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  Gopalakrishnan Subramaniam < Date:  Sun Mar 3, 2002  12:22 pmSubject: 

Interview with the Qazi of Pakistani Jamaat

 

BHARATIYA PRAGNADECEMBER 1999 NUMBER 1 VOLUME 6"Our motto is constant

Jihad"Interview with Nawabzadaa Nabiullah KhanIn February, 1999, the "Jamhooria

Islamia", a monthly Baluchi magazine publishedfrom Panj-gar, published an

interview with Nawabzadaa Nabiullah Khan, aconfidant of and adviser to the

leader of one of the prominent Pakistani Islamicmilitant outfits,

Jamaat-e-Islami, which was conducted by Jalil Amir. Thefollowing constitutes

the text of that conversation which reveals thefundamentalist ideology and

designs of the organisation and its leader .Q: Please tell us about your stay

with Qazi Hussain Ahmed.A: Qazi has two bungalows in Peshawar. We spent a lot

of time in both thehouses. The first house is where his family lived and the

second house was hisoffice and rest-house. But he used to meet all his friends

and relatives andpolitical workers only in his family house. He made sure that,

at least for 3days in a week, Qazi and his close friends used to spend time in

his rest-house.Unlike his family house, the rest-house had all the amenities

that one can thinkof. It had a 36-inch television, 2 satellite dishes to

receive all kinds oftelecasts from all over the world. He had made extensive

notes on all thetelecasts. We used to discuss all the things under the sun in

his rest-house.I had a habit of drinking small amounts of wine. Qazi never

drank or smoked.Qazi knew about my weakness for wine. He advised me not to

drink and asked me tofollow the steps of Prophet Mohammad (PBUH). Though I had

a habit of drinkingonly very small amounts of fine wine just before dinner, on

Qazi's insistence, Ileft that habit. When I was studying in engineering

college, I had started thehabit of smoking too. I left that habit after Qazi's

advice on smoking.I stayed with Qazi for almost 6 years in Peshawar. I did not

agree to some ofthe strategies used by JI during the after-Zia years. Qazi is a

very practicalman while I was more of an idealist at that time. I was insisting

that the JIshould not rely on ballot as the only route to power. Qazi was

insisting thatballot is the only way for JI to come to power in Pakistan. This

introduced asense of alienation between Qazi and me. Hence when I went to

Baluchistan tomeet my parents, I stayed back rather than going back to

Peshawar. Even thoughalmost weekly once we talk over the phone, Qazi never

called me back to staywith him and I found my work as the Jamaat teacher in

Quetta where I stay nowwith my parents and family.Yet, my years with Qazi in

Peshawar and around the world with him were the mostsatisfying years in my life

intellectually.Q: What are Qazi's views on Islam and Prophet Mohammad (PBUH)?A:

Qazi was a great admirer and student of Prophet Mohammad (PBUH). He modeledhis

whole thoughts and life on the life and teachings of Mohammad (PBUH). I

wasastounded many times by Qazi when he did a small thing and he

immediatelycompared that incident with an incident in Al-Hadith and explained

that he didwhat Prophet Mohammad (PBUH) did 10 centuries ago. I had never seen

a person whohad modeled his whole life on the sayings and teachings of Prophet

Mohammad(PBUH) like Qazi.Q: The women issue is very controversial nowadays.

Taliban and somefundamentalist organizations restrict the freedom of women

while someprogressive Muslim intellectuals are insisting that the women are

equal to menin all spheres. What are Qazi's views on women?A: As I said

earlier, the Prophet Mohammad's (PBUH) views on women are the exactviews of

Qazi. Equality of men and women is stupidity. What men can do, womencannot do

and what women can do, men cannot do. Women are weak physically andmentally

compared to men. For this we do not need any proof other than to justlook at

men and women. Men have to take care of women all the time. If somewomen do not

have any male relatives, then they have to find a man and marry himso that he

will take care of her. Women should not have a life outside thefamily.

Education can be provided to them, but not to compete with men inpublic.

Neither they can fight in war nor they can be of use in peacetimepolitics.Qazi

had said once that when JI comes to power in Pakistan, he will abolish

thevoting rights of women and minorities. Only the Muslim men can participate

invoting or standing for elections. When I asked the proof from Hadiths, he

hadquoted many Hadiths in support of that. I asked him why is it that it is

nevertalked about openly in the public by the Jamaat? Qazi had said that the

hintsare all over the place. But JI did not make it a big issue since the women

whocurrently have the voting rights may vote against JI in the elections if such

athing is said openly. I was against this, for in my opinion, since all the

mainleaders of the Jamaat believe that women will not have voting rights after

theycome to power, they should openly say that. If you do not say it now and

thenyou remove the voting rights later when you come to power, that is going

tobuild a resentment among the people. But Qazi was firmly of the opinion that

JIshould not say that now.Q: That brings us to the question of minorities. Will

they have to pay Jizyatax?A: Yes. They have to pay the tax. As explained by

Qazi, the idea of Jizya is notprotection money. But it is a monetary force on

the non-Muslim to convert toIslam. Once the Jamaat comes to power, the

minorities will be induced (forced)to become Muslims either by monetary or

psychological factors. JI is alreadyequating India with Hindus so that the

Hindus of Pakistan will be forced tobecome Muslims. This was a very successful

strategy during the Babri Masjidriots. JI was actively involved in destroying

the Hindu temples in Punjab andSindh. We ordered the destruction of the Hindu

family property too. But our mainaim was to destroy the Hindu temples. We wrote

in the JI pamphlets thatdestroying each pagan temple makes a Muslim move closer

to the heaven of Allah.We used the Hadiths in all the pamphlets. Babar

destroyed the Ram temple inAyodhya because he was a true believer. The same

way, every Muslim should takeit upon himself to destroy the Hindu temples in

Pakistan. O!ur idea was to encourage the Muslims of India also to destroy the

Hindu templesin India. But this was not met with much success since the Hindu

police in Indiastarted attacking the Muslims who were doing Allah's duty.Q:

What kind of government does JI envisage for Pakistan?A: It will be the Sharia

government. Sharia will be made our constitution sothat the eminent Muslim

scholars who had completed the schooling in Madrasaswill be appointed as the

Judges in every court. Qazi wanted to make thepresidium on the same model as

the Khalifa. Presently our idea is that theentire top leadership of JI as well

as all three military Generals will be partof the presidium for which the Qazi

will be the Khalifa. We are keenly watchingthe progress of Taliban and learning

from it. We are impressed with the Talibanon the women issue, minorities issue

and law and order issue. Mullah Omar is agreat friend of Qazi. Omar had visited

his house many times. In the tentativetalks, we had decided to form a union of

Pakistan and Afghanistan once the rightconditions are set in Pakistan (i.e. the

JI government in Pakistan). Our mottois "Constant Jihad". The idea is to keep

Pakistan in a constant state of Jihadall the time. Qazi's vision is that

Pakistan will be!the centre of the new Islamic Empire that stretches from Burma

to Afghanistanand from Srilanka to Tajikistan including Kashmir.Towards that

end, the Jamaat will use all tactics from terrorism in thekafir-controlled

areas to negotiations in the Muslim controlled areas. Alreadythe Jamaat leaders

of Bangladesh and Jamaat leaders of India have accepted theprimacy of Pakistani

leadership in this regard.Q: Do they come to Pakistan?A: Yes. We had made

arrangements once in Peshawar and another time in Multanduring the Zia time.

But the understanding remains even now.Q: What about Srilanka and Burma?A: Both

are Buddhist nations. For that matter even Baluchistan and Afghanistanwere

Buddhist once while Sindh and Punjab were Hindu earlier. Buddhists aregenerally

weaker in matters of faith. Hence we hope they will become Muslim witha little

pressure. But that will happen only after Jamaat conquers firstPakistan and

then India.Q: What are the plans for India? It looks like the entire India

policy of theJamaat revolves around Kashmir.A: Yes that is true. But that is

for a very good reason. See Kashmir is like akeystone that sits on top of the

arch. It is true that the arch holds the entireweight of the keystone. But if

you remove the keystone, then the whole archfalls down. That is why it is

called the keystone. Kashmir is the keystone forIndia. Once you remove that,

then India can no longer be secular and it will notbe a united country either.

Like the stones of the arch, all the bricks willfall down. Qazi impressed this

idea upon Zia. Hence Zia started the OperationTopac. Operation Topac's idea is

not to get Kashmir for Pakistan as thought ofby Indian analysts. Operation

Topac is much more.The ultimate aim of Operation Topac is to make India a

million pieces so that itis easy for Pakistan to swallow India once piece at a

time. That is why Pakistanwas encouraging the militancy movements all over

India. Once Kashmir is takenout, these militancy movements will break India by

asking the similar freedomfor Nagaland, Kerala, Mizoram, Meghalaya, Manipur,

Assam, Jharkand, Tamil Nadu,West Bengal and Khalistan. But Benazir destroyed

our whole plan by giving awaythe details of the Operation Topac to Indian

government led by Rajiv Gandhi.That was a big set back for our vision. But yet

we are moving ahead.Q: I heard that she gave away only details about the

Khalistan movement.A: That is true. In my opinion, that is why I think the

damage is limited. Indiathinks and deals with separatist movements in different

parts of India as ifthey are genuine movements even now. In that way, I say, the

damage is limited.Q: Do you think if the States in India became independent

countries, no suchsimilar movement will start in Pakistan itself?A: No. Jiye

Sindh movement and small separatist movements in Baluchistan andPeshawar are

contained. We are not going to deal with the separatism in Pakistanas India

treats the separatists. It will be Taliban style. Actually we do notforesee any

position for opposition in JI ruled Pakistan. Hence the BNP andPakhtoonkwa

leaders will be made irrelevant.Q: Coming back to the same point, if India was

to become many countries, how doyou deal with the individual Hindu States? They

may even become big enemies ofPakistan. Or they may again re-group to challenge

Pakistan.A: Qazi and other people had already discussed this possibility. In

our opinion,such a thing is not possible since the language and cultural

differences betweenStates in India are enormous. There is no language like Urdu

to bind allIndians. English, and not Hindi, is common language among all the

States ofIndia. Hence we have planned to start riots in each State against

theneighborhood State people so that the States will always be in the state of

war.For example, there are a lot of Kannadigas in Tamil Nadu and Telugu in

Madras.We will start the anti-Telugu riots in Madras, which will keep Andhra

Pradeshand Tamil Nadu fighting. If we keep a bomb in the Telugu Cinema Theater

inMadras and keep a bomb in the Tamil Movie Theater in Andhra, the war

betweenTamil Nadu and Andhra will run for eternity. Similar things can be done

in theAssam Cultural Center in Bengal and the Hindi Prachar Sabha in

Orissa.Given the differences between the nationalities in India, the options

forPakistan are endless. Qazi's vision is to make the entire India a 100%

MuslimNation. A United India, where Hindus are majority is an impediment to

that. LikeProphet Mohammad (PBUH) made Muslims out of pagans of Arabia, Qazi

also wants tomake Muslims out of the pagans of India.Q: This is a great vision

since this was not even possible for the Muslimdynasties and Moguls who ruled

India for the last 700 years.A: True. That is because they had never really

established the Muslim Empire.Though the Kings were Muslims, they had

entertained the Hindus in positions ofpower. When you make an unequivocal

statement that only Muslims are voters anddeclare that India is an Islamic

Republic, then automatically the people willbecome Muslims. Little bit of

terror had to be applied to the heart of Hindusand Christians. I will give you

a best example. The portions which nowconstitute Pakistan had 25% Hindu

population before Independence. AfterIndependence, a lot of Hindus migrated to

India. Yet after the migration, thePakistani Hindu population was 15%. Do you

know what is the percentage now? Itis less than 1%. How was this made possible?

How did the Hindus convert to Islamin a short span of 20 years whereas for 700

years they had never converted toIslam? That is purely because of the terror of

the Partition.That terror forced the Hindus who remained in Pakistan to become

Muslims. Pureand simple. JI used similar techniques in Punjab and Sindh. Each

time a riotbreaks out in India, we had used that pretext to strike terror among

theHindus, Christians and Ahmaddiahs. The similar terror will be at the heart

ofevery non-Muslim, both Hindu as well as Christian, in the coming years in

theentire of India. Qazi is an analytical genius who knows every strategy that

wasused by Prophet Mohammad (PBUH) and which will be and should be used in

India toachieve the total submission to Allah.Q: Do you envision a possibility

that when Kashmir becomes part of Pakistan,there could be large-scale riots in

India against Indian Muslims? Henceunwittingly Kashmir could lead to more

deaths of Indian Muslims and damage Islamic Ummah.A: Yes that is a possibility.

But our ideology is based on Quran and Hadiths.Prophet Mohammad (PBUH) in

numerous Hadiths and Allah in Quran had said that anyMuslim who associates with

a polytheist is a polytheist. Muslims cannot befriendly with a non-Muslim. This

includes the Christians, Jews and Hindus. AlsoMohammad (PBUH) says that even if

the Muslim ruler is not good, the Muslims staywith the ruler rather than go out

to a non-Muslim country. Hadiths and Quran arevery explicit regarding this. All

the Muslims who did not migrate to Pakistanduring Partition are in essence

Hindus. They may think that they are Muslims.But not before Allah.They are as

self-deluded as the Ahmaddiahs who think they are Muslims wheneveryone knows

that they are not Muslims. Hence the Muslims of India who haddecided to stay in

India during Partition are not Muslims and their progeny arenot Muslim (since

they did not migrate to Muslim lands).Another thing that I noticed in my

journeys in India is that the Hindu farmersgenerally offer their entire harvest

to their gods at the end of theirharvesting season. This makes the entire crop

as haram for Muslims. Yet theseso-called Muslims of India are forced to eat

this food which was already offeredto some other God other than Allah. This is

explicitly forbidden in Quran. Andthis is one of the serious problems of living

in non-Muslim countries. ProphetMohammad (PBUH) knew such things; that is why he

ordered Muslims not to live innon-Muslim areas. Yet knowingly these so-called

Muslims live in India. Again,all the Muslims who migrate to other countries and

US are non-Muslims. Only theMuslims who intend to come back are Muslims not the

ones who decide to stay insuch countries. Hence we do not care if such Indian

Muslims die in the riots.But due to strategy reasons we do have excellent

relations with these Muslims.All the Muslims who work for Pakistan and for the

glory of Ummah are realMuslims. They are our front line troops in non-Muslim

countries. Hence we haveto distribute the arms and ammunitions to these real

Muslims in case riots cometo their door.The Kashmiri Muslims are pure Muslims

who are toiling under the yoke of Hindurule. They are victimized by the

international conspiracy to keep them under theHindu rule. That issue is part

of the incomplete Partition, whereas the IndianMuslims have accepted Partition

and stayed on in India knowingly.Q: Yet the popular uprising in Kashmir was

missing in 1965 as well as in 1948.A: That is true. That may be because of the

clout of Sheik Abdullah of Kashmirduring the 1948 war. Actually the Muslim

population in Jammu Kashmir was onlymarginally higher than Hindus. Muslims

constituted 58% while the non-Muslimsconstituted 42%. Hence Operation Topac

aimed at eliminating the Kashmiri Panditsfrom the Valley. We thought all of

them will go to India. Instead, many went toJammu and only very little went to

India. Hence we had to ask Harkatul to startterrorising the Hindus in Jammu. We

also expected large-scale war againstMuslims in Jammu as well as in all the

parts of India because of the killings.The Indian government suppressed these

information. Another thing that was notdone was the complete removal of

Buddhists and Hindus from Jammu and Kashmir. Wecould do only in the Valley and

not in Jammu and Ladakh. Hence the population ofMuslims in Jammu and Kashmir is

around 65% only according to Harkatul.Q: Tell us about your stay in Saudi

Arabia.A: We embarked on an Umra as a team of JI leaders. Of course, Zia had

arrangedevery convenience for us. We were accommodated in a Sheik's house. He

is one ofthe richest builders in Saudi Arabia. He owns few gold shops in Qatar

too. Sheikwas a personal friend of Zia Ul Haq. During the time of Zia, we were

notpolitically active. Since Zia did whatever Qazi wanted, there was no need

forpolitical power either. Hence we had a lot of time. That is the main reason

whywe stayed 3 full months in the Sheik's palace.This Sheik comes from a

Bedouin family of southwestern Arabia. He had the habitof drinking camel urine

and camel milk early in the morning. I asked him whydoes he do that? He replied

that it is the family tradition as well as Islamicpractice that is supported by

Prophet Mohammad (PBUH). I was astounded. ButQazi explained to me that it is

true. He told me three or four Hadiths in whichthe camel urine and camel milk

drinking is suggested. So Qazi wanted to drinkthe camel urine and camel milk

along with the Sheik. Since I could not bringmyself to drink the camel urine, I

drank only fresh camel milk, which was thickand frothy. But Qazi drank the camel

urine and camel milk in the same amount andat the same time as the Sheik. Qazi

astounded me in this incident. I am amazedby the fact that Qazi was ready to go

to any length to mould his life in theteachings of the Prophet.Q: Does he

continue to do that even today?A: No. He bought a camel after coming to

Pakistan. Three years later, he hadkidney stones problem. As per the doctor's

advice he had to stop drinking theurine while he continued drinking the camel

milk. The doctor advised him to stopdrinking the milk as well since the camel

milk is rich in calcium compared tothe cow milk. I think he stopped drinking

any milk or milk products. But he hadsaid that once JI comes to power in

Pakistan, he will popularize the camel milkand camel urine drinking in

Pakistan. But I doubt he can do that. In my opinion,only camel milk can be

popularized.Q: That is quite news to me. How was your stay in Arabia

otherwise?A: First I have to tell you that Saudi Arabia, as the country's name,

is wrong.It is just Arabia. Only that Saudi dynasty rules over some parts of

Arabia. Youcannot put your name before a holy land as if you own that land. For

Pakistan,if Nawaz rules it, will it become Sheriff Pakistan and tomorrow Bhutto

rules it,will it become Bhutto Pakistan?Anyway, one thing we noticed is that

the Arabians own slaves. Though Allah saysthat the slaves should be treated in

a nice manner, he did not advocate theabolition of slavery. If slavery is bad

as considered in today's world, Allahcertainly would have said that slavery is

wrong. Prophet Mohammad (PBUH) alsosaid that the slaves should be treated in a

good manner and the slaves should bereleased often. But if there is no slavery,

how can anyone release slaves? Hencethe re-introduction of slavery in Pakistan

is one of the future plans of theJamaat. All the captured Hindu Indians and

Srilankans will be made slaves towork for Pakistani Muslims. Every God-abiding

Pakistani Muslim will get slavesonce we conquer India.All the slaves who

embrace Islam will be set free. Slavery is Islamic. Jamaat isthe only political

party, which does not voice any opposition to the slavery ofHarees (defeated) in

Pakistan.We went around all over Arabia. We were surprised to know that there

are someHindus in Yemen. These ancient Yemeni Hindus are not Indians. In my

opinion,these Hindus are traders from India in the ancient times. I was also

surprisedto know that they have a Shiva temple in Yemen. Qazi was very unhappy

over this.When he talked to the Yemen leaders, he broached this subject. But

the Yemenileaders refused Qazi's suggestion of forced conversion of these

people to Islam.I don't know why they refused. I think it may be due to the

large population ofHindus from India who work in Yemen and Arabia. He disliked

the currentleadership of Arabia for this reason.In his opinion, Arabia should

not allow any non-Muslim into the holy lands ofArabia. Arabia should be 100%

pure. A large number of Hindus in Arabia iscorrupting the Arabians. Though they

live as contractors, they have thepotential to corrupt the minds of the

Arabians. One such thing is the presenceof Arabians in the Qatar Hindu temple.

First the king allowed the Hindus tobuild a temple and church in the holy

lands, thereby polluting the Holy Land.Second is that even a member of the

Royal family visited that temple toinaugurate that temple. To the horror of

Qazi, he had learnt that one of thepowerful members of the Qatar Royal family

is a devotee of a god calledAayappan. This news resolved Qazi to fight the

force of the devil thousandfold.Q: Such things happen in Pakistan today. I mean

a friend of mine goes to a Hindutemple. Another friend goes to church

meetings.A: Yes. One of Qazi's relatives wanted to become a Hindu. He did not

have achild for many years and it seems he had prayed to a Hindu God and got

thechild. Hence he felt thankful to that god and wanted to become a Hindu. Qazi

gotto know of this and called him and threatened him with dire consequences.

Thatrelative did not become a Hindu. But that incident made Qazi read more

aboutapostasy.Quran and Hadith clearly say the punishment for abandonment of

Islam is death. Since Sharia is not the law in Pakistan, and the current

Pakistani Constitutiongrants the right to change religion, it is legally

correct to declare oneself asHindu or Christian. But once the JI takes over the

government, it will makeSharia as the Constitution. Then Pakistan will also

legally execute any personwho leaves Islam and joins Ahmaddiah, Christianity or

Hinduism the same way Iranand Taliban treats its apostates. He also opined that

the presence of the Hindutemples in Pakistan is the root cause of the problem

and hence we want todestroy all the Hindu temples and Churches in Pakistan.Q:

This brings us into another area. Right now the Internet is becomingwidespread.

Even Saudi Arabia is connected with the outside world. Destroyingthe temples may

be good, but how can we insulate the Pakistani and Muslim peopleagainst the

corrupting knowledge totally?A: JI had taken a principled stand on the matter

of science and religion.Religion is far superior to science. Whatever man needs

to know is in the Quranand Hadiths. Knowing more will create problems like the

Atom bomb andTelevision. Quran and Hadiths are explicit in denouncing pictures.

Yet the lureof Satan in the form of photography and television is eating our

lives.Music previously was confined only to the vocal singing. Now science

andtechnology made the music widespread at a cheaper price. These are the lures

ofSatan. We have to be on guard against these harami things.Hence, more science

and technology is bad for the civilization. I had completedcivil engineering.

Hence I am privy to scientific knowledge. I can tell you howcorrupting that is.

It even makes you question the glorious Quran. There aremany Hadiths, which say

that the earth is flat. But any science will tell youthe earth is a sphere. But

you can use the same science like the relativitytheory to prove that the earth

is flat. It is the same case with evolution. Butthe point being that doubt is

sown in the minds of the people on the validity ofthe Quran as the word of God.

More and more we work hard to prove the Quran'sscientific correctness, more and

more people will get apprehensive of the truthof the Quran. This is an

abomination. This is why when we talk of education, wetalk of religious

education and not scientific education.It is true that science grew after the

Prophet's revolution in Arabia. That wasthe start of science. Now each and

every science is filled with anti-god stuff.If you want to become a doctor, you

have to read evolution. If you have to readany engineering, you have to believe

in the billions of years old universetheory which effectively says that human

beings came to the world only just oneor two million years back.Q: But we still

need the arms and knowledge of the Western world, which believesin science. And

again you had referred to television as evil. If we abolishphotography how can

we have passports or identification cards?A: Yes. That is strategic. With the

help of Allah, we will be given oil for themto run their cars and we will have

arms in that place. We will use their arms todestroy them in the course of

time. As far as photos are concerned, they will bebanned as it is done in

Afghanistan. If there is no need for people to go out ofPakistan, where is the

need for the passports? For those who have to travel toother countries like the

leaders of the revolution, they only will be given thepassport with photos. For

that, we will allow limited photography licensed onlyto the government. And the

biggest corruption in today's Pakistan is Indiansatellite TV and Indian cinemas

and Indian songs. We have to abolish these too.Q: Currently we have a lot of

opposition from Mohajirs regarding reservations.What kind of reservation policy

will the JI will have in Pakistan?A: We approach that problem as the problem of

language. Urdu-speaking Muslimsand Sindhi-speaking Muslims are fighting now. We

plan to abolish all theregional languages like Pashto, Sindhi, Baluchi, Urdu,

Punjabi and Brahvi. Wewant all the people of Pakistan to speak Arabic which is

our divine language.This will make everyone equal before everyone else and

there would not be anyneed for language or region based reservations. We also

hope that this will makethe Quran and Hadiths easier to understand and will

make the people follow theQuran and Hadiths to the letter.Q: There could be

language riots. One such language riot resulted in Bangladesh.A: Bangladesh was

not a result of language riot. The very idea that they areMuslims will bring the

Bangladeshis to Arabic. We already fund heavily theArabic language courses all

over India, Bangladesh and Pakistan. From Morocco toIraq speaks in Arabic, I

don't see any reason why from Morocco to Burma we willnot bring Arabic to the

people. Even Bangladesh will start speaking in Arabic.That time there won't be

any Bangladesh where the country name itself has thename of the language. Yes.

Right now our aim is just for reunification withouttouching on the language

issue of Bengali. JI of Bangladesh is working towardsthis aim.Q: The secular

journalists of Pakistan oppose the JI. For example the Dawn andNews are very

critical of the JI. How do you see their role in the future?A: Ardheshir

Cowasjee is able to work only because of the present Constitutionof Pakistan.

When Sharia becomes the Constitution, he cannot even approach thecourt, as he

is a kafir. We see secular journalists as our main enemy in thecurrent struggle

to reach power. These secular journalists are digging ourstatements we made

during the pre-Independence days and trying to beat us. Ofcourse we opposed the

creation of Pakistan during the British times. But thatwas a different Jamaat.

Our history starts with Independence. Secularjournalists are not Muslims even

though some of them are carrying Muslim names.Let them come to us and let us

ask questions on the Quran and Hadiths. We willprove each and every thing we

say is from Quran and Hadiths. Let them prove whatwe say as wrong from the

Quranic angle. Then we will accept them. But theycannot. They cannot match us

in any debate concerning the Quran and Hadiths. Wecan comprehensively prove

that they are indeed non-Muslims.!They are like Quadianis who say that the

Muslim need not take up Jihad as anobligation. That is pure nonsense.Q: What is

your plan in Quetta?A: I have family in Panj-gur. I have my work in Quetta.

Hence I travel all thetime. Though I am a close friend of Qazi, and though he

asked me to take uporganizational work, I refused that since I am not really

good in organizationalwork. There are very good people who are very good in

organizational work inQuetta. I am being contented with the closeness of Qazi

and being an ideologueof JI. Sometimes I speak in the Jamaat meetings.

Otherwise my time is spent inreading and sending notes to Qazi.Q: Thanks for

your time.A: May Allah's blessings be with you.

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