Richard..self inquiry etc.

[Guest guest]

Richard wrote:

"Based on your last response I am starting to see more clearly what

could be spiritual issues in your approach. This is what it looks

like to me, and certainly my impressions may be off base. But they

may be worth your consideration."

 

Dear Richard:

You are my gift. Someone to point out my inconsistencies and that wont accept

donations. I hope you don't mind my jaded sense of humor? I guess I will have to

give that up, because I have fun with it.

 

Richard again wrote:

"On one hand you seek something, let's call it the Absolute, within

yourself. On the other hand, you view yourself as a part of, lets

say, the forces of the universe, so that your actions and situations

are a function of the forces of the universe, and not under you

personal control. This seems to me like two Absolutes, not One. You

surrender your "doership" to the Universe, but cannot surrender your

ego to it (or so it seems)."

 

I am not one yet, but will soon be unified. The planet after your moon in your

astrological chart is where you are going in the next existence. My spouse used

to do astrology and took a course in Karmic astrology. It seems to be a true

read. Both of us came from Uranus in the last lifetime so that she was able to

handle my weirdness. I am set to go to Pluto,which is transformation. Since that

is what I am working for, I see it as being right on. I hope that the

transformation will not be into a frog..LOL.

 

 

"Then you go on to say that you surrender to the efficacy of Inquiry.

 

The way that I understand it, inquiry is self-effort. Choice is

important in this self-effort. Choice is important in two ways. The

first is simply choosing to inquire. The second is during inquiry,

when one chooses to return attention to the Self."

 

Choice to me is just predestined mental tendencies and universal. "For anything

to happen, the whole universe must make it happen".

 

I do that with all my heart, but that is just what the universe gave me. I

really believe this stuff, but I have to deal with a duplicitous mind ego. There

are various parts to my mind, but they are not me.

 

"So as I see it, you may have surrender and inquiry kind of mixed

together. OK, but be careful about confusion."

 

I am just watching the passing show and becoming more and more relaxed about its

vagaries.

Am I becoming too self satisfied because I am not reacting like in former times?

 

> I see the objects and say internally " to I". I don't know if that

is a correct way to practice, but If you have as many thoughts as I

do, you then you might want to use "to I' to stay with it in the

present time, and not get lost in thought identification. <

 

"This is correct practice. Now I learned something at satsang Sunday

that I had not known so clearly before. This is about the role of

the intellect in inquiry. Inquiry results in two outcomes: either

one is taken to the Witnessing consciousness (in which case nothing

else is needed), or it does not. If not, one continues the inquiry.

What is happing in the inquiry is that the intellect (which is

turning over thoughts and ideas and saying, "I am this!No, I am

that.") comes to see what it really is. As it sees this, it becomes

calmer. When, finally the intellect is calm and quiet, the inquiry

goes beyond the intellect."

 

In today practice I used "To whom?" first and then "To I". It seems to work

better in staying with a mind that wants to wonder

 

PLEASE DESCRIBE THE WITNESSING CONSCIOUSNESS FROM YOUR EXPERIENCE?

 

So this is the process of "burning up the stick that is used to stir

the fire" that Ramana talks about. And there is a vital place for

the intellect in inquiry.

 

Knowing this is an immediate help to me. I had a much deeper insight

that "I" would NEVER be found in the known. This insight immediately

brought my inquiry deeper. I was getting ready to discard it though,

as mere understanding of the intellect, until in satsang I came to

see that this kind of understanding of the intellect is really a key

element in the inquiry.

 

My goals are to be always in the timeless present and to react from the inner

universal and not the outer personal.

 

So now I understand inquiry somewhat differently. Inquiry is for the

mind, for the intellect. The Self does not need any inquiry.

 

As to your chance to be with the sages, they do not travel. Some

teachers are on a "circuit," traveling to present the teachings in

different places. Nome and Russ just teach at SAT in Santa Cruz.

Each satsang is recorded though, and audiotapes are made. May I

review the list and recommend one or two that might be worthwhile?

 

 

If we get near where your teachers live, I will definitely visit them. And if

they decide to put their teachings on CD I may purchase them.

 

Thanks for all your enlightened attention.

 

Love,

Alton

 

 

We are Not two,

Richard

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Dear Alton,

 

>Choice to me is just predestined mental tendencies and

universal. "For anything to happen, the whole universe must make it

happen". <

 

OK, just keep letting the universe let you inquire.

 

>I do that with all my heart, but that is just what the universe gave

me. I really believe this stuff, but I have to deal with a

duplicitous mind ego. There are various parts to my mind, but they

are not me. <

 

So you need to keep returning your attention to the one. You are not

any various parts. You are one existence. Of this there is no

doubt.

 

> am just watching the passing show and becoming more and more

relaxed about its vagaries. Am I becoming too self satisfied because

I am not reacting like in former times?<

 

I would suggest that you are the best one to say. Is your experience

continuing to deepen? Is there more joy and freedom? One thing I

watch for in myself is any "spiritual arrogance." It is so easy to

take on this ego-driven ignorance.

 

>In today practice I used "To whom?" first and then "To I". It seems

to work better in staying with a mind that wants to wonder<

 

Great! End with Who am I? Keep pointing the attention to the One.

 

>PLEASE DESCRIBE THE WITNESSING CONSCIOUSNESS FROM YOUR EXPERIENCE?<

 

All is present. Open and free and fully conscious. It is the movie

and I am the screen. It is within me and is not who I am.

 

>My goals are to be always in the timeless present and to react from

the inner universal and not the outer personal. <

 

Ramana talks about getting past even this. To be in the present, you

must be a body (in this time and place)? Are you a body? If you are

a body when awake, are you a body in your dream? In deep sleep?

 

You have been blessed in this life. Keep taking this blessing

deeper. Ramana has shown us Self-inquiry as the door.

 

We are Not two,

Richard

[Guest guest]

Dear Richard:

Thanks to you for your sage interactions and to the list for going

along up with this. If you not now a sage, you are soon destined to

be one.

This about completes this round.

May I presume that the rest of the list, except another person, are

all advanced in their practice and seeking, so they dont have to

share things about their practice and attachments; or is this not the

place for this dialogue. The list ownner may want to state his

position.

 

Love,

Alton

 

RamanaMaharshi, "richard_clarke95125" <r_clarke@i...>

wrote:

> Dear Alton,

>

> >Choice to me is just predestined mental tendencies and

> universal. "For anything to happen, the whole universe must make it

> happen". <

>

> OK, just keep letting the universe let you inquire.

>

> >I do that with all my heart, but that is just what the universe

gave

> me. I really believe this stuff, but I have to deal with a

> duplicitous mind ego. There are various parts to my mind, but they

> are not me. <

>

> So you need to keep returning your attention to the one. You are

not

> any various parts. You are one existence. Of this there is no

> doubt.

>

> > am just watching the passing show and becoming more and more

> relaxed about its vagaries. Am I becoming too self satisfied

because

> I am not reacting like in former times?<

>

> I would suggest that you are the best one to say. Is your

experience

> continuing to deepen? Is there more joy and freedom? One thing I

> watch for in myself is any "spiritual arrogance." It is so easy to

> take on this ego-driven ignorance.

>

> >In today practice I used "To whom?" first and then "To I". It

seems

> to work better in staying with a mind that wants to wonder<

>

> Great! End with Who am I? Keep pointing the attention to the One.

>

> >PLEASE DESCRIBE THE WITNESSING CONSCIOUSNESS FROM YOUR EXPERIENCE?<

>

> All is present. Open and free and fully conscious. It is the

movie

> and I am the screen. It is within me and is not who I am.

>

> >My goals are to be always in the timeless present and to react

from

> the inner universal and not the outer personal. <

>

> Ramana talks about getting past even this. To be in the present,

you

> must be a body (in this time and place)? Are you a body? If you

are

> a body when awake, are you a body in your dream? In deep sleep?

>

> You have been blessed in this life. Keep taking this blessing

> deeper. Ramana has shown us Self-inquiry as the door.

>

> We are Not two,

> Richard

[Guest guest]

Dear Alton/Viorica/Richard and all other active

members, I do not know if I am speaking for myself or

if this is true with others too -- the most important

reason I do not contribute (except to read) is this:

the stage that you all have already reached makes me

feel so small and such a non-entity. Even to come up

with questions, one needs to be on the way. I read

your questions with envy, Richard's answers with awe

and Viorica's mails with a feeling that I am not even

fit to call myself a beginner -- all that I can say is

the thirst is there. That's all. The exchanges here

are of immense use to me. My sincerest thanks to all

of you.

 

While at work, I read a few mails from this group, and

try to look inside for a few minutes -- no doubt, it's

such a constant struggle -- few seconds, and then I

find deluged by thoughts. The one change in me over

the past few months has been that I am slowly

realizing how meaningless it is to keep questioning

everything that is happening around me. And I credit

this to this group (sometimes, though, there are

disturbing thoughts -- am I losing my sensitivity?)

Otherwise, my mind has always been a cauldron of

thoughts on everything in manifest creation.

 

There's a Sansrit saying which goes like this -- "in

an assemblage of swans, it is best if the crane keeps

its mouth shut" -- exactly my case!

 

With love,

Raghu Sankaran

 

 

--- lostnfoundation <leenalton wrote:

> Dear Richard:

> Thanks to you for your sage interactions and to the

> list for going

> along up with this. If you not now a sage, you are

> soon destined to

> be one.

> This about completes this round.

> May I presume that the rest of the list, except

> another person, are

> all advanced in their practice and seeking, so they

> dont have to

> share things about their practice and attachments;

> or is this not the

> place for this dialogue. The list ownner may want to

> state his

> position.

>

> Love,

> Alton

>

 

 

 

=====

Raghu Sankaran

(718)-460-5666

Flushing, Queens

New York NY 11355

 

 

 

Games - play chess, backgammon, pool and more

http://games./

[Guest guest]

Dear Raghu,

 

Asking questions seems pretty fundamental to Self-inquiry.

 

May I suggest two things:

 

First get a copy of Ramana Maharshi's "Who Am I?" and read it.

When you read it, you want to go slow, perhaps even reading it aloud.

 

As you read, read with the ancient sspiritual process of "Listen (or

read), reflect, and meditate. The meditation is intended to make

your knwoledge experiential, more than just a conceptual thought. No

hurry. You will want to read this many times during the time of your

practice.

 

And find a way to start your own Self-inquiry. Sit in a comfortable

position with your eyes closed and ask yourself, "Who am I?" As

thoughts or sensations arise, ask "For whom is this?" It will be

obvious that it is for you. Then ask again, "Who am I?" I have

found that before I inquire, I let myself notice that I do exist.

(What is this existance? Where does the sense of reality come from?)

 

You are that which you seek. It is the "I" that lights up your ego-

I. Of this there is no doubt.

 

Start your own daily practice. As you have questions, please ask.

My sense is that this spritual journey we are taking is for all of

us. Your questions are for all of us.

 

We are Not two,

Richard

 

RamanaMaharshi, Raghu Sankaran <raghunathans> wrote:

> Dear Alton/Viorica/Richard and all other active

> members, I do not know if I am speaking for myself or

> if this is true with others too -- the most important

> reason I do not contribute (except to read) is this:

> the stage that you all have already reached makes me

> feel so small and such a non-entity. Even to come up

> with questions, one needs to be on the way. I read

> your questions with envy, Richard's answers with awe

> and Viorica's mails with a feeling that I am not even

> fit to call myself a beginner -- all that I can say is

> the thirst is there. That's all. The exchanges here

> are of immense use to me. My sincerest thanks to all

> of you.

>

> While at work, I read a few mails from this group, and

> try to look inside for a few minutes -- no doubt, it's

> such a constant struggle -- few seconds, and then I

> find deluged by thoughts. The one change in me over

> the past few months has been that I am slowly

> realizing how meaningless it is to keep questioning

> everything that is happening around me. And I credit

> this to this group (sometimes, though, there are

> disturbing thoughts -- am I losing my sensitivity?)

> Otherwise, my mind has always been a cauldron of

> thoughts on everything in manifest creation.

>

> There's a Sansrit saying which goes like this -- "in

> an assemblage of swans, it is best if the crane keeps

> its mouth shut" -- exactly my case!

>

> With love,

> Raghu Sankaran

>

[Guest guest]

Dear Alton,

 

> May I presume that the rest of the list, except another person, are

> all advanced in their practice and seeking, so they dont have to

> share things about their practice and attachments; or is this not the

> place for this dialogue. The list ownner may want to state his

> position.

 

This dialogue seems to fit in well with the aims of this list. Thank you for

participating.

 

As far as the apparent non-participation of the majority, it may be that

they find the messages to be adequate/valuable food for silent

contemplation.

 

On a personal level, my participation is limited, from time to time, through

ill-health. Today, even this message is painful.

 

Ever Yours in Sri Bhagavan,

Miles

List Owner.

[Guest guest]

Dear Miles and List,

 

Just a note to say how very valuable these dialogues have been here.

 

 

A crane whooping,

 

diana

 

 

 

 

RamanaMaharshi, Miles Wright <ramana.bhakta@v...> wrote:

> Dear Alton,

>

> > May I presume that the rest of the list, except another person,

are

> > all advanced in their practice and seeking, so they dont have to

> > share things about their practice and attachments; or is this not

the

> > place for this dialogue. The list ownner may want to state his

> > position.

>

> This dialogue seems to fit in well with the aims of this list.

Thank you for

> participating.

>

> As far as the apparent non-participation of the majority, it may be

that

> they find the messages to be adequate/valuable food for silent

> contemplation.

>

> On a personal level, my participation is limited, from time to

time, through

> ill-health. Today, even this message is painful.

>

> Ever Yours in Sri Bhagavan,

> Miles

> List Owner.

[Guest guest]

Dear Miles,

we are all missing your contributions.

I feel sorry to hear about your ill-health again - but I know you

don't need that anyone feels sorry. That's great! Nevertheless hoping

it will become better soon.

In HIM

Gabriele

 

 

RamanaMaharshi, Miles Wright <ramana.bhakta@v...> wrote:

> Dear Alton,

>

> > May I presume that the rest of the list, except another person,

are

> > all advanced in their practice and seeking, so they dont have to

> > share things about their practice and attachments; or is this not

the

> > place for this dialogue. The list ownner may want to state his

> > position.

>

> This dialogue seems to fit in well with the aims of this list.

Thank you for

> participating.

>

> As far as the apparent non-participation of the majority, it may be

that

> they find the messages to be adequate/valuable food for silent

> contemplation.

>

> On a personal level, my participation is limited, from time to

time, through

> ill-health. Today, even this message is painful.

>

> Ever Yours in Sri Bhagavan,

> Miles

> List Owner.

[Guest guest]

Dear Sri Vicki,

 

Your letter to raghu is beautiful. It is such a

delight. Thank you.

 

om gurave namaha

suri

 

--- viorica weissman <viorica wrote:

 

dear Raghu,

 

you say : 'all that I can say is the thirst is there.

That's all.'.

 

But this is so much! This is a golden key that opens

up everything , this thirst brings love for teachings,

love for Ramana, love for truth,...understanding , the

opening, Ramana guru in your life. You have a

treasure in yourself in this thirst.

 

You can be happy there is there , it is as vital in a

spiritual aspirant as oxygen is for life, everything

comes with the thirst;

 

this thirst opens anything , teachers , scriptures ,

understanding, all these are there for people with

thirst.

 

 

______________________

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