Guest guest Posted December 7, 2004 Report Share Posted December 7, 2004 Dear srivaishNava perunthagaiyeer, On the mail of Smt.Jayasree saranathan dated 29.11.04, I add my points as given below. Dhasan Vasudevan m.g. jasn sn [jayasartn] Monday, November 29, 2004 10:51 PM RE: The Bow -Varuna's connection JASN: The bow's story is becoming interesting. Sita tells Anasuya that the bow broken by Rama to win her hand was given to her father by Varuna devatha in a maha-yajna. Rama is telling a similar version too in Ayodhya khandam. In the chapter dealing with Rama's dialogue with Lakshmana in asking him not to accompany him to the forest, Rama finally relents to lakshmana's prayer and agrees to take him along. He then tells him that king Janaka had given him 2 bows (roudhra-dharsana and divye) and other weapons that he got from Varuna devatha in a maha-yajna. Since he (Rama) had left them in the custody of sage Vasishta, he commands Lakshmana to go and fetch them so that they can carry them when they go to the forest. (2-31-27, 28 & 29) MGV: Before quoting the slokams referred by JASN, here is another interesting point: The rishis and munis, [available in the conglomeration under the leadership of visvaamithra in the forest for whose protection from thaataka sage visvaamithra sought raama from dhasaratha], say to raama that the siva's bow was given by gods [after he accomplished the mission of killing thataka]. thadhDhi poorvam narasrEshta dhaththam sadhasi dhaivathai: | apramEya balam ghOram makhE parama bhaasvaram || 1-31-8 meaning: Oh, best one among men, in early times, indeed 'gods' gave that awesome bow, which has an unimaginable power and which is superbly incandescent in wars to an erstwhile king of Mithila in a congregation of a Vedic-ritual. Point: These gods include the varuNan as already said. Why now this point is that even before raama hears the story from janaka he is aware of the siva's bow through these rishis. thadhdhi yajna phalam thEna maithilEna uththamam dhanu: | yaachitham nara saardhoola sunaabham sarva dhaivathai: || 1-31-12 meaning: Once dhEvaraatha, the grandparent of the present king Janaka of Mithila, conducted a Vedic-ritual and he indeed prayed only for this supreme bow with a best grip-handle, as the fruit of that ritual from all of the gods, and oh, tigerly man, Raama, he got the same from them. Point: it is not only janaka did a yagna to please the gods, but his ancestor dhEvaraatha also. So what raama hears from janaka in the assembly of janaka is a repeat story. [Please pardon me for not looking into these 2 slokams earlier]. Now the slOkams referred by JASN are quoted. [my intention in quoting these here is to bring to notice of bhakthaas how a simple language [sanskrit] is used and also to experience these interesting slokams in original form instead of a translation] yE cha raajnO dhadhou dhivyE mahaathmaa varuNa: svayam | janakasya mahaa yajnE dhanushee roudhra dharsanE || 2-31-27 abhEdhya kavachE dhivyE thooNee cha akshaya saayakou | aadhithya vimalou cha ubhou khaDgou hEma parishkruthou || 2-31-28 sathkruthya nihitham sarvam Ethath aachaarya sadhmani | sa thvam aayudham aadhaaya kshipram aavraja lakshmaNa || 2-31-29 meaning: "Oh, Lakshmana! At a grand sacrifice performed by Janaka, the great-souled Varuna (god of water) personally gave heavenly bows which are dreadful to look at, divine impenetrable pieces of armour, quivers containing an inexhaustible stock of arms, two swords decked with gold and with spotless luster like that of a sun - all these were kept at the residence of our receptor Vasishta, after paying due reverence. Take all those arms and return soon." JASN: The questions that we get are, 1) Do the adjectives 'roudhrou- dharshana' and 'divye' denote the outward meaning like dreadful and divine or did they mean that the bows belonged to Rudra? If so why Rama chose to mention only about Varuna and not Rudra, the fact about whose possession is far more important? (The verses are available in www.valmikiramayana.net) MGV: if anvayam is done - viz. bringing to prose order is done - this will read - janakasya mahaa yajnE yE dhivyE roudhra dharsanE dhanushee cha mahaathmaa varuNa: svayam raajnO dhadhou. That gives the meaning - in the mahaa yagnam done by king janaka, he received from varuNan, these two bows. Many an armaments [listed now by raama] like these two swords, the quivers, safety armour - kavacham etc are understood. How it is - is from that word 'cha' - meaning 'in addition' or plus. As per slOkams given above dhEvaraatha got siva dhanu: from a yagnam, janaka got these two bows along with other articles in another yagnam, respectively during their periods]. JASN: 2) What are these bows called? Which then is Kothandam, which we usually associate with Rama? MGV: 'Naming the bows' - is a very difficult question to answer. In slOkam 1-22-7, it is said raama and lakshmaNa started as dhanushpaaNi: along with sage visvaamithra when they left ayOdhyaa. Also in 1-26-6, it is said raama held the bow and made the noise - the dankaaram - the bow string pulled and a noise created. [thus informing thaatakaa about the arrival of her killer before the thaatakaa vadham]. No name for the bow is given in these two places. As could be 'inferred' from the parasuraama episode, which takes place just after the marriage, the bow received from parasuraama, [that vishNu dhanu:] was NOT returned to parasuraama. Instead dhasaratha raama gave the bow to varunNan as could be seen from gathE raamE prasaantha aathmaa raamO dhaasarathi: dhanu: | varuNaaya aprameyaaya dhadhou hasthE mahaayasaa: || 1-77-1 meaning: On the departure of parasu raama, that most glorious raama of dhasaratha, who is now peaceful [or quietened] at heart, gave away that longbow of vishNu into the hands of varuNan, the unequalled God of Rain. So we can infer (is it correct?) the vishNu dhanu: what dhasaratha raama received previously from parasu raamaa is the "kOthaNdam", which, when he started to forest, got back from the house of sage vasishta. May be the soul of 'saarngam' - the bow of sriman naarayaNan enters this vishNu dhanu and performs all acts with the name kOdhandam. [this soul of saarngam entering the bow in front of parasuraama, we saw in the bow story earlier]. JASN: 3) Are these bows in addition to the one Rama broke in the swayamvaram? Is there any reference to Rama using shiva-dhanush that he broke, after mending it? MGV: This question by JASN is fairly easy. I feel I already answered above. Further, generally, a bow, once broken, is not repaired and used, [like other weapons what we see these days]. Also a note in www.valmikiramayan.net <http://www.valmikiramayan.net> after sargam 76 of baala kaaNdam throws this very interesting point: quote: Well known is Krishna's showing his Cosmic Form visva roopa to Arjuna, while teaching Bhagavad Gita in Maha Bharatam. But that Bharatam records Rama's display of His Cosmic form to Parasu Rama, only at this juncture. In Ch. 89 of anusaasanika parvam of Maha Bharatam it is said in detail as: pasya maam svEna roopENa chakshu: thE vitaraami aham | tato raama sareerE vai raama pasyati bhaargava: | aadityaan pavamaanaan rudraan saadhyaan cha sa marudh gaNaana | pitarO hutaasana: chaiva nakshatraaNi grahaa: tathaa| and a long account follows on this. But this has not been amplified or explained in other texts, due to unknown reasons. However, it is not part of Valmiki Ramayana. -unquote. Point: hitherto I was under the impression raama never showed a visvaroopam for aathmaanam maanusham manyE is his principle and code of conduct. This is something new. Other knowledgeable bhakthaas of the lists can throw more light on this. .. JASN: Some thoughts: In the translation found in www.valmikiramayan.net <http://www.valmikiramayana.net>, there is no mention of number of bows. But in the Tamil transliteration by A.V. Narasimhachar, it is mentioned as 2. I think the original text in Sanskrit is in dwi-vachanam. I request devotees to confirm. In the Tamil version that I have, footnotes by the translator and vyakhyanam by Sri Govindarajar are given at some places. This particular verse is also explained as a footnote but I am not able to provide the information on who has given this explanation (owing to the condition of the book I have, where the few pages on the details of the sources for vyakhyanams are missing) Now the notes: 1. It is said that the weapons including the bows, given to Rama by Janaka seem to be in pairs, perhaps to denote that both Rama - Lakshmana would be in need of them when they go to the forest. MGV: a premonition for janaka? JASN: Secondly, there is no mention in Bala khandam of this information or even Varuna as having given these bows to Janaka. This is perhaps to do with style of valmiki's narration. Similar kind of narration (of not telling the incident when it had happened, but telling about it at a later stage to give some impact) is found in two other places. One is in not having told about the 'maNi-bhandhanam' (the choodamani being given at the time of marriage) in bala khandam but telling about it in Sundhara khandam and the other is in not having told about Kaakaasura vrudhantham in Ayodhya khandam but telling about it in Sundara khandam. Regards, Jayasree saranathan MGV: It is seen that varuNan was the repository for siva as well as vishNu once their fight was over. Varunan later acted in a similar way to raamaa, the vishNu as could be seen from slOkam above. points of JASN on vaalmeeki are fully in agreement. Now I invite JASN and bhagavathaas to offer more points on this raama's visva roopam to parasuraamaa. Dhaasan Vasudevan m.g. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 9, 2004 Report Share Posted December 9, 2004 SRIMATHE RAMANUJAYA NAMAHA Let me bring to the notice of devotees some more information on bows. 1)Varuna’s connection. It appears that Varuna devatha is the custodian of divine and fierce bows. The Shiva dhanush was in the custody of Varuna before Janaka got it. The Vishnu dhanush that Rama got from Parasurama was deposited with Varuna immediately afterwards. It is interesting to note that there exists similar narration with reference to Gaandeeva, the bow of Arjuna. In Mahabharatha, Virada parva, sloka 43, Arjuna as Bruhannalai describes the glory of Gandeeva to Utthara kumara. After describing the bow, he says that it was in the custody of Brhma deva for 1000 years, then with Prajapathi for 503 years, then with Indra for 85 years, with chandra for 500 years and with Varuna for 100 years. From Aadhi parvam, 225, we come to know that this bow was given to Arjuna for having destroyed Gandeeva vanam by Agni deva THROUGH VARUNA. It appears that Varuna comes into picture as custodian or giver of bows for the following reasons. # All divyaasthras are with Vishnu who is none other than Sriman Narayana (for arguments to substantiate this latter part of the sentence, refer Vedartha sangraha). The pramana is the 1000th name of Vishnu in Vishnu sahasranama, which is “sarva praharanaayudha:” Why this name has been given as the final or ultimate name is itself a matter for interesting debate. In this context let me confine myself to saying that Vishnu is the ultimate owner of all weapons. But that He is also present as Varuna among all jala-devathas, is what Gitacharyan Himself has said (BG 10-29). So it may be interpreted that all weapons, particularly the divine weapons go back to Vishnu in Varuna’s form. # Why Varuna? Why not other forms of Vishnu about which we have a good idea from BG? It may be because Varuna as jala-devatha acts as a coolant to preserve the haughty weapons. Or else the weapons might become fiercer still. (fanciful notion??!!) # Vishnu’s connection with the bows can be traced to what Dhanur veda says. Saarangham, Vishnu’s bow is described as the best among all the bows by Dhanur vedam. It is said to be 7 times greater than what Vishwa karma made. (The two bows mentioned in previous posts of MGV are made by Vishwa karma).Sage Vyasa describes Saarangam in his Siva dhanur veda. Though all bows are said to have originated from Mahadeva, he says that the archer, before aiming at a target must keep Lord Vishnu in mind and then intone the name of Arjuna to get success. He further says that Janardhana stays in the heart of the archer. The practice to invoke the blessings of Vishnu before shooting the arrow might perhaps be due to the prospect of Vishnu staying in the tip of the arrow – as what happened when Shiva sought to destroy Thripura asuras. Further corroboration:- Vishnu is the Vajayudha among all weapons (BG) Vajra is also the hard substance made of diamond and other hard substances that is smeared at the tip of the arrow, so says Vyasa. So it is assumed that Vishnu remained as the vajra at the tip of Shiva dhanush. 2) The next point I wish to take up is explained below the following dialogue that took place between me and MGV in previous posts. JASN: 2) What are these bows called? Which then is Kothandam, which we usually associate with Rama? MGV: 'Naming the bows' - is a very difficult question to answer. In slOkam 1-22-7, it is said raama and lakshmaNa started as dhanushpaaNi: along with sage visvaamithra when they left ayOdhyaa. Also in 1-26-6, it is said raama held the bow and made the noise - the dankaaram - the bow string pulled and a noise created. [thus informing thaatakaa about the arrival of her killer before the thaatakaa vadham]. No name for the bow is given in these two places. As could be 'inferred' from the parasuraama episode, which takes place just after the marriage, the bow received from parasuraama, [that vishNu dhanu:] was NOT returned to parasuraama. Instead dhasaratha raama gave the bow to varunNan as could be seen from gathE raamE prasaantha aathmaa raamO dhaasarathi: dhanu: | varuNaaya aprameyaaya dhadhou hasthE mahaayasaa: || 1-77-1 meaning: On the departure of parasu raama, that most glorious raama of dhasaratha, who is now peaceful [or quietened] at heart, gave away that longbow of vishNu into the hands of varuNan, the unequalled God of Rain. So we can infer (is it correct?) the vishNu dhanu: what dhasaratha raama received previously from parasu raamaa is the "kOthaNdam", which, when he started to forest, got back from the house of sage vasishta. May be the soul of 'saarngam' - the bow of sriman naarayaNan enters this vishNu dhanu and performs all acts with the name kOdhandam. [this soul of saarngam entering the bow in front of parasuraama, we saw in the bow story earlier]. JASN replies:- It seems that the two names that appear in Vishnu sahasranama, namely, Dhanvee and Dhanur dhara: are general terms outwardly. I am not going into the vyakhyaanams for these. Instead let me confine myself to Kodandam and certain other points. >From Sahasranama, our contention of Vishnu’s connection to bows further gets strengthened. The foremost among the dhanur dharis is Vishnu only. Next, about Kodandam. Dhanur veda has an explanation for kodandam. The bows are prepared having 3, 5 or 7 joints. But a kodandam will have 9 joints. (The significance of number nine has already been discussed in various lists. Perhaps to signify that Rama possessed this bow with 9 joints.) While Saarangam is described as ‘divine one’, kodandam is described as ‘auspicious’ one. By the name of it, it means a ‘curved stick’. The question is when and how Rama came to possess this. It can not be the Vishnu dhanush that Rama got from Parasurama. For, valmiki says that he had sent it to the custody of Varuna. I doubt whether there exists any verse in the epic to say or indicate that Rama got it back. Rama mentions about the two bows and other weapons that were received from Varuna by Janaka which he takes with him during vana vasam. This gives an impression that during the entire stay in the forest he had used only this bow(the other presumably left to with Lakshmana) Earlier for the first time the mention about the bow comes when he accompanies sage Vishwamithra to forest. He acquired sasthras of varied types from the sage. These are different from asthras as these have to be used by manthras. (Note BG sloka on the Lord being Rama among those who are good at sasthra vidhya). Rama had taken many asthras to the forest and by knowledge of sasthra vidhya, must have used the various weapons given by the sage which were at astral level. But where does the mention of kodandam come is a mute question for which I am yet to get an answer. In the vyakhyanam for Thirumalai pasuram 11, posted by Smt Sumithra Varadarajan, I found an important information that except for the time he prayed to samudra raja, Rama did not for once leave or discard his kodandam. (may I request Smt sumithra to shed more light on this?) If so, we can safely assume that kodandam is one among the two bows that Rama received from Janaka who inturn received it from Varuna. It is therefore further assumed that since Rama used it for number of times for vanquishing more asuras, kodandam came to cling to his name. Otherwise, he could have been just called as dhanur-rama or so. (Arjuna is not known as Gandeeva-arjuna) But similar references (as dhanvee or dhanur dhari) to him are aplenty in Valmiki Ramayana. Requesting further additions and clarifications, Jayasree saranathan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 9, 2004 Report Share Posted December 9, 2004 SRIMATHE RAMANUJAYA NAMAHA Let me bring to the notice of devotees some more information on bows. 1)Varuna’s connection. It appears that Varuna devatha is the custodian of divine and fierce bows. The Shiva dhanush was in the custody of Varuna before Janaka got it. The Vishnu dhanush that Rama got from Parasurama was deposited with Varuna immediately afterwards. It is interesting to note that there exists similar narration with reference to Gaandeeva, the bow of Arjuna. In Mahabharatha, Virada parva, sloka 43, Arjuna as Bruhannalai describes the glory of Gandeeva to Utthara kumara. After describing the bow, he says that it was in the custody of Brhma deva for 1000 years, then with Prajapathi for 503 years, then with Indra for 85 years, with chandra for 500 years and with Varuna for 100 years. From Aadhi parvam, 225, we come to know that this bow was given to Arjuna for having destroyed Gandeeva vanam by Agni deva THROUGH VARUNA. It appears that Varuna comes into picture as custodian or giver of bows for the following reasons. # All divyaasthras are with Vishnu who is none other than Sriman Narayana (for arguments to substantiate this latter part of the sentence, refer Vedartha sangraha). The pramana is the 1000th name of Vishnu in Vishnu sahasranama, which is “sarva praharanaayudha:” Why this name has been given as the final or ultimate name is itself a matter for interesting debate. In this context let me confine myself to saying that Vishnu is the ultimate owner of all weapons. But that He is also present as Varuna among all jala-devathas, is what Gitacharyan Himself has said (BG 10-29). So it may be interpreted that all weapons, particularly the divine weapons go back to Vishnu in Varuna’s form. # Why Varuna? Why not other forms of Vishnu about which we have a good idea from BG? It may be because Varuna as jala-devatha acts as a coolant to preserve the haughty weapons. Or else the weapons might become fiercer still. (fanciful notion??!!) # Vishnu’s connection with the bows can be traced to what Dhanur veda says. Saarangham, Vishnu’s bow is described as the best among all the bows by Dhanur vedam. It is said to be 7 times greater than what Vishwa karma made. (The two bows mentioned in previous posts of MGV are made by Vishwa karma).Sage Vyasa describes Saarangam in his Siva dhanur veda. Though all bows are said to have originated from Mahadeva, he says that the archer, before aiming at a target must keep Lord Vishnu in mind and then intone the name of Arjuna to get success. He further says that Janardhana stays in the heart of the archer. The practice to invoke the blessings of Vishnu before shooting the arrow might perhaps be due to the prospect of Vishnu staying in the tip of the arrow – as what happened when Shiva sought to destroy Thripura asuras. Further corroboration:- Vishnu is the Vajayudha among all weapons (BG) Vajra is also the hard substance made of diamond and other hard substances that is smeared at the tip of the arrow, so says Vyasa. So it is assumed that Vishnu remained as the vajra at the tip of Shiva dhanush. 2) The next point I wish to take up is explained below the following dialogue that took place between me and MGV in previous posts. JASN: 2) What are these bows called? Which then is Kothandam, which we usually associate with Rama? MGV: 'Naming the bows' - is a very difficult question to answer. In slOkam 1-22-7, it is said raama and lakshmaNa started as dhanushpaaNi: along with sage visvaamithra when they left ayOdhyaa. Also in 1-26-6, it is said raama held the bow and made the noise - the dankaaram - the bow string pulled and a noise created. [thus informing thaatakaa about the arrival of her killer before the thaatakaa vadham]. No name for the bow is given in these two places. As could be 'inferred' from the parasuraama episode, which takes place just after the marriage, the bow received from parasuraama, [that vishNu dhanu:] was NOT returned to parasuraama. Instead dhasaratha raama gave the bow to varunNan as could be seen from gathE raamE prasaantha aathmaa raamO dhaasarathi: dhanu: | varuNaaya aprameyaaya dhadhou hasthE mahaayasaa: || 1-77-1 meaning: On the departure of parasu raama, that most glorious raama of dhasaratha, who is now peaceful [or quietened] at heart, gave away that longbow of vishNu into the hands of varuNan, the unequalled God of Rain. So we can infer (is it correct?) the vishNu dhanu: what dhasaratha raama received previously from parasu raamaa is the "kOthaNdam", which, when he started to forest, got back from the house of sage vasishta. May be the soul of 'saarngam' - the bow of sriman naarayaNan enters this vishNu dhanu and performs all acts with the name kOdhandam. [this soul of saarngam entering the bow in front of parasuraama, we saw in the bow story earlier]. JASN replies:- It seems that the two names that appear in Vishnu sahasranama, namely, Dhanvee and Dhanur dhara: are general terms outwardly. I am not going into the vyakhyaanams for these. Instead let me confine myself to Kodandam and certain other points. >From Sahasranama, our contention of Vishnu’s connection to bows further gets strengthened. The foremost among the dhanur dharis is Vishnu only. Next, about Kodandam. Dhanur veda has an explanation for kodandam. The bows are prepared having 3, 5 or 7 joints. But a kodandam will have 9 joints. (The significance of number nine has already been discussed in various lists. Perhaps to signify that Rama possessed this bow with 9 joints.) While Saarangam is described as ‘divine one’, kodandam is described as ‘auspicious’ one. By the name of it, it means a ‘curved stick’. The question is when and how Rama came to possess this. It can not be the Vishnu dhanush that Rama got from Parasurama. For, valmiki says that he had sent it to the custody of Varuna. I doubt whether there exists any verse in the epic to say or indicate that Rama got it back. Rama mentions about the two bows and other weapons that were received from Varuna by Janaka which he takes with him during vana vasam. This gives an impression that during the entire stay in the forest he had used only this bow(the other presumably left to with Lakshmana) Earlier for the first time the mention about the bow comes when he accompanies sage Vishwamithra to forest. He acquired sasthras of varied types from the sage. These are different from asthras as these have to be used by manthras. (Note BG sloka on the Lord being Rama among those who are good at sasthra vidhya). Rama had taken many asthras to the forest and by knowledge of sasthra vidhya, must have used the various weapons given by the sage which were at astral level. But where does the mention of kodandam come is a mute question for which I am yet to get an answer. In the vyakhyanam for Thirumalai pasuram 11, posted by Smt Sumithra Varadarajan, I found an important information that except for the time he prayed to samudra raja, Rama did not for once leave or discard his kodandam. (may I request Smt sumithra to shed more light on this?) If so, we can safely assume that kodandam is one among the two bows that Rama received from Janaka who inturn received it from Varuna. It is therefore further assumed that since Rama used it for number of times for vanquishing more asuras, kodandam came to cling to his name. Otherwise, he could have been just called as dhanur-rama or so. (Arjuna is not known as Gandeeva-arjuna) But similar references (as dhanvee or dhanur dhari) to him are aplenty in Valmiki Ramayana. Requesting further additions and clarifications, Jayasree saranathan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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