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Explain "stupid" versus "not stupid" without using societal laws to define these

terms. in my view, stupidity is in the eye of the society which created the

laws. an action is neither stupid, nor not stupid, until your mind labels it so.

an action is an action is an action. the labeling of an action as "stupid" is

inherently based on societal norms -- we do "not stupid" things to uphold our

"image" of ourselves as being "smart" or "reasonable". This is decision making

based on the selfish motive of gaining the desired result -- namely, what will

people think if i behave this way, or that way. being "righteous" itself is

selfish to some extent -- we are 'righteous' because we deep down seek heaven or

some other un-nameable reward. This 'seeking' implies that we move away from who

we are. That is, we move away from being one thing, to something more

desireable, because we think that something else is "good" or "not stupid" and

that what we are is "stupid" or "not good". This moving away from what we are is

what seems to lead to all the trouble.

....comments?

jai guru datta.

 

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There are 7 messages in this issue.

 

Topics in this digest:

 

1. Re: "Compassion"

Winand Abhelakh

2. Re: "Compassion"

Winand Abhelakh

3. Re: "Compassion"

MadeleineHeiss

4. Re: "Compassion"

Winand Abhelakh

5. Re: "Compassion"

MadeleineHeiss

6. Re: "Compassion"

MadeleineHeiss

7. about Datta Rameshwaram (Manginapudi) in Telugu news paper

Chandra Sekhar Chaganti

 

 

______________________

______________________

 

Message: 1

Sat, 15 Feb 2003 05:19:04 -0800 (PST)

Winand Abhelakh

Re: "Compassion"

 

 

Yes i think spontanous action will be more compassionate. However spontanous

action can also be stupid. And compassion is definitely not stupid.

You wrote: "So no action which is based on 'decision making' can be truly

'compassionate'."

Yes one decides for ones own best interest. However one can aslo decide to do

something compassionate.

Jgd, Win

 

 

 

 

 

Send Flowers for Valentine's Day

 

 

 

 

 

______________________

______________________

 

Message: 2

Sat, 15 Feb 2003 07:27:13 -0800 (PST)

Winand Abhelakh

Re: "Compassion"

 

 

Btw i consider myself to be (very) spontaneous. Then again i now how stupid i

can be sometimes ;)

jgd, Win

Winand Abhelakh wrote:

Yes i think spontanous action will be more compassionate. However spontanous

action can also be stupid. And compassion is definitely not stupid.

You wrote: "So no action which is based on 'decision making' can be truly

'compassionate'."

Yes one decides for ones own best interest. However one can aslo decide to do

something compassionate.

Jgd, Win

 

 

 

 

 

Send Flowers for Valentine's Day

 

 

 

 

Latest News and Additions http://www.dattapeetham.com/additions/new.html

 

Upcomming events at Datta Temple and Hall of Trinity, Baton Rouge, LA

http://www.dattatemple.com/uevents.htm

 

Post message: JAIGURUDATTA

Subscribe: JAIGURUDATTA-

Un: JAIGURUDATTA

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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______________________

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Message: 3

Sat, 15 Feb 2003 11:54:51 EST

MadeleineHeiss

Re: "Compassion"

 

it seems to depend on the definition of "spontaneous",

whether one defines it as impulsive, but still based on ego, i.e. on wishes,

e.g to avoid the undesirable and to get the desirable,

which can of course be "stupid" if one wants to use this relative term,

or whether one, as Pradyumna does, defines it as"having no motive or bias"

which means in my understanding, not motivated by ego, i.e. not motivated by

any wish to get anything desirable or avoid anything undesirable. according

to this second definition, impulsive actions are ego motivated and thus

reactions, and only ego-less action is true action, only ego-less compassion

is true compassion. so is anyone that is not (yet) self-realized, i.e.

ego-less, able to truly act, to show true compassion? according to

Pradyumna´s definition, if I got it right, one would have to say: no

Jai Guru Datta

 

 

 

 

 

 

______________________

______________________

 

Message: 4

Sat, 15 Feb 2003 08:58:17 -0800 (PST)

Winand Abhelakh

Re: "Compassion"

 

 

Yess i think we can be compassionate but we are not-self realised so we cant be

pure in compassion.

Jgd, Win.

MadeleineHeiss wrote:it seems to depend on the definition of

"spontaneous",

whether one defines it as impulsive, but still based on ego, i.e. on wishes, e.g

to avoid the undesirable and to get the desirable,

which can of course be "stupid" if one wants to use this relative term,

or whether one, as Pradyumna does, defines it as"having no motive or bias" which

means in my understanding, not motivated by ego, i.e. not motivated by any wish

to get anything desirable or avoid anything undesirable. according to this

second definition, impulsive actions are ego motivated and thus reactions, and

only ego-less action is true action, only ego-less compassion is true

compassion. so is anyone that is not (yet) self-realized, i.e. ego-less, able to

truly act, to show true compassion? according to Pradyumna´s definition, if I

got it right, one would have to say: no

Jai Guru Datta

 

 

 

 

Send Flowers for Valentine's Day

 

 

 

 

 

______________________

______________________

 

Message: 5

Sat, 15 Feb 2003 12:23:15 EST

MadeleineHeiss

Re: "Compassion"

 

how can we, not self-realized ones, know what it would be like to be without

ego?

does a blind born person know what it is like to see a blue sky? jai guru

datta

 

 

 

 

 

 

______________________

______________________

 

Message: 6

Sat, 15 Feb 2003 13:38:53 EST

MadeleineHeiss

Re: "Compassion"

 

sookti 70 of sookti sangraha says the following about self-realization:

(www.sadguruseva.org), see below. so how do we have to imagine this, as it is

said

"If you have to go to the terrace of your house, you do not reach it by a

jump. You have to use a ladder and climb step by step till you reach."

 

so do we gradually become more and more compassionate, do we react less and

less, and act more and more instead, or do we suddenly become compassionate

(hopefully) some day? it suggests we gradually change by gradually emptying

our minds of thoughts. not all of a sudden, but step by step. jgd.

 

"Self-realization

Self-realization is a state to `Be´ rather than become. When there is

cessation of thoughts and mental activity, the experience of the Self shines

forth. So long as thoughts are there, the Self remains covered by

them.Thoughts are like bubbles upon the surface of the sea (Self). They are

pre-dispositions accumulated through innumerable former births in the chitta

(mind). Their annihilation must be the aim.If you have to go to the terrace

of your house, you do not reach it by a jump. You have to use a ladder and

climb step by step till you reach. Whatever spiritual path, you are given to,

the most important aspect of your saadhana (practice) has to be towards

emptying your mind from thoughts. Once this is accomplished, you will `Be´

-the Self within you will be self-luminous and that is your essential nature.

 

 

- Sri Swamiji

Jai Guru Datta! "

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

> Yess i think we can be compassionate but we are not-self realised so we cant

> be pure in compassion.

> Jgd, Win.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

______________________

______________________

 

Message: 7

Sat, 15 Feb 2003 23:13:34 -0800 (PST)

Chandra Sekhar Chaganti

about Datta Rameshwaram (Manginapudi) in Telugu news paper

 

 

Here is an article about Datta Rameshwaram from Eenadu (Telugu daily newspaper)

 

http://www.eenadu.net/kri4.htm

 

Jaiguru datta

 

Chandru

 

 

 

 

 

Send Flowers for Valentine's Day

 

 

 

 

 

______________________

______________________

 

 

 

Your use of is subject to

 

 

 

______________________________

The centipede was happy quite

until a bird said, in fun,

"Which foot goes after which?"

This raised his mind to such a pitch

he lay distracted in a ditch

considering how to run.

 

 

 

 

Send Flowers for Valentine's Day

 

 

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if mental silence alone is bliss, then, what makes one thought better than

another?

in this case, only freedom from thoughts is true intelligence, love and

compassion.

jai guru datta

 

 

 

 

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it may seem "stupid" to you, as you may want to avoid "bad karma". yet in a

way, wanting to "avoid bad karma" is yet another wish that keeps you caught

in the illusion of maya ...

this may sound provoking, but it´s what Pradyumna is saying in my

understanding.

jgd.

 

"jgd, doing adharmic things is stupid!

sgd, Win

Pradyumna Upadrashta <oneinfinitezero wrote:

Explain "stupid" versus "not stupid" without using societal laws to define

these terms. in my view, stupidity is in the eye of the society which created

the laws. an action is neither stupid, nor not stupid, until your mind labels

it so. an action is an action is an action. the labeling of an action as

"stupid" is inherently based on societal norms -- we do "not stupid" things

to uphold our "image" of ourselves as being "smart" or "reasonable". This is

decision making based on the selfish motive of gaining the desired result --

namely, what will people think if i behave this way, or that way. being

"righteous" itself is selfish to some extent -- we are 'righteous' because we

deep down seek heaven or some other un-nameable reward. This 'seeking'

implies that we move away from who we are. That is, we move away from being

one thing, to something more desireable, because we think that something else

is "good" or "not stupid" and that what we are is "stupid" or "not good".

This moving away from what we are is what seems to lead to all the trouble.

....comments?

jai guru datta."

 

 

 

 

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Share on other sites

jgd, doing adharmic things is stupid!

sgd, Win

Pradyumna Upadrashta <oneinfinitezero wrote:

Explain "stupid" versus "not stupid" without using societal laws to define these

terms. in my view, stupidity is in the eye of the society which created the

laws. an action is neither stupid, nor not stupid, until your mind labels it so.

an action is an action is an action. the labeling of an action as "stupid" is

inherently based on societal norms -- we do "not stupid" things to uphold our

"image" of ourselves as being "smart" or "reasonable". This is decision making

based on the selfish motive of gaining the desired result -- namely, what will

people think if i behave this way, or that way. being "righteous" itself is

selfish to some extent -- we are 'righteous' because we deep down seek heaven or

some other un-nameable reward. This 'seeking' implies that we move away from who

we are. That is, we move away from being one thing, to something more

desireable, because we think that something else is "good" or "not stupid" and

that what we are is "stupid" or "not good". This moving away from what we are is

what seems to lead to all the trouble.

....comments?

jai guru datta.

 

JAIGURUDATTA wrote:Latest News and Additions

http://www.dattapeetham.com/additions/new.html

 

Upcomming events at Datta Temple and Hall of Trinity, Baton Rouge, LA

http://www.dattatemple.com/uevents.htm

 

Post message: JAIGURUDATTA

Subscribe: JAIGURUDATTA-

Un: JAIGURUDATTA

------

 

There are 7 messages in this issue.

 

Topics in this digest:

 

1. Re: "Compassion"

Winand Abhelakh

2. Re: "Compassion"

Winand Abhelakh

3. Re: "Compassion"

MadeleineHeiss

4. Re: "Compassion"

Winand Abhelakh

5. Re: "Compassion"

MadeleineHeiss

6. Re: "Compassion"

MadeleineHeiss

7. about Datta Rameshwaram (Manginapudi) in Telugu news paper

Chandra Sekhar Chaganti

 

 

______________________

______________________

 

Message: 1

Sat, 15 Feb 2003 05:19:04 -0800 (PST)

Winand Abhelakh

Re: "Compassion"

 

 

Yes i think spontanous action will be more compassionate. However spontanous

action can also be stupid. And compassion is definitely not stupid.

You wrote: "So no action which is based on 'decision making' can be truly

'compassionate'."

Yes one decides for ones own best interest. However one can aslo decide to do

something compassionate.

Jgd, Win

 

 

 

 

 

Send Flowers for Valentine's Day

 

 

 

 

 

______________________

______________________

 

Message: 2

Sat, 15 Feb 2003 07:27:13 -0800 (PST)

Winand Abhelakh

Re: "Compassion"

 

 

Btw i consider myself to be (very) spontaneous. Then again i now how stupid i

can be sometimes ;)

jgd, Win

Winand Abhelakh wrote:

Yes i think spontanous action will be more compassionate. However spontanous

action can also be stupid. And compassion is definitely not stupid.

You wrote: "So no action which is based on 'decision making' can be truly

'compassionate'."

Yes one decides for ones own best interest. However one can aslo decide to do

something compassionate.

Jgd, Win

 

 

 

 

 

Send Flowers for Valentine's Day

 

 

 

 

Latest News and Additions http://www.dattapeetham.com/additions/new.html

 

Upcomming events at Datta Temple and Hall of Trinity, Baton Rouge, LA

http://www.dattatemple.com/uevents.htm

 

Post message: JAIGURUDATTA

Subscribe: JAIGURUDATTA-

Un: JAIGURUDATTA

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Send Flowers for Valentine's Day

 

 

 

 

 

______________________

______________________

 

Message: 3

Sat, 15 Feb 2003 11:54:51 EST

MadeleineHeiss

Re: "Compassion"

 

it seems to depend on the definition of "spontaneous",

whether one defines it as impulsive, but still based on ego, i.e. on wishes,

e.g to avoid the undesirable and to get the desirable,

which can of course be "stupid" if one wants to use this relative term,

or whether one, as Pradyumna does, defines it as"having no motive or bias"

which means in my understanding, not motivated by ego, i.e. not motivated by

any wish to get anything desirable or avoid anything undesirable. according

to this second definition, impulsive actions are ego motivated and thus

reactions, and only ego-less action is true action, only ego-less compassion

is true compassion. so is anyone that is not (yet) self-realized, i.e.

ego-less, able to truly act, to show true compassion? according to

Pradyumna´s definition, if I got it right, one would have to say: no

Jai Guru Datta

 

 

 

 

 

 

______________________

______________________

 

Message: 4

Sat, 15 Feb 2003 08:58:17 -0800 (PST)

Winand Abhelakh

Re: "Compassion"

 

 

Yess i think we can be compassionate but we are not-self realised so we cant be

pure in compassion.

Jgd, Win.

MadeleineHeiss wrote:it seems to depend on the definition of

"spontaneous",

whether one defines it as impulsive, but still based on ego, i.e. on wishes, e.g

to avoid the undesirable and to get the desirable,

which can of course be "stupid" if one wants to use this relative term,

or whether one, as Pradyumna does, defines it as"having no motive or bias" which

means in my understanding, not motivated by ego, i.e. not motivated by any wish

to get anything desirable or avoid anything undesirable. according to this

second definition, impulsive actions are ego motivated and thus reactions, and

only ego-less action is true action, only ego-less compassion is true

compassion. so is anyone that is not (yet) self-realized, i.e. ego-less, able to

truly act, to show true compassion? according to Pradyumna´s definition, if I

got it right, one would have to say: no

Jai Guru Datta

 

 

 

 

Send Flowers for Valentine's Day

 

 

 

 

 

______________________

______________________

 

Message: 5

Sat, 15 Feb 2003 12:23:15 EST

MadeleineHeiss

Re: "Compassion"

 

how can we, not self-realized ones, know what it would be like to be without

ego?

does a blind born person know what it is like to see a blue sky? jai guru

datta

 

 

 

 

 

 

______________________

______________________

 

Message: 6

Sat, 15 Feb 2003 13:38:53 EST

MadeleineHeiss

Re: "Compassion"

 

sookti 70 of sookti sangraha says the following about self-realization:

(www.sadguruseva.org), see below. so how do we have to imagine this, as it is

said

"If you have to go to the terrace of your house, you do not reach it by a

jump. You have to use a ladder and climb step by step till you reach."

 

so do we gradually become more and more compassionate, do we react less and

less, and act more and more instead, or do we suddenly become compassionate

(hopefully) some day? it suggests we gradually change by gradually emptying

our minds of thoughts. not all of a sudden, but step by step. jgd.

 

"Self-realization

Self-realization is a state to `Be´ rather than become. When there is

cessation of thoughts and mental activity, the experience of the Self shines

forth. So long as thoughts are there, the Self remains covered by

them.Thoughts are like bubbles upon the surface of the sea (Self). They are

pre-dispositions accumulated through innumerable former births in the chitta

(mind). Their annihilation must be the aim.If you have to go to the terrace

of your house, you do not reach it by a jump. You have to use a ladder and

climb step by step till you reach. Whatever spiritual path, you are given to,

the most important aspect of your saadhana (practice) has to be towards

emptying your mind from thoughts. Once this is accomplished, you will `Be´

-the Self within you will be self-luminous and that is your essential nature.

 

 

- Sri Swamiji

Jai Guru Datta! "

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

> Yess i think we can be compassionate but we are not-self realised so we cant

> be pure in compassion.

> Jgd, Win.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

______________________

______________________

 

Message: 7

Sat, 15 Feb 2003 23:13:34 -0800 (PST)

Chandra Sekhar Chaganti

about Datta Rameshwaram (Manginapudi) in Telugu news paper

 

 

Here is an article about Datta Rameshwaram from Eenadu (Telugu daily newspaper)

 

http://www.eenadu.net/kri4.htm

 

Jaiguru datta

 

Chandru

 

 

 

 

 

Send Flowers for Valentine's Day

 

 

 

 

 

______________________

______________________

 

 

 

Your use of is subject to

 

 

 

______________________________

The centipede was happy quite

until a bird said, in fun,

"Which foot goes after which?"

This raised his mind to such a pitch

he lay distracted in a ditch

considering how to run.

 

 

 

 

Send Flowers for Valentine's Day

 

 

 

 

Latest News and Additions http://www.dattapeetham.com/additions/new.html

 

Upcomming events at Datta Temple and Hall of Trinity, Baton Rouge, LA

http://www.dattatemple.com/uevents.htm

 

Post message: JAIGURUDATTA

Subscribe: JAIGURUDATTA-

Un: JAIGURUDATTA

 

Your use of is subject to

 

 

 

 

 

 

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this is no problem of mine, clear it in your own mind whether you agree with

what Pradyumna has stated or not. jgd.

 

 

> I'm not wishing anything im "saying" that doing adharmic things is stupid ;)

>

> Sgd, W.

>

 

 

 

 

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I'm not wishing anything im "saying" that doing adharmic things is stupid ;)

Sgd, W.

..

..

..

 

MadeleineHeiss wrote:

it may seem "stupid" to you, as you may want to avoid "bad karma". yet in a

way, wanting to "avoid bad karma" is yet another wish that keeps you caught

in the illusion of maya ...

this may sound provoking, but it´s what Pradyumna is saying in my

understanding.

jgd.

 

"jgd, doing adharmic things is stupid!

sgd, Win

Pradyumna Upadrashta <oneinfinitezero wrote:

Explain "stupid" versus "not stupid" without using societal laws to define

these terms. in my view, stupidity is in the eye of the society which created

the laws. an action is neither stupid, nor not stupid, until your mind labels

it so. an action is an action is an action. the labeling of an action as

"stupid" is inherently based on societal norms -- we do "not stupid" things

to uphold our "image" of ourselves as being "smart" or "reasonable". This is

decision making based on the selfish motive of gaining the desired result --

namely, what will people think if i behave this way, or that way. being

"righteous" itself is selfish to some extent -- we are 'righteous' because we

deep down seek heaven or some other un-nameable reward. This 'seeking'

implies that we move away from who we are. That is, we move away from being

one thing, to something more desireable, because we think that something else

is "good" or "not stupid" and that what we are is "stupid" or "not good".

This moving away from what we are is what seems to lead to all the trouble.

....comments?

jai guru datta."

 

 

 

 

 

Latest News and Additions http://www.dattapeetham.com/additions/new.html

 

Upcomming events at Datta Temple and Hall of Trinity, Baton Rouge, LA

http://www.dattatemple.com/uevents.htm

 

Post message: JAIGURUDATTA

Subscribe: JAIGURUDATTA-

Un: JAIGURUDATTA

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Jgd, yes i agree with Rao JI that we should constanly think of Sri Swamiji. The

Great Shankaracharya says in Sri Guru Ashtakam..if you dont constantly

concentrate on the feet of Guru ..then you are stupid.

..

Further if you check the subject of this mail ..then one can conclude that

adharmic actions are stupic :) i think that is very simple.

..

Now compassion(daya) is about being spontaneous but not stupid :) or adharmic.

One can act more compassionate by acting more selfless, this is however..

logical.

..

One becomes more selfless by following closely Sadguru. Very easy to say but one

has to offer oneself and that is not easy AT ALL!!!!!! So first we offer little

part of ourself and we grow so that we can offer ourselfes completely.

..

By studying Sri Guru Gita we can learn how to offer oneself to Sadguru...we can

learn from Sri Guru Gita how to obtain Guru Krupa. Now two verses on Guru

Krupaa and service to Guru.

..

Verse 82..Guroh krupaa prasaadena Brahma Vishnu Maheshwaraah / Samaarthaah

tatprasaadohi kevalam Guru sevayaa // = It is with the grace of Guru, the

Trinity of Godhead became capable of creation, preservation and destruction.

Those who serve Guru alone get the grace of the Trinity.

..

Verse 16 .. Dehi brahma bhavedyasmaat Tadidaaneem prakaashaye / Sarva paapa

vishuddhaatmaa Guroh paada sevannaat // = When one falls upon the feet of the

Guru, and serves him, his sins will be washed off and his mind gets purified.

Then he becomes a part of the godhead. So the .. p a n a c e a.. is the

service at the feet of the Guru.

 

 

 

 

 

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Dear Win et al., Jaya Guru Datta!

 

Please allow me to make a couple of humble commnets. I am not as

knowlegeable as you are all, but feel like offering my two cents worth.

 

"Stupid" and "Wise" are extreme terms. All those who have a Sadguru are on

Wisdom path. No one other than the mighty master, the Viraat Purusha, has a

"wisdometer" to gauge how stupid or wise the rest are.

 

Quoting from the famous Guru Ashtakam - you indicated:

"The Great Shankaracharya says in Sri Guru Ashtakam..if you dont constantly

concentrate on the feet of Guru ..then you are stupid." - Shankaracharya did

not use the word "stupid," rather he suggested, despite what ever else we

might be doing ... our stature, erudite scholarship in all scriptures,

enormous wealth, a beautiful wife, international recognition, etc., all

might be of no avail (tatah kim? tatah kim? tatah kim? tatah kim?).

 

I really don't know if there are many who could truly differentiate between

wise and stupid. If somebody announces he/she is wise, obviously he/she is

wrong for the wise never say they are wise. The wise simply meditate upon

the lotus feet of their Sadguru, silently, as you accurately mentioned.

 

I trust that the use of the word "stupid" is inappropriate for all engrossed

on the dharmic path.

 

Sri Guru Datta!

 

Satyam Upadrashta

 

 

 

-

"Winand Abhelakh" <dhiyoyonahprachodayat

<jaigurudatta>

Monday, February 17, 2003 7:32 PM

Re: "stupid" actions vs "not stupid" actions

 

 

>

> Jgd, yes i agree with Rao JI that we should constanly think of Sri

Swamiji. The Great Shankaracharya says in Sri Guru Ashtakam..if you dont

constantly concentrate on the feet of Guru ..then you are stupid.

> .

> Further if you check the subject of this mail ..then one can conclude

that adharmic actions are stupic :) i think that is very simple.

> .

> Now compassion(daya) is about being spontaneous but not stupid :) or

adharmic. One can act more compassionate by acting more selfless, this is

however.. logical.

> .

> One becomes more selfless by following closely Sadguru. Very easy to say

but one has to offer oneself and that is not easy AT ALL!!!!!! So first we

offer little part of ourself and we grow so that we can offer ourselfes

completely.

> .

> By studying Sri Guru Gita we can learn how to offer oneself to

Sadguru...we can learn from Sri Guru Gita how to obtain Guru Krupa. Now two

verses on Guru Krupaa and service to Guru.

> .

> Verse 82..Guroh krupaa prasaadena Brahma Vishnu Maheshwaraah /

Samaarthaah tatprasaadohi kevalam Guru sevayaa // = It is with the grace of

Guru, the Trinity of Godhead became capable of creation, preservation and

destruction. Those who serve Guru alone get the grace of the Trinity.

> .

> Verse 16 .. Dehi brahma bhavedyasmaat Tadidaaneem prakaashaye / Sarva

paapa vishuddhaatmaa Guroh paada sevannaat // = When one falls upon the feet

of the Guru, and serves him, his sins will be washed off and his mind gets

purified. Then he becomes a part of the godhead. So the .. p a n a c e a..

is the service at the feet of the Guru.

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in my opinion Pradyumna has said that all judgemental thoughts are always

relative, always depending on a reference frame. whereas Truth is absolute.

Thus truth cannot be reached by a relative means. what is dharma and what is

not? e.g. a mother is going to give birth to a child. now the doctor says

that he can save the life only of either the mother or the child.

so is it adharmic to let the mother die? some would say so. is it adharmic to

let the child die? some others would say so. some might say it is not ok to

torture animals for scientifical purposes, as animals are our brothers and

sisters and even humans can be reborn as animals. others might say it is ok

as it serves a higher purpose than the animals lives.

and so on. some might say if someone insists on committing suicide,

especially when having an incurable disease and a lot of pain, it is ok. ot

hers might say it is still a great sin. some say it is important to do

research with embryo stem cells, others say it is a sin.

it depends on the cultural and religious background, it always depends on a

reference frame.

and because the backgrounds are different, there are wars and other

conflicts. -

Truth doesn´t depend on any reference frame. That´s why Swamiji advised us to

become mentally still, you remember the quote, Mauna and even more ... jgd.

 

 

 

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Pradyumna has said:

> "...being "righteous" itself is selfish to some extent -- we are 'righteous'

> because we deep down seek heaven or some other un-nameable reward. This

> 'seeking' implies that we move away from who we are. That is, we move away

> from being one thing, to something more desireable, because we think that

> something else is "good" or "not stupid" and that what we are is "stupid"

> or "not good". This moving away from what we are is what seems to lead to

> all the trouble."

 

I agree with this totally. Even within our minds there is usually constant

conflict, e.g. I want to eat chocolate,but I shouldn´t, as it is not healthy.

I should prepare for my exam, but I don´t feel like doing so. I should be

more this or that, I should be less this or that ...

These constant inner conflicts create thought waves, which in a way, add to

the confusion in the world. So the world´s state in a way can be considered

to be the sum of all our constant inner conflicts, of our constant judging,

condemning and justifying. As all is one, the world is no different from us,

the world´s confusion is our own confusion.

These conflicts cause friction on an invisible level (although you can of

course see qualities of thought waves, e.g. in an EEG,

electroenzephalogramme), and this friction takes away energy which we could

use instead for turning inwards, turning to the Source, to the Self. Jai Guru

Datta.

 

from Sadguru Sookti Sangraha, Sookti 34:

 

"Harmony – Inner and Outer

If you are in harmony within yourself, the entire outside world will also be

in harmony. If you see conflicts outside, it is your inner conflict, which on

projection, sees conflicts outside.In the grand scheme of Mother Nature,

there is a beautiful arrangement for everything. Nature has not caused any

conflict anywhere. It is human mind which creates and sees conflict. The more

you see conflict or talk about it, the more power you are giving to it. Look

at everything as a consequence, but hold on to the Cause; as nothing happens

without a cause. Your mind will be restful and you will be at peace, when you

submit yourself to the higher principles of existence – that for everything

–

visible and invisible, there is the Cause behind. Without being distracted,

you should live your life in devotion, faith and surrender, and let your mind

not see any conflict anywhere.

 

- Sri Swamiji

Jai Guru Datta! "

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Jgd..i know the Great Shankaracharya did not say stupid :) ...He said what is

the use of wealth etc etc if you dont have faith in SadGuru(if you dont have

faith in Sadguru you are stupid...this is the context of the discussion).

..

I'm not saying "anyone" is stupid. I was making a statement in relation to the

discussion. That adharmic actions should be destroyed(so they are stupid). I am

only responding to these questions perhaps that could be called stupid :) for i

should observe silence.

..

Sri Swamiji said in His divine Sri Marakata RajaRajeshwari Devi Speech:

Adharmamo Naashanamo naashanamo. This means as you all might know that adharmic

actions should be destroyed.

..

Btw i hope you guys are not thinking that i think i'm knowledgable or wise or

something i'm just discussing. That is a good thing isnt it? Reflection on

things is very neccesary.

..

Ok ...Jai Guru Datta!

Win

 

 

 

 

 

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