Guest guest Posted November 4, 2004 Report Share Posted November 4, 2004 Post 3 Dear srivaishNava perunthagaiyeer, We saw that due to indhran and naaradhar, there was a fight between siva and vishNu with two newly made bows. Parasuraamaa continues to tell how he got vishNu chaapam [vishNu dhanu:] and janaka's ancestors got siva dhanu: [1. Please note in baala kaaNdam sargam 75 slokams 14, 15 talk about brahma acting as the starter of the fight between siva and vishNu. 2. Here in slokams 16 and 17 the fight reaches crescendo and result is also achieved. 3. Only thing at whose instance this fight started is missing. Perhaps that gap is filled in other puraanams - that is what we saw through the swamy mentioned in earlier post]. Now see slOkam - virOdhE thu mahath yudhDham abhavath rOma harshaNam || 1-75-16 sithi kaNtasya vishNO: cha paraspara jaya EshiNO: | virOdhE + thu = in animosity but mahath + yudhDham + abhavath = fierce war occurred rOma + harshaNam = hair raising one sithi + kaNtasya = blue throated sivaa's vishNO: + cha = of vishNu also paraspara + jaya + EshiNO: = each other victory aspiring [for himself] meaning: Owing to their animosity, then occurred a fierce and hair-raising war among siva and vishNu, as each aspired victory for himself. thadhaa thu jrumbhitham saivam dhanu: bheema paraakramam || 1-75-17 hum kaareNa mahaadhEva: sthambhithO atha thrilOchana: | thadhaa + thu = then but hum + kaareNa = by 'hum', sound [vishNu's war-whooping] bheema + paraakramam = ruinously overpowering saivam + dhanu: = siva's, longbow jrumbhitham = yawned [fatigued, broken] atha + thrilOchana: + mahaadhEva: = then triple-eyed MahaadhEva; sthambhitha: = became motionless [frozen] meaning: But, then, with the war-whooping 'hum' Vishnu ruinously overpowered the longbow of siva and broke it. The triple-eyed god mahaadhEva became motionless. dhEvai: thadhaa samaagamya sa rishi sanghai: sa chaaraNai: || 1-75-18 yaachithou prasamam thathra jagmathu: thou sura uththamou | dhEvai: + thadhaa + samaagamya = by gods then coming together sa + rishi + sanghai: + sa + chaaraNai: = with sages' assemblages with chaaraNaas yaachithou = appealed; prasamam = appeasement thathra = there [in that matter of wielding authority] jagmathu: = went into [state of amity] thou = those two [siva, vishNu]; sura + uththamou = gods, superior among. Meaning: Then came together are the gods, along with the assemblages and celestial chaaraNaas, and when they appealed for appeasement in the matter of wielding authority, those two superior gods, siva and vishNu, went into a state of amity. jrumbhitham thath dhanu: dhrishtvaa saivam vishNu paraakramai: || 1-75-19 adhikam mEnirE vishNum dhEvaa: sa rishi gaNaa: thadhaa | thath + saivam + dhanu: + dhrishtvaa = that sivas's bow on seeing jrumbhitham = breakage of vishNu + paraakramai: = by vishNu's mettle thadhaa + dhEvaa: = then on gods sa + rishi + gaNaa: = with sage assemblage vishNum + mEnirE + adhikam = vishNu deemed paramount meaning: On seeing the breakage of sivaa's bow by the mettlesomeness of vishNu, from then on the gods along with the assemblages of sages, deemed vishNu to be the paramount. Point: Incidentally this point also comes handy to solve thia anya dhEvathaa aaraadhna worship. For many a times this point crops up in the lists. Since this slOkam is in sreemadh raamaayaNam itself, and said by none else than parasuraama, at least hereafter, I hope doubts if any will be quashed to all. dhanoo rudhra: thu sankrudhDhO vidhEhEshu mahaayasaa: || 1-75-20 dhEvaraathasya raaja rishE: dhadhou hasthE sa saayakam | mahaayasaa: + rudhra: + thu = celebrated rudhra but sankrudhDha: = with indignantion dhanoo + sa + saayakam = longbow with arrow vidhEhEshu = among vidhEha [kings] raaja + rishE: = to kingly sage dhEvaraathasya + hasthE + dhadhou = in dhEvaraathaa's hand handed over meaning: But that celebrated rudhra was with indignation. He handed over that longbow, which is already fitted with unloosened arrow, into the hand of the sagely vidhEha king, namely dhEevaraatha. Point: Perhaps, dear bhakthaas, you can recollect the following slOkam [covered in post 1] where janakar, father of seethaa, said "my ancestor, by name dhEvaraatha, got this bow from siva after the dhaksha yagnam". dhEvaraatha ithi khyaathO nimE: jyEshtO mahee pathi: | nyaasO ayam thasya bhagavan hasthE dhaththO mahaathmanaa || 1-66-8 [for meaning refer post 1] Point: Here you may also ask why you are saying so much on this bow. For there is an interesting side story, which says seethaa as a six year old just pushed this siva's bow like a play thing. When reported king janakar became surprised that she is so mystically powerful and must have an equally powerful or better husband. This story is again quoted from the same site referred in post 2. Of course I heard from other sources that padhma puranam has slokams, which gives the following content. Sorry, I am not able to quote the slOkams. Quote-- Devarata got Shiva's bow and he kept it in the palace as a worshippable object. In this way it was coming down in the family, and this Janaka we are dealing with was also worshipping the bow. He did not have any children, so they suggested to him to do a hola-yajna. You take a plough and draw a line around the palace. When you move the plough, it will get stuck in the mud, and every time it gets stuck you have to donate gold to the priests. And every movement you make it will get stuck, so you have to give gold. When all the Brahmins are satisfied, you move it again and when it gets stuck you have to get more gold. In this way you are giving a lot of charity and you are getting a lot of blessings so you will get children. So Janaka was doing this, moving the plough and giving gold. In one place it got stuck, and after giving all the gold, still the plough would not move on. "There must be some big rock there," everybody said, so they dug and found a box. And inside the box was a baby, a female baby, and she looked just like Laksmi. She was known as Janaki, the daughter of Janaka, and she grew up in the palace. She was six years old. Janaka had a brother, and he had three daughters. So these four daughters were running around and playing at the palace. Once they made a stick with a hook on it to take some flowers from the trees. So Janaki was trying to get it, but somehow or other there was a mystic tree there, and whenever she reached up, it grew more. Somebody was in that tree. So Janaki could not get it and she was the only daughter of the emperor, so she was very frustrated. "I want to get it, and I know what I will use to get it." She ran into the puja room, and in there was this big bow inside a box. She opened the box and took the bow in her hands, and then she walked outside with the bow. When the soldiers saw her they all swooned. Three hundred people were supposed to push the cart, and this little girl was holding the bow. Whoever was able to stay conscious ran to Janaka and said, "Do you know what's happening? Your little girl is holding Lord Shiva's bow!" "Send this man to the doctor," Janaka said. "There's something wrong with his head." Then another lady came and said, "Yes, yes, it's true! And if you want to see it come quickly.""What's wrong with these people?" Janaka said. Then he called his doctor. "Supply 1000 lemons to the palace. And put at least 500 lemons on these people's heads, to cool them down." And then Janaka's minister came running and said, "No, it is no joke. I just saw it myself." This time Janaka said, "It must be true," so he came running, and the last thing he saw was Janaki lifting the bow into the box. Then she came towards Janaka as if she had done nothing. When questioned by Janaka, she innocently said that she had performed no great task. But Janaka had seen it happen, and he went to his ministers and said, "My daughter must be haunted by some big brahma-rakshasa ghost, more powerful than Lord Shiva. Otherwise how is it possible that she is able to lift it?" So then the ministers thought over it and said, "Janaka, we think that your daughter is Maha-laksmi. From all the symptoms of her bodily features, we can understand that she is none other than Laksmi. And if she is Laksmi, then naturally her Lord is Narayana. Now your problem is, how are you going to get Narayana to marry her? There is no Narayana here." Then Janaka came up with an idea. He said, "Anyone who can take this bow and string it will marry my daughter." All the ministers laughed. They said, "In this way your daughter is going to remain unmarried. Because who on this earth has the strength to do this?" Janaka said, "Narayana obviously knows that Lakshmi is here. He is not going to leave her unmarried. She is not going to take some woman sannyasa or anything. No. Narayana must come here." So everyone was shocked. They were saying, "What is this man doing? This is as good as saying, `No-one can marry my daughter." - unquote. The author of www.valimikiramayan.net <http://www.valimikiramayan.net> site also gives a comment as follows for slOkam 18 and 19 in sargam 66 of baala kaaNdam. This bow of Shiva will be transported on a wheeled casket-cart with eight wheels and drawn by five thousand robust persons. This is narrated in next chapter. 'It is drawn by drawn by five hundred bulls...' aananda raamayana says so. In other versions of Ramayana, it is said that many people will pull that casket-cart, as one or two persons cannot haul it. Once, when Seetha was playing with other girls, their flowery ball of girl's rugby goes under this cart. None of her girlfriends is dare enough to near this bow-casket-cart, since it is a reverential casket-cart. But Seetha goes there and pushes that casket-cart aside with her left hand, as though it is a garland, and retrieves that flower ball. This capability of Seetha in easy handling of Shiva's bow, becomes a bane to her, when one among the wives of sapta rishi 'Seven Sages...' issues a curse to Seetha, saying that 'Seetha will be separated from her husband for some time, of course, for the good of people...' So says the tradition. We will continue the "bow's story" in next post as again the length is growing more. Dhasan Vasudevan m.g. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 5, 2004 Report Share Posted November 5, 2004 Dear Swamy, This is an interesting aspect and I will try to add something more to the discussion from "Soorya namaskaaram" or Aruna prasnam. In that prasnam, the story goes as follows. Lord Siva after the Tripura samhaaram (where Mahavishnu blessed the arrow) was standing with full valour and pride that he could blast the three demon satellites by a single arrow without fail. His head was above the top tip of his bow. Mahendra took a form of an insect bee and drilled a hole into the thread of the bow which then broke releasing the tension on the main bow stem. Along with it Rudra's head was also severed. Later, Mahavishnu joined the head and life was given back to Rudra. This lessened the pride that Rudra was having. The manthram goes as follows: "Shira utpipesha, sapravargyo bhavath, thasmaath yassapravargyena yagyena yajathe, rudrasya sa shiraha prathi dadhaathi, nainagum rundra aaruko bhavathi" The phalam is if some one recites this manthram Rudra will ward off all the evil diseases for the person reciting this. So, then the bow string was broken and never joined back. It was the same bow string which Lord Rama tried to tie back and lo! the power of the lord was so high that it broke the bow itself - probably was also done intentionally by lord : who can gauge his mind ! enjoy further ! Sajjana pada padma parama renuhu Lakshmi Narasimha dasan "M.G.Vasudevan" <mgv wrote: Post 3 Dear srivaishNava perunthagaiyeer, We saw that due to indhran and naaradhar, there was a fight between siva and vishNu with two newly made bows. Parasuraamaa continues to tell how he got vishNu chaapam [vishNu dhanu:] and janaka's ancestors got siva dhanu: [1. Please note in baala kaaNdam sargam 75 slokams 14, 15 talk about brahma acting as the starter of the fight between siva and vishNu. 2. Here in slokams 16 and 17 the fight reaches crescendo and result is also achieved. 3. Only thing at whose instance this fight started is missing. Perhaps that gap is filled in other puraanams - that is what we saw through the swamy mentioned in earlier post]. Now see slOkam - virOdhE thu mahath yudhDham abhavath rOma harshaNam || 1-75-16 sithi kaNtasya vishNO: cha paraspara jaya EshiNO: | virOdhE + thu = in animosity but mahath + yudhDham + abhavath = fierce war occurred rOma + harshaNam = hair raising one sithi + kaNtasya = blue throated sivaa's vishNO: + cha = of vishNu also paraspara + jaya + EshiNO: = each other victory aspiring [for himself] meaning: Owing to their animosity, then occurred a fierce and hair-raising war among siva and vishNu, as each aspired victory for himself. thadhaa thu jrumbhitham saivam dhanu: bheema paraakramam || 1-75-17 hum kaareNa mahaadhEva: sthambhithO atha thrilOchana: | thadhaa + thu = then but hum + kaareNa = by 'hum', sound [vishNu's war-whooping] bheema + paraakramam = ruinously overpowering saivam + dhanu: = siva's, longbow jrumbhitham = yawned [fatigued, broken] atha + thrilOchana: + mahaadhEva: = then triple-eyed MahaadhEva; sthambhitha: = became motionless [frozen] meaning: But, then, with the war-whooping 'hum' Vishnu ruinously overpowered the longbow of siva and broke it. The triple-eyed god mahaadhEva became motionless. dhEvai: thadhaa samaagamya sa rishi sanghai: sa chaaraNai: || 1-75-18 yaachithou prasamam thathra jagmathu: thou sura uththamou | dhEvai: + thadhaa + samaagamya = by gods then coming together sa + rishi + sanghai: + sa + chaaraNai: = with sages' assemblages with chaaraNaas yaachithou = appealed; prasamam = appeasement thathra = there [in that matter of wielding authority] jagmathu: = went into [state of amity] thou = those two [siva, vishNu]; sura + uththamou = gods, superior among. Meaning: Then came together are the gods, along with the assemblages and celestial chaaraNaas, and when they appealed for appeasement in the matter of wielding authority, those two superior gods, siva and vishNu, went into a state of amity. jrumbhitham thath dhanu: dhrishtvaa saivam vishNu paraakramai: || 1-75-19 adhikam mEnirE vishNum dhEvaa: sa rishi gaNaa: thadhaa | thath + saivam + dhanu: + dhrishtvaa = that sivas's bow on seeing jrumbhitham = breakage of vishNu + paraakramai: = by vishNu's mettle thadhaa + dhEvaa: = then on gods sa + rishi + gaNaa: = with sage assemblage vishNum + mEnirE + adhikam = vishNu deemed paramount meaning: On seeing the breakage of sivaa's bow by the mettlesomeness of vishNu, from then on the gods along with the assemblages of sages, deemed vishNu to be the paramount. Point: Incidentally this point also comes handy to solve thia anya dhEvathaa aaraadhna worship. For many a times this point crops up in the lists. Since this slOkam is in sreemadh raamaayaNam itself, and said by none else than parasuraama, at least hereafter, I hope doubts if any will be quashed to all. dhanoo rudhra: thu sankrudhDhO vidhEhEshu mahaayasaa: || 1-75-20 dhEvaraathasya raaja rishE: dhadhou hasthE sa saayakam | mahaayasaa: + rudhra: + thu = celebrated rudhra but sankrudhDha: = with indignantion dhanoo + sa + saayakam = longbow with arrow vidhEhEshu = among vidhEha [kings] raaja + rishE: = to kingly sage dhEvaraathasya + hasthE + dhadhou = in dhEvaraathaa's hand handed over meaning: But that celebrated rudhra was with indignation. He handed over that longbow, which is already fitted with unloosened arrow, into the hand of the sagely vidhEha king, namely dhEevaraatha. Point: Perhaps, dear bhakthaas, you can recollect the following slOkam [covered in post 1] where janakar, father of seethaa, said "my ancestor, by name dhEvaraatha, got this bow from siva after the dhaksha yagnam". dhEvaraatha ithi khyaathO nimE: jyEshtO mahee pathi: | nyaasO ayam thasya bhagavan hasthE dhaththO mahaathmanaa || 1-66-8 [for meaning refer post 1] Point: Here you may also ask why you are saying so much on this bow. For there is an interesting side story, which says seethaa as a six year old just pushed this siva's bow like a play thing. When reported king janakar became surprised that she is so mystically powerful and must have an equally powerful or better husband. This story is again quoted from the same site referred in post 2. Of course I heard from other sources that padhma puranam has slokams, which gives the following content. Sorry, I am not able to quote the slOkams. Quote-- Devarata got Shiva's bow and he kept it in the palace as a worshippable object. In this way it was coming down in the family, and this Janaka we are dealing with was also worshipping the bow. He did not have any children, so they suggested to him to do a hola-yajna. You take a plough and draw a line around the palace. When you move the plough, it will get stuck in the mud, and every time it gets stuck you have to donate gold to the priests. And every movement you make it will get stuck, so you have to give gold. When all the Brahmins are satisfied, you move it again and when it gets stuck you have to get more gold. In this way you are giving a lot of charity and you are getting a lot of blessings so you will get children. So Janaka was doing this, moving the plough and giving gold. In one place it got stuck, and after giving all the gold, still the plough would not move on. "There must be some big rock there," everybody said, so they dug and found a box. And inside the box was a baby, a female baby, and she looked just like Laksmi. She was known as Janaki, the daughter of Janaka, and she grew up in the palace. She was six years old. Janaka had a brother, and he had three daughters. So these four daughters were running around and playing at the palace. Once they made a stick with a hook on it to take some flowers from the trees. So Janaki was trying to get it, but somehow or other there was a mystic tree there, and whenever she reached up, it grew more. Somebody was in that tree. So Janaki could not get it and she was the only daughter of the emperor, so she was very frustrated. "I want to get it, and I know what I will use to get it." She ran into the puja room, and in there was this big bow inside a box. She opened the box and took the bow in her hands, and then she walked outside with the bow. When the soldiers saw her they all swooned. Three hundred people were supposed to push the cart, and this little girl was holding the bow. Whoever was able to stay conscious ran to Janaka and said, "Do you know what's happening? Your little girl is holding Lord Shiva's bow!" "Send this man to the doctor," Janaka said. "There's something wrong with his head." Then another lady came and said, "Yes, yes, it's true! And if you want to see it come quickly.""What's wrong with these people?" Janaka said. Then he called his doctor. "Supply 1000 lemons to the palace. And put at least 500 lemons on these people's heads, to cool them down." And then Janaka's minister came running and said, "No, it is no joke. I just saw it myself." This time Janaka said, "It must be true," so he came running, and the last thing he saw was Janaki lifting the bow into the box. Then she came towards Janaka as if she had done nothing. When questioned by Janaka, she innocently said that she had performed no great task. But Janaka had seen it happen, and he went to his ministers and said, "My daughter must be haunted by some big brahma-rakshasa ghost, more powerful than Lord Shiva. Otherwise how is it possible that she is able to lift it?" So then the ministers thought over it and said, "Janaka, we think that your daughter is Maha-laksmi. From all the symptoms of her bodily features, we can understand that she is none other than Laksmi. And if she is Laksmi, then naturally her Lord is Narayana. Now your problem is, how are you going to get Narayana to marry her? There is no Narayana here." Then Janaka came up with an idea. He said, "Anyone who can take this bow and string it will marry my daughter." All the ministers laughed. They said, "In this way your daughter is going to remain unmarried. Because who on this earth has the strength to do this?" Janaka said, "Narayana obviously knows that Lakshmi is here. He is not going to leave her unmarried. She is not going to take some woman sannyasa or anything. No. Narayana must come here." So everyone was shocked. They were saying, "What is this man doing? This is as good as saying, `No-one can marry my daughter." - unquote. The author of www.valimikiramayan.net <http://www.valimikiramayan.net> site also gives a comment as follows for slOkam 18 and 19 in sargam 66 of baala kaaNdam. This bow of Shiva will be transported on a wheeled casket-cart with eight wheels and drawn by five thousand robust persons. This is narrated in next chapter. 'It is drawn by drawn by five hundred bulls...' aananda raamayana says so. In other versions of Ramayana, it is said that many people will pull that casket-cart, as one or two persons cannot haul it. Once, when Seetha was playing with other girls, their flowery ball of girl's rugby goes under this cart. None of her girlfriends is dare enough to near this bow-casket-cart, since it is a reverential casket-cart. But Seetha goes there and pushes that casket-cart aside with her left hand, as though it is a garland, and retrieves that flower ball. This capability of Seetha in easy handling of Shiva's bow, becomes a bane to her, when one among the wives of sapta rishi 'Seven Sages...' issues a curse to Seetha, saying that 'Seetha will be separated from her husband for some time, of course, for the good of people...' So says the tradition. We will continue the "bow's story" in next post as again the length is growing more. Dhasan Vasudevan m.g. Sponsor Eliminate Your Debt! ·Get out of Debt Now · Christian counselors available·Click here to find out how you can become free from debt. / Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 5, 2004 Report Share Posted November 5, 2004 Dear Sri Vasudevan, meaning: Owing to their animosity, then occurred a fierce and hair-raising war among siva and vishNu, as each aspired victory for himself. >>I THINK BOTH ASPIRE FOR VICTORY FOR THE SAKE OTHER GODS AND IN REALITY NEITHER SHIVA NOR >>VISHNU CAN THINK OF FIGHTING EACH OTHER - ONE BEING A BHAKTHA AND THE OTHER BEING >>ANTARYAMI IS THE ULTIMATE DECISION MAKER. meaning: But, then, with the war-whooping 'hum' Vishnu ruinously overpowered the longbow of siva and broke it. The triple-eyed god mahaadhEva became motionless. >>MAY BE THAT'S WHY WE CALL SHIVA 'STHANU' BORROWED FROM VISHNU(ONE OF THE NAMES OF VISHNU AS IN VISHNUSAHASRANAMA) dhEvai: thadhaa samaagamya sa rishi sanghai: sa chaaraNai: || 1-75-18 yaachithou prasamam thathra jagmathu: thou sura uththamou | dhEvai: + thadhaa + samaagamya = by gods then coming together sa + rishi + sanghai: + sa + chaaraNai: = with sages' assemblages with chaaraNaas yaachithou = appealed; prasamam = appeasement thathra = there [in that matter of wielding authority] jagmathu: = went into [state of amity] thou = those two [siva, vishNu]; sura + uththamou = gods, superior among. Meaning: Then came together are the gods, along with the assemblages and celestial chaaraNaas, and when they appealed for appeasement in the matter of wielding authority, those two superior gods, siva and vishNu, went into a state of amity. >>AGAIN I THINK THIS IS ONLY FOR OTHER DEMI GODS AND THE WORLD AROUND THEM. THIS REMINDS ME A >>SCENARIO IN MAHABHARATHA WHERE BIBRI (SON OF GHATOTHKACHA) SEES KRISHNA FIGHTING KRISHNA IN >>KURUKSHETRA. dhanoo rudhra: thu sankrudhDhO vidhEhEshu mahaayasaa: || 1-75-20 dhEvaraathasya raaja rishE: dhadhou hasthE sa saayakam | mahaayasaa: + rudhra: + thu = celebrated rudhra but sankrudhDha: = with indignantion dhanoo + sa + saayakam = longbow with arrow vidhEhEshu = among vidhEha [kings] raaja + rishE: = to kingly sage dhEvaraathasya + hasthE + dhadhou = in dhEvaraathaa's hand handed over meaning: But that celebrated rudhra was with indignation. He handed over that longbow, which is already fitted with unloosened arrow, into the hand of the sagely vidhEha king, namely dhEevaraatha. >>I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY SHIVA BECOMES KRUDDHA. SOMETHING TO DO WITH HIS THAMASA PRAKRUTHI >>OR IS AFFECTED BY MAYA, HE IS MAYA BADDHA RIGHT? AS HE AND BRAHMA CAN CREATE & DESTROY ONLY >>THIS WORLD AND CAN'T DO ANYTHING BEYOND THAT - PRAKRUTI, MAYA, MAHAT WHICH FALLS UNDER THE PURVIEW OF ONE AND ONLY LORD VISHNU Dhasan Vasudevan m.g. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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