance of shravana, manana and

nidhidhyasana.

 

To emphasise the point that nidhidhyasna means dhyana please refer

to the following Gita verse:

 

dhyanenatmani pasyanti kecidatmanamatmana.

anye samkhyena yogena karmayogena capare..13.25..

 

The Uttama Adhikaris who through Shravana and Manana done in a

earlier birth have become free from defects such as being unable to

accept the unity of Jiva and Brahman

 

(Pasyante) realize (Atmanam) the atma

(Dhyanena) through Dhyana which is the same as Nidhidhyasana

 

Sri Madhusudana Saraswati also refers to Nidhidhyasana while

commenting on this verse.

 

Thus it is clear that the verse refers to a person who has duly

completed Shravana and Manana in an earlier birth and attains

realization through Nidhidhyasana in the next birth.

 

For those who may have the doubt whether the terms dhyana and

Samadhi used by Sankara and the Upanishads corresponds to the Yoga

Sutras, the answer

is a categorical YES. I will show this in future messages quoting

from Advaitic Purvacharyas as far back as Sri Sureshvaracharya, Sri

Anandagiri & others.

 

Sri Bhaskar:

>>

Likewise, in shAstra-s

also there is knowledge about brahman, after gaining this knowledge

one

should enter into samAdhi to have the *practical* experience of this

knowledge (this is what post shankara advaita Acharya-s emphasized)

then

only one can have the *complete fulfillment* of his knowledge. BUT

shankara categorically declares * NO* even from the mere knowledge

(shAstra

vAkya janita jnAna) one can reap the rich dividends directly without

making

it karmAnga & experiencing *special* trance in samAdhi.

>>

The very same Sankara in the very same Brahma Sutra Bhasya has

clearly contradicted what you have said above.

 

Sankara says

"In the Upanishads Samadhi is taught as the means for realization of

the oupanishad Atma (the atman that is known through the Upanishads

alone)"

 

regards

Sundar Rajan

[Guest guest]

praNAms Sundar Rajan prabhuji

Hare Krishna

 

SR prabhuji:

 

The very same Sankara in the very same Brahma Sutra Bhasya has

clearly contradicted what you have said above.

 

Sankara says

"In the Upanishads Samadhi is taught as the means for realization of

the oupanishad Atma (the atman that is known through the Upanishads

alone)"

 

bhaskar :

 

Kindly give the exact sUtra reference to enable me to look at the complete

bhAshya.....anyway, It is all depend on how you interpret the word

*samAdhi* is it not?? Kindly wait for my next mail, wherein I'd like to

share my understanding on shankara's usage of these terminologies at

various places in prasthAna trayi. By the way, at last, I have a copy of

translated version of yOga sUtra of patanjali by RK mission monk Swamy

prabhavAnanda & Christopher Isherwood, RK Mutt, Chennai publication...I am

trying to compare patanjali's usage of dhAraNa, dhyAna & samAdhi in YS vis

a vis in vEdAnta & shankara bhAshya. I dont know how followers of YS take

the works of RK mission...I will be entirely depending on their purports

for patanjali sUtras. I think, since RK mission monks are the greatest

propagators of NS, publication from this mission will be treated as

authoritative among PY followers.

 

After posting my next part of the mail to the list, I'll take your mails &

Sri Sunder Hattangadi's quote of ramaNa & various scriptures prabhuji.

Till then kindly bear with me.

 

Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!

bhaskar

[Guest guest]

Namaste all.

 

I don't know if we have discussed Trevor Leggett in this thread.

Here is a link that says he has translated Sankara's commentary on

the Yoga Sutras:

 

http://www.leggett.co.uk/sys.htm

 

Has any one read him? What had Sankara to say on the YS?

 

PraNAms.

 

Madathil Nair

[Guest guest]

Namaste again.

 

Also Viveka Chudamani 361-370 stand out. Please see this link where

they are all together:

 

http://acharya.iitm.ac.in/mirrors/vv/literature/sankara/vc37.html

 

Of course, it is not important to those who believe Sankara didn't

author VC.

 

PraNAms.

 

Madathil Nair

[Guest guest]

Namaste Nairji,

 

I have the edition translated by TS Rukmani which is called

Yogasutrabhashyavivarana by Shankara. It is actually a commentary by

Vyasa on the Yoga Sutras and the commentary (vivarana) by Shankara on

Vyasabhashya. The translation is readable with devanagari script as

well. It comes in two volumes and published by Munshiram Manoharlal

Publishers. Recommended.

 

see link: https://www.vedamsbooks.com/no19475.htm

 

 

On Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:40:16 -0000, Madathil Rajendran Nair

<madathilnair wrote:

>

>

> Namaste all.

>

> I don't know if we have discussed Trevor Leggett in this thread.

> Here is a link that says he has translated Sankara's commentary on

> the Yoga Sutras:

>

> http://www.leggett.co.uk/sys.htm

>

> Has any one read him? What had Sankara to say on the YS?

>

> PraNAms.

>

> Madathil Nair

>

>

> Discussion of Shankara's Advaita Vedanta Philosophy of nonseparablity of Atman

and Brahman.

> Advaitin List Archives available at: http://www.eScribe.com/culture/advaitin/

> To Post a message send an email to : advaitin

> Messages Archived at: advaitin/messages

>

>

> Links

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

praNAms Bhaskar prabhuji

> Hare Krishna

>

> SR prabhuji:

>

> The very same Sankara in the very same Brahma Sutra Bhasya has

> clearly contradicted what you have said above.

>

> Sankara says

> "In the Upanishads Samadhi is taught as the means for realization

of

> the oupanishad Atma (the atman that is known through the Upanishads

> alone)"

>

> bhaskar :

>

> Kindly give the exact sUtra reference to enable me to look at the

complete

> bhAshya.....anyway, It is all depend on how you interpret the word

> *samAdhi* is it not??

 

The word samadhi occurs in 2.3.39 (samadhy-abhavacca), Bhagavatpadal

(Sankara) explains

 

In the Upanishads Samadhi is taught as the means for realization of

the oupanishad Atma (the atman that is known through the Upanishads

alone)

 

While expounding this Sutra, Bhagavatpadal also cites

 

Atma va are drashtavyah srotavyo, mantavyo, nididhyasitavyah " (BU

2.4.5)

 

The importance of Samadhi is shown by the phrase

atmapratipattiprayojana ("whose purpose is

the realization of the Self")

> Kindly wait for my next mail, wherein I'd like to

> share my understanding on shankara's usage of these terminologies

at

> various places in prasthAna trayi. By the way, at last, I have a

copy of

> translated version of yOga sUtra of patanjali by RK mission monk

Swamy

> prabhavAnanda & Christopher Isherwood, RK Mutt, Chennai

publication...I am

> trying to compare patanjali's usage of dhAraNa, dhyAna & samAdhi

in YS vis

> a vis in vEdAnta & shankara bhAshya. I dont know how followers of

YS take

> the works of RK mission...I will be entirely depending on their

purports

> for patanjali sUtras. I think, since RK mission monks are the

greatest

> propagators of NS, publication from this mission will be treated as

> authoritative among PY followers.

>

 

I haven't read the book you mentioned and not sure how authoritative

it is considered.

 

Sri Madhusudana Saraswati's

Gudharta Dipika (Advaita Ashrama/RK Mutt) and Sri Vidyaranya's

Jivanmukti Viveka contain lots of references to Yoga Sutras in the

advaitic context.

 

Sri Sadasiva Brahmendral has written a commentary on the Yoga Sutras

and the english translation of this can be found in the

book "Science of Mind Control" published by Sri Sharada trust

(Bangalore Sringeri Mutt).

 

regards

Sundar Rajan

[Guest guest]

Namaste Kathirasanji.

 

Thanks for the info.

 

Will you be able to quote from the book any pertinent remarks made

by Sankara generally on abhyAsa in vedAnta and particularly on

samAdhi?

 

I notice that there has been an authorship problem. But, as far as

this book in question is concerned, it has been satisfactorily

resolved. It is strange that there are too many authorship problems

about Sankara. It only shows the different ways his works have been

interpreted by different followers. When an unpalatable idea is

found, authorship becomes questionable or the idea is distorted to

suit the point of view of the interpreter.

 

PraNAms.

 

Madathil Nair

_______________

 

In advaitin, K Kathirasan <brahmasatyam@g...> wrote:

> I have the edition translated by TS Rukmani which is called

> Yogasutrabhashyavivarana by Shankara. It is actually a commentary

by

> Vyasa on the Yoga Sutras and the commentary (vivarana) by Shankara

on

> Vyasabhashya. .........

[Guest guest]

Namaste Nairji,

 

It will be a tedious task to quote all references on Samadhi from this

book . Simply because of its over emphasis. 'Shankara' seems to bring

Samadhi in most his replies to the Purvapakshi. Hence, I am very sorry

I would not be able to give you random quotes from the book. However,

he does mention that Samadhi is both the 'means' and 'goal' of Yoga.

 

While taking classes in Rishikesh 2 years agos , I approached the then

Acharya of Arsha Vidya Gurukulam, Swami Sakshatkrtananda, to resolve

this doubt about Shankara's authorship issues. He mentioned that the

best way to ascertain it is by studying the Prasthana Traya Bhashyas.

I think this is good advice. So let us all study the prasthana traya

bhashyas before arguing about authorship issues.

 

On Thu, 24 Feb 2005 17:50:24 -0000, Madathil Rajendran Nair

<madathilnair wrote:

>

>

> Namaste Kathirasanji.

>

> Thanks for the info.

>

> Will you be able to quote from the book any pertinent remarks made

> by Sankara generally on abhyAsa in vedAnta and particularly on

> samAdhi?

>

> I notice that there has been an authorship problem. But, as far as

> this book in question is concerned, it has been satisfactorily

> resolved. It is strange that there are too many authorship problems

> about Sankara. It only shows the different ways his works have been

> interpreted by different followers. When an unpalatable idea is

> found, authorship becomes questionable or the idea is distorted to

> suit the point of view of the interpreter.

>

> PraNAms.

>

> Madathil Nair

> _______________

>

> In advaitin, K Kathirasan <brahmasatyam@g...> wrote:

> > I have the edition translated by TS Rukmani which is called

> > Yogasutrabhashyavivarana by Shankara. It is actually a commentary

> by

> > Vyasa on the Yoga Sutras and the commentary (vivarana) by Shankara

> on

> > Vyasabhashya. .........

>

>

> Discussion of Shankara's Advaita Vedanta Philosophy of nonseparablity of Atman

and Brahman.

> Advaitin List Archives available at: http://www.eScribe.com/culture/advaitin/

> To Post a message send an email to : advaitin

> Messages Archived at: advaitin/messages

>

>

> Links

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Namaste Kathirasanji.

 

Thanks.

 

I very much appreciate your frankness and the caution with which you

approach issues advaitic.

 

PraNAms.

 

Madathil Nair

______________

 

 

advaitin, K Kathirasan <brahmasatyam@g...>

wrote:

..... However,

> he (Sankara) does mention that Samadhi is both the 'means'

and 'goal' of Yoga.

>

> While taking classes in Rishikesh 2 years agos , I approached the

then

> Acharya of Arsha Vidya Gurukulam, Swami Sakshatkrtananda, to

resolve

> this doubt about Shankara's authorship issues. He mentioned that

the

> best way to ascertain it is by studying the Prasthana Traya

Bhashyas.

> I think this is good advice. .....

[Guest guest]

praNAms Sri Sundar Rajan prabhuji

Hare Krishna

 

Kindly pardon me for the delayed response...almost after 15 days I am

looking at the mails!!

 

> bhaskar :

>

> Kindly give the exact sUtra reference to enable me to look at the

complete

> bhAshya.....anyway, It is all depend on how you interpret the word

> *samAdhi* is it not??

 

SR prabhuji:

 

The word samadhi occurs in 2.3.39 (samadhy-abhavacca), Bhagavatpadal

(Sankara) explains

 

In the Upanishads Samadhi is taught as the means for realization of

the oupanishad Atma (the atman that is known through the Upanishads

alone)

 

While expounding this Sutra, Bhagavatpadal also cites

 

Atma va are drashtavyah srotavyo, mantavyo, nididhyasitavyah " (BU

2.4.5)

 

bhaskar :

 

Thanks a lot for the sUtra reference prabhuji...I think the sUtra

samAdhyAbhAvAchha should be read along with other sUtra-s which come under

the adhikaraNa..I think it talks only about jIva's kartrutva (!!??) & his

kartru tantra dhyAna etc. but I believe in the next adhikaraNa it has been

clarified that jIva & kartrutva of jIva is the result of kEvala avidyAkruta

upAdhi sambhanda & is not permanent...Anyway I am not sure of these

observation as I am just telling all these from memory...I'll look at the

commentary on this sUtra & come back to you prabhuji.

 

SR prabhuji:

 

The importance of Samadhi is shown by the phrase atmapratipattiprayojana

("whose purpose is the realization of the Self")

 

bhaskar :

 

again, even if you interpret samAdhi as *saMyag jnAna* the result is

nothing but Atmaikatva is it not prabhuji...in anyway it cannot be

categorically attributed to PY's NS/AS.

 

 

bhaskar :

> Kindly wait for my next mail, wherein I'd like to

> share my understanding on shankara's usage of these terminologies

at

> various places in prasthAna trayi. By the way, at last, I have a

copy of

> translated version of yOga sUtra of patanjali by RK mission monk

Swamy

> prabhavAnanda & Christopher Isherwood, RK Mutt, Chennai

publication...I am

> trying to compare patanjali's usage of dhAraNa, dhyAna & samAdhi

in YS vis

> a vis in vEdAnta & shankara bhAshya. I dont know how followers of

YS take

> the works of RK mission...I will be entirely depending on their

purports

> for patanjali sUtras. I think, since RK mission monks are the

greatest

> propagators of NS, publication from this mission will be treated as

> authoritative among PY followers.

>

 

SR prabhuji:

 

I haven't read the book you mentioned and not sure how authoritative

it is considered.

 

bhaskar :

 

Since the yOga siddhAnta of patanjali is in sUtra form, I think we have to

depend on commentaries written by propagators of NS/AS..as this is the core

teaching of YS...Sri prabhavananda is the RK mission monk & I think his

commentaries are hold good..Kindly let me know if RK mission's translations

of PYS are not good.

 

SR prabhuji:

 

Sri Madhusudana Saraswati's Gudharta Dipika (Advaita Ashrama/RK Mutt) and

Sri Vidyaranya's Jivanmukti Viveka contain lots of references to Yoga

Sutras in the

advaitic context.

 

bhaskar :

 

About Sri Madhusudana Saraswati I've posed a question to the list by

quoting Sri Vidya prabhuji's observation that Sri MS is not *entirely*

following shankara in siddhAnta pratipAdana...I donot know anyone has

replied to this mail...if it is true then we dont have to take his works as

reference even though it is advaita..may be we can consider it as one among

many available versions of advaita but not that of shankara's

shrutyanugrahIta parishuddha advaita siddhAnta.

 

 

SR prabhuji:

 

Sri Sadasiva Brahmendral has written a commentary on the Yoga Sutras

and the english translation of this can be found in the

book "Science of Mind Control" published by Sri Sharada trust

(Bangalore Sringeri Mutt).

 

bhaskar :

 

Thanks for the reference prabhuji, I shall purchase this book & try to

compare with shankara siddhAnta.

 

 

regards

Sundar Rajan

 

Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!

bhaskar