[world-vedic] SRILA PRABHUPADA'S DISCIPLE. In reply to Jan--- peace?

[Guest guest]

Dear Mahesh,

 

I am that brother of Jan who has been in the movement since '71.

 

Shrila Prabhupada tells us in his 1936 Vyas Puja offering to his guru that "

the guru is one." Frankly speaking, at this point, I feel that a person can

take initiation from whatever guru in the lineage, whether he be Narayan

Maharaj or Govinda or some ISKCON guru. If one is sincere, then Krishna

from within his heart will make arrangements. Krishna in the Gita promises

us that he will " carry what they lack and preserve what they have."

 

Shrila Prabhupada himself tells us that diksha can be a formality while the

siksha understanding can take us to the highest platform.

 

I can't believe that banging, fundamentalist litany of quotes which you

presented in an e - letter the other day. You are simply assuring that

sincere people will be alienated from Krishna consciousness.

 

Not everyone on these lists are hard core ISKCON people- some are curious

lurkers checking things out like my sister Jan. I think that every few

years, Jan looks into the movement and, every few years, she walks away and

finds other things. She keeps seeing things in the Western devotees of

Krishna which don't seem right to her.

 

YS,

 

Dharmapada Dasa

 

 

 

 

> In a message dated 4/15/00 3:26:44 AM Central Daylight Time,

> mahesh.r writes:

>

> << ONE WHO IS ACCEPTING DISCIPLINE FROM SRILA PRABHUPADA IS SRILA

> PRABHUPADA'S DISCIPLE. >>

>

> But not *only* Prabhupada's disciples are disciples.

>

> You are in ISCKON, I take it? One of my sisters and my brother have been

in

> the movement since the late 60s/early 70s.

>

> A furthered peace, which is always based on better understanding, is the

goal

> of communcation, always. My words are spoken in peace. But it don'

mattah

> to me.

>

> Jan

>

>

>

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[Guest guest]

Jan wrote:

> But not *only* Prabhupada's disciples are disciples.

 

You are correct because even Kanistha adhikari(neophyte Vaisnava) can accept

disciples although we note Srila Prabhupada *does not actually state* that a

Kanistha adhikari is a

spiritual master. Srila Prabhupada however, strongly gives the

warning:"Therefore a disciple should be careful to accept an uttama-adhikari

as a spiritual master."

 

NoI 5

In this verse Srila Rupa Gosvami advises the devotee to be intelligent

enough to distinguish between the kanistha-adhikari, madhyama-adhikari and

uttama-adhikari. The devotee should also know his own position and should

not try to imitate a devotee situated on a higher platform. Srila

Bhaktivinoda Thakura has given some practical hints to the effect that an

uttama-adhikari Vaisnava can be recognized by his ability to convert many

fallen souls to Vaisnavism. One should not become a spiritual master unless

he has attained the platform of uttama-adhikari. A neophyte Vaisnava or a

Vaisnava situated on the intermediate platform can also accept disciples,

but such disciples must be on the same platform, and it should be understood

that *they cannot advance very well toward the ultimate goal of life under

his insufficient guidance*. Therefore a disciple should be careful to accept

an uttama-adhikari as a spiritual master.

 

> You are in ISCKON, I take it? One of my sisters and my brother have been

in

> the movement since the late 60s/early 70s.

 

No. As you have seen I do not accept their concoction of guru by vote of 2/3

majority as opposed to July 9th 1977 letter instruction to be ritviks. Srila

Prabhupada also clearly stated:

 

Madhya 24.330

*maha-bhagavata-srestho*

brahmano vai gurur nrnam

sarvesam eva lokanam

asau pujyo yatha harih

 

maha-kula-prasuto 'pi

sarva-yajnesu diksitah

sahasra-sakhadhyayi ca

na guruh syad avaisnavah

 

The guru *must* be situated on the topmost platform of devotional service.

There are three classes of devotees, and the guru *must* be accepted from

the topmost class.

 

Madhya 24.330

When one has attained the topmost position of *maha-bhagavata,* he is to be

accepted as a guru and worshiped exactly like Hari, the Personality of

Godhead. *Only such a person* is eligible to occupy the post of a guru.

 

> A furthered peace, which is always based on better understanding, is the

goal

> of communcation, always.

 

This is nice. I agree. There is a peace formula Srila Prabhupada states:

 

SB 7.15.34 P

This peace is described in Bhagavad-gita (5.29):

bhoktaram yajna-tapasam

sarva-loka-mahesvaram

suhrdam sarva-bhutanam

jnatva mam santim rcchati

If one can understand Krsna as the supreme enjoyer, the supreme proprietor

of everything, and the supreme friend of everyone, one is established in

peace and is free from material agitation.

 

SB 8.8.8 P

bhoktaram yajna-tapasam

sarva-loka-mahesvaram

suhrdam sarva-bhutanam

jnatva mam santim rcchati

This peace formula for the world is given in Bhagavad-gita (5.29). When

people know that the Supreme Lord, Krsna, is the supreme enjoyer, the

supreme proprietor and the most intimate well-wishing friend of all living

entities, peace and prosperity will ensue all over the world. Unfortunately,

the conditioned souls, being placed into illusion by the external energy of

the Lord, want to fight with one another, and therefore peace is disturbed.

 

> My words are spoken in peace. But it don' mattah to me.

 

Okay --Jan we all do have some disagreements --but as Srila Prabhupada says:

 

69-01-21.Letter: Gurudasa, Yamuna

Perhaps you know that there are many political parties in a country, but

when the country's total responsibility has to be executed, they become

combined. To have some little disagreements amongst yourselves is not very

unnatural because we are all individual beings. But as we are all working on

behalf of Krishna we should always forget our personal interests and see to

the prime cause.