Guest guest Posted February 17, 2006 Report Share Posted February 17, 2006 Namaskarams Dear Sri Sankaraman avargale! After reading all your recent posts on this thread , may i please be allowed to quote the following verse from Vasishta yoga , a favorite treatise of great saints like sri Ramakrishna parmahamsa, swami Vivekananda and sri Ramana bhagvan? "Desire for liberation interferes with the fullness of the Self; absence of such desire promotes bondage! Hence, constant Awareness is to be preferred. The sole cause for bondage and Liberation is the movement in consciousness. Awareness of this ends this movement. The ego-sense ceases the very moment one observes it, for it has no support any longer. Then who is bound by whom, or who is liberated by whom? " HARI AUM! advaitin, Ganesan Sankarraman <shnkaran wrote: > > > > bhuvan eswar chilukuri <bhuvaneswarc wrote: > respecvted ganesanga;ru, > > Have u read Yoga Va:sishtam ? > > Please do me a favour. > > There is a lot of mentioning here and there about vasana:s. > > could u please give me all the verses where it occurre? > > On Wed, 08 Feb 2006 Ganesan Sankarraman wrote : > > > > > > Apropos your query, it is to be noted that Yoga Vasishta is full of the ideas of vasanas, and not here and there to be specified. You may read the translation done by Swamy Venkatesananda, which goes by the name, 'Supreme Yoga'. But the Swamiji has been influenced greatly by the modern terminologies of J.Krishnamurthy, such as conditioning, psychological memory, psychological becoming, choiceless awareness, which he freely uses in expounding the philosophy of Vasishta, even though he has not acknowledged the fact. The Swamy has met Krishnamurthy and held talks with him which are available in the book, "Awakening of Intelligence". There are further two versions, one containing the selections from one B.l.Aytreya, who has done tremendous research on this scripture dating it back to the period of Sankara, another containing the philosophy of this work alongwith the stories, both these having been done by one Samvit, who has simply adopted the terminology, > "Choiceless Awareness," of J.K, in explaining the thought of Vasishta, no acknowledgment having been made in this case also. There is another translation by one R.M.Hari, this being an English translation from a Hindi version from a Sufi Master, which is very original, coming from self-realization. There is also a free rendering by one K.Narayanaswamy Iyer, having been published by Theosophical Foundation. But, of course, the oldest version is by Mitra, which is a prodigious work, all the thirty thousand verses having been rendered in English. This is in a very archaic language, and would not suit the purpose of the readers, even though the author is very sincere. The attribution of this work to Valmiki is sheer myth, the author being anonymous having resorted to this nom- de-plume, which shows his greatness, the author sublating himself in the grandeur of the thought. According to professor Dasgupta, the author of this work, an unknown saint, belongs to the period > of Gaudapada or Nagarjuna. But then the question arises as to why Sankara has not made mention of this work, when Vidyaranya has done. Aitreya attributes this to the fact of the work not having derived the authority of tradition. But all these things are irrelevant. This work talks of nonduality in unmincing terms, there being a direct hit, without resort to all logic, dialectics and polemics. Bhaghavan Ramana has very much recommended this work to be read, while paradoxically Ramakrishna is very averse to this work, having specifically stated that house-holders should not read this. That is why the monks of the Ramakrishna order have not brought out any translation of this work in spite of their great contribution to traditional advaitic works. But Ramana does not make this type of discrimination. Personally, I feel that the translations of Venkatesanada and Samvit are most excellent in spite of the plagiarism involved. R.M.Hari's version is very spiritual. > Sankarraman > > > > Mail > Use Photomail to share photos without annoying attachments. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 18, 2006 Report Share Posted February 18, 2006 Dhyaanasaraswatiji, Beautiful statement. Both bondage and liberation are mithya. But they appear to be satya as long as long as one has the notion that one is bound. Appreciate if you can give complete sloka with reference. Dhynavaad Hari OM! Sadananda Can you give us the complete reference to it - possibly the sloka too. --- dhyanasaraswati <dhyanasaraswati wrote: > Namaskarams Dear Sri Sankaraman avargale! > > After reading all your recent posts on this thread , may i please be > allowed to quote the following verse from Vasishta yoga , a favorite > treatise of great saints like sri Ramakrishna parmahamsa, swami > Vivekananda and sri Ramana bhagvan? > > "Desire for liberation interferes with the fullness of > the Self; absence of such desire promotes > bondage! Hence, constant Awareness is to be preferred. > The sole cause for bondage and Liberation is the > movement in consciousness. Awareness of this ends this > movement. The ego-sense ceases the very moment one > observes it, for it has no support any longer. Then who is > bound by whom, or who is liberated by whom? " > > > HARI AUM! > > > > > > > advaitin, Ganesan Sankarraman <shnkaran > wrote: > > > > > > > > bhuvan eswar chilukuri <bhuvaneswarc wrote: > > respecvted ganesanga;ru, > > > > Have u read Yoga Va:sishtam ? > > > > Please do me a favour. > > > > There is a lot of mentioning here and there about vasana:s. > > > > could u please give me all the verses where it occurre? > > > > On Wed, 08 Feb 2006 Ganesan Sankarraman wrote : > > > > > > > > > Apropos your query, it is to be noted that Yoga > Vasishta is full of the ideas of vasanas, and not here and there to > be specified. You may read the translation done by Swamy > Venkatesananda, which goes by the name, 'Supreme Yoga'. But the > Swamiji has been influenced greatly by the modern terminologies of > J.Krishnamurthy, such as conditioning, psychological memory, > psychological becoming, choiceless awareness, which he freely uses > in expounding the philosophy of Vasishta, even though he has not > acknowledged the fact. The Swamy has met Krishnamurthy and held > talks with him which are available in the book, "Awakening of > Intelligence". There are further two versions, one containing the > selections from one B.l.Aytreya, who has done tremendous research on > this scripture dating it back to the period of Sankara, another > containing the philosophy of this work alongwith the stories, both > these having been done by one Samvit, who has simply adopted the > terminology, > > "Choiceless Awareness," of J.K, in explaining the thought of > Vasishta, no acknowledgment having been made in this case also. > There is another translation by one R.M.Hari, this being an English > translation from a Hindi version from a Sufi Master, which is very > original, coming from self-realization. There is also a free > rendering by one K.Narayanaswamy Iyer, having been published by > Theosophical Foundation. But, of course, the oldest version is by > Mitra, which is a prodigious work, all the thirty thousand verses > having been rendered in English. This is in a very archaic language, > and would not suit the purpose of the readers, even though the > author is very sincere. The attribution of this work to Valmiki is > sheer myth, the author being anonymous having resorted to this nom- > de-plume, which shows his greatness, the author sublating himself > in the grandeur of the thought. According to professor Dasgupta, the > author of this work, an unknown saint, belongs to the period > > of Gaudapada or Nagarjuna. But then the question arises as to why > Sankara has not made mention of this work, when Vidyaranya has done. > Aitreya attributes this to the fact of the work not having derived > the authority of tradition. But all these things are irrelevant. > This work talks of nonduality in unmincing terms, there being a > direct hit, without resort to all logic, dialectics and polemics. > Bhaghavan Ramana has very much recommended this work to be read, > while paradoxically Ramakrishna is very averse to this work, having > specifically stated that house-holders should not read this. That is > why the monks of the Ramakrishna order have not brought out any > translation of this work in spite of their great contribution to > traditional advaitic works. But Ramana does not make this type of > discrimination. Personally, I feel that the translations of > Venkatesanada and Samvit are most excellent in spite of the > plagiarism involved. R.M.Hari's version is very spiritual. > > Sankarraman > > > > > > > > Mail > > Use Photomail to share photos without annoying attachments. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2006 Report Share Posted February 19, 2006 kuntimaddi sadananda <kuntimaddisada wrote: Dhyaanasaraswatiji, Beautiful statement. Both bondage and liberation are mithya. But they appear to be satya as long as long as one has the notion that one is bound. Sir, May I be permitted to quote the following dialog between Rama and sage Vasishta, as brought about in the translation of sri R.M.Hari. "Question 294: Sir, you have instructed me to be established in the turiya state of quiescence. Are you free from the ideation of, ' I am Vasishta'? What is the nature of the turiya state where you do not experience the, 'I'. [ Hearing these words of Sri Ramachandra, Vasishtaji became quiet and gave no reply. At this Sri Ramachandra said, ' Sir, your silence does not suit you. You are truly Brahmagyani and jagat-guru. Nothing is unknown to you. Are you quiet because you consider me incompetent?' After a silence for a while, Vasishta replied.] Answer: Ramji, I did not become silent because of your incompetence, but I replied according to the nature of your question, or silence is the only answer to your question. Had you been an agyani, I would have replied in words, but because you are a gyani, I have answered it in gyan. Or, quiescence is the answer to your question; hence I remained silent. As long as you were an agyani, I answered your questions by the method of variants ( vikalpas), that is with ideation and words. All verbal statements or instructions are imbued with words and duality. Formerly, words and variants ( vikalpa ) suited you. But, now I have instructed you about Nirvikalpa ( the mode that is divested of illusions or variants). Ramji, words are of four kinds, viz (i) words having subtle purport, ( ii ) words having spiritual purport, ( iii ), and ( iv ) long or elaborate words. All these four types are limited on account of three kinds of deficiencies or faults ( kalank ): (i ) doubt or logic ( sanshay ), ( ii ) duality ( pratiyogi ) and three division or distinction ( bhed ). The state that is beyond mind and verbal description cannot be expressed with the afflicted words." Vasishta very beautifully disowns the relevance of words in the scheme of the unravelling of that which is, which cannot be conceptualized through the network of thought, which is essentially a knower-known phenomenon, and is relevant only in the realm of the empirical. Vasishta ends this peroration by the final statement to the following effect: " When a person says, ' I am Brahman and that is the world,' you should assume that he has not yet attained gyan. When the jiva truly attains gyan, then he does not even have the awareness of non-duality.. He just becomes sublime. At that stage who will teach whom, and what? Words and meaning are absent at that stage and the universe is dissolved." Further, Vasishta is very insightful in the following utterance, which is a practical guide for those who may not be familiar with the dialectics or averse to it. "Accepting the present that has arrived in regular course for the moment with the externalized intellect, and not accepting ( or entertaining ) the future and the past, the mind is reduced to the state free from thoughts." ( Page 145, verses 40-41, the story of Ghadhi, Essence of Yoga Vasishta by Samvid) yours truly, Sankarraman Brings words and photos together (easily) with PhotoMail - it's free and works with Mail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2006 Report Share Posted February 19, 2006 >Ganesan Sankarraman <shnkaran ..... > Vasishta very beautifully disowns the relevance >of words in the scheme of the unravelling of that which is, which cannot >be conceptualized through the network of thought, which is essentially a >knower-known phenomenon, and is relevant only in the realm of the >empirical. .... Thanks Sankarraman for the beautiful passage from Yoga VasishhTam - I am reminded of advaita prakaranam of Goudapaada kaarika. Has anyone given complete yoga VasishTam with sloka and meaning? Anyone else quated this work before Vidyaranya? Shankara did not quote from Sreemad Bhagavatam either and there is a theory that that work was later to Shankara. Hari OM! Sadananda _______________ Don’t just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2006 Report Share Posted February 19, 2006 Kuntimaddi Sadananda <k_sadananda wrote: >Ganesan Sankarraman ..... > Vasishta very beautifully disowns the relevance >of words in the scheme of the unravelling of that which is, which cannot >be conceptualized through the network of thought, which is essentially a >knower-known phenomenon, and is relevant only in the realm of the >empirical. .... Thanks Sankarraman for the beautiful passage from Yoga VasishhTam - I am reminded of advaita prakaranam of Goudapaada kaarika. Has anyone given complete yoga VasishTam with sloka and meaning? Anyone else quated this work before Vidyaranya? Shankara did not quote from Sreemad Bhagavatam either and there is a theory that that work was later to Shankara. Hari OM! Sadananda Sir, One Mitra- I am forgetting the surname- of the nineteenth century has made an English rendering of the entirety of the text; but by virtue of the archiac language, it is not readable despite the prodigious effort of the author. But, we must be thankful to him for being the pioneer in this effort. One pundit from Kashmir has rendered a summarized version known as Lagu Yoga Vasishta. In the Tamil language some of the vedantins of the yesteryears have translated this work into Tamil. I think in the Sanskrit tradition, none, other than Vidyaranya, have made any reference to this beautiful work. yours truly, Sankarraman Brings words and photos together (easily) with PhotoMail - it's free and works with Mail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2006 Report Share Posted February 19, 2006 ref post 38285 Sadaji, You write (Beautiful statement. Both bondage and liberation are mithya. But they appear to be satya as long as long as one has the notion that one is bound. Thank you , Sir ! Is that not a state of True JIVAN MUKTA - FREE AND UNBOUND ! There are similar verses in Ashtavakra Gita as well If one thinks of oneself as free, one is free, and if one thinks of oneself as bound, one is bound. Here this saying is true, "Thinking makes it so." 1.11 Your real nature is as the one perfect, free, and actionless consciousness, the all-pervading witness -- unattached to anything, desireless and at peace. It is from illusion that you seem to be involved in samsara. 1.12 (translation by John Richards) Sadaji, i do not have access to the actual sanskrit text ! Maybe our respected Sunderji can provide the actual links or reference materials. However, there is an English Tranlation available at Amazon.com Vasistha's Yoga by Swami Venkatesananda Swamiji belongs to the the Sri Ramakrishna mutt and has also written a concise version of the same text. The original Brihat YOGA VASISHTA has almost 32, 000 couplets with a lot of illustrative stories . But as Sankararamanji has pointed out in his message a shorter version of 6,000 couplets was translated by a kashmiri pandit named Abhinanda Pandita,called Lghu Yoga Vasishta. Sankararamanji just informed me via private email that Yoga Vasishta was often quoted by sri Ramana Maharishi but was not used by swami vivekananda or sri Ramakrishna ! Sunderji can help us out in this regard. but i do know that A TRANSLATION OF THIS GREAT WORK YOGA VASISHTA IS AVAILABLE AT SRI RAMANASHRAM. warrmest regards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2006 Report Share Posted February 19, 2006 dhyanasaraswati <dhyanasaraswati wrote: ref post 38285 Vasistha's Yoga by Swami Venkatesananda Swamiji belongs to the the Sri Ramakrishna mutt and has also written a concise version of the same text. May I be permitted to make the correction that swamy Venkatesananda does not belong to the Ramakrishna Order, but to that of the Sivananda Ashram, having been initiated into monkhood by Sivananda. His translation is non-traditional as I pointed out earlier. There is also yet another free rendering by one Raghunandan, a devotee of Ramakrishna. But the pioneer is B.L.Aireya, who has selected 2500 verses as constituting the quintessence of the text, these verses having been translated by one great man under the nom-de-plume Samvid. yours etc, Sankarraman Brings words and photos together (easily) with PhotoMail - it's free and works with Mail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 20, 2006 Report Share Posted February 20, 2006 post ref 30304 Thank you Sri Sankararaman-ji! you are absolutely correct. I do apologize for this error - i guess the suffix'ananda' at the end of the author's name must have resulted in this error -as most saints from the SRI RamAkrishna mutt have 'ananda' at the end of their names! i apologize for not checking the facts regarding to which lineage Swami venkateshnanda belongs - Many saints from Sri SIVANANDA ASHRAM AND SWAMI CHINMAYANANDA MISSION also have 'ANANDA' as suffixes! well, all this sainthood is about ''anandam' is it not ? Infinite bliss is what results when you follow the path of all these great lineages! Sankara-ji, this 'jiva' has assumed various 'names and forms from time to time , the day is not far off when this jiva will become Swamini 'Vinathananda' ! ( smile) ! Sankara-ji, here i quote to you your own brilliant words that you wrote to me off list " Have you heard of the concepts of, "Nirmana Kaya, Nirmana Chitta," talked about Patanjali Maharishi, this being answerable to the ideas of artificial minds and artificial bodies being taken by the yogis, either to destroy their karmas, or to have a form to communicate the teachings to the world, as according to Yoga philosophy, once the Satva, the finest constituent of the Prakriti, is disentangled from the Purusa through discriminating knowledge, the yogi's body gets disintegrated, leaving him no opportunity to communicate the message to the world? Verses relating to these concepts are available in the Kaivalya Pada of the Yogasutras of Patanjali, which no commentator has given a clear account of." Sankara-ji, although you are a late 'bloomer' on this list, you do exhibit a lot of wisdom and knowledge ! thanx! with warmest regards advaitin, Ganesan Sankarraman <shnkaran wrote: > > > > dhyanasaraswati <dhyanasaraswati wrote: ref post 38285 > > > > > Vasistha's Yoga > by Swami Venkatesananda > > Swamiji belongs to the the Sri Ramakrishna mutt and has also written > a concise version of the same text. > > May I be permitted to make the correction that swamy Venkatesananda does not belong to the Ramakrishna Order, but to that of the Sivananda Ashram, having been initiated into monkhood by Sivananda. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2006 Report Share Posted February 21, 2006 advaitin, "dhyanasaraswati" <dhyanasaraswati wrote: > > > " Have you heard of the concepts of, "Nirmana Kaya, Nirmana Chitta," > talked about Patanjali Maharishi, this being answerable to the ideas > of artificial minds and artificial bodies being taken by the yogis, > either to destroy their karmas, or to have a form to communicate the > teachings to the world, as according to Yoga philosophy, once the > Satva, the finest constituent of the Prakriti, is disentangled from > the Purusa through discriminating knowledge, the yogi's body gets > disintegrated, leaving him no opportunity to communicate the message > to the world? Verses relating to these concepts are available in the > Kaivalya Pada of the Yogasutras of Patanjali, which no commentator > has given a clear account of." Namaste, Yes I have seen that, probably in Patanjali but it wouldn't work. For one could have a million bodies but would still only have one ego and that is the problem...........ONS...Tony. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 24, 2006 Report Share Posted February 24, 2006 advaitin, Ganesan Sankarraman <shnkaran wrote: > > There is also yet another free rendering by one Raghunandan, a devotee of Ramakrishna. But the pioneer is B.L.Aireya, who has selected 2500 verses as constituting the quintessence of the text, these verses having been translated by one great man under the nom-de- plume Samvid. ------------------ Vihari Lal Mitra's work is now available in 4 volumes, edited and revised by Dr. Ravi Prakash Arya, publ. Parimal Publications, 1st ed. 1998; 3rd reprint 2003. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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