Vedic Indigenous Truths

[Guest guest]

"I am sure Dr. Mubarak does not claim to be more expert in Buddhism

than the Dalai Llama. He obvioulsy recognizes the unity of

Vedic/Hindu and Buddhist Dharma. Thus he is hosting a Dharma

conferance along with the modern leaders of Hindu spirituality in

order to confirm this fact.Its also why he chose India as his sacred

land away from Tibet."

 

 

Repectful Greetings,

What Mubarak wrote was total disinformation and paints a highly

innacurate picture of Hinduism. I apologise if I seemed anti-Islam. I

am not. I just see it as one of the ways to Divinity not the Only

way.

I encourage all sincere seekers to research for themselves and I

don't caution anyone to accept any "Truths" because we are all free

to accept "truth" as it appeals to our hearts. I encourage inquiry

and logical application of info to reach independent conclusions. To

add to the info pool I wrote this long rebuttal to Dr Mubarak.I

invite anyone interested to email me for the details like referances

etc.

 

Because we have no doubts about what happen to the American Indians

and as to who perpertrated these crimes against them, it is only

logical to understand that these same forces did the same to India.

One only needs to look at Constantinople and see the Islamification

of this ancient Christian city to recognize the same thing was done

everywhere Islam went. WHERE ARE ALL THE ANCIENT CHRISTIAN CHURCHES,

SCHOOLS AND LIBRARIES OF THE MIDDLE EAST AND NORTH AFRICA? I am not

an expert in that region but I am sure they perished under the sword

of politicized Islam.

 

In India,KAshi is the ancient city of Shiva but where is the ancient

Shiva temple? Its gone. there is a big mosque there, though. Go to

Mathura, Krsna's city.Where is the ancient Krsna temple? Gone. But

there is a big mosque there too. Go to Ayodhya, Rama's city. Where is

the ancient temple? We are told it never existed even though Rama's

story the Ramayana is the most popular ancient literature of India.

Though, Ayodhya is repeatedly mentioned as the capital of Rama, we

are taught that no one built any spiritual place of worship there

until the Mulsims built a Mosque there.

 

Now go to those parts of India that were never conquered by Islam.

What do we see? Many ancient and beautiful Hindu temples can be

found. They have been built with such mathematical precision that can

not be duplicated to this day.We are supposed to believe that there

is a magic line, north of which the Hindus were lazy idiots who built

nothing. But south of this line we suddenly come across the most

magnificent architecture. This does not make sense unless we

understand that North India was savaged by the Moghuls, who were

Mongols that converted to Islam.

 

Again we see another paradox.The Mongols were famous for destroying

and carried out some of the largest massacres in history. No one

denies they did this every where they went. Suddenly when they get to

India we are told to believe they did nothing but "liberate the

suffering Indians from the tyranny of Hinduism." Anyway I agree that

Islam has some liberating elements but fails when it teaches that

there is no Prophet except Mohammed and no God but Allah.

 

I do want to point out that I accept an individual's right to be a

Muslim or Christian. I however have been repeatedly proselityzed by

people of these two groups that feel they must convert me from my

heathen ways. This is the heart of the problem. I can accept Jesus

and Mohammed as reps of God but they can not accept Shiva, Krishna,

Rama or Mother Durga as reps of God.

 

In the parts of India unconquered by Islam We can also notice that

the women are much more involved in leadershiop roles, leading

chants, lecturing etc. They don't cover their heads and can always be

found at the front of social and spiritual functions.

 

The best way to learn about a culture is to inquire from members of

the culture in question.This is the honorable and respectful way of

researching. Unfortunately all of Mubarak's statements come from

people outside of the Hindu culture. They imposed their views on

India's history ignoring all the evidence based on the traditions and

beliefs of the culture itself.

 

This is a common tactic which implies that such superstitiuos,

ignorant heathens can not be trusted to tell the world their own

history. No, we are expected to depend on the so-called experts even

though they have no practical experiance or understanding of the

culture they are studying.

 

Thus we are taught that even though American Indian histories place

them solidly in the Americas from the beginning of time, the so-

called experts say "NO. American Indians are Asians that walked

across the frozen Bering straits."

 

The much maligned Hindu caste system is a modern corruption of the

Vedic Varna system. While secularists and outsiders translate Varna

to solely mean color, those being of the culture know it also means

aura or 'vibe'. As one would say that person is shining does not mean

that the person is literally shining like a light bulb but refers to

their energy or mood.

 

Mubarak says Manu (source of the word MAN)invented the caste system

thats not what the Indian literature says. The Vedic/Hindu scripture

the Bhagavad Gita means the "Song of God." In there Krishna clearly

says

"Chatur Varnam Maya Shreshta

Guna Karma Svabhagashm.."

Which means

The 4 Varnas or societal divisions were created by Me(God)

They are based on CHARACTER AND ACTIONS..."

 

No where does He say it is based on Birth. Its like expecting a

Surgeon's son to automatically be a surgeon.

This was a later practice which came in the later Vedic era when the

culture was in decline.So to say that it is real Hinduism is wrong.

 

Anyway, I challenge anyone to find one society that isn't divided

into functional roles. My Guru was once invited to the Soviet Union

in the 1970s. His host challenged him by saying,"Our Communist

society is superior to your Hindu/Vedic Society because we don't have

a caste system."

My Guru immediatley replied,"How can you say this? When you came to

visit me today you were driven by a chaffeur in a State owned car.

You got your permission to interview me from the Police and on your

way to my hotel room you walked past the street sweeper lady and the

front door was opened by the doorman.So its obvious that even your

Soviet society is depended on the functionality of the Varna system."

 

The point is that no society can survive, not even the ants, without

the Varna system, which is nothing more than a division of labor. As

I said earlier the problem arose when things became based on birth

rather qualification. This was a fault of the Hindus, but again the

natural devolution of any society is understood as an unavoidable

enventuality.

 

Thus In the "Song of God" Krsna says

"Whenever and wherever there is a decline and imbalance in the

natural order, I repeatedly come down to earth to set things right."

 

Thats why the lives of the great heroes of ancient India are full of

images of humanity and love. Yes society and humanity stray but the

heroes and worshipable figures of Hinduism are loved for the very

fact that they correct injustice. We Vedic/Hindus accept all the

Prophets, Avatars and Saints as Messengers of God. Not just Jesus or

Mohammed. Like a normal human can have many children and friends, the

Supreme Being is not limited to having only One Son or Messenger.All

these Reps of God came to heal societies diseased condition.

 

The trick of the Anti-traditionalist is to focus on the diseased form

of a society and present it as the normal state of affairs. Thats why

we are always informed about "the Evil human sacrifices of the Aztecs

or the scalping frenzy of the American Indians etc" and the

uninformed goes away believing the worst rather than the truth.

 

Just as the theory that American Indians are not indigenous to the

Americas was invented to rationalize European conquest as a 2nd wave

of invaders, the same has been done to the Hindus of India. As

someone who works closely with Indian tribals, I am very familiar

with many of their ancsetral tales. Who are their heroes? they are

great Vedic/Hindu heroes such as Rukmini, Bhima, Krsna, Sita etc. In

other words the theory that the tribals of India are a distinct

separate group from the Hindus of India is not believed by the

Tribals themselves. It is a theory invented by the British to

discredit the Hindus. This theory is called the Aryan Invasion

theory. Adolf Hitler's Aryan philosophy was based upon this British

theory.The results are well known.

 

According to the Vedic wisdom of India, the source of the term Aryan

or "Arya",

Arya means Noble not in birth but in deed. We know Aryan was never

considered a race because Balaram was a Light complexioned Aryan,

while Arjuna was also considered a great leader of the Aryans and he

was famous for being very dark of hue. Again we are told by the so-

called experts that even though the vast Indian literature never use

the word Arya to mean a race, it means a race because they have

decided it means a race.

 

As to the source of Aryan=Vedic=Hindu civilization. The theory that

they came from the inhosptibale barren russian steppes does not make

sense. India to this day is bountiful in both population and

resources. It is much more logical that such a prolific peoples would

come from a place of prolific resources. Besides the point that the

traditional sources both Hindu and Buddhist literatures never

identify a foriegn source of their culture. Again we are told to

believe racist theories that sprouted Nazism.

 

It is obvious that without the racist Aryan theories, we are forced

to come to the conclusion that India may have had a major impact and

been a source of wisdom for the ancient europeans. This theory would

mean that white people had to accept brown people as an advanced

civilization. This was unthinkable and unbelievable to the racist

mindset of european scholardom of the 1800s. I am actually quite

shocked to read Dr Mubarak's reinformcemnet of her Afro-centric

studies with the virulent Aryan racism of the Euro-centric theories

of yesteryear.

 

Race is not an issue in real Hindu/Vedic civilization thus the issue

of wheter Buddha was black is irrelevent. Krsna was black as well

thus the name Krsna which means dark as a raincloud. The artificial

separation of Buddhism from Hinduism does not hold up. Buddhism is

Hinduism stripped of its dependence on Sacrifice or the need to rely

on Scriptures or demigod worship. Buddha is an Avatar of Krsna who

came to stop the needless animal blood scarifices of the ancient

Indians.Again its God coming to set things right.I am sure Mubarak

does not claim to be more expert in Buddhism than the Dalai Llama. He

obvioulsy recognizes the unity of Vedic/Hindu and Buddhist Dharma.

Thus he is hosting a Dharma conferance along with the modern leaders

of Hindu spirituality in order to confirm this fact. Its also why he

chose India as his sacred land away from Tibet.

 

Mubarak seems to be promoting a form Matriarcilism. Again this is an

inbalanced view. The Hindu reality is one of Female and Male energies

in harmony. Thus there is no need to separate Hindu cultures into

patriarcal and matriarchal. Shiva is incomplete w/out Parvati/Kali,

Krsna is not complete w/out Radha, Rama is incomplete w/out Sita.

This is relflected in the natural world where Man and Woman together

reproduce, Lion and Lioness, Cow and Bull etc.

 

As for Celts and Tuatha de Dannan. One of the ancient Vedic races

were called the "Danavas" or the children of Goddess Danu.Tuatha de

Dannan means "the children of the Goddess Danu." They are the same

people and they play an imminent role in many of the ancient Hindu

legends. Great Kings like Prahlad and Bali were Danavas. Again there

is no separate Identity.

 

In conclusion I want to close by pointing out that it is because of

Hindu civilization that India has over a billion people yet still has

room for elephants, has the last remaining population of Asian lions

who use to stretch from Greece to China, Tigers, Rhinos besides

million of Cows etc. They don't need to cut trees for fuel because

the cow dung is dried and burns longer than wood.Because Hindu

civilization teaches that all of us, even the ant, is equal in the

eyes of the Creator, Hindu culture has survived to this day.

 

So anyone who made to the end of this article, thank you for the time

and please accept my humble challenge. Compare American Indian

spirituality with Vedic/Hindu spirituality. The evidence will speak

for itself. They are both ancient indigenous cultures that allow for

diversity, seeming contradictions and a variety of belief systems.

However we see any differances as complimentary of each other. There

is no need to convert and reject our anscestors ways, unlike the

demands of the Judeo-Christian-Islamic civilizational Paradigms.

Namaste

Vrn Parker

 

 

 

 

 

-- In Native-Prophecy-Council, "Sophia Mubarak"

<sophiamubarak2001> wrote:

> HO! Well since this is crosscultural, I am

> going to stick my neck out, and hopefully not get embroiled in the

rants against Islam in

> India.

>

> Al Islam was spread into India by the

> Moguls..and came from Persia...built towers and mosques, and

attacted millions of

> converts because they could be accepted into a religion which was

based on belief of equality which enabled the conquered indigenous

people who were caught up in the

> Hindu caste system, created by the Codes of

> Manu...based upon color...and the four

> classes of the Brahman, the householder, the warrior, the sage.

Buddhism also arose

> amongst the beleagured Black/African Indigenous people, called

Dravidians, but went back 8,000 years as the Harrapan cultures.

Buddha was an African/Black man

> and again million of people were able to

> escape the horrors of the "untouchables,

> the Dalits, the old Dravidian linguistic

> groups can be identified through the

> Tamil languages...even the word "sanskrit"

> adapted from these indigenous languages...

>

> I believe today the strategies colonizing

> from the era of British Colonialism to the

> present day international/US Imperialism

> aided through the agencies created after

> World War II, the United Nations, and its

> requirements for member nations, based upon

> an economic system of neocolonization, and

> a system of accounts, and accounting, which

> excluded primary economics, that which did not produce for the

market economy, was not

> included, plus there is not accounting for

> costs, damages. See my links:

> Afrocentric perspectives multidisciplinary

> studies, guide to research websites.

> Ah but I digress.

>

> I decided not to respond because obviously

> this "hindu" is embedded in a political/religious world view that

has

> consequences for him today, and this divisive psychological warfare

cooked up by Kissinger

> and his council on foreign relations, follows a pattern. The

indigenous people who are

> the laborers, agricultural workers, who live

> in the village economies, have ancient temples to the Goddess

Mother Kali, and still

> reflect the ancient matriarchy overthrown by

> what today is called Hinduism...a very

> syncretizing religion...when challenged by

> Buddhist teachings and its adherents, they

> went into competition by establishing

> "schools"...however, Buddhism like Islam,

> spread to the east...Thailand, Cambodia,

> China, Korea, Japan and Phillipines...

> cuse me, forgot the Vietnamese, and the

> great zen master living in exile in France,

> Thicht Nhat Hanh.

>

> It is foolish to pretend a blurb like that

> posted makes sense in the light of the

> suffering of Bangladesh, a very recent history, and the current

Indigenous voices

> posted and coming in still on the

> SAIIC and many others...that is the one I

> am most familiar with, and I have volumes

> printed out from 1996 to 1999 from

> India's millions of tribals (another way to

> identify the lower castes, and the outside of castes)....this

neocolonization by the

> Hindu/Muslim governments, which send in settlers, ban the use of

the language of locals, and destroy their economic system, is not a

new formula.

>

> I do not think it is religion we are talking about here, and hardly

what is indigenous

> according to whose definitions? If the

> Romany gypsies left their homelands and

> migrated, they are not considered indigenous

> by the un...because they were not invaded

> or conquered in this last century?

>

> I think if you visit my website, which is

> now only featuring five pages for research

> for news, alternative news, journalists,

> and you will see Afrocentric Multicultural

> Studies....I put this together initially

> on web after the World Conference Against

> Racism, Sept. 3, 2001, and America and Israel walked out on the

conference.

>

> So you have offered a very simplistic can of worms, and I caution

Anaquea specifically,

> not to make some serious acclamation that

> some "truth" has been revealed other than

> this person who is posting his complaints.

> We are not talking religion here, we are talking GeoPolitics in the

Nuclear Age

> and I personally read the India Times from

> a website, and whether you claim Islam or

> Buddhism, Hindus or Punjabi's who created

> their own little caste system, there is much hatred and confusion

going on here. I personally support Dr. Vandana Shiva and

> The Foundation for Research in Biology and

> Physics, and Kali for Women. It matters

> not whether Ganesha is in charge or the

> Veddic Goddesses, the Shastra Goddesses of the Star

Constellations ... we must move beyond all these hatreds of race,

caste,

> and class, and the role of women ....

>

> Dr. Sophia K. Mubarak

> http://community.webtv.net/sofiakmubarak/

>

> scroll down to Shivas Feminist Economics 101

> for the Indigenous Third World Network on

> your country and the destruction wrought by

> Nafta/Gatt/and Patenting of the Neem Tree...

> and the cutting down of your forests, and

> the destruction of your economic bases of

> what is termed "subsistence" farming...and

> how the IMF and World Bank and corporatization is wrecking your

world...

> not Islam. Islam is about spreading the

> light of the world...like each person or

> being is a point of light, seek knowledge

> from the cradle to the grave, even if you have to go as far as

china, all people are

> equal in the eyes of the Mysterious and

> Unknowable "Allah" of 99 atributes? for

> a Thousand Names, or Ten Thousand Names...

> and right now I am willing to state that

> Allah is the Feminine and Masculine forces

> in the universe...and is beyond names and forms. Islam is a

communal, tribal religion

> which blended itself onto many nations, countries, tribes and

peoples to bring back

> the light which had been put out during some

> critical historical epics.

>

> Myself, I am presently immersed in the study

> of the Celts, an Indo-european group who lived close to the

Himalayas, and the Aryavarta...Aryans...germanic tribes..and

> how these groups were the barbarians..i.e.

> outside of the Roman Empire, who came into

> Europe, and had earlier migrated from

> Macedonia, Illyria, Greece, Ionia....and

> Africa...called the Tuatha de Danaan...with

> the ancient pre Hindu goddesses and pantheon.