Bhagavatam verse quiery

[Guest guest]

Here you can see what a Dvaita scholar (yes, he is from the sampradaya that

Gaudiyas belong to) has to say about the matter. I think this pretty much ends

this discussion once and for all.

 

"The context in this case clearly indicates that "varNaM" refers only to color.

They also interpret with that meaning for the first 3 yugas.

 

When it comes to the 4th one:

"kR^ishhNavarNaM kalau kR^ishhNaM sAN^gopAN^gaM sapArshhadam.h

yaj~naiH saN^kIrtanaprAyairyajanti hi sumedhasaH"

 

as in other instances, only similar approach has to be taken.

 

"In Kaliyuga, the black colored Krishna, with beautiful limbs and adorned with

jewels and attended by gods is worshipped by the wise thru sacrifices and

chanting of His names".

 

This they make a pAThAntara

 

"kR^ishhNavarNaM tvishA kR^ishhNaM sAN^gopAN^gAstrapArshhadam.h

yaj~naiH saN^kIrtanaprAyairyajanti hi sumedhasaH"

 

and further interpret "tvishA kR^ishhNaM" as "tvishA.akR^ishhNaM"

and then translate akR^ishhNaM as "golden complexioned".

 

There are too many problems with this approach

 

1. The word "kalau" (indicating in Kaliyuga) is made missing.

2. In an off-the-track way kR^ishhNavarNaM is translated as repeating the

syllable Krishna

3. akR^ishhNam (not black) can be any color, but they make it golden color only.

4. They attribute to Chaitanya only, where as it can be attributed to any fair

complexioned person, who chants Lord's name.

5. The whole meaning is a stretched, perverted meaning.

 

In this regard, for additional info see,

 

http://dvaita.info/pipermail/dvaita-list_dvaita.info/2005-June/000865.html

 

(user and passwd are dvaita).

 

Regards,

Kesava Rao

[Guest guest]

PRIYA SRIMAN !

JAI SRIMANNARAYANA!

 

WE ARE HAPPY WITH YOUR INTEREST. WE NEED TO UNDERSTAND THE MEANING CLEARLY.

 

The meaning of the sloka 32, ch.5, canto 11

Krishnam = Lord Krisha

Twisha = with the glow of the complexion

Krishna varnam = black in colour

Sa:ngo:pa:nga:sthra pa:rshadam: - along with 'anga=limbs of the body,

Upa:nga = other physical identities like kowsthubham, sri etc., in the body,

Asthra = weapons like sudarsana, panchajanya etc.,

Pa:rshadam = intimates like sunanda, nandana etc,

Su me:dhasaha = wise

Yajanthi = are worshipping

Yajnaihi = with pujas

Sanki:rthana pra:yaihi = filled with songs etc.

 

Here when we take the complexion, as it is dealing with Kaliyuga, the mu:rthy

must be a deity that is worshipped in temples as Archa Vigraha, made in black

stone only, it seems. The Sage Veda Vyasa did not accept white morble, it

appears. For sure, it is not dealing with the murthy which moves like that of

Vibhava Avathara.

 

Again, krishnam does not necessarily mean Lord Krishna only. Krishna = one who

gives immence joy to the devotees. The word Krishna talks abouall the forms of

Lord Vishnu.

 

"krishir bhu: va:chakas sabdah, nas cha nirvruthi va:chakaha" ' one who gives

abundant joy'

 

When you take the meaning like this, then only it goes with the meaning of the

other slokas 38 etc. As you have observed, the slokas from 38 are talking about

Alwars only. The reason is so clear here. 'narayana parayanah' = who chant the

divine name of 'narayana' means those who are dedicated to Lord with

ashta:kshari maha manthra. Only alwars and their followers do so. Other

Sampradaya people have their own manthras and ways. For taking narayana

ashtakshari, pancha samskaram is essential. Followers of Alwars & acharyas

only do so, but not other sampradaya people you have mentioned.

 

It is only the alwars, always identified with the sacred rivers they were living

with, even today. Others cannot claim that at all. They were only the wise

talked about the Archa A:ra:dhana in their songs in Divya Prabandhas. For

Alwars, archa is the ultimate, but not just means to the ultimate.

 

The great sage Veda Vyasa was predicting the forth coming appearance of alwars

in his slo:kas.

=chinnajeeyar=

 

 

"tesh_tel"

Bhagavatam verse quiery

 

Jai Shri Krishna.

 

I have come across two verses in chapter 5 of canto 11 of the Srimad

Bhagavata purana, in these verse Narada, explians how Sriman NArayam is

worshiped the varius yugas, and i would like to know how these verses are

construed and Interpreted by in Sri vaishnava sampradaya.

 

Fristly we have Sloka 32 (chapter 5, canto 11)

 

krishna-varnam tvishakrishnam

sangopangastra-parshadam

yajnaih sankirtana-prayair

yajanti hi su-medhasah

 

TRANSLATION

 

In the age of Kali, intelligent persons perform congregational chanting to

worship the incarnation of Godhead who constantly sings the names of

Krishna. Although His complexion is not blackish, He is Krishna Himself. He

is accompanied by His associates, servants, weapons and confidential

companions.

 

Secondly there are verses 38-40 in the same chapter

 

kritadishu praja rajan

kalav icchanti sambhavam

kalau khalu bhavishyanti

narayana-parayanah

kvacit kvacin maha-raja

dravideshu ca bhurisah

tamraparni nadi yatra

kritamala payasvini

kaveri ca maha-punya

pratici ca maha-nadi

ye pibanti jalam tasam

manuja manujesvara

prayo bhakta bhagavati

vasudeve 'malasayah

 

 

TRANSLATION

 

My dear King, the inhabitants of Satya-yuga and other ages eagerly desire to

take birth in this age of Kali, since in this age there will be many

devotees of the Supreme Lord, Narayana. These devotees will appear in

various places but will be especially numerous in South India. O master of

men, in the age of Kali those persons who drink the waters of the holy

rivers of Dravida-desa, such as the Tamraparni, Krtamala, Payasvini, the

extremely pious Kaveri and the Pratici Mahanadi, will almost all be

purehearted devotees of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Vasudeva.

 

Who is being predicted in sloka 32???? Gaudiyas interpret this to mean

Chaitanya mahaprabhu, the swaminarayans see this as predicting Sahajanada

swami (Swaminarayan). What is the view of Sri vaishnava Purvacharyas in

regards to this verse???

 

In slokas 38-49 does the referrence to "the devottees in south india" refer

to The Alawars and Srimat Ramanuja?????