Need some guidance and help regarding Sanathana Dharma

[Guest guest]

Dear Bhagawathas, Gurus and Friends,

 

My name is Vasudevan and I need some help from the

learned ones on this forum. I recently came across an

article written by a Christian activist, titled "Is

there a true religion?" and as I read on, I found that

the title was deceptive and that the article

eventually went on to eulogise the christian faith.

 

I challenged this writer to a debate with me and we

have been having some exchanges over the past one

week. When I started this debate, I was fully aware

that I was not entirely equipped to carry on with the

debate entirely on my own and that I would need a lot

of help and assistance from other learned Sanathanis.

 

I write this mail to call upon anyone who may be

interested in joining this debate on the side of

Sanathana Dharma and participate in answering the

questions that get thrown in, in defence of Sanathana

Dharma.

 

For those who are interested, I would like to give the

URLs of the postings that have happened so far:

 

http://vasuerfolg-sanathanadharma.blogspot.com

 

is the Blog-site where I have posted the discussions

that have happened so far.

 

You could send me your reply to the following mail

IDs:

 

vasu_erfolg and vasuerfolg

 

I will then add your mail ID to the Blog-site and

invite you to participate (that is, if you are

interested)

 

I look forward to your responses in upholding our

Sanathana Dharma.

 

Thanks and with warm regards

 

 

R. Vasudevan

Bangalore

 

 

 

 

FareChase: Search multiple travel sites in one click.

http://farechase.

[Guest guest]

I have gone through this.

Based on my experience, here are some simple tips:

 

First, forget all you know about Hinduism, exept for the

simple translation of 4 shlokas of Gita (see below) in parts.

They are not interested in breadth and depth of information;

nor will they help you in the debate.

Because, the debate will come to 4 points:

1. Jesus said he is the only way...

2. He died for your sins and whoever believes in him will be saved.

3. This is available readily and equally to anyone.

4. You don't need any mediation, except to let you know that it is available!

 

The following shlokas of Bhagavadgita is all you need:

Also, note just simple direct translations. NO BHASHYAMS please!

1. api-chEt su-durA-chA-rO bh-ja-tE mAma-na-nya-bAk....sah.

Even the gravest sinner, if he prays me alone, he should be considered wise.

(this is important because no prior qualification is needed,and the worst of

worst

are equally and readily saved)

2. xi-pram bha-va-ti dha-rmA-tma......na-mE bha-ktah-prana-shya-ti.

Such a person is instantaneously transformed spiritually..

(This is important because of the speed with which thetransformationhappens)

3. stri-yO-vai-shya ta-thA shU-drAh......ga-tim.

(Irrespective of caste/sex)

4. sa-rva dha-rmAn pa-ri-tya-jya.....mA shu-chah.

Setting aside all other religious doctrines and dogmas, just surrender to me

alone.

I will relieve you of all your sins and save you. Don't worry!

(ESPECIALLY HERE STAY AWAY FROM OUR ACHARYAS BHASHYAMS).

 

Good luck.

 

dAsan

 

K.S. tAtAchAr

 

PS: Also it would be a good thing to read the Bible (and Koran) for yourself.

However, prior knowledge of The Bible is not necessary for above debate.

But it will enlighten you to how wrong most Hindus (Including the Mahatma)

in dealing with the Muslims and the Christians. You will better appreciate

where the Jinnahs and the Missionaries are coming from.

 

 

 

Vasudevan Raghavan <vasu_erfolg

; enthralling-archa;

tdsingh

Mon, 14 Nov 2005 23:53:28 -0800 (PST)

Need some guidance and help regarding Sanathana Dharma

 

 

Dear Bhagawathas, Gurus and Friends,

 

My name is Vasudevan and I need some help from the

learned ones on this forum. I recently came across an

article written by a Christian activist, titled "Is

there a true religion?" and as I read on, I found that

the title was deceptive and that the article

eventually went on to eulogise the christian faith.

 

I challenged this writer to a debate with me and we

have been having some exchanges over the past one

week. When I started this debate, I was fully aware

that I was not entirely equipped to carry on with the

debate entirely on my own and that I would need a lot

of help and assistance from other learned Sanathanis.

 

I write this mail to call upon anyone who may be

interested in joining this debate on the side of

Sanathana Dharma and participate in answering the

questions that get thrown in, in defence of Sanathana

Dharma.

 

For those who are interested, I would like to give the

URLs of the postings that have happened so far:

 

http://vasuerfolg-sanathanadharma.blogspot.com

 

is the Blog-site where I have posted the discussions

that have happened so far.

 

You could send me your reply to the following mail

IDs:

 

vasu_erfolg and vasuerfolg

 

I will then add your mail ID to the Blog-site and

invite you to participate (that is, if you are

interested)

 

I look forward to your responses in upholding our

Sanathana Dharma.

 

Thanks and with warm regards

 

 

R. Vasudevan

Bangalore

 

 

 

 

FareChase: Search multiple travel sites in one click.

http://farechase.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Dear Sri Tatachar, Sri Vasudevan

 

May I say what a beautiful selection of verses that was from Sri

tAtAchAr swAmin on how to elucidate concepts of salvation and grace

within bhakti tradition and Hinduism in general.

 

If I may offer some input, I have also had experience with this

debate - as a university student, interfaith interaction is very

common for me and have had such discussions with devout evangelical

Christians.

 

My troubles in the past stemmed from a desire to somehow defend

all of Hinduism from the criticisms of Christians or Muslims. Before

I had any awareness on sampradAyam, I understandably found this a

very difficult task - perhaps it is an impossible one. My personal

experience is that if you wish to carry out this discussion at all,

focussing more on a specific tradition (e.g. bhakti/Vaishnava, or

Advaita, or Dvaita etc) will be a little more useful. The Sri

Vaishnava's answers to common Christian questions may be very

different to the Advaitin's answers, for example. Our University

Hindu student bodies in the UK are only just coming round to this

reality.

 

Lastly like Sri tAtAchAr swAmin, I too came to realise that

there is little point in trying to set out to convince a devout

Christian that his view on other religions is wrong - his/her

sincerely held convictions are based on his interpretation of their

scripture and 'anubhAvams'. We can say exactly the same for us in

many ways. Perhaps a staunch Sri Vaishnava would insist that without

performing samAshrayaNam, there is no way to salvation. This isn't

that different to their stance, to a rough first approximation.

 

For the less clever ones like me, I like to simply hope that the

Lord will shower his grace on every being in His creation, whether

they follow the same 'sAdhanA'/'tattvam' as me or not. I haven't got

the intellect to prove one or the other right or wrong, and so to me

anyway, all such arguments become futile after a while. I hope no

offence was caused to anyone.

 

sarvAparAdhAn kShamasva

with praNAmams,

 

Ranjan

 

, tatachar@a... wrote:

>

>

> I have gone through this.

> Based on my experience, here are some simple tips:

>

> First, forget all you know about Hinduism, exept for the

> simple translation of 4 shlokas of Gita (see below) in parts.

> They are not interested in breadth and depth of information;

> nor will they help you in the debate.

> Because, the debate will come to 4 points:

> 1. Jesus said he is the only way...

> 2. He died for your sins and whoever believes in him will be saved.

> 3. This is available readily and equally to anyone.

> 4. You don't need any mediation, except to let you know that it is

available!

>

> The following shlokas of Bhagavadgita is all you need:

> Also, note just simple direct translations. NO BHASHYAMS please!

> 1. api-chEt su-durA-chA-rO bh-ja-tE mAma-na-nya-bAk....sah.

> Even the gravest sinner, if he prays me alone, he should be

considered wise.

> (this is important because no prior qualification is needed,and the

worst of worst

> are equally and readily saved)

> 2. xi-pram bha-va-ti dha-rmA-tma......na-mE bha-ktah-prana-shya-ti.

> Such a person is instantaneously transformed spiritually..

> (This is important because of the speed with which

thetransformationhappens)

> 3. stri-yO-vai-shya ta-thA shU-drAh......ga-tim.

> (Irrespective of caste/sex)

> 4. sa-rva dha-rmAn pa-ri-tya-jya.....mA shu-chah.

> Setting aside all other religious doctrines and dogmas, just

surrender to me alone.

> I will relieve you of all your sins and save you. Don't worry!

> (ESPECIALLY HERE STAY AWAY FROM OUR ACHARYAS BHASHYAMS).

>

> Good luck.

>

> dAsan

>

> K.S. tAtAchAr

>

> PS: Also it would be a good thing to read the Bible (and Koran) for

yourself.

> However, prior knowledge of The Bible is not necessary for above

debate.

> But it will enlighten you to how wrong most Hindus (Including the

Mahatma)

> in dealing with the Muslims and the Christians. You will better

appreciate

> where the Jinnahs and the Missionaries are coming from.

>

>

>

> Vasudevan Raghavan <vasu_erfolg>

> ; enthralling-archa;

tdsingh@b...

> Mon, 14 Nov 2005 23:53:28 -0800 (PST)

> Need some guidance and help regarding

Sanathana Dharma

>

>

> Dear Bhagawathas, Gurus and Friends,

>

> My name is Vasudevan and I need some help from the

> learned ones on this forum. I recently came across an

> article written by a Christian activist, titled "Is

> there a true religion?" and as I read on, I found that

> the title was deceptive and that the article

> eventually went on to eulogise the christian faith.

>

> I challenged this writer to a debate with me and we

> have been having some exchanges over the past one

> week. When I started this debate, I was fully aware

> that I was not entirely equipped to carry on with the

> debate entirely on my own and that I would need a lot

> of help and assistance from other learned Sanathanis.

>

> I write this mail to call upon anyone who may be

> interested in joining this debate on the side of

> Sanathana Dharma and participate in answering the

> questions that get thrown in, in defence of Sanathana

> Dharma.

>

> For those who are interested, I would like to give the

> URLs of the postings that have happened so far:

>

> http://vasuerfolg-sanathanadharma.blogspot.com

>

> is the Blog-site where I have posted the discussions

> that have happened so far.

>

> You could send me your reply to the following mail

> IDs:

>

> vasu_erfolg and vasuerfolg@g...

>

> I will then add your mail ID to the Blog-site and

> invite you to participate (that is, if you are

> interested)

>

> I look forward to your responses in upholding our

> Sanathana Dharma.

>

> Thanks and with warm regards

>

>

> R. Vasudevan

> Bangalore

>

>

>

>

> FareChase: Search multiple travel sites in one click.

> http://farechase.

>

Links

>

[Guest guest]

Sri Tatachar wrote:

 

 

 

> 4. sa-rva dha-rmAn pa-ri-tya-jya.....mA shu-chah.

 

> Setting aside all other religious doctrines and dogmas, just

 

surrender to me alone.

 

> I will relieve you of all your sins and save you. Don't worry!

 

> (ESPECIALLY HERE STAY AWAY FROM OUR ACHARYAS BHASHYAMS).

 

>

 

> Good luck.

 

>

 

> dAsan

 

>

 

> K.S. tAtAchAr

 

****************************************************

 

Dear friends,

 

 

 

I generally like Sri Tatachar's views. I should say - a good modernization

of our ancient rishis' views.

 

 

 

However the following " ESPECIALLY HERE STAY AWAY FROM OUR ACHARYAS

BHASHYAMS" seems to devalue the views of great acharyas. This is not so

considerate comment on our great ancient acharyas such as Samkara, Ramanuja

and Madhva, who have toiled hard to summarize the whole meaning of

Bhagawadgita in this verse. Neither is this an easy verse, which is better

interpreted using a modern view, if one were to pay attention to the whole

text of Bhagawadgita.

 

 

 

I think one should understand our traditional bhasyas on this verse "sarva

dharman parityajya". Yes it is complicated and probably the person asking

this question is not so interested in deep "analysis and hair splitting

views on this verse". However, deep ideas are hidden in this verse and a

good understanding is necessary for any deep student of "hindu philosophy".

Further the diametrically opposite views, which have even crept into modern

books on Bhagawadgita is something one should know deeply.

 

 

 

For more details get this book from amazon.com or bizrate.com

 

 

 

 

 

 

<http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/8121511011/qid=1123042246/sr=

8-4/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i4_xgl14/104-3149499-1278347?v=glance&s=books&n=507846>

 

 

Philosophy

<http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/8121511011/qid=1123042246/sr=

8-4/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i4_xgl14/104-3149499-1278347?v=glance&s=books&n=507846>

of the Bhagavadgita: A Study Based on the Evaluation of the Commentaries of

Samkara, Ramanuja & Madhva by S.M. Srinivasa Chari (Hardcover - April 2005)

 

 

Books: See

<http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/search-handle-url/index=stripbooks:releva

nce-above&field-keywords=srinivasa%252520chari&search-type=ss&bq=1&store-nam

e=books/ref=xs_ap_sai4_xgl14/104-3149499-1278347> all 6 items (Rate

<javascript:amz_js_PopWin('/exec/obidos/tg/stores/recs/rate-this-asin/-/8121

511011/rate/no-refresh/ref=pd_rate_lk_rate_search/104-3149499-1278347','Recs

WhyWindow','width=480,height=450,resizable=yes,scrollbars=yes,status=yes')>

this item)

 

 

 

 

 

krishna

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Namaste!

 

May be this will be made clear when swamy tells us as to why he want us to

stay from Acharya's Bhashyas in this famous Charama Sloka. Till such time

this should not be blown out of proportions.

 

On the other hand, Sri Madhwa says in one of his works says that - every

vedic word has three hidden meanings, every sloka of mahabharatha has ten

hidden meanings and every nama of Vishnu in Vishnu Sahasra Nama has 100

esoteric meanings hidden in it. In fact, in a scholarly gathering, when

challenged by scholars on his words(especially on VSN), he rendered 100

meanings of the first nama - 'Om Vishwaya namaha' in a seamlessly rapid

phase, that the scholars gathered there unable to follow the esoteric

meanings shouted - 'sadhu, sadhu' and begged pardon. Thus Madhwa tradition

has till date has this work of Madhwa on this first nama. It is

altogether different matter that another disciple in Madhwa tradition has

given out 100 meanings for nama - Narayana. Our Sadhana is in

knowing/understanding/contemplating these esoteric meanings.

 

As you all are aware, the words/thoughts/mind set of Lord Krishna is divine.

In fact, it is said that he did not rendered all of 700+ slokas to Arjuna

but Vyasa(who is rightly called as Vyasaya Vishnu rupaya Vyasa rupaya

Vishnave) compiled all these for our sake. Who else but Lord can only

author works like Mahabharatha. Thus, the divine words and thoughts is

impossible to understand even for gods (let alone us) and hence, he being

indwelling in Acharyas (in a special way) wrote bhashyas for Prasthana

Trayas. Otherwise, the literal meanings of Vyasa's works will not do any

good for the mankind.

 

regards

sukumar

 

 

 

[]On

Behalf Of Krishna Kashyap

Thursday, November 17, 2005 8:17 AM

'rvv21';

RE: Re: Need some guidance and help regarding

Sanathana Dharma

 

 

 

 

Sri Tatachar wrote:

 

 

 

> 4. sa-rva dha-rmAn pa-ri-tya-jya.....mA shu-chah.

 

> Setting aside all other religious doctrines and dogmas, just

 

surrender to me alone.

 

> I will relieve you of all your sins and save you. Don't worry!

 

> (ESPECIALLY HERE STAY AWAY FROM OUR ACHARYAS BHASHYAMS).

 

>

 

> Good luck.

 

>

 

> dAsan

 

>

 

> K.S. tAtAchAr

 

****************************************************

 

Dear friends,

 

 

 

I generally like Sri Tatachar's views. I should say - a good modernization

of our ancient rishis' views.

 

 

 

However the following " ESPECIALLY HERE STAY AWAY FROM OUR ACHARYAS

BHASHYAMS" seems to devalue the views of great acharyas. This is not so

considerate comment on our great ancient acharyas such as Samkara, Ramanuja

and Madhva, who have toiled hard to summarize the whole meaning of

Bhagawadgita in this verse. Neither is this an easy verse, which is better

interpreted using a modern view, if one were to pay attention to the whole

text of Bhagawadgita.

 

 

 

I think one should understand our traditional bhasyas on this verse "sarva

dharman parityajya". Yes it is complicated and probably the person asking

this question is not so interested in deep "analysis and hair splitting

views on this verse". However, deep ideas are hidden in this verse and a

good understanding is necessary for any deep student of "hindu philosophy".

Further the diametrically opposite views, which have even crept into modern

books on Bhagawadgita is something one should know deeply.

 

 

 

For more details get this book from amazon.com or bizrate.com

 

 

 

 

 

 

<http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/8121511011/qid=1123042246/sr=

8-4/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i4_xgl14/104-3149499-1278347?v=glance&s=books&n=507846>

 

 

Philosophy

<http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/8121511011/qid=1123042246/sr=

8-4/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i4_xgl14/104-3149499-1278347?v=glance&s=books&n=507846>

of the Bhagavadgita: A Study Based on the Evaluation of the Commentaries of

Samkara, Ramanuja & Madhva by S.M. Srinivasa Chari (Hardcover - April 2005)

 

 

Books: See

<http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/search-handle-url/index=stripbooks:releva

nce-above&field-keywords=srinivasa%252520chari&search-type=ss&bq=1&store-nam

e=books/ref=xs_ap_sai4_xgl14/104-3149499-1278347> all 6 items (Rate

<javascript:amz_js_PopWin('/exec/obidos/tg/stores/recs/rate-this-asin/-/8121

511011/rate/no-refresh/ref=pd_rate_lk_rate_search/104-3149499-1278347','Recs

WhyWindow','width=480,height=450,resizable=yes,scrollbars=yes,status=yes')>

this item)

 

 

 

 

 

krishna

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The information contained in this electronic message and any attachments to this

message are intended for the exclusive use of the addressee(s)and may contain

confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient,

please notify the sender or administrator