[Y-Indology] On Mr. Malaiya's comments

[Guest guest]

Stephen Hodge wrote:

 

> > >It must also be remembered that extensive portions of the

>aagamas/nikaayas

>> >etc were "retrofitted" with words being attributed to the Buddha to suit

> > >various doctrinal / organizational agendas --

 

I commented:

 

> > I have seen this repeated from time to time. But is there any

> > evidence for the claim ?

 

Stephen responded:

 

>So, conversely, you would maintain that all nikaaya / aagama texts are

>literally Buddha-vacana ?

 

Nothing I said could possibly be interpreting as implying that. My

point was concerned with the notion that we have a body of texts that

have undergone substantial revision as a later date for doctrinal and

other reasons. The concept of an agenda necessarily implies some type

of conscious motivation or it is completely meaningless. It also

implies something like a list of things 'to do'. As you know, an

agendum is a 'thing to be done'. The nature and processes of

historical evolution over time are an entirely different matter.

 

>Actually, you have misread my msg -- where did I say that the "various

>doctrinal / oganizational agendas" were sectarian based ? My view, on

>grounds of style and content, is that significant additions would have been

>made within the first 150 years with more after the various schools drifted

>apart. You will also be familar with Waldschmidt on the development of the

>early Vinaya.

 

So you agree that in the one area where we can test the matter, there

is no evidence for systematic, subsequent changes (revision).

 

> > I have seen evidence for what one might call 'doctrinal creep' i.e.

>> specific discourses composed at a later date which contain ideas

> > belonging to the time of composition.

 

>Precisely what I was alluding to in my initial message -- what else are

>these but "doctrinal agendas" ?

>

If you define 'agenda' in such a loose manner, then everything that

has ever been done by any human being is the product of an agenda. At

this point the word agenda conveys no information at all.

 

Lance Cousins