Guest guest Posted February 16, 2004 Report Share Posted February 16, 2004 Namaste, I will be grateful to you if you could enlighten me on the following: * What is the state of soul in the salvation? * Where will be the location of soul, that has attained salvation? Namaste Ramesh >ramanuja >ramanuja >ramanuja >[ramanuja] Digest Number 736 >16 Feb 2004 12:55:02 -0000 > > >There are 12 messages in this issue. > >Topics in this digest: > > 1. Re: Digest Number 731 - Sandhya/Gayathri related > "apramanujam" <apramanujam > 2. bhutanese rerfgee > bhuwan sharma <bhuwansharma_w > 3. nAnmugan thiruvandhAdhi-15 > "Sumithra Varadarajan" <sumivaradan > 4. Re: Re: Dasa Avatara > "Sumithra Varadarajan" <sumivaradan > 5. AchArya Hrdhyam 156 > nsp <aazhwar > 6. Fw: Ten avathAram-s > nsp <aazhwar > 7. geethA sAstramum nedunthAndaka sAstramum-14 > "Sumithra Varadarajan" <sumivaradan > 8. Re: Sandhya/Gayathri related > "amshuman_k" <amshuman_k > 9. Ten AvathArAs > nsp <aazhwar > 10. AchArya Hrdhayam 157 > nsp <aazhwar > 11. Re: Re: Sandhya/Gayathri related > srinivasa chary <srinivasadasa > 12. AchArya Hrdhayam 158 > nsp <aazhwar > > >______________________ >______________________ > >Message: 1 > Fri, 13 Feb 2004 02:56:55 -0000 > "apramanujam" <apramanujam >Re: Digest Number 731 - Sandhya/Gayathri related > > > Dear Bhagavathas, > I was really happy to see Smt.Sumitra's mail, as she has >written whatever I wanted to write. To add a few more lines to her >mail regarding the Anushtanam's followed by our poorvacharyars, > Our Ramanuja Sampradhayam emphasizes Seshathvam and >Parathanthriyam and also "Melaiyar seivangal". A Seshan cannot ask >questions nor he cannot do researches on the statements of his master. >(this is against our Sampradhayam). so all we need to do is to follow >simply. > Eventhough, I understand that it is difficult to follow(esp when >it comes to Sandhya) lets not find justifications for not doing as it >been rightly quoted in the mail "Avan manam kanni pOga nAm >kAranamAgalAmA?".If we start doing this way, then the future >generations will come with more questions such as "what is scientific >reason for doing Thiruvaradhanam, why should I go to temple as >Perumal is there in my heart as Antharyami etc. etc." > When our Ramanuja found it difficult for people like us(the >regular samsari) to do the three Yogas to attain our Beloved Lord and >made "Saranagathi" the best way, then why didn't he change other >karmas too? Are we that qualified to question them and change them? > >Kshmikka prarthikkiren, > >adiyen >ramanujam > > > > > >______________________ >______________________ > >Message: 2 > Thu, 12 Feb 2004 23:21:04 -0800 (PST) > bhuwan sharma <bhuwansharma_w >bhutanese rerfgee > >asmad guru vieow namaha >shreematey ramanujaya namaha > jay shreeman narayana > This is my first letter to you because i got link >just few days back. > I am a student of Bsc final eyer in Sikkim govt >College tadong. > Let me introduce to you. > My name is Bhuwan pyakurel,citizen of himalayan >kingdom Bhutan.Presently we are (certain portion of >citizen )spending the life of Refugee in Bhutanese >camp Jhapa nepal in estern nepal. > > We are large nos of Ramanuj shree vishnabs in camps > plese do send such informations which i should send >to people in camps > >jaya shreeman narayan > > > > > Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online. >http://taxes./filing.html > > > >______________________ >______________________ > >Message: 3 > Fri, 13 Sep 2002 18:37:54 +0530 > "Sumithra Varadarajan" <sumivaradan >nAnmugan thiruvandhAdhi-15 > >Sri Parthasarathi thunai >Srimathe Ramanujaya Namaha >Sri Vara Vara MunayE Namaha >Sri vAnAchala mahA munayE Namaha > > > >Paasuram-8 > > > >"elaituNai mattrennenjE Esanaivendra > > silaikoNda senkaNmAl sErA- kulaikoNda > > eerain thalaiyAn elangaiyai eedazhiththa > > kooranbha nallAl kurai" > > > >Oh! Azhvar like a few who are adamant that we will eat only when cooked in >our house or else will remain hungry throughout why are you acting >foolishly saying "nAnunnaiyandri elEn kandAi nAraNanE" why don't you get >your wishes satisfied with the help of others? Azhvar answers in this >paasuram stating that no one other than the senkAnmAl (sriya:pathi Sriman >Narayanan) can become our saviour. Moreover not stopping with being unable >to help us they also prevent emperuman from coming to our help instructs >azhvar to his mind. > > > >(elaituNai mattru) More than understanding that emperuman is the only >saviour it is more important to realize that others can never take that >role. It is very important for a Srivaishnavaite to remain away from >anyasEshatvam (servitude to anyone other than emperuman) "thiruvadi than >nAmam marandhum puramthOzhA mAndhar". On the same lines, we have to get to >our memory the aphorism of pillai ulagariyan in mumukshupadi, "adhilum >anyasEshatvam kazhigaiyE pradhAnam" > > > >(en nenjE) Oh! My mind you are suitable for me to give this divine >rahasyam. You are not like the other's mind that has a number of >confusions ("sanjalam he mana:") > > > >Why do you say that others cannot be the saviour? That is because he alone >is the paramAtma. But there are references that state even rudra to be the >paramatma? Let's see how their paratvam remains continues azhvar, > > > >(eesanai vendra silai koNda senkaNmAl) the emperuman holds the bow which >was obtained on winning rudra. This particular incident is found in Sri >Ramayana Baala kAndam where parasurAma narrates the incident to Sri Rama >Piran. "Oh! Rama These two bows that belong to the devaloka where well >created by vishvakarma. They are world famous, strong, marvellous, and >powerful. Among these one was given to rudra who wanted to do >tripuradahanam. Only that bow which was handy in burning the tripura was >broken by you in the janaka sabhai. This powerful second bow was gifted to >mahavishnu by the devas. This vishnu danus has equal power with the siva >danus. At that time the devas wanted to test the power of Siva and Vishnu >and hence they requested the same to brahma. That Brahma who was chief >among the brahmajnAnis created a conflict between rudra and Vishnu. So a >big war started between rudra and Vishnu. At that time the great bow of >Siva that did many big jobs cracked a little just due to the 'hoonkAram' (a >sign of anger) of Vishnu. And Siva fainted. Later due to the request of >the rishis and devas Vishnu and Siva calmed down. At that time the rishis >who visualised the cracking of Siva danus due to the anger of Vishnu >realized the supremacy of Vishnu," says the Valmiki rAmAyana. This >incident has been reminded by azhvar in the above line. > > > >(eesanai vendra silai) So not emperuman his bow itself won over Rudra. >That shows that even emperuman's divya ayudhAs (weapons) have power to win >over other devatas. Then how can they be considered equal to emperuman? Or >otherwise it can be read as "eesanai vendra senkaNmAl" > > > >(silai koNda) Emperuman just held the bow that won over Rudra. It was not >necessary for emperuman to put any other effort other than just holding the >bow the rest was done by the bow itself. That shows that each and every >thing belonging to emperuman has special powers. That even includes >bhagavatas. So the anya devatas never come near bhagavatas or they show >their special regards to the bhagavatas. > > > >(senkaNmAl) Emperuman has reddish eyes that indicate his supremacy. >"kapyAsam pundareekamEva aksheenee" (he has two eyes that are like the >lotus that has blossomed due to the rising of the sun). Sem kaN mAl can >also refer to Sri rAmapiran with reddish eyes that indicate his love to his >devotees. "rAmO rAjeeva lOchana:rAma kamala patrAksha:Sem kaN" >refers to wealth and love whereas "mAl" refers to supreme and lover. > > > >(elai tuNai mattrennenjE eesani vendra silai koNda senkaNmAl) Will the >emperuman who won over Rudra become the sarva rakshakan or will the >defeated Rudra become the saviour? > > > >(senkaNmAl sErA) Not joining the ghosti of rAma who is the incarnation of >the pundareekAkshan, sarvEshvaran rAvana says, > >"dvithA bhajjEyamapyEvam.....svabhAvO dhuradhikrama:" (Even if I am cut >into two I will not prostrate anyone. This is a quality born with me and >hence cannot be changed) > >(senkaNmAl sErA) Even after seeing the beautiful lovable eyes of emperuman >can anyone be without falling to his feet? > >(eesanai vendra....senkaNmAl sErA) But when even Rudra who is a devotee of >emperuman (anukoolan) suddenly due to the increase of thAmasa guna wages a >war against emperuman what to say about a person who is always in the >opposite army (prathikoolan). Who is that? > > > >(kulaikoNda eerainthaliyAn) He is none other than ravana who has a bunch of >10 heads. "koththuthalaivan kudikeda thOndriya" says periyAzhvar (1-9-3) > >(eerainthalaiyAn elangaiyai eedazhiththa) "lankAm rAvaNa pAlithAm" the >lanka was protected by a great warrior, rAvana. But even that lanka was >shattered by emperuman. > > > >(kooranbhanallAl kurai elai tuNai) None other than rAmapiran who has a >strong arrow in his hands can solve our problems and protect us. > > > >PeriyavAchAn pillai's vyakhyanam > > > >"EmperumAnAr sri pAdhaththai Ashsrayiththavargal achEtanamAna kriyA >kalApaththinudaiya koormaiyai vishvashittirArgal. Chakravarththi thirumagan >ambin koormaiyaiyAyittru thanjamAga ninaiththiruppar" > > > >From the above it has been very clearly stated that for Srivaishnavas who >have fallen to the feet of Swamy emperumAnAr anya sEshatvam has to >absolutely abandoned and only the ultimate faith in emperuman is essential. > > > >Note: If we want to be in the emperumAnAr ghosti then it is absolutely >essential for us to give up anya devata worship. At this point we have to >get to memory the great kooraththAzhvan who gave up even darshan of >namperumal to uphold his status as the disciple of swamy emperumAnAr. >Being a disciple of that great acharya is more essential than even >emperuman himself that has been shown by all our acharyas. Get to memory >the acharya bhakthi of vaduga Nambi. So it is our prime duty to follow >them and get uplifted. > > > >Saint thyagaraja, in one of his krithis beautifully says, "nithichAla >sukamA rAma sannithi sEva sukama" What is crores of wealth going to grant >us will it ever equal what the service to emperuman will actually grant us? > > > > (To be continued) > > > >Azhvar emperumAnAr Jeeyer thiruvadigalE sharaNam > > > >Adiyen ramanuja dAsee >Sumithra Varadarajan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >______________________ >______________________ > >Message: 4 > Fri, 13 Sep 2002 19:07:05 +0530 > "Sumithra Varadarajan" <sumivaradan >Re: Re: Dasa Avatara > >SrimathE rAmAnujaya Namaha >Dear Bhagavatas, > >Buddha avataram is surely a avatharam of perumal but it has been >disregarded by our acharyas (refer Sri Parasara bhattar's bhagavat guna >darpanam-commentary to Vishnu sahasranAma bhAsyam) since that avatharam was >mainly done to side track the evil people who did all wrong things with the >help of the vedas. In Vishnu sahasranAmam the thirunAmas from 787-810 >(durArihA to mahAkartha:) talk about buddhAvatara only. This buddha >avathara is quite different from goutama buddha who is the founder of >Buddism. Balarama avatara ofcourse is among the 10 avataras without any >doubt and that has been very clearly stated by the azhvars as already shown >by Sri Lakshmi Narasimhan and Sri Padmanabhan. > >Alwar emperumAnAr Jeeyer thiruvadigalE sharaNam >Adiyen ramanuja dAsee >Sumithra Varadarajan > > - > Lakshmi Narasimhan > ramanuja > Friday, February 13, 2004 1:50 AM > [ramanuja] Re: Dasa Avatara > > > Asmad Gurubhyo Namaha > Srimathe Ramanujaya Namaha > Dear Shriman Soundararajan, > I am sharing what I know on this subject. I apologize in case of > mistakes. > > Some avathaaraas are not much glorified by Azhwars. Those are > Matsya, Koorma, Parasurama, Balarama and Kalki. Periyazhwar did > summarize all these dasaavataras though: > "Thenudaya meenamaai, aamayaai, enamaai, ariyaai, kuralaai, > moondruruviraamanaai, kannanaai, kalkiyai mudippan kovil..." > > Parasurama has been in fact depicted as an angry person from whom > Shri Rama grabbed the Dhanus and along with it his anger & thapas. > As Parasurama and Balarama are more of aavesa avathaarams, they > aren't glorified to much extent. But there are references to these > in quite a few pasurams of azhwars. > > Choodikkoduttha chudarkkodi says, "Baladevarkkor > keezhkkandrai", "semporkazhal adi selva baladeva" etc. > > Thiru Arangatthamudhanaar (author of Ramanusa Nootrandhadhi) says: > "Kokkula mannarai moovezhukaal, orr koor mazhuvaal, pokkiya devanai > pottrum punidhan" i.e Ramanuja worshipped that lord who destroyed 21 > generations of the kshatriyas with a sharp axe - Parasurama. > > Regarding buddha, few of our scholars say that it was Shriman > Narayana who came as him to spread the naasthika matham to maintain > a balance. I am not sure whether this is authentic. Even if this is > true, it is definitely not a part of the 10 avataarams. It would be > more of a side track like Hayagreeva, Hamsa avataarams. > > I am sure other learned scholars might come up with more information. > > Sarva aparaadhaan kshamasva > > Azhwaar Emperumaanaar Jeeyar Thiruvadigale Saranam > > adiyen, > Ramanuja Dasan > > ramanuja, vimalkumar ranganathan > <panardasan> wrote: > > Sri: > > > > Respected SriVaishnavAs, > > > > Many fora, many discussions on this topic. I want to encapsulate > them all in a single mail. According to Sri Vaishnavism, the 10 > AvatArAs of Lord Sriman Narayana are: > > > > 1) Matsya > > 2) kUrma > > 3) VarAhA > > 4) Nrsimha > > 5) vAmanA > > 6) parasurAmA > > 7) rAmA > > 8) balarAmA > > 9) KrSnA > > 10) KalkI. > > > > Has balarAmA been glorified by the AzhwArs or the AzAryAs?? > > > > And one more, the poet Jayadeva calls Buddha as an avataara, but > our AzhwArs tear Buddha and his philosophy to pieces. Is the Buddha > referred by JayadeEvA the same as "Adhi Buddha" or does Jayadeva > glorify Gautama Buddha himself?? And what is the stand of our > Sampradayam with respect to Buddha?? > > > > Dasan, > > Kidambi Soundararajan. > > > > > > > > > > Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online > > > > > > > > > azhwAr emberumAnAr jeeyAr thiruvadigalE saranam > > > > > > Links > > > ramanuja/ > > b.. > ramanuja > > c.. Terms of >Service. > > > > > > > > > >______________________ >______________________ > >Message: 5 > Sat, 14 Feb 2004 07:44:56 +0530 > nsp <aazhwar >AchArya Hrdhyam 156 > >AchArya Hrdhyam suthram 224 >The Sixth Ten >Lord's Divine Feet is the means for one and all. > >"ennaiyum, yAvarkum surarkAi adiyEr vAzhmin enRu karuNaiyAlEa sarva lOga >bhUdhEbya: enRavai kadalOsaiyum kazhuthukku mElumAgAmAl upAyathvam >kalvettAkkugiRa charaNyan..." > > >Summary: When the Lord did not show Himself in person to AzhwAr, emissaries >were sent " inform Him, that here is a woman left out by Him". > >The refuge is the feet of Lord in "thiru viNNagaram". There is no other >refuge. > >The refuge for the dhEvA-clans in their world is also HIm. > >Those who surrender unto His feet, without expecting anything in return but >Him, are out of His Grace blessed by Him.. > >It is highlighted He is the refuge for one and all. > >He is the refuge for nithya-sUrigaL, for souls like us in this world and >for animals. Even for those who expect something other than Him, He is >refuge. > >Thus, He is the refuge for one and all, for all purposes. He is in "the >thiru-malA" -Lord thiru-vEnkatamudaiyAn -- The means for one and all. > >pAsuram-s: The Lord did not show Himself in person immediately to AzhwAr. >The need for sending mesengers arose. Various types of messengers including >birds were sent to the Lord and to say > >" Here is also a person who is to be rescued by You?". >"yEaru sevaganArku ennaiyum vuLaL enmingaLEA" 6-1-11 > > >the Lord of thiru-viNNagar is the refuge for all >"thiru-viNNagar sEarndha pirAn varamkoL pAdham allAl illai,yAvarkkum vaN >charaNEA" 6-3-7 thiru voi mozhi; > > >He rescues the dhEva clans by vanqusihing the demons > >"vaN charaN surarkkAi asurarku venkURRamum Ai" thiru voi mozhi 6-3-8; > > >The Lord showers His Grace to those who surrender totally at His divine >feet. They are blessed by Him. > >"adikkEzh amarndhu pugundhu adiyEr vAzhmin enRu aruL kodukkum" thiru voi >mozhi 6-10-11; > >Is He refuge only for those in this worlds? >Even for the dhEvAs in their world He is the refuge >"vAnavar kOnodum namanRezhum thiru vEnkatam' thiru voi mozhi 3-3-7; > >Is He refuge only for those who surrender to Him completely. >No. He is approached even by those who expect other things from HIm >"ezhuvAr, vidai koLvAr, En thuzhAzhAn adiyEA vazhuvAi vagai ninaindhu >vaigal thozhuvAr" mudhal thiruvandhAdhi 26. >Is He not refuge for animal class. >Yes! of course >"pOdharindhu vAnarangal" iraNdAm thiruvandhAdhi 72 and " kaNdu vaNangum >kaLiur" mUnRAm thiruvandhAdhi 70 go to confirm this point. > >Thus Lord thiru-vEnkatamudaiyAn is the refuge for one and all; for all >purposes. >This is indelibly exhibited conspicuously in thiruvEnkatam--> kal >vettAkkugiRa charaNyan. > >(to be continued) >vanamamalai padmanabhan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >______________________ >______________________ > >Message: 6 > Sat, 14 Feb 2004 07:45:13 +0530 > nsp <aazhwar >Fw: Ten avathAram-s > > >- >nsp >oppiliappan >Thursday, February 12, 2004 9:33 PM >Ten avathAram-s > > >The ten avathArA-s have been precisely spelt out by sri kaliyan in his >periya thiru mozhi > >".mEnodu Amai kEzhal ari kuRaLAi, munnum irAmanAi, thAnAi, pinnum irAmanAi, >dhAmodharanAi kaRkiyum AnAn thannai.." periya thiru mozhi 8-8-10 > >mEnOdu=matsyam; Amai==kUrmam; >kEzhal=varAham; ari=narasimham; >kuRaL=vAmanam; munnum irAman=parasu rAman > thAnAi=chakravarthith thirumagan;pinnum irAmanAi=bala rAman >dhAmOdharan=krishNan;=kaRki-kalki. > >Another reference to sri bala rAmar >nAchiyAr thiru mozhi > >"patti mEindhOr kAr yEAru pala dhEvaRku Or kEzh kanRAi.." nAchiyAr thiru >mozhi 14-1. > >Lord krishNA behaved in a obedient manner towards His elder brother sri >bala rAmar. > >dhAsan >vanamamalai padmanabhan > > > > > > > >______________________ >______________________ > >Message: 7 > Sat, 14 Sep 2002 15:02:33 +0530 > "Sumithra Varadarajan" <sumivaradan >geethA sAstramum nedunthAndaka sAstramum-14 > >Sri Parthasarathi thunai > >Srimathe Ramanujaya Namaha > >Sri Vara Vara munayE Namaha > >Sri vAnAchala mahA munayE Namaha > > > >(VilakkoliyAi) Similar to the light of a lamp removing the outside >darkness, emperuman through the sastras destroys all our ignorance (inside >darkness, agnAnam). He with ultimate grace has bestowed the sAstras for >the upliftment of poor souls like us ("vedAntha krith vEda vidEva chAham"). > > > > BrihadAranya upanishad says, "AthmAvA arE drushtavya: srOthavya: >mandhavya: nidhithyAsithavya:" That is first stage is the learning about >the athma through listening to what the sastras say. Then a person starts >to analyse and think about it. When we feel that the thought is good to us >we start to meditate on the divine qualities of the athma and finally we >attain the athma sAkshAtkaram. But in the above upanishadic verse, the >order is a little different. It first says drushtavya: that is to see or >obtain athma sAkshAtkaram. Why? It is to increase our interest to know. >When I say the athma attains athma sAkshAtkaram the next question will be >how? Then the sruthi answers, first learn about it, then do mananam >(thinking) then meditate and finally you will visualise. Such rearranging >due to the importance of the meaning are seen in a few other places also. > > > >In one of his periya thirumozhi paasuram, thirumangai azhvar says >"vAthamAmagan markadam vilangu maRRorjAdhi" Here actually the paasuram >should be read in the reverse order. Rama showered his grace on a person >who did not belong to his clan (maRRorjAdhi), that to not even a man but an >animal (vilangu), even among the animals it is not a king animal but a >monkey (markadam) not an ordinary monkey but son of vayu (vAthamAmagan). >Here immediately all of us will ask, "How is being the son of vayu be >treated as lower than an ordinary monkey?" Yes it is low because the other >ordinary monkeys will consider themselves to be inferior but due to the >greatness of the birth surely ego and pride, our prime enemies will creep >in. Where there is ego and pride (ahankAram and mamakAram) emperuman never >goes near them. Only when we leave our self-effort emperuman showers his >grace on us. ("erukaiyum vittEnO drowpathiyai pOlE"- thirukkoloor ammal >varthai) > > > >In bhagavad geetha, slokas 55,56,57and 58 of chapter 2 are similarly >misarranged. The ordering according to the meaning should be 58,55,56,57. >These were given to prove that at times rearranging for proper >understanding of the meaning is not wrong. Coming back to our upanishadic >verse, the ordering for understanding the meaning properly should be >"srOthavya: mandhavya: nidhithyAsithavya: drushtavya:" The same has been >translated by thirumangai azhvar in his thirunedunthAndaka paasuram. >"vilakkoliyAi mulaiththu ezhundha thingalthAnAi" > >vilakkoliyAi - srOthavya: > >mulaiththu - mandhavya: > >ezhundha - nidhithyAsithavya: > >thingal thAnAi - drushtavya: > > > >Our dear geethAcharya puts the same in his words as: > >"sruthivipradhipannA tE yathA stAsyathi nishchalA I > > samAdhA achalA buddhi: tathA yOga mavApsyasi II" (2-53) > > > >SruthivipradhipannA - due to those specially understood meanings listening >to me (sruthi-listening, sravanam) - "vilakkoliyAi" -"srOthavya:" > >achalA tE buddhi: - your knowledge will get deep rooted (orupadipatta >jnAnam) - "mulaiththu" - "mandhavya:" > >samAdhow yathA nischala stAsyathi - when that leads to deep meditation - >"ezhundha" - "nidhithyAsithavya:" > >tathA yOgam avApsyasi - you will attain athma sAkshAtkAram - "thingal >thAnAi" - "drushtavya:" > > > >Here azhvar explains with moon as the example. First while the moon is >seen on top of a mountain (mulaiththu) it is brighter than a normal >lamplight (vilakkoli). So just listening removes a little of darkness and >then when we think about it, it gives more light. Further as the moon >rises to the sky (ezhundha) it spreads the light to a larger area so more >darkness is removed similarly when we start meditating without any stop on >the same subject as shown by the sastras all the darkness inside us >gradually vanish and finally we are able to visualise the athma that is >athma sAkshAtkAram (thingal thAnAi). > > > > (To be continued) > > > >Azhvar EmperumAnAr Jeeyer thiruvadigalE sharanam > > > >Adiyen ramanuja dAsee > >Sumithra Varadarajan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >______________________ >______________________ > >Message: 8 > Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:55:06 -0000 > "amshuman_k" <amshuman_k >Re: Sandhya/Gayathri related > >Dear Sri Venkatesan, > Kindly clarify whether the life incident of bhattar is quoted as an >injunction to TK VaishNavas for the non-performance of sandhya? >Regular performance of nityakarmas are typically ordained by dharma >sUtras of one's vedic affiliation (it may appear in grhya sutras in >some cases; smrti digests elaborate the dharma sUtras). > >From my limited understanding rAmAnujAchArya never attempted to >tamper the dharma sUtras, veda pramANas and the associated >paraphernalia (and even sanctions sacrifice of goat in the context >of yAgas in his gIta bhAshya). > >If I am right, the ashtAdasha bheda nirNaya discusses about >nithyakarmas - "whether an evolved sould will go to hell if he >doesn't perform them": yes -> vadakalai; no -> thenkalai, however >the evolved soul should continue to do them as an example for others. >This is a non question for unevolved souls! > >Accept my apologies if I've commited any mistakes or was offensive. > >Regards, >Kasturi Rangan > >ramanuja, TCA Venkatesan <vtca> wrote: > > Sri: > > Srimathe Ramanujaya Nama: > > > > Dear Sri Ramachandran, > > > > While it is good to see your enthusiasm for performing > > sandhyavandanam, the following lines are puzzling. > > > > > It is therefore, extremely critical and mandatory > > > for the Sandhya to be performed without fail. It > > > is quite surprising that Shri Vishnu has > > > questioned the efficacy of Sandhya and perhaps > > > thinks of replacing the Sandhya with 'namaa' > > > chanting. Come what may, the Sandhya is a nitya > > > karma ordained by the Vedas and no one is excused. > > > Dilution of Sandhya requirements are therefore out > > > of question. One may dilute all other rituals, > > > worship etc. but not the Sandhya. > > > > Is it your stand or our pUrvAchAryas stand that > > other rituals and even worship can be 'diluted' > > but not the sandhyavandanam. Is there any pramANam > > for this stance? > > > > Of course, the sastras themselves excuse many from > > performing the sandhya. So, how is that you say that > > no one is excused? Or do you mean only those that > > are eligible for it. > > > > Certainly our acharyas did not give up their nithya > > karmas, but only so as to not set the wrong example > > for those who are at the first steps. However, there > > are two things here. I don't think they saw it as a > > mandatory act which is an unforgivable sin when > > missed, as you are stating ; and they only saw > > it as a kainkaryam to the Lord and not for their > > personal benefits. And again, I believe their stress > > was on all nithya karmas and not just the sandhya > > alone. > > > > Guru Paramapara records that Bhattar refused to > > stop his fan service to the Lord for the sake > > of doing sandhyavandanam. > > > > Pillai Lokacharyar includes the performance of all > > nithya karmas as one of the sins that the Lord > > wipes out in the "sarva pApEbhyO" of the Charama > > shloka. > > > > Kindly clarify. > > > > adiyEn madhurakavi dAsan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online. > > http://taxes./filing.html > > > > >______________________ >______________________ > >Message: 9 > Sat, 14 Feb 2004 20:23:09 +0530 > nsp <aazhwar >Ten AvathArAs > >Dear srEvaishNavites, > >It is true that bhudhAvathArA is not an incarnation. However, as pointed >out, it may be a small act by the Lord Himself without being an avathAram >in particular. >The following is reference to this in thiru-voi-mozhi > >"kaLLa vEdathai koNdu pOi puram pukkavArum, kalandhu asurarai bhEdham >seidhittu vuyir vuNda upAyangaLum...' 5-10-4. > >The mention in Edu, irupathi nAlAyirappadi and onbadhAyirappadi -->' >bhaudhAvathAra vrudhAntham ennai naliyA ninRadhu engiRAr" > >It was already mentioned in the earlier messages that; > >a BuddhAvatharan who came to mislead the asurans with false teachings, this >Buddha was not the same Buddha . I think this is right. >dhasan >vanamamalai padmanabhan > > > > > > > > > >______________________ >______________________ > >Message: 10 > Sun, 15 Feb 2004 07:21:14 +0530 > nsp <aazhwar >AchArya Hrdhayam 157 > >AchArya Hrdhyam suthram 224 >The Sixth Ten Contd. >You but nobody else is my refuge- An impact of extreme devotion. > >"AgnAna asakthi yAdhAthmaya gnAnangaL aLavAl anRikkEa anguRREan ennAn >puNarAi ennumpadi meyyamar bhakthi bhUma balamAgavum ananya >gadhithvamudaiya thamkku..." > > >Summary: It was seen in the earlier posting that AzhwAr declares the Lord >as the means and also surrenders at His divine feet. Is it becuase AzhwAr >does not have the knowledge of other means? Or is it beacuse AzhwAr is >incapable of executing other means? Or is it because AzhwAr does realises >that the nature of the soul is to surrender unto Him and it does not behove >the soul to consider other means? > >These apart, AzhwAr mentions that " i am a person who has not followed any >means. Hence, you have to be my means and rescue me. I do not have anyone >else to salvage me. Please, see to it that I reach your divine feet" is >AzhwAr's plea. The immense affection and love makes AzhwAr think in these >terms. Hence, it is to be understood that apart from the facts mentioned >above, the effect of extreme devotion- migundha bhakthi- makes AzhwAr to >think about the Lord Almighty and only Him. > >pAsuram-s: >"angutREAn allEAn, ingutREAn allEAn, unnaik kANum avAvil vEZhndhu nAn >engutrEAnum allEAn.." --thiru voi mozhi 5-7-1--> I have neither performed >any formal means nor have put on efforts to reach You; However, my >yearnings and longings to meet you is on but without any strength on my >part--is AzhwAr's declaration. > >"en nAn seigEAn yArEA kaLai kaN, unnAl allAl yAvarAlum, voNRum kuRai >vEANdEAn" thiru -voi mozhi 5-8-3--> No efforts or credit on my part to >reach on my part;You are the one to salvage me. > >"pUvAr kazhalgaL, aru vinaiyEAn, porundhumARu puNarAyEA" thiru voi mzohi >6-10-4--> >You have to lead me to a stage where I reach your divine feet. > >"mei amar kAdhal" --> thiru voi mozhi 6-8-2--> This stand by AzhwAr is due >to extreme devotion apart from other things mentioned hereinabove-mighundha >bhakthi. > >(to be continued) >vanamamalai padmanabhan > > > > > > > > > >(to be continued) >vanamamalai padmanabhan > > > > > > > > > > >______________________ >______________________ > >Message: 11 > Sun, 15 Feb 2004 22:51:57 -0800 (PST) > srinivasa chary <srinivasadasa >Re: Re: Sandhya/Gayathri related > >Dear Sri Kasturi Rangan, > This question appears to me as an unjustified >conclusion from Sriman Venkatesan's post. To me it >appears more like a caution against forgetting the >more imporatant issue of Bhagavadkainkaryam (in Sri >Ramanuja Sampradayam) in our enthusiasm for >"Sandhyavandanam". Probably this may lead us in to >more controversial corridors. What is the significance >of "Nityakarmas" for any vedantic tradition in pursuit >of "Moksha"? While there is general agreement on >necessity of "Nityakarmas" as ordained by >Dharmasastras across wide spectrum of vedantic >traditions, does any tradition attribute more >importance to these as an aid to attainment of >"Moksha"? Isn't it necessary that the "Nityakarmas" >should be put in their proper perspective, instead of >treating them as a "be-all-and-end-all" for mumukhu as >Sri Ramachandran seems to imply? > Kindly note that these points are raised more >with an intention to learn than to question. Forgive >me for any misinterpretation. >Regards, >Srinivasadasa >--- amshuman_k <amshuman_k wrote: > > Dear Sri Venkatesan, > > Kindly clarify whether the life incident of bhattar > > is quoted as an > > injunction to TK VaishNavas for the non-performance > > of sandhya? > > Regular performance of nityakarmas are typically > > ordained by dharma > > sUtras of one's vedic affiliation (it may appear in > > grhya sutras in > > some cases; smrti digests elaborate the dharma > > sUtras). > > > > From my limited understanding rAmAnujAchArya never > > attempted to > > tamper the dharma sUtras, veda pramANas and the > > associated > > paraphernalia (and even sanctions sacrifice of goat > > in the context > > of yAgas in his gIta bhAshya). > > > > If I am right, the ashtAdasha bheda nirNaya > > discusses about > > nithyakarmas - "whether an evolved sould will go to > > hell if he > > doesn't perform them": yes -> vadakalai; no -> > > thenkalai, however > > the evolved soul should continue to do them as an > > example for others. > > This is a non question for unevolved souls! > > > > Accept my apologies if I've commited any mistakes or > > was offensive. > > > > Regards, > > Kasturi Rangan > > > > ramanuja, TCA Venkatesan > > <vtca> wrote: > > > Sri: > > > Srimathe Ramanujaya Nama: > > > > > > Dear Sri Ramachandran, > > > > > > While it is good to see your enthusiasm for > > performing > > > sandhyavandanam, the following lines are puzzling. > > > > > > > It is therefore, extremely critical and > > mandatory > > > > for the Sandhya to be performed without fail. It > > > > > > is quite surprising that Shri Vishnu has > > > > questioned the efficacy of Sandhya and perhaps > > > > thinks of replacing the Sandhya with 'namaa' > > > > chanting. Come what may, the Sandhya is a nitya > > > > karma ordained by the Vedas and no one is > > excused. > > > > Dilution of Sandhya requirements are therefore > > out > > > > of question. One may dilute all other rituals, > > > > worship etc. but not the Sandhya. > > > > > > Is it your stand or our pUrvAchAryas stand that > > > other rituals and even worship can be 'diluted' > > > but not the sandhyavandanam. Is there any pramANam > > > for this stance? > > > > > > Of course, the sastras themselves excuse many from > > > > > performing the sandhya. So, how is that you say > > that > > > no one is excused? Or do you mean only those that > > > are eligible for it. > > > > > > Certainly our acharyas did not give up their > > nithya > > > karmas, but only so as to not set the wrong > > example > > > for those who are at the first steps. However, > > there > > > are two things here. I don't think they saw it as > > a > > > mandatory act which is an unforgivable sin when > > > missed, as you are stating ; and they only saw > > > it as a kainkaryam to the Lord and not for their > > > personal benefits. And again, I believe their > > stress > > > was on all nithya karmas and not just the sandhya > > > alone. > > > > > > Guru Paramapara records that Bhattar refused to > > > stop his fan service to the Lord for the sake > > > of doing sandhyavandanam. > > > > > > Pillai Lokacharyar includes the performance of all > > > nithya karmas as one of the sins that the Lord > > > wipes out in the "sarva pApEbhyO" of the Charama > > > shloka. > > > > > > Kindly clarify. > > > > > > adiyEn madhurakavi dAsan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Finance: Get your refund fast by filing > > online. > > > http://taxes./filing.html > > > > > > > > > > Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online. >http://taxes./filing.html > > > >______________________ >______________________ > >Message: 12 > Sun, 15 Feb 2004 19:44:13 +0530 > nsp <aazhwar >AchArya Hrdhayam 158 > > >AchArya Hrdhyam suthram 224 >The Sixth Ten Contd. >AzhwAr's indifference -Removed by the Lord Himself. >"pAdhamEA charaNAkka avaiyEA shEmang koNdu yEAka sindhaiyarAi >thriyakkugaLaiyittu swAbiprAyathai nivEadhithu viLamba rOsham upAyathAlEa >azhiya........" > >Summary: It was seen in the fifth ten that He has bequeathed His divine >feet as the means to reach Him. Accordingly, AzhwAr acknowledged and >followed this meticulously. However, since the Lord did not appear >forthwith, AzhwAr sent messengers thorugh various birds etc. to inform the >Lord that 'here is a woman waiting for You and to be rescued by You alone" >despite failing health. > >Despite this, the Lord Almighty did not present Himself immediately which >resulted in AzhwAr becoming indifferent even after the Lord's presence. >This indifference by AzhwAr facing the other side-praNaya rOsham - was >destroyed by the Lord Himself by His holy feet. > > >pAsuram-s: >The Lord bequeathed His divine feet as the means >"ARu enakku, nin pAdhamEa charaNAgath thandozhindhAi" thiru voi mozhi >5-7-10; > >AzhwAr accepted this completely > >"kazhalgaL avaiyEA charaNAgak koNda kurugur satakOpan" thiru voi mozhi >5-8-11; > >AzhwAr sent messengers to inform the Lord " here is a woman expecting You, >affected by Your Love and affection" > >The thiru voi mozhi 6-1 --vagal pUngazhivAi : > >sending --> kurugu, nArAi, puLLinagaL, annangaL, kuyilgaL,kiLi, vandugaL as >emissaries reflecting the role of AchAryan in making the Lord and the soul >getting together. > >The delay of the Lord resulted in indifference and praNaya rOsham of >AzhwAr. > >This is explained in the next thriu-voi-mozhi "minnidai madavArgaL' 6-2; >What are these? >"pOgu nambE" --> 6-2-1--> Get away; >"pOyirundhu un puLLuvam aRiyAdhavarku vurai nambE" 6-2-3--> Go and tell >your falsehood to people who do not know about You. >"ninmalA nediyAi vunakkEalum, pizhai pizhaiyEa" --> thiru voi mozhi >6-2-7--> You may be the Great one but a mistake is a mistake. > >How was this indifference removed. >"azhithAi vun thiru adiyAl" --> 6-2-9--> The Divine Feet indicating Him >and His beautiful form removed these negative acts and made AzhwAr to >conciliate and settle down with Him. > >(to be continued) >vanamamalai padmanabhan > > > > > > > > > > >______________________ >______________________ > > >azhwAr emberumAnAr jeeyAr thiruvadigalE saranam > >------ > Links > > > > >------ > > _______________ Click here for a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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