Guest guest Posted May 5, 2002 Report Share Posted May 5, 2002 Dear Richard, The quotes from the Ribhu Gita are supremely welcome. May we all take them to heart. (You may want to correct "husband and wire".) Jai, Stan - <RamanaMaharshi> <RamanaMaharshi> Sunday, May 05, 2002 12:26 AM [RamanaMaharshi] Digest Number 553 > > > Post message: RamanaMaharshi > Subscribe: RamanaMaharshi- > Un: RamanaMaharshi- > List owner: RamanaMaharshi-owner > > Shortcut URL to this page: > /community/RamanaMaharshi > ------ > > There are 15 messages in this issue. > > Topics in this digest: > > 1. Essay on Knowing > "texasbg2000" <Bigbobgraham > 2. Ramana Gita II,2: the 'I-I' > "Gabriele Ebert" <g.ebert > 3. search with inward-diving mind > "Gabriele Ebert" <g.ebert > 4. Richard the Satsangs > "lostnfoundation" <leenalton > 5. Song of Ribhu, Chapter 10, 26 - 29 > "richard_clarke95125" <r_clarke > 6. Re: Song of Ribhu, Chapter 10, 26 - 29 > "Gloria Lee" <glee > 7. SEARCHING FOR AWARENESS > "I'M" <leenalton > 8. Re: Essay on Knowing > "lostnfoundation" <leenalton > 9. Re: Fear of death > "vioricail" <vioricail > 10. Re: Song of Ribhu, Chapter 10, 26 - 29 > "richard_clarke95125" <r_clarke > 11. Re: Richard the Satsangs > "richard_clarke95125" <r_clarke > 12. Song of Ribhu, Chapter 10, 30-36 (end) > "richard_clarke95125" <r_clarke > 13. New file uploaded to RamanaMaharshi > RamanaMaharshi > 14. Re: Essay on Knowing > "texasbg2000" <Bigbobgraham > 15. silence > "gabriele_ebert" <g.ebert > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 1 > Sat, 04 May 2002 14:31:51 -0000 > "texasbg2000" <Bigbobgraham > Essay on Knowing > > Hi Everyone: > > The following is a small essay I offer in the spirit of discussion > from my studies of Raja Yoga and Advaita Vedanta. > > Thinking and knowing are difficult to distinguish in the jumble of > the mind. > > Patanjali, the Father of Raja Yoga, who describes the mind in great > detail, lists five types of fluctuations of consciousness; sleeping, > conceptualization, misconception, valid cognition, and memory. They > may be afflicted or not. Constrained fluctuation of the > consciousness is meditation. > > Any thought must of necessity be one of these types of fluctuation or > vritti. Knowing is none of them. In fact it could be said that each > one of these types of thought is a different type of knowing, making > knowing in this sense the same as consciousness. > > All thinking is dependent on the first thought which is established > in the mind as the thinker. The thinker is the first thought, Aham > Vritti, which is a misconception, or error in cognition. The Aham > Vritti is also the last thought and when it dissolves, thought > dissolves. Since it is a vritti itself, or fluctuation of the > consciousness, it is of the mind. When held before the consciousness > it's nature is discovered, as is its tenacity. > > Discriminating between thought and knowing allows recognition of when > thinking is halted. Thinking stops when the "I am" or aham vritti is > held before the mind. Knowing is not stopped. > > The chain of thoughts continues in a seemingly ceaseless fashion. > When it stops, there is a space where the "I am" appears before > another chain of thought begins. This is the space between thoughts. > Whenever thinking stops, the "I am" appears and when the "I am" > appears, thoughts stop. Knowing does not stop. > > Peace is the cessation of thought. At first it is found in the space > between thoughts, or however long the "I am" is held before the mind > uninterruptedly. > > Love > Bobby G. > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 2 > Sat, 4 May 2002 16:42:11 +0200 > "Gabriele Ebert" <g.ebert > Ramana Gita II,2: the 'I-I' > > In the centre of the Heart-cave, > Brahman shines alone. > It is the form of Self experienced directly as 'I-I'. > Enter the Heart, through self-enquiry > or merging or by breath-control > and become rooted as That. > > Commentary (continuation) > It may be noted that the terms 'Heart', 'Brahman', 'Atman', and 'Self' are used > as interchangeable by Ramana. > However, one finds that he generally uses the expression 'Heart'. ... > > The scriptures declare that 'Brahman' shines in the hearts of all creation. > The scriptures are also replete with descriptions of it, as pure, eternal > and self-luminous. > > Ramana describes how consciousness shines forth by itself, spontaneously. > It takes the form of an unbroken feeling of 'I'. To denote the continous nature > of this throb of consciousness, Ramana repeats the words as 'I-I'. The word > 'alone' has been used after Brahman to indicate the absence of duality. .... > > Though the feeling of fulness as 'I-I' is present without let even when one has > the notion of seperateness, the awareness of this feeling would be absent. > When through conscious effort the 'I'-thought is traced to its source and > merges there one becomes conscious of the continous sparkle of the Heart. > > to be continued > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Ramana Gita, transl. and commentary by A.R. Natarajan > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > > > > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 3 > Sat, 4 May 2002 16:53:48 +0200 > "Gabriele Ebert" <g.ebert > search with inward-diving mind > > Controlling speech and breath, and diving deep > within oneself - like one who, to find a thing that has > fallen into water, dives deep down - one must seek > out the source whence the aspiring ego springs. > > Cease all talk of 'I' and search with inward-diving > mind whence the thought of 'I' springs up. > This is the way of wisdom. > To think, instead, "I am not this, but That I am", > is helpful in the search, > but it is not the search itself. > > When the mind turns inward seeking "Who am I?" > and merges in the Heart, > then the 'I' hangs down his head in shame > and the One 'I' appears as Itself. > Though It appears as "I,I", it is not the ego. > It is Reality, Perfection, the Substance of the Self. > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Ramana Maharshi: Reality in Forty Verses, V. 28-30 > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > > > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 4 > Sat, 04 May 2002 17:26:10 -0000 > "lostnfoundation" <leenalton > Richard the Satsangs > > > Dear Richard: > I am looking for more of the Satsang that you shared with us. > Please ask you teachers if they are willing to grant you permisson to > share more or all of them with this group, provided that Miles does > not object. If not, please tell how we may have access to them. At > least one other list member appreciated it too. > Aloha, > Alton > > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 5 > Sat, 04 May 2002 18:43:16 -0000 > "richard_clarke95125" <r_clarke > Song of Ribhu, Chapter 10, 26 - 29 > > Song of Ribhu, Chapter 10 All is of the Nature of the Self, 26-29 > > 26 > All the beings, indeed, are of the nature of the Self. > All the worlds, indeed, are of the nature of the Self. > All accomplishments, indeed, are of the nature of the Self. > All the Veda-s, indeed, are of the nature of the Self. > All desired fruits of action, indeed, are of the nature of the Self. > All differences, indeed, are of the nature of the Self. > All that is divided is, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > > 27 > The bodies, are, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > All the beings are, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > All experience is, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > All objects of experiences are, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > All delusions are, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > All realization is, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > All yoga is, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > All objects of yoga are, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > > 28 > All longings are, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > All activity is, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > All understanding is, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > All good fortune is, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > All that goes away is, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > All that remains is, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > All that gets transformed is, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > All that is sentient is, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > > 29 > All people are, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > The husband and wire are, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > The guru and disciple are, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > All expression of ideas is, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > All knowledge acquired is, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > All holy waters are, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > All sacred shrines are, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > All the celestials are, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > > ****** > Just 6 more chapters, they will get put up in the next such posting. > > > We are Not two, > Richard > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 6 > Sat, 4 May 2002 16:48:50 -0400 > "Gloria Lee" <glee > Re: Song of Ribhu, Chapter 10, 26 - 29 > > Dear Richard, > > Would you mind to upload al the chapters to the files after you > have posted them all? It would be lovely to have them all in one place. > > Thanks, > Gloria > - > richard_clarke95125 > RamanaMaharshi > Saturday, May 04, 2002 2:43 PM > [RamanaMaharshi] Song of Ribhu, Chapter 10, 26 - 29 > > > Song of Ribhu, Chapter 10 All is of the Nature of the Self, 26-29 > > 26 > All the beings, indeed, are of the nature of the Self. > All the worlds, indeed, are of the nature of the Self. > All accomplishments, indeed, are of the nature of the Self. > All the Veda-s, indeed, are of the nature of the Self. > All desired fruits of action, indeed, are of the nature of the Self. > All differences, indeed, are of the nature of the Self. > All that is divided is, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > > > > > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 7 > Sat, 4 May 2002 06:50:19 -1000 > "I'M" <leenalton > SEARCHING FOR AWARENESS > > > Searching for awareness I asked for suggestions > I was willing to follow those many directions > I studied the scriptures and took many teachings > But all I did get was the inevitable preachings > A clue that was meant to have it expose > That it's right here now in front of my nose > I focused the attention on where they said > It gave me a headache which ended in bed > I'm still searching for the illusive awareness > If I don't succeed I'll just claim unfairness > > > > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 8 > Sat, 04 May 2002 22:09:48 -0000 > "lostnfoundation" <leenalton > Re: Essay on Knowing > > Dear Bobby: > Interesting post. > Wondering how Pantanjali defines misconception and valid cognition. > Thanks in advance. > > Love, > Alton > > > > RamanaMaharshi, "texasbg2000" <Bigbobgraham@a...> wrote: > > Hi Everyone: > > > > The following is a small essay I offer in the spirit of discussion > > from my studies of Raja Yoga and Advaita Vedanta. > > > > Thinking and knowing are difficult to distinguish in the jumble of > > the mind. > > > > Patanjali, the Father of Raja Yoga, who describes the mind in great > > detail, lists five types of fluctuations of consciousness; > sleeping, > > conceptualization, misconception, valid cognition, and memory. They > > may be afflicted or not. Constrained fluctuation of the > > consciousness is meditation. > > > > Any thought must of necessity be one of these types of fluctuation > or > > vritti. Knowing is none of them. In fact it could be said that > each > > one of these types of thought is a different type of knowing, > making > > knowing in this sense the same as consciousness. > > > > All thinking is dependent on the first thought which is established > > in the mind as the thinker. The thinker is the first thought, Aham > > Vritti, which is a misconception, or error in cognition. The Aham > > Vritti is also the last thought and when it dissolves, thought > > dissolves. Since it is a vritti itself, or fluctuation of the > > consciousness, it is of the mind. When held before the > consciousness > > it's nature is discovered, as is its tenacity. > > > > Discriminating between thought and knowing allows recognition of > when > > thinking is halted. Thinking stops when the "I am" or aham vritti > is > > held before the mind. Knowing is not stopped. > > > > The chain of thoughts continues in a seemingly ceaseless fashion. > > When it stops, there is a space where the "I am" appears before > > another chain of thought begins. This is the space between > thoughts. > > Whenever thinking stops, the "I am" appears and when the "I am" > > appears, thoughts stop. Knowing does not stop. > > > > Peace is the cessation of thought. At first it is found in the > space > > between thoughts, or however long the "I am" is held before the > mind > > uninterruptedly. > > > > Love > > Bobby G. > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 9 > Sat, 04 May 2002 22:34:49 -0000 > "vioricail" <vioricail > Re: Fear of death > > > Gabriele, > I came back to this old message as there is > something that I forgot to say . > > Feelings and the fire of love brought Ramana in my life. > > Not that it would be so simple , but that is a good > vehicle ; this is why I burst at times and say 'i love you' > as I am filled with love for him and it gets out for > other people too , the pressure is too high ; > > just wanted to say this before saying good night > everybody, > ~~~ v. > > > > > > I like more the coolness of the mind, the cool brise and not so > much > > the fire and the change of emotions. People are different. > > ... > > In Sri Ramana > > Gabriele > > > > > > RamanaMaharshi, "viorica weissman" <viorica@z...> wrote: > > > what I meant , Gabriele, is that we can't live > > > without communicating and having friends > > > and hold other people's hands. > > > we are alone and not alone, > > > I am with you and with anybody else and so > > > you are. > > > v. > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 10 > Sun, 05 May 2002 01:31:26 -0000 > "richard_clarke95125" <r_clarke > Re: Song of Ribhu, Chapter 10, 26 - 29 > > Dear Gloria, > > I will be happy to do so. I am glad you find it worthwhile. I > continue to find this a most valuable text. > > I remind all that it is available from www.booksbeyondwords.com > > We are Not two, > Richard > > RamanaMaharshi, "Gloria Lee" <glee@c...> wrote: > > Dear Richard, > > > > Would you mind to upload al the chapters to the files after you > > have posted them all? It would be lovely to have them all in one > place. > > > > Thanks, > > Gloria > > - > > richard_clarke95125 > > RamanaMaharshi > > Saturday, May 04, 2002 2:43 PM > > [RamanaMaharshi] Song of Ribhu, Chapter 10, 26 - 29 > > > > > > Song of Ribhu, Chapter 10 All is of the Nature of the Self, 26-29 > > > > 26 > > All the beings, indeed, are of the nature of the Self. > > All the worlds, indeed, are of the nature of the Self. > > All accomplishments, indeed, are of the nature of the Self. > > All the Veda-s, indeed, are of the nature of the Self. > > All desired fruits of action, indeed, are of the nature of the > Self. > > All differences, indeed, are of the nature of the Self. > > All that is divided is, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > > > > > > > > > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 11 > Sun, 05 May 2002 01:35:56 -0000 > "richard_clarke95125" <r_clarke > Re: Richard the Satsangs > > Dear Alton, > > The two parts of the satsang, were I believe the whole one. Glad > that you found the material worthwile. When I am in satsang, I feel > as if we are at the feet of Ramana. What more could a seeker ask? > > I will ask about access. Perhaps SAT will start occasionally putting > new satsang transcripts up on their site. > > If you go to http://www.satramana.org/tapecat.htm and scroll to the > botton of the list, you will see tape recordings of recent satsangs > that are available. > > RamanaMaharshi, "lostnfoundation" <leenalton@h...> wrote: > > > > Dear Richard: > > I am looking for more of the Satsang that you shared with us. > > Please ask you teachers if they are willing to grant you permisson > to > > share more or all of them with this group, provided that Miles does > > not object. If not, please tell how we may have access to them. At > > least one other list member appreciated it too. > > Aloha, > > Alton > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 12 > Sun, 05 May 2002 02:30:19 -0000 > "richard_clarke95125" <r_clarke > Song of Ribhu, Chapter 10, 30-36 (end) > > Song of Ribhu, Chapter 10 All is of the Nature of the Self, 30 - 36 > > 30 > All directions are, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > All countries are, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > "I" and "the other" are, indeed, all of the nature of the Self. > All egoity is, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > Mind and such are, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > All anger is, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > All that arises in the memory is, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > All that happens is, indeed, of the nature of the Self. > > 31 > Charity and other acts that are done are all of the nature of the > Self. > Being courageous is of the nature of the Self. > All that is seen in duality is of the nature of the Self. > All harassing fear is of the nature of the Self. > All that is seen as unity is of the nature of the Self. > All reassuring security is of the nature of the Self. > All thoughts of differentiation are of the nature of the Self. > All differenceless thoughts are of the nature of the Self. > > 32 > All illusions of differentiation are of the nature of the Self. > All Truth of non-difference is of the nature of the Self. > All that is seen clearly is of the nature of the Self. > All that is seen as mysterious is of the nature of the Self. > All that is seen as Knowledge is of the nature of the Self. > All that is seen as pure is of the nature of the Self. > The knower and the knowledge is of the nature of the Self. > The world, the individuals (jiva-s), and the Supreme-all-are of the > nature of the Self. > > 33 > The Self is a mass of perfectly full Existence. > The Self is a mass of sorrowless Bliss. > The Self is a mass of undiminishing Knowledge. > The Self is one changeless, undivided Essence. > The Self is here, the Self is there, and the Self is everywhere. > The Self is one complete fullness. > There is nothing apart from the Self. > All that is seen as duality is the perfectly full Self. > > 34. > Apart from the all-pervasive, perfectly full Self, > There is no world or individual (jiva) or such. > The world, the individual, and the Supreme > Are entirely of the nature of the Supreme Self, > Which is higher than the highest. > There is not a trace of doubt in this firm exposition. It is the > Truth. > Whoever has steadfastly listened to and understood this > Even once will become Brahman. > > 35 > Supreme Siva, the embodiment of Grace, > The consort of Uma, established as the Infinite Power with the maya > (illusion) in his power, > Is the cause of the wondrous effect > That is the universe, inclusive of this world and others. > When inquired into, all this universe, which is the effect, > Is only a form of the cause, which is Supreme Siva. > Thus did the rare sage Ribhu discourse upon the greatness of the > undivided Self > To the great sage Nidagha. > > 36 > It is the perfectly full form of our Lord in the state of joyous > dance that proclaims: > The beings who are in a divided state, the Lord who confers desired > good fortune, > [And] the wondrous far-flung universe in all its variety, > Are all of the nature of the perfectly full Self and nothing else at > all. > > ************************************************* > >From The Song of Ribhu, published by The Society of Abidance in > Truth, Santa Cruz, CA. Available from www.booksbeyondwords.com > This material's copyright is owned by the Society of Abidance in > Truth. Members of the newsgroup are given permission to use this > material, but that this material should not be further copied by or > for others. > ************************************************* > > Not two, > Richard > > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 13 > 5 May 2002 03:00:31 -0000 > RamanaMaharshi > New file uploaded to RamanaMaharshi > > > Hello, > > This email message is a notification to let you know that > a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RamanaMaharshi > group. > > File : /Song of Ribhu Chapter 10.txt > Uploaded by : richard_clarke95125 <r_clarke > Description : Song of Ribhu, Chapter 10 > > You can access this file at the URL > > RamanaMaharshiSong%20of%20Ribhu%20Chapt er%2010.txt > > To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit > > http://help./help/us/groups/files > > Regards, > > richard_clarke95125 <r_clarke > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 14 > Sun, 05 May 2002 03:40:51 -0000 > "texasbg2000" <Bigbobgraham > Re: Essay on Knowing > > Hi Alton: > > I find everything about Patanjali interesting. The idea one can > describe the mind is fascinating. > > About your question: > Sutra I:8- Misconception is erroneous knowledge not based on the > [actual] paaearance of that [which is the underlying object]. > -Feuerstein > > Sutra 1:8- Indiscrimination is false knowledge not based on the real > nature [of an object]. > -Vivekananda > > Sutra I:7- Valid cognition [is based on ] perception, inference and > testimony. > -Feurerstein > > Sutra I:7- Direct perception, inference, and competent evidence > constitute right knowledge, or proof. > -Vivekananda > > There are many translations and the differences are sometimes > monumental. Feuerstein is my favorite for now. > > I am aware many people believe that being valid or wrong is a > personal event and it is impossibe to define them. Is this what you > were referring to in your question? > > Yours truly > Bobby G. > > > RamanaMaharshi, "lostnfoundation" <leenalton@h...> wrote: > > Dear Bobby: > > Interesting post. > > Wondering how Pantanjali defines misconception and valid cognition. > > Thanks in advance. > > > > Love, > > Alton > > > > > > > > RamanaMaharshi, "texasbg2000" <Bigbobgraham@a...> wrote: > > > Hi Everyone: > > > > > > The following is a small essay I offer in the spirit of > discussion > > > from my studies of Raja Yoga and Advaita Vedanta. > > > > > > Thinking and knowing are difficult to distinguish in the jumble > of > > > the mind. > > > > > > Patanjali, the Father of Raja Yoga, who describes the mind in > great > > > detail, lists five types of fluctuations of consciousness; > > sleeping, > > > conceptualization, misconception, valid cognition, and memory. > They > > > may be afflicted or not. Constrained fluctuation of the > > > consciousness is meditation. > > > > > > Any thought must of necessity be one of these types of > fluctuation > > or > > > vritti. Knowing is none of them. In fact it could be said that > > each > > > one of these types of thought is a different type of knowing, > > making > > > knowing in this sense the same as consciousness. > > > > > > All thinking is dependent on the first thought which is > established > > > in the mind as the thinker. The thinker is the first thought, > Aham > > > Vritti, which is a misconception, or error in cognition. The Aham > > > Vritti is also the last thought and when it dissolves, thought > > > dissolves. Since it is a vritti itself, or fluctuation of the > > > consciousness, it is of the mind. When held before the > > consciousness > > > it's nature is discovered, as is its tenacity. > > > > > > Discriminating between thought and knowing allows recognition of > > when > > > thinking is halted. Thinking stops when the "I am" or aham vritti > > is > > > held before the mind. Knowing is not stopped. > > > > > > The chain of thoughts continues in a seemingly ceaseless > fashion. > > > When it stops, there is a space where the "I am" appears before > > > another chain of thought begins. This is the space between > > thoughts. > > > Whenever thinking stops, the "I am" appears and when the "I am" > > > appears, thoughts stop. Knowing does not stop. > > > > > > Peace is the cessation of thought. At first it is found in the > > space > > > between thoughts, or however long the "I am" is held before the > > mind > > > uninterruptedly. > > > > > > Love > > > Bobby G. > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 15 > Sun, 05 May 2002 07:14:23 -0000 > "gabriele_ebert" <g.ebert > silence > > Dear Vicki, > very beautiful. This one "cool" message some days ago in which I said > I did not like the fire so much is perhaps not the whole true about > this entity Gabriele (LOL) and I would not express it anymore like > this. So please forget and forgive if there was something in it that > hurts you. > What me brought to Ramana and helds me there is his tremendous > silence which is everything in fullness. In this silence not only his > teaching is "felt" in the heart, also his love - and both is one. > But "feeling" is perhaps the wrong word as it is beyond mind and > emotions. > Please come back with your postings soon. > In HIM > Gabriele > > RamanaMaharshi, "vioricail" <vioricail> wrote: > > > > Gabriele, > > I came back to this old message as there is > > something that I forgot to say . > > > > Feelings and the fire of love brought Ramana in my life. > > > > Not that it would be so simple , but that is a good > > vehicle ; this is why I burst at times and say 'i love you' > > as I am filled with love for him and it gets out for > > other people too , the pressure is too high ; > > > > just wanted to say this before saying good night > > everybody, > > ~~~ v. > > > > > > > > > > > I like more the coolness of the mind, the cool brise and not so > > much > > > the fire and the change of emotions. People are different. > > > > ... > > > In Sri Ramana > > > Gabriele > > > > > > > > > RamanaMaharshi, "viorica weissman" <viorica@z...> > wrote: > > > > what I meant , Gabriele, is that we can't live > > > > without communicating and having friends > > > > and hold other people's hands. > > > > we are alone and not alone, > > > > I am with you and with anybody else and so > > > > you are. > > > > v. > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > > > Your use of is subject to > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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