questions: narakamarga; and dvaita versus advaita; Kali and Krshna

[Guest guest]

Learned Sir,

Namaste!

When discussing the quaint philosophical peculiarities of some of the

Gaudiya Vaishnavas, you said (post 786):

"Though it is admitted that the forms are identical in terms

of `tattva' (essence), they differ in `rasa' or more complete

manifestation of the capabilities. All these concepts are not only

totally against Tattvavâda, but are classified as major sins

(`nava-vidha dveshha' -- indicating the nine forms of hatred of the

Supreme Being, by denying His unique greatness and freedom from all

defects and limitations) which lead to eternal hell."

 

Would you please tell us, what are the other eight manifestations of

hating the Supreme One?

 

Also, in that post you contrast ISKON's teachings with those of the

Tattvavadins. Is that just because you wanted to compare one school

of

dvaita with another, or do you perhaps think that dvaita philosophy

has won

the debate, that is, do you think it superior to advaita? I do not

wish to stir up dissension, especially since the site is primrarily

oriented toward devotion to Ma. I should say,for myself, I feel more

attracted to advaita -- but I could not advance even a single

argument to defend

myself! For me, who am not knowledgeable in these matters, it's a

matter of preference based on emotion, almost like the choice of

istadevatta. Now, there must have been many great debates beween

dvaitins and

advaitins, and between different scools of advaita. Please tell us

something about this.

 

Thirdly, you mention Kuliga Kali was worshipped by Sri Rama. Is it

true that in the Mahabharata, Krishna and his whole family worshipped

Kali? If it is true, how do Gaudiya Vaishnavas explain

this?

 

Jai Kali!

[Guest guest]

Namaste Patrick,

 

 

> When discussing the quaint philosophical peculiarities of some of

the

> Gaudiya Vaishnavas, you said (post 786):

> "Though it is admitted that the forms are identical in terms

> of `tattva' (essence), they differ in `rasa' or more complete

> manifestation of the capabilities. All these concepts are not only

> totally against Tattvavâda, but are classified as major sins

> (`nava-vidha dveshha' -- indicating the nine forms of hatred of the

> Supreme Being, by denying His unique greatness and freedom from all

> defects and limitations) which lead to eternal hell."

>

> Would you please tell us, what are the other eight manifestations

of

> hating the Supreme One?

 

We would discuss this on length on our Narada Bhakthi Sutra

discussion later.

>

> Also, in that post you contrast ISKON's teachings with those of the

> Tattvavadins. Is that just because you wanted to compare one school

> of

> dvaita with another, or do you perhaps think that dvaita philosophy

> has won

> the debate, that is, do you think it superior to advaita?

 

 

None is superior to another but they are steps leading to the

highest ideal of perfection. Could we say the first step in the

ladder is superior to the next step . No we cant . Advaita, dvaita

and also viswhvadvaita are all paths along the

finality .Explaination given by Sri Ramakrishna in Gospel would be a

good help.

 

I do not wish to stir up dissension, especially since the site is

primrarily oriented toward devotion to Ma. I should say,for myself, I

feel more attracted to advaita -- but I could not advance even a

single argument to defend myself!

 

 

Bhakthi and Jnana exist side by side . So dont worry you not stirring

things rather strengthening them. You attraction are based from your

perception which is fine and you need not argue with words which are

also limitied in certain sense . ISKCON's creed request arguement to

convince other's but the inner meaning of Sankaracharaya and other

acharya going around preaching was not to win by arguement ( common

mistakes made by modern commmentators) but actually to compare

contrast their system of beleif and experience in contrast to other

system available then . It is not to establish superiorty but to

strengthen the experience within ( comparing with experiences in the

world). So the scope is to learn more in one's own path not to stop

others form their path

 

For me, who am not knowledgeable in these matters, it's a

> matter of preference based on emotion, almost like the choice of

> istadevatta.

 

 

Then you are incline more towards bhakthi yoga. Please read Narada

and Sandilaya Bhakthi Sutra

 

Now, there must have been many great debates beween

> dvaitins and

> advaitins, and between different scools of advaita. Please tell us

> something about this.

 

There are myriads way of looking at a chameleon.Learn all of them and

dont worry they would all drop once the mind stops it's chattering .

But learn first then discard. A lot of people are lazy to learn and

say all this is unnnecessary. The beggar cannot say it would be

futile to be rich man. He have not experience it . He do not know

until he becomes rich.But at the highest point all this would drop by

itself. The husk would leave the rice once it matures. Then you would

realise as Ramprasad sings , Who knows thy true

nature ............Even the six darsana fail to reveal you ...........

 

 

Darsanas are the 6 philosophical formulation in Hindu philosophy.

Gospel would be a good start .For me vishawadavaita, dvaita and

advaita are steps towards the goal and further separation within are

stones that strengthen each steps to be taken on them . There are all

there to lead you to the door-final goal that is beyond any mental

speculation

 

> Thirdly, you mention Kuliga Kali was worshipped by Sri Rama. Is it

> true that in the Mahabharata, Krishna and his whole family

worshipped Kali? If it is true, how do Gaudiya Vaishnavas explain

> this?

 

I do not see any scriptural reference to this in Mahabharat, even if

there is gaidiyai Vaishnavas need not worry as even Lord krishna have

all that worship would finally would only come . It is clear no

matter which form you worship it would only finally reach the

Ultimate Supreme Being that is the Personality of Godhead himself.And

Lord Krishna is the Supreme Personality of god head at this instance .

 

 

Jai Kali!!!