Guest guest Posted September 12, 2002 Report Share Posted September 12, 2002 Hello Satish, >>"The truthfull persons are seen in this world ofeten suffering like a death sentence, while liers and blasphmiiers are found making meeriment and rejoicing in this world." << What is suffering? When do you say a person is suffering? Let's look at the following story : A man found a cocoon of a butterfly. One day a small opening appeared. He sat and watched the butterfly for several hours as it struggled to force its body through that little hole. Then it seemed to stop making any progress. It appeared as if it had gotten as far as it could, and it could go no further. So the man decided to help the butterfly. He took a pair of scissors and snipped off the remaining bit of the cocoon. The butterfly then emerged easily. But it had a swollen body and small, shriveled wings. The man continued to watch the butterfly because he expected that, at any moment, the wings would enlarge and expand to be able to support the body, which would contract in time. Neither happened! In fact, the butterfly spent the rest of its life crawling around with a swollen body and shriveled wings. It never was able to fly. What the man, in his kindness and haste, did not understand was that the restricting cocoon and the struggle required for the butterfly to get through the tiny opening were God's way of forcing fluid from the body of the butterfly into its wings so that it would be ready for flight once it achieved its freedom from the cocoon. Sometimes struggles are exactly what we need in our lives. If God allowed us to go through our lives without any obstacles, it would cripple us. We would not be as strong as what we could have been. We could never fly! I asked for Strength......... And God gave me Difficulties to make me strong. I asked for Wisdom......... And God gave me Problems to solve. I asked for Prosperity......... And God gave me Brain and Brawn to work. I asked for Courage......... And God gave me Danger to overcome. I asked for Love......... And God gave me Troubled people to help. I asked for Favors......... And God gave me Opportunities. I received nothing I wanted ........ I received everything I needed! EACH AND EVERY ADVERSITY HAS A SEED OF EQUIVALENT OR GREATER BENEFIT - NAPOLEAN HILL ---------- As Erica, and pyari_h said, the Lord is all Merciful. how then can an all Mercifull confer suffering on His devotees? The very fact that we think we are suffering is b'cos we do not have sufficient faith in the Almighty. Can the Ocean of Kindness ever be partial and confer suffering only to a select few and that too to His devotees / dear ones? That apart, if you have an ore of gold, it is practically useless unless you purify the ore and separate pure gold from the dross. Only when the gold is subjected to a lot of heat, can it be purified, melted and made into a beautiful ornament. People joining the military /army / navy undergo a lot of heavy training. Only those subjected to harsh trainings can become good soldiers / commandos / black cats etc. So too these obstacles we face make us stronger, though it may not be apparent at the moment. When do we say we suffer? We say we suffer only when our desires are not fulfilled. When there are apparent obstacles in our path to achieve something we want, we say we are suffering. But in reality it is only a purificatory / strenghtening process, that we construe as suffering. Just like how the caterpillar, may think it is undergoing great suffering, and that its freedom is curbed inside the cocoon, but in reality, it's undergoing an internal transformation process, so it becomes a butterfly after the process is over. Now as a butterfly it enjoys greater freedom than it had as a caterpillar. But so long as it is in the cocoon, it must undergo the purificatory process. So too, our suffering is only what we infer of the obstacles we face in gratifying our desires. But in reality we are quietly getting transformed internally. Our freedom seems to be curbed, but only so we enjoy greater freedom eventually. I conclude with the following story by Ramana Maharshi : One day Sri Bhagavan was feeding the squirrels when a Muslim devotee, who had been watching him, gave him a note in which was written: "The squirrels are very fortunate because they are getting the food from your own hands. Your grace is so much on them. We feel jealous of the squirrels and feel that we also should have been born as squirrels. Then it would have been very good for us." Sri Bhagavan couldn't help laughing when he read this note. He told the man, "How do you know that the grace is not there on you also?" And then, to illustrate his point, he started to tell a long story. "One saint had the siddhi of correct predictive speech. This is, whatever he said came true. In whatever town he went to, the local people would come to him to have his darshan and to get his blessings. The saint, who was also full of compassion, removed the unhappiness of the people by blessing them. Because his words always came true, the blessings always bore fruit. That is why he was so popular. "During his wanderings he came to a town where, as usual, a lot of people flocked to him to get his blessings. Among the blessing seekers there was a thief. He went to have darshan of the saint in the evening and asked for his blessings. When the saint blessed him, the thief was very happy. He felt certain that because of these blessings, when he went out to steal at night, he would be successful. But it turned out otherwise. Whenever he went to break into a house, somebody or other from that house would wake up and he would have to run away. He tried in three or four places but he could not succeed anywhere. "Because of his failure, the thief got very angry with the saint. Early the next morning he went back to him and angrily said, 'You are an impostor! You are giving false blessings to the people.' "The saint very peacefully asked the reason for his anger. In reply the thief narrated in detail how unsuccessful he had been during his attempts to steal the previous night. Having heard his story, the saint commented, 'In that case, the blessings have borne fruit.' "How?" the thief asked with astonishment. "Brother, first tell me, being a thief, is it a good or a bad job?" "It is bad," the thief admitted, but then he defended himself by saying, "but what about the stomach that I have to feed?" The saint continued with his explanation: "To be unsuccessful in bad work means that the blessings have indeed borne fruit. There are so many other ways of feeding the stomach. You should accept any one of them. To come to this conclusion it was necessary that you be unsuccessful in your thieving work." "The thief understood and informed the saint that in future he would take up some other honest work. He prostrated before the saint and left." Having narrated the above story, Sri Bhagavan asked the Muslim devotee, "Do you mean to say that if everything goes according to your desires, only then is it possible to say that the grace of a saint has worked?" "I don't understand," replied the Muslim. Sri Bhagavan explained in more detail: "The blessings of a saint perform the purificatory work of life. These blessings cannot increase impurity. One whose understanding is limited will ask for blessings so that he can fulfill certain desires, but if the desires are such that their fulfillment will make the seeker more impure rather than purer, the saint's blessings will not enable him to fulfill the desires. In this way the seeker is saved from further impurities. In that case, are not the saint's blessings a gift of compassion?" The Muslim finally understood and was satisfied by these words. Hari Aum !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 12, 2002 Report Share Posted September 12, 2002 Dear Satishji, Your question is very valid and has been asked by many before. The enjoyment and suffering we see in the world is the result of our own past actions (Karmas). If we were to take a mundane example of a person working on a monthly wage, he goes to work daily and work hard all day but he is not rewarded for his hard work every evening at the end of the day's work. He gets rewarded for the work done on the 1st of the month only after a month. The law of Karma works something like this example of the mundane world, but is under the total control of the Law Maker, the Supreme Being, without any favor or discrimination. Have no doubt about it, the people who take advantage of their position or riches and make others suffer, cannot escape the rod of justice of the Lord. They are writing a bleak future for themselves. The Nature is very ruthless. When death comes, no distinction is made, between the beggar and the king, in His court of justice. When an earthquake or a hurricane comes it levels every thing without any distinction. Lord Krishna says in the Gita that the Nature (Prakriti) works under my control, "Maiya Adhaikshena Na Prakritihi". Therefore the people walking the path of righteousness should never give up their path by observing the bad people enjoying. There are two types of results of actions (Karma Phalas) viz. immediate and long term. The immediate we realize in this lifetime itself and the long term in future incarnations. For instance a doer of good actions will have peaceful life and a tranquil mind where as an evil doer shall always live in fear and have an agitated mind in spite of him looking happy and prosperous externally. OM, radhakutir. ______________________ > > Message: 9 > Wed, 11 Sep 2002 20:03:20 -0000 > safar_x > Re: "Sache Phansi Chadh di wekhe, Jhothey Mauj Manadi" WHY? > > Uma, Shiva,Pyari.svca and all. > I dare start a new subjectline. The tile is in vernaculer Punjabi > dilect of India. It Means, "The truthfull persons are seen in this > world ofeten suffering like a death sentence, while liers and > blasphmiiers are found making meeriment and rejoicing in this world." > My querry is:- > 1.Why it is so, and > 2.A honest Saadhak is very often than not, seen in "sufferings", and > still preached unattachment. > Comments please > Love, > Satish ______________________ > *********************************************************************** "Bhakti is immortalizing nectar; it transmutes a man into divinity. It makes him perfect. It bestows on him everlasting peace and bliss." --- Swami Sivananda. -- Please visit our websites on Vedanta: http://personal.vsnl.com/vedanta or http://www.geocities.com/radhakutir ********************************************************************** Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 20, 2002 Report Share Posted September 20, 2002 Dear Satish Sorry it has taken me this long to give my response to a very important question. It is one that has been addressed before too, by a different group of members and each time there is something new to learn. I notice very few members have responded so far. Where is everyone? I have actually been living through some such events lately, which kept me in the moment for the last few weeks. One has to step back to be an observer and perhaps I am better about it now after a few days. "Why do bad things happen to good people"? Last week I was told that a dear friend, extremely spiritual, was at the last stage of cancer. She had taken care of her husband, who died of same disease 4 years ago. She is now being taken care of by very elderly parents and a son in his 20's. She has been a sunshine in the lives of all she touched. She had a bottomless pit which she drew to give love, but refused to accept it from anyone. She valued her privacy above all. Today she has total privacy. A beautiful friend-couple who spent their career consoling others as a minister in a church, lost their 21 yr old son to car wreck. The son, who I knew since elementary school, had an incredibly angelic look about him all the time. Gone in a flash, no fault of his. Parents couldn't stand it, moved away, but the pain went with them. One of the most beautiful human beings in all the worlds put together (yes I'm biased), is a soulfriend of mine, who also lost his teenage son a few years ago. He and his family are like Gods gift to earth, a community asset, pouring love to all around them. The community asks .. Why? An old beautiful friend who wouldn't know how to hurt a soul in the world, lost her daughter to a car wreck 17 yrs ago. In tears she still asks .. . Why? As I sit with these sadhak friends through their grief and draw back long enough to obseve, I think over what I have learnt so far. A Karma yogi attempts to see the world as a play of cause and effect, and is exhorted to do whatever needs to be done without attachment to their fruits of their labor. A Bhakta sees the hands of their Beloved in everyone and every event is a divine gift. We are puppets in the hands of the Lord - sit back and take the ride. A Gyani sees external suffering as a reflection of the suffering within, and asks what is suffering, but an ignorance about what is happiness and bliss. A Vedantin says, it's not a snake .. its only a rope!!!! Those of us who believe in participatory management of our spiritual path, ( ) say we have some lessons to learn from this experience, and as soon as we learn those our lessons will be over. So figure it out and learn! A poem illustrates our predicament. The Caged Nightingale by Swami Rama Tirtha "There was a cage formed of mirrors, With a fresh rose hanging in the middle. The flower was one, but each reflection Was a separate object of love To the nightingale within. Everytime the nightingale flew towards a flower, It received a rap. What it thought was the flower Was only a reflection. When it flew towards it, It knocked its head against the glass. When it looked to the right, There was the rose. When it ran to left It suffered the same fate. When it flew forward It stubbed its beak. And when it fell It received another wound. But once, it turned back And lifted up its eyes, There was the real rose smiling. Feeling startled, it thought "Let there be no more deception". Is this the real rose Or a rose only in name? It flew up at once to the rose. Now there was joy, no cage, no mirrors. It was free. Oh Man, this is your condition Encompassed by the cage of the world. He in search of who, You are wandering from door to door Is shining peacefully within your own heart." A Buddhist story makes my favorite point. A hunter is hit by an arrow by accident. The companions argue about the course of action. Buddha asks, what is it that is needed at that moment? Is it a discussion about what karma brought him to this point or is it to decide what kriyas (actions) he needs to do to purify his future karma, or an immediate attempt to stop the bleeding and pain? This is the basis of his method (being in the present moment). Meanwhile the bleeding heart bleeds on. Om namah shivaya. _/\_ Tat twam asi Uma *********************************************** Post 4335 safar_x wrote: > Uma, Shiva,Pyari.svca and all. > I dare start a new subjectline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 22, 2002 Report Share Posted September 22, 2002 Thank you for your wonderful post Uma. This reminds me of a message by Kathy, and I'm reposting it below : A precious necklace was seen flashing from the bottom of a lake. Many felt tempted to recover the valuable ornament and dived deep into the water for it, but found no necklace anywhere. Yet it was clearly visible to everyone from the edge of the lake. They were all puzzled. Eventually they realized that there was no necklace at the bottom of the lake; what they saw was its reflection in the water. They looked up and discovered the precious ornament hanging from a tree. A bird must have picked it up from somewhere and deposited it there. God who dwells within you is the source of true happiness. In the objects of the senses this happiness is merely reflected. The individual, misled by birth after birth by having only a glimpse of this reflected joy, thinks that this is the real thing, namely sensuous delight. So long as one believes that true happiness can be had in sense objects without searching within, one will never taste true happiness. The kingdom of God, hence of happiness, is within you. -- Anandamayi Maa Hari Aum !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 23, 2002 Report Share Posted September 23, 2002 Conversation With God! I asked God, "why do you give me so many tribulations my lord?", and he answered, A diamond must have friction, to achieve perfection, a butterfly must be forced to brake her cocoon to be able and use her wings later on, If I give you only laughter, your face will hurt from laughing all the time, and your eyes will go dry, they will not know how to cry, If I give you Pain all the time, your heart will dry like a forgotten rose, and brake with time, so because you need exercise in all parts I give you both, laugh with abandon when you have joy, cry with understanding when you are in pain, but know you must have a balance in both, there is no night without day, no moon without a sun, everything comes and goes like the ocean waves, so learn to love the same when you are in happiness, or when you grieve, only then, you will learn to be, a true human being. I said thank you God, good night! till tomorrow again. ~ Tulsi ~ Poems from kavitanjali.com ***************************** Post 4389 s_v_c_s wrote: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.