Concept of prarabhda

[Guest guest]

Dear All,

 

Namaste,

 

First let me introduce myself briefly as i am a new

member of the group. My name is vinayaka. I am a

serious student of advaita vedanta. I am now serving

in one of the math as a brahmachari. I would prefer to

keep the name of the math confidential so that i can

express my views more freely. I like the non-sectarian

attitude and a lover of truth.

 

I have one question regarding the prarabhda. It is

said that after the realisation the body of the free

soul will go on according to the prarabhda. and the

sanchita and agami is burnt. to quote the example it

is said the it will go on for sometime like a boat

after the rowing has been stopped or like a potters

wheel after he stops turning the same.

 

Now the question is if we accept the above explanation

shall we have to consider that prarabhda is

independent of knowledge of brahman/realisation?

becasue even the fullest realisation is unable to

eradicate it fully! According to some view if the

nirvikalpa samadhi is of fullest and highest degree

the ordinary jeeva cannot come back. There will be

nothing to hold on to. The mind and all other things

are totally annihilated so the prarabhda is out of

question.

 

So can we take that if the realised soul comes back to

phenominal world after realisation then his

realisation is not of fullest degree? I have read an

experience of a sage who tells that he was able to

come to the relative plane becasue during samadhi he

had very slight ego consiousness left which he says

that the last stage in the plane of the mind. He says

that if that was also not left then there was no

chance of his coming to realtive plane.

 

It is also said that the bliss in the realisation will

be so intense the jiva will never be inclined to come

down to the phenominal world.This is possible only for

incarnations and those who are destined to teach the

mankind by the wish of the providence. They do so by

cherishing the satvik desires like doing good to the

world and to teach the mankind for their good etc.

 

I request all of you to quote from the scriptures and

clarify the above doubt. It is said that one has to

practice to know the subtle truths of the religion but

sometimes it becomes necessary to understand certain

points intellectually. As rightly said by Swami

Vivekandana we should reason as far as possible and

when reason fails reason itself will take us to the

truth.

 

HARI OM TAT SAT

 

Yours in the lord,

 

 

Br. vinayaka.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005

 

[Guest guest]

Namaste Sri Vinayaka-ji,

 

advaitin, br_vinayaka <vinayaka_ns> wrote:

> I have one question regarding the prarabhda. It is

> said that after the realisation the body of the free

> soul will go on according to the prarabhda. and the

> sanchita and agami is burnt. to quote the example it

> is said the it will go on for sometime like a boat

> after the rowing has been stopped or like a potters

> wheel after he stops turning the same.

> Now the question is if we accept the above explanation

> shall we have to consider that prarabhda is

> independent of knowledge of brahman/realisation?

> becasue even the fullest realisation is unable to

> eradicate it fully!

 

There are two things we need to consider with regard to the prarabdha

of a jnani. The first is that prarabdha is like an arrow that has

left the bow and continues to be in ballistic flight until its

momentum is exhausted. The second is that the jeevan-mukta does not

accumulate new karma. In the context of prarabdha, it is important to

realise why the jnani does not accumulate any new karma. The answer

is simply that the jnani sees that the Self never acts. The jnani is

stitha-prajna in the universe of actions.

 

"Actions are wrought in all cases by the gunas of Prakriti. He whose

mind is deluded by ahamkara thinks 'I am the doer.'"

(Bh.Gita.III.27)

 

"O Arjuna, as a blazing fire reduces pieces of wood to ashes,

similarly the fire of Knowledge reduces all actions to ashes."

(Bh.Gita.IV.37)

 

How can the jnani who does not see the Self as acting see the

workings of prarabdha as his action? Therefore, there is no action

for a jeevan-mukta even though others deluded by avidya may see him

as acting. There is no return for a jeevan-mukta because all his

actions have been burnt out in the fire of jnana.

 

> So can we take that if the realised soul comes back to

> phenominal world after realisation then his

> realisation is not of fullest degree?

 

Self-realisation is the realisation that the Self is all there is.

Where does the Self go and where shall it come back to?

 

Sri Shankaracharya says in the Brahma Sutra Bhashya that there are

some free souls who 'come down' for doing good works. Their 'coming

down' is Self-assumed limitation in the Leela of God.

 

Warm regards,

Chittaranjan

[Guest guest]

Namaskar,

 

 

Jnani has no prarabdha at all. People on the worldly plane can't justify good

and bad happening without support of luck or karmaphala or prarabdha. When they

look at Jnani they think the Jnani is undergoing prarabdha.

 

 

 

Imagine a Jnani is in Jail on the charge of murder, everybody will naturally

think that Jnani must be undergoing his prarabdha. They can not have any other

imagination. It is impossible to them in given set up of the Chitta conditions.

What really happens is Jnani is always in Brahmabhava as well as on the worldly

plane. This is called a Turya Awastha of Chitta. This awastha is also called

Sandhi Kaal. Like, while the sun sets there is always a particular moment of

time when there is Sun as well as no Sun. Jnanis's chitta is always in Sandhi

Kaal. he understands what is happening and also do not understand what is

happening. This is a wonderful situation of the mind.

 

 

 

To explain this Turiya condition better, let us take an example. Everybody of

us see the dream. A dream like one meets an accident of his car while driving

and somebody dies under the car. There is a cop standing on the corner of the

square and he starts approaching

 

the place. The person in the dream gets horrified and immediately get up from

sleep. Now many a time, there is a condition, that a person is not in the dream

and not fully awakened. He looks at the cop and at the same time his mind tells

him that do not be afraid this is a dream and not a true condition.

 

 

 

Jnani or Jeevan Mukta, though seen by others to be in action, laughing, crying,

playing or doing any thing, the condition of Chitta is like a man in the dream.

He while doing all action understands them to be absolutely false like dream.So

he does not think of any reality in whatever happens to him. Let him be in jail,

let him be in Mandir or sleeping on the public dustbin.

 

 

 

The examples of arroow and wheel are given in the Shastra because the A-jnanis

can't imagine of such conditions and call it prarabdha.

 

The examples are given just to satisfy the new sadhak-s, and with Gounatwa.

These examples are not really applicable to Jnani. He is so much aware of

Brahma, that he can't forget it for a second while doing all good or bad things

by his body in this world.

 

 

 

 

 

Anil

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Chittaranjan Naik <chittaranjan_naik wrote:

Namaste Sri Vinayaka-ji,

 

advaitin, br_vinayaka <vinayaka_ns> wrote:

> I have one question regarding the prarabhda. It is

> said that after the realisation the body of the free

> soul will go on according to the prarabhda. and the

> sanchita and agami is burnt. to quote the example it

> is said the it will go on for sometime like a boat

> after the rowing has been stopped or like a potters

> wheel after he stops turning the same.

> Now the question is if we accept the above explanation

> shall we have to consider that prarabhda is

> independent of knowledge of brahman/realisation?

> becasue even the fullest realisation is unable to

> eradicate it fully!

 

There are two things we need to consider with regard to the prarabdha

of a jnani. The first is that prarabdha is like an arrow that has

left the bow and continues to be in ballistic flight until its

momentum is exhausted. The second is that the jeevan-mukta does not

accumulate new karma. In the context of prarabdha, it is important to

realise why the jnani does not accumulate any new karma. The answer

is simply that the jnani sees that the Self never acts. The jnani is

stitha-prajna in the universe of actions.

 

"Actions are wrought in all cases by the gunas of Prakriti. He whose

mind is deluded by ahamkara thinks 'I am the doer.'"

(Bh.Gita.III.27)

 

"O Arjuna, as a blazing fire reduces pieces of wood to ashes,

similarly the fire of Knowledge reduces all actions to ashes."

(Bh.Gita.IV.37)

 

How can the jnani who does not see the Self as acting see the

workings of prarabdha as his action? Therefore, there is no action

for a jeevan-mukta even though others deluded by avidya may see him

as acting. There is no return for a jeevan-mukta because all his

actions have been burnt out in the fire of jnana.

 

> So can we take that if the realised soul comes back to

> phenominal world after realisation then his

> realisation is not of fullest degree?

 

Self-realisation is the realisation that the Self is all there is.

Where does the Self go and where shall it come back to?

 

Sri Shankaracharya says in the Brahma Sutra Bhashya that there are

some free souls who 'come down' for doing good works. Their 'coming

down' is Self-assumed limitation in the Leela of God.

 

Warm regards,

Chittaranjan

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Discussion of Shankara's Advaita Vedanta Philosophy of nonseparablity of Atman

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[Guest guest]

Namaskar,

 

The reply posted by anilji and chittaranjanji both are

quite satisfactory. Especially regarding anilji's

opinion that the scriptural examples are just a hint

for the novices and in many cases they should not be

taken litterally is very correct. Many sages opine

that the object of the scriptures is to trun the

aspirant's mind somehow to the brahman or ultimate

reality and this holds good in may cases.

 

HARI OM TATSAT

 

Yours in the Lord,

 

Br. Vinayaka.

 

 

 

 

 

Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005

 

[Guest guest]

Namaskar.

 

Here is my current understanding and I want learned ones to

comment/throw more light on this.

 

"All happenings" are like total destiny (I use that term because I

don't know better words). Its like a show is going on. Like a

Kaleidoscope with same glasses keep showing different different

patterns, all happenings are taking place. All striving for better

worldly life and all Self-Effort for realisation is only apparent.

Just notions imposed on those happenings. As long as notion of

individuality is there they continue. This very notion is also part of

that show and A-Jnani, Jnani, Realisation, Ignorance everything is

just part of it. So really the moment we speak any of these terms it

is of the same degree only.

 

What I mean to say is the term "Jnani" is a result of ignorant notion

otherwise there is no such thing as "Jnani" or "Ajnani". Everything is

of same degree. So "Ajnani's thinking some thoughts about Jnani"

and "Jnani thinking of Brahmabhav and World at the same time" this is

of the same degree. There is no difference. Is this understanding

correct?

 

- Padma

 

advaitin, Anil Bharatey <selfanil> wrote:

>

> Namaskar,

>

>

> Jnani has no prarabdha at all. People on the worldly plane can't

justify good and bad happening without support of luck or karmaphala

or prarabdha. When they look at Jnani they think the Jnani is

undergoing prarabdha.

>