Beyond death

[Guest guest]

Ref Msg.10 of Digest 2762

 

Member Harsha ji wrote on behalf of his friend 'N':

 

Most people who die a natural death have lived a complete life, that

 

has

 

seen its ups and downs. By the time they are in their death bed, their

 

brain has retained a vast amount of information, including the many

 

many

 

memories of that person's experience. Personally, I find it hard to

 

believe that when a person "dies", all that information in the

 

persons's

 

brain, including the special memories, simply "disappear" from the

 

scene

 

and is "wasted". And gone forever. I would like to know what happens to

 

it.

 

 

 

 

 

Harsha, if your group members or other friends know anything about this

 

or have some thoughts on the matter please forward these.

 

 

 

 

Reply:

Dear Harsha ji and Sri N ji

Namaste. Our shastra although does not say anything about the brain, says a

lot about the antahkaranam, the manas, that is the repository of the samskaras,

what you called 'information'. These samskaras, good and bad, from the point of

view of being of an uplifting nature to the individual jiva, are carried from

one body to another to help in the jiva's evolution. In the Bhagavadgita 15th

chapter, among other things, discusses the issue that is on hand::

 

Mamaivaamsho jivaloke jiva-bhuutaH sanaatanaH |

ManaH Shashthaani-indriyaani prakRtishaani karshati | 7

 

Then in the next verse:

Shariram yadavaapnoti yacchaapyutkraamati-ishvaraH |

GRhiitvaitaani samyaati vaayur-gandhaaniva-aashayaat || 8

 

When the jiva, the lord of the aggregate of the body and the rest, is to leave

the body, then (he draws round himself the senses and the manas). When he

leaves a former body and enters another, he does so, taking these – the (five)

senses with the manas the sixth – with him as the wind takes with it the scents

of flowers.

 

In the 8th chapter of the Gita there is a verse:

Yam yam vaapi smaran bhaavam tyajatyante kalevaram |

Tam tamevaiti Kaunteya sadaa tatbhaava-bhaavitaH || 6

 

The thought that is foremost at the time of death determines the kind of

body\life the individual will be acquiring next. As the person will not be able

to regulate the mind the way he wants at the time of death, being overpowered by

pain, weakness, etc, that accompany the dying moment, the thought type that has

been predominantly been practiced, developed , nurtured by that individual,

comes up whether one likes it or not. It is said that like a leach that catches

hold of the other leaf before leaving its foothold of the earlier leaf, this

individual too, by this last determining thought, catches hold of the next

body-infrastructure before leaving the present body. As far as he is concerned

it is not an unknown place to which he is going. Only that, the others will not

know this.

 

In the Kathopanishad Chapter 2, section 2, mantras 6,7 deal with this aspect:

In the seventh mantra, Yonimanye ….

The ignorant, that is, those without Self Realisation, attain to other wombs.

Some others who are endowed with very lowly karma attain to the life of trees

and plants. All this depends upon the type of actions that he has engaged

induring this life. Also depending upon the type of knowledge he has acquired

in this life.

 

There could be descriptions in other scriptural works too. The Brihadaranyaka

Upanishad speaks of the 'journey' of the soul after leaving this body.

 

Bhagavan says in the Gita, as the rule described in verse 6 of ch.8 operates,

why not think of Me, the Lord, always and make that a habit, so forceful that at

the time of death the thought of Me comes up, although involuntarily. There is

a Tamil poem, a part of which says: Appodaikku ippode solli vaithen… meaning:

At that time of death I may not be able to utter your name, O Lord, so I utter

Your Holy Name now itself, when I am in my senses.

 

Regards

subbu.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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[Guest guest]

V Subrahmanian <subrahmanian_v wrote: Ref Msg.10 of Digest

2762

 

Member Harsha ji wrote on behalf of his friend 'N':

 

Most people who die a natural death have lived a complete life, that

 

has

 

seen its ups and downs. By the time they are in their death bed, their

 

brain has retained a vast amount of information, including the many

 

many

 

memories of that person's experience. Personally, I find it hard to

 

believe that when a person "dies", all that information in the

 

persons's

 

brain, including the special memories, simply "disappear" from the

 

scene

 

and is "wasted". And gone forever. I would like to know what happens to

 

it.

 

 

 

 

 

Harsha, if your group members or other friends know anything about this

 

or have some thoughts on the matter please forward these.

 

 

 

 

Reply:

Dear Harsha ji and Sri N ji

Reg: Message 29921 of sri V.Subramanium

 

I am not sure whether anybody has lived a complete life, unless they

have understood their basic reality. They might have led a successful life,

which is a different thing, which is not having lived a complete life. Many

persons without the need for the quest for a transcendental reality, or being

satisfied with their traditional way of life, carry on, not having been buffet

ted by the painful lashes of life, which gives us a misleading conception of

the doctrine of karma and the grace of god, these two things being interpreted

by most of the people in terms of worldly success or failure. As regards the

question as to what happens to all the empirical memories of the individuals,

it is a difficult question to answer, as no answer to these questions are

available both from the standpoint of transcendental truth, and purely the sole

evidence of the empirical existence, the outcome of avidya, which hides truth.

I have a feeling- this is based on my personal

judgment- that the individual does not separately evolve into the higher

states, all individuality being attributable to mere ignorance, not also

being in conformity with the idea of the natural justice of a divine being, who

ought not to be partial in his treatment meted out to his creation. The

question as to what happens to an individual after he dies, is based on the

belief that we are individuals, which may not be so, although we may be

different bodies with different talents. The question of after life is only

related to spirit ism and not religious, and should not bother us. We should

not allow this question to be nourished by way of curiosity, as it would result

in a detour in our quest making us believe that we are individuals. Sri

Ramakrishna, when a question is raised as regards rebirth vis-a-vis the

concepts of the various astral planes talked about by Theosophy, answers that

he does not know all these things, his knowledge being limited only to the

contemplation of the divine. Ramana Maharishi also discourages questions about

after life, stating that only the unreal individuality continues and not the

transcendental Atman. Of course, driven by an extreme fear of samsara, pursuit

of this question at a religious level helps us to chalk out our divine destiny.

Pure academic interest of what happens to the particular memories, is not of

help to us, but surely a hindrance, which does not mean reincarnation is not

real; but the fact of the matter is that we can have no yes or no to this

question, as it belongs to the domain of Maya.

with regards,

Sankarraman

 

 

 

 

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