Guest guest Posted September 10, 2003 Report Share Posted September 10, 2003 Hiya Alan, That is perfectly fine. Remember to have fun, while seeing that the need to enquire is the very ache. It is not what you do or don't do Alan, ........it's the premise from which you view the doing or non-doing, which separates Heaven from Hell, ...so to say. RamanaMaharshi, Alan Jacobs <alanadamsjacobs> wrote: > > Dear Sandeep ,with respect , I feel you are a bit like a dentist who says to his patients -your > tooth ache and pain are quite imaginary ,so forget it .Who would go to such a dentist ?I would > rather go to one who treats me -so in the case of the pain of suffering from 'separation' I > would rather practice Self Enquiry and have it extracted then endlessly "chat" about it .Regards > ,Alan > > > ____________________ __ > Want to chat instantly with your online friends? Get the FREE > Messenger http://mail.messenger..co.uk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 10, 2003 Report Share Posted September 10, 2003 Yes, indeed!!!! Fine statement, Alan. Also remembers me I really have to go to the dentist today afternoon Likewise Gabriele knows she really has to practice atma vichara anbudan Gabriele - Alan Jacobs RamanaMaharshi Wednesday, September 10, 2003 7:46 AM Re: [RamanaMaharshi] Strive for what, inquiry of what? Dear Sandeep ,with respect , I feel you are a bit like a dentist who says to his patients -yourtooth ache and pain are quite imaginary ,so forget it .Who would go to such a dentist ?I wouldrather go to one who treats me -so in the case of the pain of suffering from 'separation' Iwould rather practice Self Enquiry and have it extracted then endlessly "chat" about it .Regards,Alan ______________________Want to chat instantly with your online friends? Get the FREE Messenger http://mail.messenger..co.ukCommunity email addresses: Post message: RamanaMaharshi Subscribe: RamanaMaharshi- Un: RamanaMaharshi List owner: RamanaMaharshi-ownerShortcut URL to this page: http://www./community/RamanaMaharshi Your use of is subject to the Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 10, 2003 Report Share Posted September 10, 2003 ---dear Sandeep , i like this one .Regards Alan > Hiya Alan, > > It is not what you do or don't do Alan, ........it's the premise from > which you view the doing or non-doing, which separates Heaven from > Hell, ...so to say. RamanaMaharshi, Alan Jacobs > <alanadamsjacobs> wrote: > > > > Dear Sandeep ,with respect , I feel you are a bit like a dentist > who says to his patients -your > > tooth ache and pain are quite imaginary ,so forget it .Who would go > to such a dentist ?I would > > rather go to one who treats me -so in the case of the pain of > suffering from 'separation' I > > would rather practice Self Enquiry and have it extracted then > endlessly "chat" about it .Regards > > ,Alan > > > > > > > ____________________ > __ > > Want to chat instantly with your online friends? Get the FREE > > > Messenger http://mail.messenger..co.uk > > > > > Post message: RamanaMaharshi > Subscribe: RamanaMaharshi- > Un: RamanaMaharshi > List owner: RamanaMaharshi-owner > > Shortcut URL to this page: > http://www./community/RamanaMaharshi > > Your use of is subject to > > ______________________ Want to chat instantly with your online friends? Get the FREE Messenger http://mail.messenger..co.uk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 10, 2003 Report Share Posted September 10, 2003 Dear Sandeep, Why should realisation be a catch 22 situation? could it be, in my case, that 'seeing that the need to enquire is the very ache', is a nice trap put up by maya; inviting me, born in maya, to disregard it and what it teaches? Why? So I can giggle at my catching the only thought that is required for realisation in a world which offers no realisation, and let all other thoughts of liberation go unexamined, as meaningless. But, what if I am merely immeresed in materialism, expending any merit I have in being proud, insensitive to the reality of any situation, and quite stuck? regards, JOhn Plum 10/9/03 6:06 AM +0000 Sandeep sandeepc (AT) bom3 (DOT) vsnl.net.in wrote: > Remember to have fun, while seeing that the need to enquire is the > very ache. Regards, John Plum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 10, 2003 Report Share Posted September 10, 2003 Sounds by this that 'where we are at' is a matter of speculation or intellect, and not heart. Also, I suspect premises are usually dual, No? Is one premise enough to guide action and non-action? 10/9/03 8:29 AM +0100 Alan Jacobs alanadamsjacobs (AT) (DOT) co.uk wrote: >> It is not what you do or don't do Alan, ........it's the premise from >> which you view the doing or non-doing, which separates Heaven from >> Hell, ...so to say. Regards, John Plum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 10, 2003 Report Share Posted September 10, 2003 Hiya John, RamanaMaharshi, chueewowee <chueewowee> wrote: > Dear Sandeep, > > Why should realisation be a catch 22 situation? You cannot realize, become, experience,..... what you already are. In order to point to this, the dudes used the metaphor, ...the eye can see everything but itself. > could it be, in my case, that 'seeing that the need to enquire is >the very ache', is a nice trap put up by maya; inviting me, born >in maya, to disregard it and what it teaches? LOL Who is that "me" which you allude to, being invited by Maya? Who is born in Maya? The body-mind organism? That is a mere out-growth of an ejaculated sperm doing the hip-hop with an ejaculated ovum. The essence of both the sperm and the ovum is the food ingested. The essence of food are the five fundamental elements of nature. On "death" of the organism, either through cremation or burial or being fed to the vultures (if the prevailing ethos was Zorastrian),..........the biological object merges back to the very elements from which it emerged. Nothing lost, nothing gained, ....just transforming energy patterns. So what is born in Maya, which is now entraped in Maya? ------ > > Why? So I can giggle at my catching the only thought that is >required for realisation in a world which offers no realisation, and >let all other thoughts of liberation go unexamined, as meaningless. All thoughts connote a meaning, which the prevailing conditioning-in- the-moment, lends to it. > > But, what if I am merely immeresed in materialism, expending any >merit I have in being proud, insensitive to the reality of any >situation, and quite stuck? :-) What is the existential reality of the entity which is supposed to earn merit in being immersed in spirituality, being sensitive to the reality of the situation and being not quite stuck? There is functioning through an appropriate conditioned psycho- somatic apparatus. In the moment. Moment to moment to moment. Neuro-science confirms that the prevailing conditioning-in-the-moment in an sentient biological object ,.... is not something etched in stone, but something which has a genetic legacy going back to the history of evolution itself. The Human Genome Project shows that the genetic lessons as imbibed by the single cell amoeba, which crawled out of the waters some couple of billion years back, exist in your genome, right now. This genetic legacy arrives through the contributory culminations of the sperm and the ovum, which got together to make "you". This at-birth-genetic template, neuro-biologists and behaviourial experts,.... confirm is impacted, moment to moment to moment,.... by arriving inputs from the environ in which the nurturing happened. Inputs like parental dictates, the presence or lack of religion in the home atmosphere, education or lack of one, peer-influences, societal/communal/national prevailing ethos, personal experiences that occurred as you grew up, conditionings painted on you by some respected/admired icon either within the family or outside etc etc. These squiggly signs which have appeared in your PC screen, which you are right now viewing, ......is an arriving impacting input. These inputs, impact the genetic template, altering, ammending, chnaging, evolving it, hence the term conditioning-in-the-moment. It is this "conditioning-in-the-moment" which "fashions" the thinking, and the actualization of thought, viz an action, or a behaviour. Whether that is a devotion for a Ramana or a devotion for a Barcadi Dark Rum. Thus your forays into spirituality (whatever be it's particular form and shape, or whichever icon is your beloved Teacher), is once again a "fashioned" functioning, ........fashioned by the prevailing conditioning-in-the-moment. That is all there is to it. Seeking is the essence of living. At birth you sought your mother's nipple, as a teenger, you sought some other thrills, as an young adult you sought an icon of self- identity believing that is to be reached through "thingies", whether that was relationships or material possessions. Seeing the hollowness of all thingies, that same energy in a rare object, moves into the realm of spirituality, the conditioning then being a prevailing hope in such a sentient object,... that the intrinsic insecurity, the essential fear may get assuaged in the achievement of Moksha. Seeing that time demolishes everything, you seek the timeless. Not seeing that the issue is in the seeking, not in the sought. This "not-seeing" is also a nuance of the perfection of the movement in the moment. Dancing energy patterns, moving into different realms. What merit? What demerit? All concepts of merit and demerits,..... pure baloney. ZIp-a-Dee-Dah-Doo-Phaaaat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 11, 2003 Report Share Posted September 11, 2003 Dear Sandeep, thank you for your clear reply. i asked those questions, for something to do, and because i wondered what your reply would be. I wasn't hoping to become inspired through the answer. Now, I am again resting in dancing patterns and shall continue to be so (for a series of moving moments), from realm to realm! 10/9/03 1:44 PM +0000 Sandeep sandeepc (AT) bom3 (DOT) vsnl.net.in wrote: > Seeing that time demolishes everything, you seek the timeless. > Not seeing that the issue is in the seeking, not in the sought. > > This "not-seeing" is also a nuance of the perfection of the movement > in the moment....... >...... Dancing energy patterns, moving into different realms. Regards, John Plum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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