Rob and everyone on the 'I' thought

[Guest guest]

Dear Alton,

don't know if this is of any help. All what can be said about has

already been said - so far I see. Ramana has said it all.

The 'I' has not to be made another object - but awareness stays in

this primal 'I'-thought or -feeling, which is the root of all other

thoughts and so the I-thought will be drawn back to the Heart and be

consumed there. This is only possible with a silent mind. Attention

is then on itself and not on a centre in the body or elsewhere. The

body can do and experience meanwhile what it wants - that means

nothing.

If you feel drawn to focus on a centre in the body to make the mind

onepointed and silent - that's fine. Whatever helps to silence the

mind is fine. The I-thought arises from the Heart, from there all

other thoughts come up and go up to the brain - so perhaps you can

try to go the way back: from focus on the brain to the Heart.

 

In HIM

Gabriele

 

 

RamanaMaharshi, "Atlon Slater" <leenalton@h...> wrote:

> Dear Rob and everybody who reads or posts about this.

>

> OK, you say, "hold fast to this 'I'".)

>

> Now what exactly do I focus on when I hold the "I"?

>

> I make the 'I' another object, replacing all thoughts, sensations

of

> the body with this 'I' object. Moving the attention to the silence

> between the thoughts when I become aware of other unsolicited

objects

> appearing in consciousness?

>

> But, while doing the above one has to put the attention somewhere

in

> the body or in space? Since my thoughts appear to be arising in my

> brain I have found that I have much less thoughts focusing on that

> area. This morning I tried the right side of the heart and found

that

> I had 10 times the thoughts I usually have when I focus on the

> forehead or inside my head. My sense of presence or 'I' thought can

> be anywhere I chose to be aware of it? Right?

> If the attention is focused on the 'I' thought is that just another

> way of saying that the attention is on the attention or the space

> between the thoughts in the waking state?

>

> When the attention eats up the attention is that not samadhi or a

> possible entry into Self Realization?

>

> These questions are from a novice, but how can I learn unless I ask

> them.

>

> Also, Richard the questions for Self Inquiry that you shared are

> direct and informative, but are we not taking away the silence of

the

> mind and poluting the mind with so many questions. Is not Vichara

> done with a silent mind more efficacious? Or is that silent Vichara

> for advanced seekers.

>

> Thanks everyone in advance for replies.

>

> Tired of Names.. Aka Alton Slater

>

>

RamanaMaharshi, "Rob Sacks" <editor@r...> wrote:

> > Dear Everybody,

> >

> > Here's a passage from Talks that addresses this point

> > precisely.

> >

> > (Alton: regarding focus, he says "hold fast to this 'I'".)

> >

> > Best regards,

> >

> > Rob

> > ....................

> >

> > From Talks With Sri Ramana Maharshi, article 131:

> >

> > D.: There are said to be six organs of different colours in

> > the chest, of which the heart is said to be two finger-breadths

> > to the right of the middle line. But the Heart is also formless.

> > Should we then imagine it to have a shape and meditate on it?

> >

> > M.: No. Only the quest "Who am I?" is necessary. What

> > remains all through deep sleep and waking is the same.

> > But in waking there is unhappiness and the effort to remove

> > it. Asked who wakes up from sleep you say 'I'. Now you

> > are told to hold fast to this 'I'. If it is done the eternal being

> > will reveal Itself. Investigation of 'I' is the point and not

> > meditation on the heart-centre. There is nothing like

> > within or without. Both mean either the same thing or

> > nothing.

> >

> > Of course there is also the practice of meditation on the

> > heart-centre. It is only a practice and not investigation.

> > Only the one who meditates on the heart can remain aware

> > when the mind ceases to be active and remains still; whereas

> > those who meditate on other centres cannot be so aware but

> > infer that the mind was still only after it becomes again

> > active.

> > ..........................

[Guest guest]

Dear Alton,

 

> OK, you say, "hold fast to this 'I'".

 

Well, actually, Sri Ramana said it. I was just

quoting him.

 

> Now what exactly do I focus on when I hold the "I"?

 

That's the million dollar question, isn't it? The Talks

book is full of people who asked the same question.

Bhagavan never seemed to give a straight answer. Maybe

he answered the lucky ones by staring into their eyes

and stopping their minds.

 

Maybe there's a hint in the following paragraphs, which

I just ran across in David Godman's new book, volume

3 of Power of the Presence:

 

"....Many western visitors came for Sri Bhagavan's

darshan. One of them, Mr. Maurice Frydman, a Polish

Jew of subtle intellect, plied Sri Bhagavan with ingenious

pleas for practical guidance on Self-Realization. Sri

Bhagavan followed his arguments with keen interest

but kept silent all the time.

 

"When pressed to say something, Sri Bhagavan only

quoted from the Bible, 'Be still and know that I am

God,' and added a rider that the Lord said 'know' and

not 'think that I am God.'" (page 114)

 

"Know" not "think"? Maybe it's a hint?

 

But seriously, you'll find a lot of similar questions

and answers in the following places:

 

-- Chapters 5 and 6 of "Be As You Are: The Teachings

of Sri Ramana Maharshi" by David Godman.

 

-- Chapter 8 of "No Mind, I Am The Self" by David

Godman.

 

> These questions are from a novice, but how can I

> learn unless I ask them.

 

I think you'll learn from your own experience as

your mind gets quieter. And you'll learn from the sheer

effort of trying to find the I-thought, even if the instruction

isn't completely clear.

 

Cheers,

 

Rob

 

-

"Atlon Slater" <leenalton

<RamanaMaharshi>

Thursday, September 12, 2002 4:44 PM

[RamanaMaharshi] Rob and everyone on the 'I' thought