Guest guest Posted December 3, 2002 Report Share Posted December 3, 2002 Hi, I didn't hear back from anyone? So I'm reposting! Sat Nam Anyone know how the Aquarian sadhana mantras were originally intended to be chanted, if any? There are so many CDs with musician's own interpretations and some of them really seem to be a bit farther away from what I would consider The Source (The Naad, etc...) than others... At my local group sadhana, we are talking about doing a practice one of these weeks where we chant them "Tibetan" style -- you know, more of a monotone recitation than singing them. Well, one person thought they were intended to be done this way originally, another thought they HAD to be sung because this is a form of Laya Yoga -- not sure exactly what she meant by that as there are Laya practices where the chanting IS monotone, not sung -- but ANYWAY we are in discussion about it, and so I'd love to hear what you know. Thanks so much! Ek ong kar sat gurprasad ranjit k. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 3, 2002 Report Share Posted December 3, 2002 Dear Ranjit Kaur, Hey, folks if you don't get your answer, ask again. > Anyone know how the Aquarian sadhana mantras were originally intended > to be chanted, if any? Yogi Bhajan gave us the "words" sounds on a piece of paper and said do this for this amount of time. Then as was cusomary, the musicians got together and made musical versions. He used to give mantras at Solstice and give the musicians 1 to 2 hours to come up with music. There are so many CDs with musician's own > interpretations and some of them really seem to be a bit farther away > from what I would consider The Source (The Naad, etc...) than> others... I totally agree. Some of them work for me and some of them turn me off completely. And this is different for everyone. Some people get high off the ones that irritate me. Of course, in my humble opinion these are the ones farthest away from the naad, with rock beats and synthetic music. At my local group sadhana, we are talking about doing a practice one > of these weeks where we chant them "Tibetan" style -- you know, more > of a monotone recitation than singing them. Monotone is always good. Then you really have to do them and not just listen to the music. I think the biggest issue is that if you are just absorbed in the music you are not enunciating the sounds or really listening to the sound inside your head. Mantra is the science of yoga of the mouth. > Well, one person thought they were intended to be done this way > originally No. But this was certainly acceptable. The har hare harey wha he guru was often done monotone. , another thought they HAD to be sung because this is a > form of Laya Yoga No. These chanting versions are not what I understand as Laya yoga which as you said can and often is not sung. Sat Nam, Gururattan Kaur Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 4, 2002 Report Share Posted December 4, 2002 Sat Santokh Singh in San Leandro told me that Yogi Bhajan said to him that to truly derive maximum benefit from Sadhana is to chant the sounds and simultaneously understand and even experience what they mean... syllable for syllable (which implies some study for most of us who didn't grow up with Gudwara teaching us Gurmukhi) and I agree with Rattana that getting hung up on the music is counter productive, however... My hands down favorite Sadhana is 4:30 am in San Leandro ashram living room with Sat Santokh's wife Prabu Nam Kaur (who is a wonderful musician and student of Gurmukhi) just playing the harmonium and setting simple melodies to the chants that sound as if she'd heard them in India at some point. The harmonium is hypnotic and makes it easy to find harmonies. If there are any number of participants the chant becomes a beautiful multipart harmony as though the melody has a life of its own...but if it gets too ornate PNK always takes it back to the simple. No wonder Sat Santokh says he's not missed a Sadhana in tens of years. When I think of Sadhana with them it makes me believe that "God loves us when we sing", but it also seems to be important that the mantras stay with you throughout your day so the music must support the deep ingestion of the mantras. Just my $.02 Sat Nam, Danese On Tuesday, December 3, 2002, at 08:34 PM, Gururattan K.Khalsa wrote: > Monotone is always good. Then you really have to do them and not just > listen to the music. I think the biggest issue is that if you are just > absorbed in the music you are not enunciating the sounds or really > listening > to the sound inside your head. Mantra is the science of yoga of the > mouth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 4, 2002 Report Share Posted December 4, 2002 Well said! Both your and Gururattan's comments hit the mark, for me. Simple melodies and music that support the ingestion of the mantras. Letting yourself have a feeling about it brings us to the right brain, while understanding the meaning makes it even much more powerful because we engage our left brain in a connected way. There are new opportunities in this mix. Really KNOWING the meaning is conducive to letting it speak for itself. When I come to chant with some of these new Sadhana CDs I really try to not react to the music. My energy is put into simply resonating, enunciating and projecting. If I got into how far away something is from the Naad, I'd never do group Sadhana. I "bring my own weather". I make it a good Sadhana (and play what I think works when I lead it). And after all these years I am still not sure of the proper pronunciation of tat one line in "Wah Yantee". Is it "Taysha" or "Traysha"? Anyone got some deep and irrefutable knowledge to drop on me? Dharam P.S. Shakti Parwha said (in not so many words) to save the ornamental harmonies for Gurdwara. Danese Cooper wrote: > and I agree with Rattana > that getting hung up on the music is counter productive, however... > > My hands down favorite Sadhana is 4:30 am in San Leandro ashram living > room with Sat Santokh's wife Prabu Nam Kaur (who is a wonderful musician > and student of Gurmukhi) just playing the harmonium and setting simple > melodies to the chants that sound as if she'd heard them in India at > some > point. The harmonium is hypnotic and makes it easy to find harmonies. > If > there are any number of participants the chant becomes a beautiful > multipart > harmony as though the melody has a life of its own...but if it gets too > ornate > > be important that the mantras stay with you throughout your day so the > music must support the deep ingestion of the mantras. > > Just my $.02 > > Sat Nam, > Danese Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 4, 2002 Report Share Posted December 4, 2002 Sat Nam, Gururattan Kaur! Thank you so much for your wonderful and enlightening reply! I teach my first "professional" Kundalini yoga class tonight, how exciting! I owe alot of my inspiration to teach, to you and Dharam and Sadhant Singh and so many others on this list. You are all Bountiful, Blissful and Beautiful, don't go changing that now ya hear?! ;p Prem Ranjit Kaur Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 4, 2002 Report Share Posted December 4, 2002 > line in "Wah Yantee". Is it "Taysha" or "Traysha"? Anyone got some deep and irrefutable knowledge to drop on me? > Dharam Good question, and one that came up at the Master's Touch course as a matter of fact! The official answer from our trainers there is : TREYSHA (Traysha). I don't know the Gurmukhi for the number 3 (anyone?) but in Sanskrit (which is usually pretty close) it is Tri (adj) -- Trini (ord.) -- Tritiya (card.)... so it makes sense to me to have the "tr" in there. Don't know if this is deep, or irrefutable, though!!! ranjit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 4, 2002 Report Share Posted December 4, 2002 > . Is it "Taysha" or "Traysha"? Tray, as in three. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 5, 2002 Report Share Posted December 5, 2002 This is somewhat a pretentious issue in the world of Kundalini Yoga. There are three types of mantra. One is japa/naam simran, which is the outloud or silent use of mantras as in a kind of recitation. Second is the laya yoga fashion, which has a specific melody or combination of tones which are distinct from that of singing of songs. The third is kirtan, as in gurbani kirtan, which is an even more complex combination of tones that appears to be very close to singing. It is not. They are all naad, albeight sometimes complex naad. The goal is to find the naad and create music that support the naad and the particular level of complexity involved. To be quite honest, that is often not achieved, though the songs and music produced can still be very nice and elevating and have their own benifits, as all devotional music is stirring to the heart and elevating to the soul. Seva Simran ~ ranjit kaur ~ (elle) wrote: > Hi, I didn't hear back from anyone? So I'm reposting! > > Sat Nam > > Anyone know how the Aquarian sadhana mantras were originally intended > to be chanted, if any? There are so many CDs with musician's own > interpretations and some of them really seem to be a bit farther away > from what I would consider The Source (The Naad, etc...) than > others... > > At my local group sadhana, we are talking about doing a practice one > of these weeks where we chant them "Tibetan" style -- you know, more > of a monotone recitation than singing them. > > Well, one person thought they were intended to be done this way > originally, another thought they HAD to be sung because this is a > form of Laya Yoga -- not sure exactly what she meant by that as there > are Laya practices where the chanting IS monotone, not sung -- but > ANYWAY we are in discussion about it, and so I'd love to hear what > you know. > > Thanks so much! > > Ek ong kar sat gurprasad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 5, 2002 Report Share Posted December 5, 2002 Dear Seva Simran, Then how is one to choose ? How are we to know which versions are closer to the Naad ? Avtar ______________ Sign Up for Juno Platinum Internet Access Today Only $9.95 per month! Visit www.juno.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 5, 2002 Report Share Posted December 5, 2002 Good question; unfortunately there is no simple answer. If you learn the mantra(s) and start chanting with the tape as a backdrop to your own effort you will discover after a while that the naad begins to come to you as a natural consequence. At that point you will start noticing that some tapes support you better than others. With the good tapes the rythyms should be good and the pronunciation should be accurate but you still might end up chanting with a slightly different tone. Copy the pronunciation and the pacing but add the naad. The idea is to use the tape to support you; not the other way around. As a general rule, don't learn chanting from tapes - learn it from a group or with simple mantras first until you understand the naad and can feel yourself get into it then use the tapes if you want to. If you are not sure then listen to tapes other people have or the samplers available on-line and see if you can chant to them. Seva Simran Avtar Kaur wrote: > Dear Seva Simran, > > Then how is one to choose ? How are we to know which versions are > closer to the Naad ? > > Avtar > > ___________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 6, 2002 Report Share Posted December 6, 2002 Sat Nam, I feel that Yogi Bhajan has turned us loose so to speak to chant the mantras in many differenent ways because in fact there are an infinite number of ways to tune into the infinite. If you are chanting the mantras you are doing Naad yoga. Connection with the Diivine sound opens the upper chakras. The big trick is how to integrate the cosmic sound current into the physical vibration of the body and open the heart. This is done through the emotional body. It is a delicate process to merge sound into the physical. Different music will do for different people. It is a personal choice to find the music (1) that turns you on, (2) that you can stay present to in your own body and (3) that you feel the integration of the sound current into your emotional body. Grounding spirit is our task. It is easy to fly away into the ethers and check out, but then who is going to make lunch? It is a very special time, when all us yogis of the past get to figure out how to do the spiritual path as householders with real jobs, families and many, many distractions. And we many not have other practitioners next door, so we may have to learn on our own and with tapes. I live in much gratitude for the electronic age, i.e. we are all included wherever we are. Isn't this fun? Sat Nam, Gururattan Kaur Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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