Guest guest Posted January 16, 2002 Report Share Posted January 16, 2002 JAI GURUDEV Hi all... The group has created a new record. This month, we have the highest number of messages since the creation of this group. The last record was 214 in April last year. Then, we had a long, long discussion on Sadhak. Ashish... ===== ø¤º°`°º¤ø,,,,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,,,,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,,,,ø¤º°`°º¤ø Sadhak, The Quest for Completeness http://www20.brinkster.com/sadhak ø¤º°`°º¤ø,,,,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,,,,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,,,,ø¤º°`°º¤ø Send FREE video emails in Mail! http://promo./videomail/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 17, 2002 Report Share Posted January 17, 2002 My Dear Friends, Congrats & Thanks "Anu ji" , "You" & to all as everybody is contributing. With the grace of god & our guru we will see some great heights in the future if continue our quest for truth. Thanks . Rohit. - "Ashish Marathe" <nikhilashish <> Thursday, January 17, 2002 12:29 AM The new high > JAI GURUDEV > Hi all... > > The group has created a new record. This month, we > have the highest number of messages since the creation > of this group. The last record was 214 in April last > year. Then, we had a long, long discussion on Sadhak. > > Ashish... > > ===== > ø¤º°`°º¤ø,,,,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,,,,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,,,,ø¤º°`°º¤ø > Sadhak, The Quest for Completeness > http://www20.brinkster.com/sadhak > ø¤º°`°º¤ø,,,,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,,,,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,,,,ø¤º°`°º¤ø > > > > Send FREE video emails in Mail! > http://promo./videomail/ > > > Jay Gurudev > > > > > > Your use of is subject to > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 17, 2002 Report Share Posted January 17, 2002 , "S.A." <sunnyan@n...> wrote: > My Dear Friends, dear rohit, anuji wastes her time, as well as yours. i do not know what i have done to get caught up with philosophers again and again and again. surely it must not be a small sin. before it is too late, i run for my life.........you should also worry about yours. wishes bye anu > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 17, 2002 Report Share Posted January 17, 2002 -ds, > > dear rohit, i did not mean to be rude to you or anyone else. it is just that i am irritated with myself gor not giving my work first priority. which is the most important thing sorry and bye wishes anu i do not know what i have > done to get caught up with philosophers again and again and again. > surely it must not be a small sin. before it is too late, i run for my > life.........you should also worry about yours. > > wishes > bye > anu > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 18, 2002 Report Share Posted January 18, 2002 dear ashisih, > The group has created a new record. This month, we > have the highest number of messages since the creation > of this group. The last record was 214 in April last > year. Then, we had a long, long discussion on Sadhak. > > Ashish... > > ===== > ø¤º°`°º¤ø,,,,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,,,,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,,,,ø¤º°`°º¤ø > Sadhak, The Quest for Completeness > http://www20.brinkster.com/sadhak > ø¤º°`°º¤ø,,,,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,,,,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,,,,ø¤º°`°º¤ø i remember the commotion that was going on, good work, if u know abt arvind and charanjit let me know personally/publicly whichever u feel appropriate. when ever i think of numbers i defenitly would remember arvind, i was for long time wanting to know as to what happened to him regarding the improvements i will let u knwo within 2 - 3 days, i have to go thru what people have suggested, and see if mine dosent overlap, i suggest that it would be practical enough if u put some deadlines (may be 15 days ) and remind people of the deadline for submission for improvements every now and then(Say twice a week) affectionately Jai Gurudev Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 18, 2002 Report Share Posted January 18, 2002 Dear Swami Birendranand Maharaj... > if u know abt arvind and charanjit let me know Arvind was looking for a new job since his contract with Symbion had expired. Then, in November, he visited Delhi and after that, he simply vanished. I mailed him twice, but never got a response. I and Charanjit exchanged new year e-greetings and after that, he has vanished too. Have a nice day. Ashish... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 18, 2002 Report Share Posted January 18, 2002 Namaste Sri Anu! Thanks for being the live wire in the group and also for taking the initiative in revamping sadhak.com(and people are saying that dotcoms are going bust!) Aum Namasivaya, Vijay --- devi_bhagat <devi_bhagat wrote: > , "S.A." <sunnyan@n...> wrote: > > My Dear Friends, > > dear rohit, > anuji wastes her time, as well as yours. i do not > know what i have > done to get caught up with philosophers again and > again and again. > surely it must not be a small sin. before it is too > late, i run for my > life.........you should also worry about yours. > > wishes > bye > anu > > > > > Send FREE video emails in Mail! http://promo./videomail/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 18, 2002 Report Share Posted January 18, 2002 JAI GURUDEV Jai Paramhansa Swami Vijayanand Saraswati Maharaj ji > for taking the initiative in revamping sadhak.com That's NOT sadhak.com. That's www20.brinkster.com/sadhak > and people are saying that dotcoms are going bust! Of course, they are not. Only those dotcoms with poor revenue models or those whose only source of revenue was advertising while requiring investment in millions are going bust. Ashish... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2002 Report Share Posted January 19, 2002 , Yoga man <childofdevi> wrote: > Namaste Sri Anu! > namaste, > Thanks for being the live wire in the group ` you are welcome. now listen carefully, greed is not a good thing vijay, be it for yantras or for sadhnas. learn it from my few 100 words mail, or learn it yourself by experience the hard way. the choice is yours. why do you need multiple yantras vijay, some to decorate in the cupboard, some to wear?? what is your problem? are you sure you can treat them all with respect? i.e. say a pranaam to all of them, show dhoop deep and chant the respective mantras daily atlest 5 times. if so go ahead. if not, any no. of yantras lying at home will do you no good. without reference to context i wish to say something to you. money does not buy God, it never did and it never will. run miles away from anyone who claims otherwise. he is simply exploiting your own fears/confusions and situation. mix it with some amount of faith and devotion,and you will get results. but with it will come the very dangerous message that they have to be mixed together to get results. if you wish to respect any of the GODS you believe in, if you have to respect any of the masters you have read, stand up, be a lion have the courage to face failure if it comes but try devotion unpolluted. any of the GODs you believe in has in him the metal to provide you with all you need. only if you have the courage to ask yourself. good wishes aum namah shivay anu shiva is the GOD from whom all the mantras tantras of the world rose. Shiva is the GURU of all Gurus in the world, who came before or will come later. YET this very shiva gets pleased if you make a shivling of mud pour a lota jal, and provides you with all you need. And he is impartial, educated or uneducated, rich or poor do not matter to him. in my life long before i discovered sadhans or mantras, there came a time when i was under so much stress that i almost lost my mind. i suffered from hallucinations, and all kinds of confusions-well the reason was tantric prayog if you wish to believe it (told by a very renouned saint), but fancy names have little meaning before GOD or even humans, no? Do you know how i got cured, i went to a shiva temple bowed my head on a shivratri day, and the next day it all vanished. JUST that much. "I" also here narrate a miracle to match any others may present you with. for months because of my own greed, i have been trying this sadhna and that saahna and perhaps believeing like an idiot that things will not get OK without them, then perhaps in the process i accumultaed some good karma, and was again driven to this GOD of all GODs, no i have not done any sadhna pertaining to him properly though i plan to, and within a blink again, i have been shown the mistakes i have made in the past to suffer, and also the direction for all future happiness-no miracles here some simple pure wisdom. some callit sanmati. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2002 Report Share Posted January 19, 2002 > Of course, they are not. Only those dotcoms with > poor revenue models > or those whose only source of revenue was > advertising while requiring > investment in millions are going bust. and those with bad and lazy presidents(unlike our president madam). > > Ashish... > > Send FREE video emails in Mail! http://promo./videomail/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2002 Report Share Posted January 19, 2002 - > > and those with bad and lazy presidents(unlike our > president madam). > you know, vivekanda says somewhere that if you have given a man the truth, your job is done. let him reason it out himself, and draw his own conclusions. and i was talking not just to you, but to everyone present here. but truth too perhaps depends on the frame of reference you view it from. i have never understood or learnt anything minus my own experiences. it is not an easy path, but it is interesting. nonethe less it is my moral obligation to warn others of the mistakes i have made. good wishes jai gurudev anu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2002 Report Share Posted January 19, 2002 Namaste Sri Anu! --- devi_bhagat <devi_bhagat wrote: > , Yoga man <childofdevi> > wrote: > > Namaste Sri Anu! > > > namaste, > > Thanks for being the live wire in the group > ` > you are welcome. now listen carefully, greed is not > a good thing > vijay, be it for yantras or for sadhnas. learn it > from my few 100 > words mail, or learn it yourself by experience the > hard way. the > choice is yours. > why do you need multiple yantras vijay, some to > decorate in the > cupboard, some to wear?? what is your problem? > are you sure you can treat them all with respect? > i.e. say a pranaam > to all of them, show dhoop deep and chant the > respective mantras daily > atlest 5 times. if so go ahead. if not, any no. of > yantras lying at > home will do you no good. Thank you very much for this heartfelt advice. > > without reference to context i wish to say something > to you. > money does not buy God, it never did and it never > will. run miles away I beg to disagree. In my opinion there is no curse worse than poverty. After all is not money Laxmi herself. Now the kind of attitude where you hoard up money and keep it to yourself is a very harmful thing. Money has nothing good/evil about it. It tends towards good/evil depending on the intent of the person handling it. And my position about money is that money should be earned(honourably and lawfully) to give it all away. Are you in habit of writing down goals that you want to achieve in life. Well I have, and I have point by point list of things I need to do. And my position is that if there is anything that will lead to achieving that goal, I would go for it(very practical) as long as it involves no wrongdoing. So if a specified sadhana promises me a certain result, then I would go for it. > from anyone who claims otherwise. he is simply > exploiting your own > fears/confusions and situation. mix it with some > amount of faith > and devotion,and you will get results. but with it > will come the very > dangerous message that they have to be mixed > together to get results. > > if you wish to respect any of the GODS you believe > in, if you have to > respect any of the masters you have read, stand up, > be a lion have the > courage to face failure if it comes but try devotion > unpolluted. any > of the GODs you believe in has in him the metal to > provide you with > all you need. only if you have the courage to ask > yourself. You know in one of his books, Yogananda used to say that one can cure sickness, heal the body, live without food....provided one knows how to, if not one should every possible physical means to do. > > good wishes > aum namah shivay > > anu > > shiva is the GOD from whom all the mantras tantras > of the world rose. > Shiva is the GURU of all Gurus in the world, who > came before or will > come later. YET this very shiva gets pleased if you > make a shivling of Ah the Divine Father does not even need that. All he wants is a heart of love. > mud pour a lota jal, and provides you with all you > need. And he is > impartial, educated or uneducated, rich or poor do > not matter to him. > > in my life long before i discovered sadhans or > mantras, there came a > time when i was under so much stress that i almost > lost my mind. i > suffered from hallucinations, and all kinds of > confusions-well the > reason was tantric prayog if you wish to believe it > (told by a very > renouned saint), but fancy names have little meaning > before GOD or > even humans, no? Do you know how i got cured, i went > to a shiva temple > bowed my head on a shivratri day, and the next day > it all vanished. > JUST that much. "I" also here narrate a miracle to > match any others > may present you with. > It is really funny that you mention this incident. I too had a similar situation and in my case, the miraculous cure(for a supposedly incurable disease) happened in just a moment. You must learn to forgive the person who did this to you- because in some past life you must have caused him great grievance. What goes around, comes around. And besides, if it were not for this person, you would not have come to this great realisation in the first place. Generally speaking, everyones situation is unique. Some may or may not benefit from sadhanas, mantras, pure devotion etc. Just because something worked for you does not mean that this is the only thing that works and one should not end up assuming that everything else is of lesser value. > > for months because of my own greed, i have been > trying this sadhna and > that saahna and perhaps believeing like an idiot > that things will not > get OK without them, then perhaps in the process i > accumultaed some > good karma, and was again driven to this GOD of all > GODs, > no i have not done any sadhna pertaining to him > properly > though i plan to, and within a blink again, i have > been shown the > mistakes i have made in the past to suffer, and also > the direction for > all future happiness-no miracles here some simple > pure wisdom. > some callit sanmati. > Anyhow, thank you very much for your advice again. Also I notice that you are a mantra-holic i.e suggesting mantras, I wish to add that sometimes constant chanting of mantras can be DANGEROUS; mantra generally brings out whatever is inside of you. So if you are a fearful person, the mantra would amplify that fear especially if that fear is a deep rooted fear that you do not want to face consciously. Everyone unself-realized person has such repressions. That is why it is better to get the mantra from a satguru as the guru knows what is the best medicine. I studied for several years with Subramuniya Swami(www.gurudeva.org) a truly great saint. Usually when he gave me advice, at the moment it did not strike me as useful, it is usually one year later that I realise the significance of what he told me. So he could see that much ahead. And sometimes, the problem you are facing cannot be solved by mantra, yantra or even pure devotion. It is just a plain acceptance of yourself as is. Siva no doubt likes pure devotion but Siva likes it even more when you meet Him through the guru. Aum Namasivaya, Vijay > > > > > > Send FREE video emails in Mail! http://promo./videomail/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2002 Report Share Posted January 19, 2002 --- devi_bhagat <devi_bhagat wrote: > - > > > > and those with bad and lazy presidents(unlike our > > president madam). > > > you know, vivekanda says somewhere that if you have > given a man the > truth, your job is done. let him reason it out > himself, and draw his "truth" is person specific. What is "truth" to you may not apply to someone else. Only a satguru can give the "TRUTH". and there is no verbalisation in the "TRUTH". "TRUTH" is a matter of non-comprehension for the non-knowers. Now I did mention that I was greedy in a couple of places. I meant this in a harmless, jocular, innocular vein. So nobody should take this as meaning that I am budding Mr Scrooge:-). > own conclusions. and i was talking not just to you, > but to everyone > present here. but truth too perhaps depends on the > frame of reference > you view it from. > > i have never understood or learnt anything minus my > own experiences. > it is not an easy path, but it is interesting. > nonethe less it is my > moral obligation to warn others of the mistakes i > have made. This is amply appreciated. This is what our purpose was originally in discussing about personal experiences in the spiritual path. Aum namasivaya, Vijay > > good wishes > jai gurudev > anu > > Send FREE video emails in Mail! http://promo./videomail/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2002 Report Share Posted January 19, 2002 > .. So if a specified > sadhana promises me a certain result, then I would go > for it. so would i. did i claim anywhere that you shouldn't? > > > > > You know in one of his books, Yogananda used to say > that one can cure sickness, heal the body, live > without food....provided one knows how to, if not one > should every possible physical means to do. > > > why not? > > > Ah the Divine Father does not even need that. All he > wants is a heart of love. > that is more difficult to manufacture than any other commodity. ment. You must learn to forgive > the person who did this to you- because in some past > life you must have ..... did i sound like i am complaining to you? i havenever wished this person ill, and do not have energy to waste in this process. i am sorry i conveyed the wrong impression to you. in some life i must have....prove it. people who died in the earth quake must have.....prove it.the girl who got raped on the street must have..... why should i believe what you say because you read it in some book, or heard it word of mouth. the beauty of karma thoery does not lie in retrospect it lies in moving ahead. trying to take blame for all that happens to you, is a superhuman effort to be more than human--it does not pay. it only makes a philosopher out of you. at this is the only thing that > works and one should not end up assuming that > everything else is of lesser value. > > > definitely not. everybody has their own path to tread. > > Anyhow, thank you very much for your advice again. > Also I notice that you are a mantra-holic i.e > suggesting mantras, I wish to add that sometimes > constant chanting of mantras can be DANGEROUS; i rarely do anything.... mantra > Siva no doubt likes pure devotion but > Siva likes it even more when you meet Him through the > guru. > may the good lord bless you, as well as me. as for shiva let him decide for himself. it is possible that he likes one thing from you, and another from me. at this is the only thing that > works and one should not end up assuming that > everything else is of lesser value. good wishes jaigurudev anu ://promo./videomail/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2002 Report Share Posted January 19, 2002 Namaste Sri Anu! I appeared to have singed nerves. If I did say something incisive, please forgive me- it was not done intentionally. > that is more difficult to manufacture than any other > commodity. Which is why it is better for many people to be doing this and that sadhana when the heart is barren inside. > ment. You must learn to forgive > > the person who did this to you- because in some > past > > life you must have ..... > > did i sound like i am complaining to you? i > havenever wished this I am again sorry to ponitificate. I did have ill-will for a long time, so I thought you would also. > person ill, and do not have energy to waste in this > process. > > i am sorry i conveyed the wrong impression to you. > in some life i > must have....prove it. people who died in the earth > quake must > have.....prove it.the girl who got raped on the > street must have..... > > why should i believe what you say because you read > it in some book, or > heard it word of mouth. the beauty of karma thoery > does not lie in > retrospect it lies in moving ahead. trying to take > blame for all that > happens to you, is a superhuman effort to be more > than human--it does > not pay. Ah. I could not agree with you any less. karma truly is for moving forward. But it is very easy to say drop the past and move forward. It is unresolved issues from the past that shapes the future. Taking control of your life is essentially reconciling with the past. If you have totally reconciled with the past, then you would be self-realised. Again I want to reiterate that I did not mean to say anything incisive. Aum Namasivaya, Vijay > it only makes a philosopher out of you. > > at this is the only thing that > > works and one should not end up assuming that > > everything else is of lesser value. > > > > > > > definitely not. everybody has their own path to > tread. > > > > > Anyhow, thank you very much for your advice again. > > Also I notice that you are a mantra-holic i.e > > suggesting mantras, I wish to add that sometimes > > constant chanting of mantras can be DANGEROUS; > > i rarely do anything.... > mantra > > Siva no doubt likes pure devotion but > > Siva likes it even more when you meet Him through > the > > guru. > > > may the good lord bless you, as well as me. as for > shiva let him > decide for himself. it is possible that he likes one > thing from you, > and another from me. > > at this is the only thing that > > works and one should not end up assuming that > > everything else is of lesser value. > > good wishes > > jaigurudev > > > anu > > > > > ://promo./videomail/ > > Send FREE video emails in Mail! http://promo./videomail/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2002 Report Share Posted January 19, 2002 > Thank you very much for this heartfelt advice. > > > > > without reference to context i wish to say something > > to you. > > money does not buy God, it never did and it never > > will. > > I beg to disagree. meanwhile, also accept my heart felt good luck, when you go on this mission. good wishes good bye jai GURUDEV anu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2002 Report Share Posted January 19, 2002 , Yoga man <childofdevi> wrote: > Namaste Sri Anu! > > > > that is more difficult to manufacture than any other > > commodity. > > Which is why it is better for many people to be doing > this and that sadhana when the heart is barren inside. > no, brother, not this and that, only this , this and none other till you succeed at it. then move on to the next. > Ah. I could not agree with you any less. karma truly > is for moving forward. But it is very easy to say drop > the past and move forward. that is true, but do we have a choice? you can either move on, or die and be born again to carry the remining karma, may be in a worse situation. a few days ago, i faced hell lot of problems that shaped my life. i really had to push myself to carry. i went to a friend to chatter. and told him i would commit suicide but i do not like the idea of becoming a ghost and sitting on a tree perhaps hanging upside down. i like my centrally heated room a lot more.....jokes apart, there really is no escape. you do not even have a guarantee that you will be born human leave other things alone. NOthing goes with you, your "beautiful" body, your "intelligent" head, your "education", this that... all that you take with you is tendencies. habits, character. make them so strong now that in whatever situation GOD places you you are able to take the direction best then and there. > > Again I want to reiterate that I did not mean to say > anything incisive. > i fully appreciate that. BUt there is only 1 question: how do you distinguish a sadguru from a Pseudoguru?? anyway, perhaps even that is not relevant. kabir says in a beautiful bhajan das kabir har kr Gun gave bahar koi paar na paye. Guru ki karni, guru jayega, chele ki karni chela. ==>>> gurus if pseudo are also not above the law of karma,. they will have to pay for it. whereas a chela even if he is truely devoted to a psuedoguru will also see the light by the grace of the again the GOD of all GODs... jaigurudev anu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2002 Report Share Posted January 19, 2002 , Yoga man <childofdevi> wrote: > daer vijay, > "truth" is person specific. What is "truth" to you may > not apply to someone else. Only a satguru can give the > "TRUTH". and there is no verbalisation in the "TRUTH". > "TRUTH" is a matter of non-comprehension for the > non-knowers. > thank you for the reminder that i am not a SADGURU, not that i had any illiusions. there are two prayers i say to my GOD wherever he is 1) may i never get the power to curse another human being no matter what he does to me 2)that i may never be placed in a position in life where i have power over other human beings to such an extent that they consider me above or close to GOD, because i do not have the confidence taht i will be able to make good use of it. however,remember one thing. GOD or GUru or whatever you choose to call him, does not have to make an appearance everytime there is a comfusion. sometimes it comes as a idea in your head, sometims if you are well tumed you may hear the voice of a saint, or sometimes you may hear him from you friends, family everywhere. so even if i am not a sadguru, it does not directlty imply that my statement is false. the chances of my statement being false are very high if my ego comes in between however, and the chances of your not receiving it are high if your ego comes in between. and vice versa is equally true, that is why you wrote i bow to the divine in you.... good wishes jai gurudev anu ahoo.com/videomail/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2002 Report Share Posted January 19, 2002 > > > Namaste! The question that I had was many different yantras was a fixation of the past. I just wanted to know if this was true or not(after is not that the purpose of this discussion board). You are right, in my current situation I did not need any of them. In fact on one of the pages at siddashram.org, it was said that you could throw away all yantras and fall at the feet of the guru(you might begin to begrudge the fact that I am a guru-fanatic). Accepting a guru in no way lessens you mantle or willpower, it just makes things easier. > > > Ah. I could not agree with you any less. karma > truly > > is for moving forward. But it is very easy to say > drop > > the past and move forward. > > that is true, but do we have a choice? we always have choices, albeit heavily weighted ones. > a few days ago, i faced hell lot of problems that > shaped my life. i > really had to push myself to carry. i went to a > friend to chatter. and > told him i would commit suicide but i do not like > the idea of becoming > a ghost and sitting on a tree perhaps hanging upside > down. i like my > centrally heated room a lot more.....jokes apart, > there really is no I am really sorry to hear that you had a difficult situation. And am glad that you came out stronger in the end. When you are at a dead end, the only thing that will work is prayer. Praying is almost always successful at the critical juncture. But how often can you pray like that? Anyhow suicide is the worst possible thing that you do to accumulate karma. So please hereafter do not even talk about it. > escape. you do not even have a guarantee that you > will be born human > leave other things alone. > NOthing goes with you, your "beautiful" body, your > "intelligent" head, > your "education", this that... > all that you take with you is tendencies. habits, > character. make them > so strong now that in whatever situation GOD places > you you are able Yep! We make them or we break them or we keep them. > to take the direction best then and there. > > > > > > Again I want to reiterate that I did not mean to > say > > anything incisive. > > > > i fully appreciate that. BUt there is only 1 > question: how do you > distinguish a sadguru from a Pseudoguru?? No doubt there are a lot of charlatans who pose as gurus. In fact there was this guru Premamanda from Tamil Nadu who was arrested becausing in his big ashram he was in the habit of raping women and then jailing them! At the time, a lot of genuinely spiritual people were greatly saddenened. For a genuine sadguru, first thing I would look at the devotees. So I was testing the waters on this list for sometime. And it seemed to me that I did meet some genuine people. Apparently you have not had any inner experiences with Gurudev(correct me if I am wrong)- that could mean a number of reasons. Generally speaking, a genuine guru shines like the sun. There is no hiding his spiritual grandeur. There may be ordinary people who have no such grandeur but nonetheless are spiritual giants. When you are in a crisis, praying to the guru can give spectacular results for after all is not guru the intermediary between God and yourself. Well I am sure that everyone has a personal story of how the guru came into his life and really the answer to your question is that is something endemic to each individual(not much of an answer). Now I wondering in the couplet by Kabir that you translated, if he meant to add another one saying that genuine guru+genuine sadhak>> false guru+ genuine sadhak Perhaps you are aware that Kabir himself was the result of the grace of his guru Ramamanda. So that pretty much speaks of the guru's grace. Aum Namasivaya, Vijay > > anyway, perhaps even that is not relevant. > > kabir says in a beautiful bhajan > > das kabir har kr Gun gave bahar koi paar na paye. > Guru ki karni, guru jayega, chele ki karni chela. > > ==>>> gurus if pseudo are also not above the law of > karma,. they will > have to pay for it. whereas a chela even if he is > truely devoted to a > psuedoguru will also see the light by the grace of > the again the GOD > of all GODs... > jaigurudev > > anu > > Send FREE video emails in Mail! http://promo./videomail/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2002 Report Share Posted January 19, 2002 > > so even if i am not a sadguru, it does not directlty > imply that my > statement is false. the chances of my statement > being false are very > high if my ego comes in between however, and the > chances of your not > receiving it are high if your ego comes in between. > and vice versa is equally true, that is why Ah! The ego is truly the enemy. If it were not for the ego, there would be no need for the satguru. Most of us have a great deal of ego consciousness- the ego is truly shattered only after self-realisation. You are looking at your situation probably from an individual perspective but from a truly cosmic viewpoint what is it that I need to do? That a satguru tells me. Again these are my own opinions... Aum Namasivaya, Vijay > > you wrote i bow to the divine in you.... > > good wishes > jai gurudev > anu > > ahoo.com/videomail/ > > Send FREE video emails in Mail! http://promo./videomail/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2002 Report Share Posted January 19, 2002 JAI GURUDEV Dear Vijay... > I wish to add that sometimes constant chanting of mantras can be > DANGEROUS; mantra generally brings out whatever is inside of you. > So if you are a fearful person, the mantra would amplify that fear > especially if that fear is a deep rooted fear that you do not want > to face consciously. I TOTALLY and COMPLETELY DISAGREE with you. Nothing of that sort can happen if a mantra is chanted constantly. I request you not to spread such negative ideas about mantras and sadhanas. My experience tells me that if you are a fearful person, constant chanting of mantra will teach you to boldly face and iradicate it once and for all. Ashish... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2002 Report Share Posted January 19, 2002 Namaste Ashish! Ok! I will desist from making such statements. I myself am a constant mantra chanter regardless of what I have inside. The statement that I made was with reference to a very few group of people who have violent kundalini symptoms- such people are generally not under the guidance of a guru(who would prevent such things happenings) and the first thing they are asked to do is to stop chanting. Aum Namasivaya Vijay --- nikhilashish <nikhilashish wrote: > JAI GURUDEV > Dear Vijay... > > > I wish to add that sometimes constant chanting of > mantras can be > > DANGEROUS; mantra generally brings out whatever is > inside of you. > > So if you are a fearful person, the mantra would > amplify that fear > > especially if that fear is a deep rooted fear that > you do not want > > to face consciously. > > I TOTALLY and COMPLETELY DISAGREE with you. Nothing > of that sort can > happen if a mantra is chanted constantly. I request > you not to spread > such negative ideas about mantras and sadhanas. My > experience tells > me that if you are a fearful person, constant > chanting of mantra will > teach you to boldly face and iradicate it once and > for all. > > Ashish... > > Send FREE video emails in Mail! http://promo./videomail/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2002 Report Share Posted January 19, 2002 ---pparently you have not had any inner experiences with Gurudev(correct me if I am wrong)- that could mean a number of reasons. > > Ok! I will desist from making such statements. I > myself am a constant mantra chanter regardless of what > I have inside. The statement that I made was with > reference to a very few group of people who have > violent kundalini symptoms- such people are generally > not under the guidance of a guru(who would prevent > such things happenings) and the first thing they are > asked to do is to stop chanting. > > thank you. but what made you think that my spiritual quest was unguided? it is a sign of defeat when you start making personal allegations for which you have neither rhyme nor reason, what do you mean by a inner experience? of course i have had some spiritual experiences like all here but what is so great about it any case, as rohit put across they are universal? to me nothing short of my guru appearing right before me in person and talking to me directly is enough. dreams are not enough. and no it has not happened yet. in any case, i totally admire your quest for a master and i admit i cannot equal it. so you win. good wishes good bye jai gurudev anu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2002 Report Share Posted January 19, 2002 dear anu and dear vijayP > anyway, perhaps even that is not relevant. > > kabir says in a beautiful bhajan > > das kabir har kr Gun gave bahar koi paar na paye. > Guru ki karni, guru jayega, chele ki karni chela. > > ==>>> gurus if pseudo are also not above the law of karma,. they will > have to pay for it. whereas a chela even if he is truely devoted to a > psuedoguru will also see the light by the grace of the again the GOD > of all GODs... hmm the discussion was good, so what i would like to tell from my experiences is that, both are true from ur own perspectives , i agree to both of u, but what kabir told is absolute truth , its nice that both of u agree with it, and when a realised person like kabir tells ,it is truth. anu conclusion of power of other beings is also a visible truth to her, which no one can deny, i too having similar experiences for past quiet few days which is a shock to me, but the person in reference, is still i feel a gentle soul, though probably not of a sadguru stature, but i for past few yrs beleived him as a sadguru only, so am taken aback. but my bhavana to him always was a sadguru, so for past few yrs i have based faith in what he said and things worked directly or indirectly, now also i dont feel its untrue, but i am currently under the guidance of a master, who told me the nature of sadguru, and when i superimpose onto the person of reference, he seems not to posses that qualities, then i asked my current master as to how should i believe it, he only told that whenever u are in difficulty go to him, and u will make out the difference. so the point to note is overtly/covertly also people may be good but you cant tell wheter one is a sadguru or not so easily, so i have left my confusion to lord himself, by Gods grace i have learnt to worship/see lord as one who is TATTVA and who is in everything,so kind of cooly able to withstand the shock , but my faith for my lord is always/will be there and is beyond name and form.it will remain that he is love and that he will not mislead and misguide me , i believe in his grace whatever my experiences are(good/bad), i believe he is noble one, and we cant judge or measure him by our limited minds, so there is no solution to this is faith in him( ill later post how to faith), i really feel that one should be very fortunate and higly be yearning to get a sadguru. one thing i believe wfhatt vijay told abt a sadguru is a lion and sincere aspirant will get him, if has faith in the lord(whoever the lord may be as long as i can submit to the lord completly) lion when it roars u can make out, the terror it strikes , so sincere aspirant is the key, there are always signals out there where a sincere aspirant can catch (of a sadguru signal), lord gives signals always. people in their own goals lost cant catch it, but a sincere aspirant can catch it, take vivekanda he had only goal was if some can show him the lord no one could satisfy him except ramakrishna paramahams so he too didnt show him the lord immediately the reply that ramakrsihna parmahamsa gave to vivekanda hit him directly.so when a child cries mother has to come wherever she is. mother cant miss the childs cry. affectionately Jai Gurudev so u see things work as long as ur sincere aspirant having faith in lord that he will/is leading u. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2002 Report Share Posted January 19, 2002 --- devi_bhagat <devi_bhagat wrote: > ---pparently you have not had any inner experiences > with > Gurudev(correct me if I am wrong)- > that could mean a > number of reasons. > > > > > > > Ok! I will desist from making such statements. I > > myself am a constant mantra chanter regardless of > what > > I have inside. The statement that I made was with > > reference to a very few group of people who have > > violent kundalini symptoms- such people are > generally > > not under the guidance of a guru(who would prevent > > such things happenings) and the first thing they > are > > asked to do is to stop chanting. > > > > > thank you. but what made you think that my spiritual > quest was > unguided? OOps sorry anu! I should be really be thrashed for making such statements. It is just that when you asked me what the difference between a satguru and pseudoguru is I foolishly made the assumption that you did not have any of the experiences mentioned. Again forgive this lowly contemptile creature. > > it is a sign of defeat when you start making > personal allegations for > which you have neither rhyme nor reason, what do you > mean by a inner > experience? Yes I do accept defeat. I will define an inner experience as something definitive had come from your teacher and I will also add that most people would keep their truly inner experience to themselves. Since this varies from person to person, I dont know how to define this. > > of course i have had some spiritual experiences like > all here but what > is so great about it any case, as rohit put across > they are universal? > to me nothing short of my guru appearing right > before me in person and > talking to me directly is enough. dreams are not > enough. and no it has > not happened yet. Your stong resolution in indeed admirable and I wish you success in it. May I ask what prompted you to want this? Also I must add that this has been done by many people and will be done. > > in any case, i totally admire your quest for a > master and i admit i > cannot equal it. > so you win. There is no winning or loosing. You took a step forward and I took a step backward. At the end of the journey, all are winnners. Aum Namasivaya, Vijay > > good wishes > good bye > jai gurudev > > anu > > Send FREE video emails in Mail! http://promo./videomail/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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