[Y-Indology] rajakI

[Guest guest]

I presume from 'rajas' "dust, dirt, menstrual blood."

 

Allen Thrasher

 

 

 

Allen W. Thrasher, Ph.D.

 

Senior Reference Librarian 101 Independence Ave., SE

Southern Asia Section LJ-150

Asian Division Washington, DC 20540-4810

Library of Congress U.S.A.

tel. 202-707-3732 fax 202-707-1724

Email: athr

 

The opinions expressed do not necessarily represent those of the

Library of Congress.

 

>>> <naga_ganesan 04/29 1:57 PM >>>

 

Why is a washerwoman called rajakI?

 

It looks to be a literal loan translation from Dravidian.

Compare the bards' title in nAvitan/nApita for barbers.

 

Regards,

N. Ganesan

 

 

 

 

indology

 

 

 

Your use of is subject to

 

[Guest guest]

I would think so too. In sangam literature, washerwomen

(who are usually accused of bringing vezyAs to chieftains)

are called "pulaitti". pulaiyan/poleya(kannada) were

the so called untouchable castes. pole means blood, menstrual

blood in DED. Menstrual blood being extremely polluting

in old Indian culture, washerwoan was pulaitti in sangam texts,

this becomes rajakI in sanskrit.

 

Compare drav. poleya with the Nepali pore caste who sacrifice

buffaloes and other animals in all the Godeess festivals

 

Thanks,

N. Ganesan

 

INDOLOGY, "Allen W Thrasher" <athr@l...> wrote:

> I presume from 'rajas' "dust, dirt, menstrual blood."

>

> Allen Thrasher

>

>

>

> Allen W. Thrasher, Ph.D.

>

> Senior Reference Librarian 101 Independence Ave., SE

> Southern Asia Section LJ-150

> Asian Division Washington, DC 20540-4810

> Library of Congress U.S.A.

> tel. 202-707-3732 fax 202-707-1724

> Email: athr@l...

>

> The opinions expressed do not necessarily represent those of the

> Library of Congress.

>

> >>> <naga_ganesan@h...> 04/29 1:57 PM >>>

>

> Why is a washerwoman called rajakI?

>

> It looks to be a literal loan translation from Dravidian.

> Compare the bards' title in nAvitan/nApita for barbers.

>

> Regards,

> N. Ganesan

[Guest guest]

INDOLOGY, naga_ganesan@h... wrote:

>

> I would think so too. In sangam literature, washerwomen

> (who are usually accused of bringing vezyAs to chieftains)

> are called "pulaitti". pulaiyan/poleya(kannada) were

> the so called untouchable castes. pole means blood, menstrual

> blood in DED. Menstrual blood being extremely polluting

> in old Indian culture, washerwoan was pulaitti in sangam texts,

> this becomes rajakI in sanskrit.

>

> Compare drav. poleya with the Nepali pore caste who sacrifice

> buffaloes and other animals in all the Godeess festivals

>

> Thanks,

> N. Ganesan

 

 

 

Skt. rajakI is most likely of Dravidian origin meaning simply to

wash by rubbing/grinding.

This is attested in most Dravidian languages including many

North Dravidian ones.

 

DEDR entry #228:

Ta. arai = to grind...

Ma. arayuka

Ir. re

To. art

Ka. are

Kod. ara

Tu. arepuni

Te. rAyu, rAcu, rAyiDi = to rub/be rubbed etc.

?rAju = to kindle fire

Kol. rAk = to rub teeth, wash

Go. (Ma.) aRs

rAy = to rub

Konda.

rAs = to anoint (body), clean teeth

rAsay = to apply oil, turmeric

rAspis = to cause to apply oil/turmeric

rEs = to stir/mix, plate metals

Pe. rec = ti scrape, sharpen

Kui. rAga = to be rubbed, worb by friction

rApka = to cause to rub together

rEsa = to rub

rEc = to rub , smear

Kuwi. rAca = to rub

rAc = to wash (clothes)

rAcali = to clean

rAjinai = to launder

....

 

So without invoking blood/menstruation etc., using the above

metathetized NDr form of, the PDr root ar-, ra(k/c/j)= "to rub, to

clean by rubbing" one can account for Skt. rajakI = washerman.

 

Regards

P.Chandrasekaran.

 

>

> INDOLOGY, "Allen W Thrasher" <athr@l...> wrote:

> > I presume from 'rajas' "dust, dirt, menstrual blood."

> >

> > Allen Thrasher

> >

>

[Guest guest]

INDOLOGY, "Periannan Chandrasekaran"

<perichandra> wrote:

> INDOLOGY, naga_ganesan@h... wrote:

> >

I find this unconvincing. First of all, one would expect to discover

the word in other Sanskrit usages meaning "wash." Then one

would expect to find the word or its root used for a washerperson

somewhere in Dravidian. On the other hand, it is well-known

that all over India, the washer caste is polluted because of the

menstrual blood on the garments they wash. It is not scholarly

to use one's preconceptions to try to find etymologies -- it is

extremely easy to do, and quite wrong (e.g. Palaniappan's

conflation of two separate Dravidian roots, pul and poli). It is

much harder to look at all the evidence and make a reasonable

choice. In this case, Chandrasekaran has (in my opinion)

constructed an ingenious but quite erroneous folk etymology.

Has anyone looked to see what Mayrhofer says about rajaki.

One further note: why is it only feminine (or is it sometimes

Masculine as well)? George Hart

>

>

> Skt. rajakI is most likely of Dravidian origin meaning simply to

> wash by rubbing/grinding.

> This is attested in most Dravidian languages including many

> North Dravidian ones.

>

>[. . .]

>

> So without invoking blood/menstruation etc., using the above

> metathetized NDr form of, the PDr root ar-, ra(k/c/j)= "to rub, to

> clean by rubbing" one can account for Skt. rajakI =

washerman.

>

> Regards

> P.Chandrasekaran.

>

> >

> > INDOLOGY, "Allen W Thrasher" <athr@l...> wrote:

> > > I presume from 'rajas' "dust, dirt, menstrual blood."

> > >

> > > Allen Thrasher

> > >

> >

[Guest guest]

INDOLOGY, "Periannan Chandrasekaran" <perichandra>

wrote:

So without invoking blood/menstruation etc., using the above

> metathetized NDr form of, the PDr root ar-, ra(k/c/j)= "to rub, to

> clean by rubbing" one can account for Skt. rajakI = washerman.

 

Is it listed in Burrow and Emeneau's 1) Dravidian Etymological

Dictionary or 2) Dravidian Borrowings from Indo-Aryan?

 

Another possibility, given the rarity of r- words in *PDr. may be:

 

ra- (prefix) may relate to rubbing on stone.

 

But, -jaki_ may be related to the verbs: je_ki (Koruku) or s'oca

(Skt.) as seen from the following lexemes of almost all languages of

Bha_rata:

 

s'o_cayati sets alight, burns (RV.); s'o_cyate_ is purified (MBh.);

soccai purified (Pkt.); s'o_cun, s'ro_cun to be purified (K.) (CDIAL

12621). s'o_cis flame, glow (RV.); splendour (BhP.)(CDIAL 12620).

jo_ku, je_ki to wash (Kor.); so_ka_na_ to apply ointment, hot water,

etc., to one's skin, rub, apply (oil, etc.); mat soka_na_ to apply

medicine, anoint; ho_k- to rub on (oil, etc.); o_k- to rub; so_klal

washerman; so_k to anoint (Go.); so_k- (-t-) to clean body (while

bathing), rub, clean; caus. so_kpis- (Kond.a); ho_k- (-t-) to wash,

rub, rub on (oil); intens. ho_bga- (Pe.); jo_ga (jo_gi-) to wash

clothes; n. act of washing clothes; joh- to wash clothes (Kui);

co_shing to soak, steep; wash by rubbing, scrub (Br.)(DEDR 2872).

[source: http://sarasvati.simplenet.com/dictionary/5422TO.HTM ]

[Guest guest]

dear sir,

the word rajaki was used for washer women only and the meaning of

blood mensuration etc..,are also correst,asyou will be knowing that

the tantrk worships areprincipally opposite to the vedicworships,they

were incomplete without women,also the intercourse were main parts of

tantrik rituals.The mensuration was also used as one of the most

importent material for getting the tantrik sidhhisetc..,for that

purpose only they were in search for ladies,and kidnapping ladies and

girls,and secrifying them after worship.

As it was difficult todare for getting upper classladies and

therewere danger of getting strong opposition,thats why they selected

the lower class girls,ladies,like barbour,washermen,fishermen,etc..,

there are many words in rigveda,and other vedas which cannot be

derived from their rout words,as the meaning will be changed,

also the "patanjai"the authorof "mahabhasya"claimed ,therearemany

words of snskrat went in otherlanguages,so while going for their

meanings,one mustget the same meaning as per thatlanguage.

The tantrimk books clearly mentioned the names and casts of

thesegirls,so we must except their meanings.

this is my opinion

spsharma

[Guest guest]

Monier-Williams gives masculine "rajaka" (from sources including the

Mahaabhaarata), and derives it from rañj-.

 

Dr Valerie J Roebuck

Manchester, UK

 

S P Sharma writes:

 

>the word rajaki was used for washer women only

[Guest guest]

INDOLOGY, "S.Kalyanaraman" <kalyan97> wrote:

> >So without invoking blood/menstruation etc., using the above

> > metathetized NDr form of, the PDr root ar-, ra(k/c/j)= "to rub, to

> > clean by rubbing" one can account for Skt. rajakI = washerman.

>

> Is it listed in Burrow and Emeneau's 1) Dravidian Etymological

> Dictionary or 2) Dravidian Borrowings from Indo-Aryan?

 

Sanskrit lexicographers record raja as blood of menses,

and rajakI follows from that. 'raja' or rajakI are not

listed as Dravidian in Burrow or Emeneau publications.

[Guest guest]

INDOLOGY, Valerie J Roebuck <vjroebuck@A...> wrote:

> Monier-Williams gives masculine "rajaka" (from sources including the

> Mahaabhaarata), and derives it from rañj-.

 

"Rajaka, m. a washerman (so called from his cleaning or whitening

clothes; regarded as a degraded caste; accord. to L. either

'the son of a Paara-dhenuka and a Brahman' or 'the son of

a Nish.thya and Ugrii', MBh.; Kaav. &c.; a parrot or a garment

("suka or an"suka), L; N. of a king, VP, (prob. w.r.t rAjaka);

(ikA), f. a washerwoman, PaaN. iii, I, 145, Pat.; (akI), f. id.

or the wife of a washerman, ib.; N. of a woman on the third

day of her impurity, Bhpr."

(p. 862, Monier-Williams, MLBD reprint)

 

I fail to see the mention of the word, "ranj".

 

Regards,

N. Ganesan

[Guest guest]

Please correct me, but if I am not mistaken, rajaka etc. would be

related to rajas. Now rajas can mean general dust and impurity, as

well as (what I believe is a more specialized meaning of) menstrual

blood. (Note that it can also mean semen, so--even if one accepts that

it is the substances *on* the (dirty) clothes that gives them this

name--it need not be restricted to menstrual blood).

 

The _CittavizuddhiprakaraNa_ attributed to Aaryadeva, has the

following verses which seem to imply that launderers are known for

using dirt to remove dirt. Unfortunately for my theory (of the

derivation of rajaka from rajas), he does not use the term rajas

directly in relation to the rajaka (using mala instead), but he does

use the term in the immediately following verse, which is about the

method of cleaning a mirror. Interestingly, the term he does use

(mala) also has the meaning of bodily fluids in general. The verses in

question read:

 

yathaiva rajako vastraM malenaiva tu nirmalam/

kuryaad vijñas tathaatmaanaM malenaiva tu nirmalam//

 

yathaa bhavati saMzuddho rajonirghRSTadarpanaH/

sevitas tu tathaa vijñair doSo doSavinaazanaH//

 

Just as a launderer [makes] clothes

pure (nirmala) by means of impurity (malena) itself,

Likewise, the wise one should make the self

pure by means of impurity.

 

Just as a mirror rubbed with dust (rajas)

Becomes clean (saMzuddha),

Just so, the wise ones practice

The destruction of faults (doSa) by faults.

 

This suggests to me that, at least in the mind of this author, rajaka

was associated with rajas (in the sense of a sand or dust used as an

abrasive washing agent) and its use in cleaning.

 

Are there any clear references elsewhere in Indian literature which

would suggest a derivation of rajaka relating to the presence of

menstrual blood on the clothing?

 

Best,

 

Christian

[Guest guest]

INDOLOGY, naga_ganesan@h... wrote:

> INDOLOGY, Valerie J Roebuck <vjroebuck@A...> wrote:

> > Monier-Williams gives masculine "rajaka" (from sources including

the

> > Mahaabhaarata), and derives it from rañj-.

>

....

>

> I fail to see the mention of the word, "ranj".

 

Please check the paper version.

rajaka is listed under the entry for the root "ranj".

 

{raj} cl. 1. 4. P. A1. (Dha1tup. xxiii , 30 ; xxvi , 58) %{rajati} ,

%{-te} (only Gr. ; %{-raJjati} R. vii , 99 , 11) or %{rajyati} ,

%{-te} (Gr. also pf. P. %{raraJja} , 3rd du. %{rarajatuH} or

%{raraJjatuH} ; A1. %{raraJje} ; aor. %{arAGkSIt} , %{araGkta} ; Prec.

%{rajyAt} , %{raGkSISTa} ; fut. %{raGktA} ; %{raGkSyati} , %{-te} ;

inf. %{raGktum} ; ind. p. %{raktvA} or %{raGktvA}) , to be dyed or

coloured , to redden , grow red , glow AV. Ka1v. ; to be affected or

moved , be excited or glad , be charmed or delighted by (instr.) , be

attracted by or enamoured of , fall in love with (loc.) MBh. Ka1v. &c.

; (%{rajati} , %{-te}) , to go Naigh. ii , 14: Caus. %{rajayati}

(only AV.) and %{raJjayati} , %{-te} (aor. %{arIrajat} or %{araraJjat}

; Pass. %{rajyate} ; aor. %{araJji} or %{arAJji}) , to dye , colour ,

paint , redden , illuminate AV. &c. &c. ; to rejoice , charm , gratify

, conciliate MaitrUp. Mn. MBh. &c. ; to worship Naigh. iii , 14

(%{rajayati@mRgAn} = %{ramayati@mRgAn} Pa1n2. 6-4 , 24 Va1rtt. 3

Pat.): Desid. %{riraGkSati} , %{-te} Gr.: Intens. %{rArajIti} (Gr.

also %{rArajyate} and %{rAraGkti}) , to be greatly excited , exult RV.

ix , 5 , 2 (others `" to shine bright "'). [Cf. Gk. $ , `" to dye "'

, $ , &261033[861 ,2] `" dyer. "']

 

One can see that the root ranj (raJj) is connected with

glowing, brightening, coloring, or dyeing etc. Typical wahserman's

duties.

 

The interesting thing about that entry is that there are mainly three

categories of stems rak-, raG- and raj- listed.

Whle raG- stems have dyeing, pleasantness etc., raj- stems have

somewhat conflicting senses:

the raj- stems are shown to be more directly derived from rajas which

is clearly listed as having the senses of dust, particle, pollen,

impurity, dirt etc. darkness is also assocaited with that conflciting

with the putative root ranj = to glow.

 

 

Entry

rajas

Meaning

n. [deleted] vapour , mist , clouds , gloom , dimness ,

darkness RV. AV. ; impurity , dirt , dust , any small particle of

matter RV. &c. &c. (cf. %{go-r-}) ; the dust or pollen of flowers

Ka1lid. BhP. ; cultivated or ploughed land (as `" dusty "' or `" dirty

"') , arable land , fields RV. ; the impurity i.e. the menstrual

discharge of a woman Gr2S. Mn. MBh. Sus3r. &c. ; the `" darkening "'

quality , passion , emotion , affection MBh. Ka1v. &c. ; (in phil.)

the second of the three Gun2as or qualities (the other two being

%{sattva} , goodness , and %{tamas} , darkness ;..[deleted]

 

Moreover rajaka and rajo-hara both are listed as meaning washerman.

If rajo-hara meant "remover of impurities" then can the raja- in

rajaka also mean impurity? Could it mean "glow" as derived directly

from "raJj"?. And rajata is listed as meaning 'whitish,

sliver-cloloured, silvery'.

 

 

The entry for rAj is also worth considering: meaning "to shine'

illuminate" etc., MW says it probably had the same root as raj and

rAj .

 

Entry rAj

Meaning

1 (prob. originally two roots ; cf. %{raj} %{raJj} , %{RJj})

cl. 1. P. A1. ( Dha1tup. xix , 74) %{rA4jati} , %{-te} (Ved. also

%{rASTi} , %{rAT} ; pf. %{rarAja} ; %{rarAje} or %{reje} , 2. sg. P.

%{rarAjitha} or %{rejitha} MBh. &c. ; aor. %{arAjiSuH} RV. ;

%{arAjiSTa} Gr. ; fut. %{rAjitA} , %{rAjiSyati} ib. ; inf. %{rAja4se}

RV.) , to reign , be king or chief , rule over (gen.) , direct ,

govern (acc.) RV. &c. &c. ; to be illustrious or resplendent , shine ,

glitter ib. ; to appear as or like (%{iva}) Kum. vi , 49: Caus.

%{rAjayati} , %{-te} (aor. %{ararAjat}) , to reign , rule AV. MBh. ;

to illuminate , make radiant (cf. %{rAjita}): Desid. %{rirAjiSati} ,

%{-te} Gr.: Intens. %{rArAjyate} , %{rArASTi} ib. [For cognate words

see under %{rAjan}.]

 

 

P.Chandrasekaran

[Guest guest]

INDOLOGY, [George Hart] ghartiii wrote:

...

> that all over India, the washer caste is polluted because of the

> menstrual blood on the garments they wash.

 

 

I find that in Skt. most words for washerman are derived directly from

cleanser/brightener etc.

cf.

dhAvaka, nejaka, zauceya, deSNu

 

There are indeed some that are derived from rubbing/grinding:

mArja, marjU

where mRj

means as per M-W

" .. to wipe , rub , cleanse , polish , clean , purify , embellish ,

adorn (A1. also `" one's self "') RV. &c. &c. ;... to wipe , rub ,

cleanse , purify , adorn "

 

...

> Has anyone looked to see what Mayrhofer says about rajaki.

 

As I have pointed out in a previous message, we have to compare

rajaka/kI and rajohara.

 

I feel that the raja in rajo-hara is like mala in mala-ga (where

raja and mala mean dirt/impurity as in rajastamas) but that the raja

in rajaka/kI may be from raj = white as is rajata =

whitish/silvery-colored.

 

We need to look at traditional conflation of homophonic roots *here*.

One meaning to glow another meaning dirt/particle.

 

I venture to submit that rajaka is, like bhaj > bhajaka = apportioner,

raj/raJj > rajaka = cleanser/glower.

[Note that MW says "raJj or raj"]

We are supported in the latter by dhAvaka, nejaka, deSNu etc.

 

Of course

Regards,

P.Chandrasekaran.

[Guest guest]

dhAvaka also < dhAv = "to rinse, cleanse, wash, purify, polish, make

bright, (also to rub one's self with, rub into one's own person).

 

 

 

Regards,

P.Chandrasekaran.

[Guest guest]

INDOLOGY, "Periannan Chandrasekaran" <perichandra>

wrote:

> Please check the paper version.

> rajaka is listed under the entry for the root "ranj".

 

rajaka is not listed under the root, "ranj".

 

As I pointed out here before, in the main entry on

rajaka, the word "ranj" is not mentioned either.

 

Regards,

N. Ganesan

[Guest guest]

>INDOLOGY, "Periannan Chandrasekaran" <perichandra>

>wrote:

>> Please check the paper version.

>> rajaka is listed under the entry for the root "ranj".

>

>rajaka is not listed under the root, "ranj".

 

It is in my copy.

 

>As I pointed out here before, in the main entry on

>rajaka, the word "ranj" is not mentioned either.

>

>Regards,

>N. Ganesan

 

Lance Cousins

--

HEADINGTON, UK

 

CURRENT EMAIL ADDRESS:

selwyn

[Guest guest]

INDOLOGY, "Periannan Chandrasekaran" <perichandra>

wrote:

 

> rajaka is listed under the entry for the root "ranj".

>

> {raj} cl. 1. 4. P. A1. (Dha1tup. xxiii , 30 ; xxvi , 58) %{rajati} ,

> %{-te} (only Gr. ; %{-raJjati} R. vii , 99 , 11) or %{rajyati} ,

> %{-te} (Gr. also pf. P. %{raraJja} , 3rd du. %{rarajatuH} or

> %{raraJjatuH} ; A1. %{raraJje} ; aor. %{arAGkSIt} , %{araGkta} ;

>Prec. %{rajyAt} , %{raGkSISTa} ; fut. %{raGktA} ; %{raGkSyati} ,

>%{-te} ; inf. %{raGktum} ; ind. p. %{raktvA} or %{raGktvA}) , to be

>dyed or coloured , to redden , grow red , glow AV. Ka1v. ; to be

>affected or moved , be excited or glad , be charmed or delighted by

>(instr.) , be attracted by or enamoured of , fall in love with

>(loc.) MBh. Ka1v. &c.

> ; (%{rajati} , %{-te}) , to go Naigh. ii , 14: Caus. %{rajayati}

> (only AV.) and %{raJjayati} , %{-te} (aor. %{arIrajat} or

>%{araraJjat} ; Pass. %{rajyate} ; aor. %{araJji} or %{arAJji}) , to

>dye , colour ,

> paint , redden , illuminate AV. &c. &c. ; to rejoice , charm ,

>gratify , conciliate MaitrUp. Mn. MBh. &c. ; to worship Naigh. iii

>, 14 (%{rajayati@mRgAn} = %{ramayati@mRgAn} Pa1n2. 6-4 , 24 Va1rtt.

>3 Pat.): Desid. %{riraGkSati} , %{-te} Gr.: Intens. %{rArajIti}

>(Gr. also %{rArajyate} and %{rAraGkti}) , to be greatly excited ,

>exult RV. ix , 5 , 2 (others `" to shine bright "'). [Cf. Gk. $ ,

>to dye "'

> , $ , &261033[861 ,2] `" dyer. "']

>

> One can see that the root ranj (raJj) is connected with

> glowing, brightening, coloring, or dyeing etc. Typical wahserman's

> duties.

 

I presume this is the Cologne Digital Lexicon entry.

Here, washerman or washerwoman is not mentioned, isn't it?

 

Is there 'rajaka' in here?

 

Regards,

N. Ganesan