Upadesa Saram Study Group(V:14)

March 23, 2003

Om Namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya

By Pranayama there is control of breath

The troublesome 'I thought' is quickly restrained ,

Mind turns inward and there follows its death

By searching for its Source as it is ordained .

-o0o-

Comment :There seems to be some ambivalence about what is to be 'contemplated'by

the different

commentators on this verse .The Muni refers to the Soul {Jiva] some to the Self

and another to the

Source of Thought .Perhaps all three meanings are implied by Ramana in this

verse .? AJ

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March 24, 2003

om namo bhagavate sri ramanaya

Dear Alan,

> Comment :There seems to be some ambivalence about what is to be

> 'contemplated'by the different

> commentators on this verse .The Muni refers to the Soul {Jiva] some to the

> Self and another to the

> Source of Thought .Perhaps all three meanings are implied by Ramana in this

> verse .? AJ

prANabandhanAllInamAnasam /

ekacintanAnnASametyadah // 14 //

Through control of breath, mind cowers.

Through contemplation of one thought, it (mind) is destroyed .

A similar point is raised in 'Day by Day':

Mr. P. C. Desai asks, 'In Verse 14 they have translated the second line of

the Sanskrit verse as 'If the mind is continuously fixed on meditation of

the Self etc.' Is that all right, seeing that neither 'continuously' nor

'Self' is found in the original?'

Bhagavan comments:

'Eka chintana involves continuous thought. If no other thought is to come,

the one thought has to be continuous. What is meant by the verse is as

follows. The previous verses have said that for controlling the mind

breath-control or prAnAyama may be helpful. This verse says that the mind so

brought under control or to the state of laya should not be allowed to be in

mere laya or a state like sleep, but that it should be directed towards eka

chintana or one thought , whether that one thought is of the Self, the Ishta

Devata or a mantram. What the one thought may be will depend on each man¹s

pakva or fitness. The verse leaves it as one thought.' (Day by Day with

Bhagavan; 21-1-46)

March 24, 2003

---Dear Miles ,

thanks for this helpful elucidation .Regards ,Alan

om namo bhagavate sri ramanaya

>

> Dear Alan,

>

> > Comment :There seems to be some ambivalence about what is to be

> > 'contemplated'by the different

> > commentators on this verse .The Muni refers to the Soul {Jiva] some to the

> > Self and another to the

> > Source of Thought .Perhaps all three meanings are implied by Ramana in this

> > verse .? AJ

>

> prANabandhanAllInamAnasam /

> ekacintanAnnASametyadah // 14 //

>

> Through control of breath, mind cowers.

> Through contemplation of one thought, it (mind) is destroyed .

>

> A similar point is raised in 'Day by Day':

>

> Mr. P. C. Desai asks, 'In Verse 14 they have translated the second line of

> the Sanskrit verse as 'If the mind is continuously fixed on meditation of

> the Self etc.' Is that all right, seeing that neither 'continuously' nor

> 'Self' is found in the original?'

>

> Bhagavan comments:

> 'Eka chintana involves continuous thought. If no other thought is to come,

> the one thought has to be continuous. What is meant by the verse is as

> follows. The previous verses have said that for controlling the mind

> breath-control or prAnAyama may be helpful. This verse says that the mind so

> brought under control or to the state of laya should not be allowed to be in

> mere laya or a state like sleep, but that it should be directed towards eka

> chintana or one thought , whether that one thought is of the Self, the Ishta

> Devata or a mantram. What the one thought may be will depend on each man1s

> pakva or fitness. The verse leaves it as one thought.' (Day by Day with

> Bhagavan; 21-1-46)

>

> Post message: RamanaMaharshi

> Subscribe: RamanaMaharshi-

> Un: RamanaMaharshi

> List owner: RamanaMaharshi-owner

>

> Shortcut URL to this page:

> http://www./community/RamanaMaharshi

>

> Your use of is subject to

>

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March 24, 2003

Dear Alan,

You wrote:

> Comment :There seems to be some ambivalence about

> what is to be 'contemplated'by the different

> commentators on this verse .The Muni refers to the

> Soul {Jiva] some to the Self and another to the

> Source of Thought .Perhaps all three meanings are

> implied by Ramana in this verse .? AJ

You are correct. There is ambivalence in regard to

the proposed object of contemplation. This problem is

not unique to the Ramana Maharshi tradition. Just

consider all of the fractures in Hinduism itself. And

when we consider the sects, denominations and other

divisions of every major religion, including Buddhism;

it seems quite obvious that for the most part, no one

really knows.

Priests, clergy, gurus and chelas initiate and run the

machinery of religion. They are mostly "clueless".

But blind tradition goes on and on.

The fact that someone who lived so recently and

remains mostly "un-understood" even by direct

disciples, indicates the exteme difficulty of the

situation.

regards

michael

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March 24, 2003

---Dear Michael, this is a most interesting reflection .It shows that we must

exercise our

discrimination and verify what we read,other than the words of the Master,or a

Jnani we can trust

, as far as possibly by our own experience .The Sufi's have a saying 'that

scholars

[pundits]often miss the point'.Love , in Him , Alan

> You wrote:

> > Comment :There seems to be some ambivalence about

> > what is to be 'contemplated'by the different

> > commentators on this verse .The Muni refers to the

> > Soul {Jiva] some to the Self and another to the

> > Source of Thought .Perhaps all three meanings are

> > implied by Ramana in this verse .? AJ

>

> You are correct. There is ambivalence in regard to

> the proposed object of contemplation. This problem is

> not unique to the Ramana Maharshi tradition. Just

> consider all of the fractures in Hinduism itself. And

> when we consider the sects, denominations and other

> divisions of every major religion, including Buddhism;

> it seems quite obvious that for the most part, no one

> really knows.

>

> Priests, clergy, gurus and chelas initiate and run the

> machinery of religion. They are mostly "clueless".

> But blind tradition goes on and on.

>

> The fact that someone who lived so recently and

> remains mostly "un-understood" even by direct

> disciples, indicates the exteme difficulty of the

> situation.

>

> regards

>

> michael

>

> Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop!

> http://platinum.

>

> Post message: RamanaMaharshi

> Subscribe: RamanaMaharshi-

> Un: RamanaMaharshi

> List owner: RamanaMaharshi-owner

>

> Shortcut URL to this page:

> http://www./community/RamanaMaharshi

>

> Your use of is subject to

>

Everything you'll ever need on one web page

from News and Sport to Email and Music Charts

http://uk.my.

March 24, 2003

Dear Miles,

Thank you for clarifying this issue so precisely. What

an extraordinary message! Exactly the information

needed, no more, no less. It's the real deal. What a

gift we have here in this mail group, in these friends, in

this Satsang.

I wish we had a critical edition of Bhagavan's works

that contained, for each verse or paragraph, a note like

this message you gave us.

Rob (sorry for the manic effusiveness but I suspect

you know what this is like

-

"Miles Wright" <ramana.bhakta

Monday, March 24, 2003 3:41 AM

Re: [RamanaMaharshi] Upadesa Saram Study Group(V:14)