[Y-Indology] Difference between Varna and Jnati

[Guest guest]

--- ymalaiya <ymalaiya wrote:

 

In the past there has been extensive debate on the

> varna kayasthas

> belong to. A few cases had gone to court during the

> british period.

 

Could you please cite the sources. Where can I read

about the extensive debate? What are 'the few cases

that had gone to the court during the british period?'

 

 

> They apparently did not fit any of the four varnas

> (like quite a few

> other groups as well), and thus were considered

> varna-sankaras.

 

 

What other groups? Could you please name them?

 

 

 

> It is my guess that kayasthas were occupational

> groups, in some cases

> even brahmins served as kayasthas.

 

Please do not guess. Give us reasons or at least tell

us the the sources/writings/records that made you

guess thus. What is the basis of your hypothesis. You

often make tall claims, and seldom back them up with

facts or references.

 

Best.

 

Jogesh Panda

 

 

 

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[Guest guest]

Jogesh Panda wrote:

 

> In the past there has been extensive debate on the

> > varna kayasthas

> > belong to. A few cases had gone to court during the

> > british period.

>

> Could you please cite the sources. Where can I read

> about the extensive debate? What are 'the few cases

> that had gone to the court during the british period?'

 

For example, see cases cited in "WHO WERE THE SHUDRAS?"

by Ambedkar. It happens to be on-line at

 

"http://www.dr-ambedkar.com/writings/38C2.%20Who%20were%20the%

20Shudras%20PART%20II.htm"

See section IV

 

Some of the debate can be found in the Hindi Vishvakosh Ed.

Nagendranath Vasu (around 1923).

 

 

> > They apparently did not fit any of the four varnas

> > (like quite a few

> > other groups as well), and thus were considered

> > varna-sankaras.

>

> What other groups? Could you please name them?

 

They are too many to name, but once can see lists in places like

 

Jatibhaskar of Jwalaprasad Mishra.

The caste system of the Hindus: Surendro Mohan Tagore.

Manusmriti Chapter 10.

Also see atha-dvadasha-vidha-gauda-brahmaha-chaturvidha-kayasthanam-

utpatti-prakaranam in Brahmanottpatti-marthanda of Harikrashna

Shastri.

 

> > It is my guess that kayasthas were occupational

> > groups, in some cases

> > even brahmins served as kayasthas.

 

If I remember correctly, Rajatarangini mentions this.

 

Yashwant

[Guest guest]

> For example, see cases cited in "WHO WERE THE SHUDRAS?"

> by Ambedkar. It happens to be on-line at

 

For issues like this I would request people to use any reference but

Ambedkar! Ambedkar's arguments are generally skewed and devoid of

historical or textual support. He had a political axe to grind and he

used whatever arguments was convinient to his own worldview.