Guest guest Posted January 18, 2003 Report Share Posted January 18, 2003 <When Shivaji wanted to become a sovereign king, a chhatrapati, an objection arose that since he was not a Kshatriya, he can not be king.> As I recall, the objection was not that he was not a kshatriya, but that he was a Sudra. Would anyone confirm or contradict? V. V. Raman January 28, 2003 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2003 Report Share Posted January 19, 2003 V.V. Raman wrote: > As I recall, the objection was not that he was not a kshatriya, >but that he was a Sudra. Would anyone confirm or contradict? Wouldn't that be the same thing? There was a claim that there were no Kshatriyas existing at that time, and thus all non-brahmins are shudras. Also Shivaji or his immediate ancesters had not gone through Upanayanam. What is to be noted here is this - clearly defining the four separate varnas by birth today, is not possible. Everyone today belongs to all the four varnas, in some sense. Yashwant Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2003 Report Share Posted January 19, 2003 VVR> > As I recall, the objection was not that he was not a kshatriya, > >but that he was a Sudra. Would anyone confirm or contradict? > INDOLOGY, "ymalaiya <ymalaiya>" <ymalaiya> wrote: > Wouldn't that be the same thing? Shivaji was considered a Shudra until Tilak's times when Indian nationalism surged. http://listserv.liv.ac.uk/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind9803&L=indology&P=R13340 Esp. prof. Madhav Deshpande's reply http://listserv.liv.ac.uk/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind9812&L=indology&P=R2752 It seems Ambedkar (in his book, Who were the Sudras?) mentions about bringing some Benaras brahmins to get himself crowned, just few years before his demise. In Kerala, Trivandrum kings used to bring brahmins from Tanjore, may be because it's easier to get the jobs that Raja wants done with outer state brahmins. http://listserv.liv.ac.uk/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind9806&L=indology&P=R19391 http://listserv.liv.ac.uk/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind9806&L=indology&P=R19869 Incidentally, the Sivaji descendents were the first rulers to introduce quota systems for jobs in India. http://www.hinduonnet.com/thehindu/2000/03/24/stories/05242524 Jotirao Phule's book, Shetkaryaca Asud, was read in front of the Marathi rulers. Translation by Ms. Gail Omvedt, http://www.ambedkar.org/gail/Phule.pdf Regards, N. Ganesan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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