Guest guest Posted October 20, 2005 Report Share Posted October 20, 2005 To everyone: I know the term "recovery" is used a lot from AA and other venues. But it no longer reflects your yogic life! Your true self is not in recovery, it is already whole and infinite! The only part of you in recovery is your personality. Your soul is not diseased. If you learn to speak from your infinite self and from your soul, you will avoid staying suck in diseases and other things. You will learn to see yourself whole, not matter what is happening to your personality or how much your personality is disturbed... A change of perspective is required... but that is a change to your true self... Best wishes!!! Awtar S. Rochester, NY Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 20, 2005 Report Share Posted October 20, 2005 Sat Nam to all, I am very grateful to have found Kundalini Yoga and to have the opportunity to participate in teacher training. This process is a part of the healing of my physical being, my emotional being, my ego, the parts of me that walk about from day to day and relate to self and others. I know my soul, my true essense, is absolutely complete. I was created a perfect being. I will always be a perfect being. Right now, in this manifesation of my perfect being, I have a disease. As the result of that disease I have many walls, many blocks to that true essense. I need all the help the universe has to offer and I want to feel free to use any and all of them which provide me a path to that perfect essence. Recovery, as used in 12 Step Programs, is one of the tools I am fortunate to have available. I don't have to utilize one way or the other. My yogic life is my recovery life. I am blessed. joan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 20, 2005 Report Share Posted October 20, 2005 Sat Nam everyone, Awtar - your second paragraph puts it perfectly! I have been focussed on cultivating this mind set throughout 2005. Recently, but only v recently (past 2 months), I have felt a slight shift in this direction. It is tough trying to reprogramme years of dualistic thinking but at the same time exciting to feel a sense of expansion and unity. Thanks for the reminder/inspiration to keep it up. Much love & light, Aleta, Sydney Kundaliniyoga, <kundalini_yoga@h...> wrote: > > To everyone: > > I know the term "recovery" is used a lot from AA and other venues. But it no > longer reflects your yogic life! Your true self is not in recovery, it is > already whole and infinite! > > The only part of you in recovery is your personality. Your soul is not > diseased. If you learn to speak from your infinite self and from your soul, > you will avoid staying suck in diseases and other things. You will learn to > see yourself whole, not matter what is happening to your personality or how > much your personality is disturbed... A change of perspective is required... > but that is a change to your true self... > > Best wishes!!! > > Awtar S. > > Rochester, NY > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 21, 2005 Report Share Posted October 21, 2005 Dear Joan: Far from me to suggest that you cannot do other things than yoga to help you! My piece on recovery is you can't at the same time say: I am in recovery and I am whole. You have to choose. As you experience more and more of yourself from your infinite nature, the personality struggles and "recoveries" shed off more easily! Blessings, Awtar > I need all the help the universe has to offer and I want to feel free > to use any and all of them which provide me a path to that perfect essence. > Recovery, as used in 12 Step Programs, is one of the tools I am fortunate to > have available. I don't have to utilize one way or the other. My yogic life is > my recovery life. > > I am blessed. > joan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 21, 2005 Report Share Posted October 21, 2005 Sat Nam Atwar, Are you saying that as long as I identify as an alcoholic and acknowledge that I have the disease of alcoholism, that I am not whole? I can grasp this disease not affecting my infinite being. But, to think that I will think myself cured or no longer need to practice the principles of my Program are frightening. Thank you for this conversation. Joan On Friday, October 21, 2005, at 05:24AM, <kundalini_yoga wrote: >Dear Joan: > >Far from me to suggest that you cannot do other things than yoga to help >you! >My piece on recovery is you can't at the same time say: I am in recovery and >I am whole. >You have to choose. As you experience more and more of yourself from your >infinite nature, >the personality struggles and "recoveries" shed off more easily! >Blessings, >Awtar > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2005 Report Share Posted October 22, 2005 Sat Nam Joan, Thanks for asking further until my words are clear to you! In answer to your question that if you identify with a disease then you are not whole. No, you are still whole. Because of your identification you can't feel the wholeness, you can only pretend to know it. It creates an inner conflict. There's a part of you that knows you are whole but it keeps receiving the message from this other part of you that you are something other that whole. This conflict creates another problem: shame, a sense of being less than, or something else, I don't know for you what it might be. it depends on the individual. The real problem is that by identifying with any disease we put our true self on hold until we are no longer diseased. This may be blunt, or it may be subtle. We don't move forward freely with all our power. To answer the 2nd part of your message, I am not saying not to practice the 12 step program or any of the principles. I suggest to practice them while holding your space of wholeness as though you were there to help a dear friend who needs help. This friend is your personality and you humbly and innocently don't know why it is having its problems, so you are there following the principles to retrain this personality to see things differently. Part of it is to see that it is more whole than it thinks and to let or open up to your wholeness. But to do this you need to be able to feel it so you can have a communication between the you that is whole and the personality that doesn't think it is. A different perspective. I have been in touch with people who practice a form of healing which involves letting the light stream of God flow through oneself at least twice a day for 5 or 10 minutes each time. They call themselves the circle of friends of Bruno Groening. A man who had been abusing alcohol for 20 some years chose to join the group to be healed from alcoholism. These people learn not to identify with the disease. They learn to think of the disease as coming from evil. We are not used to this. But it works because they don't identify with it and so they can allow it to go away. What happens when people practice this healing is that their bodies go through pain and aches as the toxins and the disease leave the body. It is like an exorcism. It is an interesting phenomenon. So it was with this man. It took 3 full days of pain in his throat (it felt to him like it was tightening up) so much that he asked God to still help him but to lessen the pain. He trusted that this pain was the release of the disease. During the whole time he had no desire for alcohol due to his throat feeling the way it did and due to his commitment and his prayers. The 4th day, the pain completely disappeared and never came back. He found himself a new man, as if his drinking habit was from a previous life, a different existence. It's been a couple of years now and he has not felt any desire for alcohol whatsoever. His personality is not even possessed by alcoholism anymore, it is truly healed. So I believe in AA principles except for the one principle where they say that you have to think of yourself as an alcoholic for the rest of your life. Experiences from others who chose to let it go prove that it just isn't true! I hope this clarifies what I am trying to convey. Deep blessings, may you be healed, completely! Awtar Rochester, NY Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 23, 2005 Report Share Posted October 23, 2005 Sat Nam Atwar, Thank you, again, for your clarification. In my experience, AA works in the same manner as the circle of friends of Bruno Groening. I have found the focus to be on achieving a psychic change and a connection with God, as the result of the 12 steps, which removes the obsession to consume alcohol and allows change in personality. Whether that is accomplished by feeling the light of God stream through one while sitting in meditation or while participating in a meeting, the result must be similar. Once that change has occurred, the sense of guilt and shame, the feelings of being less than, begin to disappear, behavior changes. we are recovered. We can then use our past experience to help the next person who walks through the door. We hold the space for those who still suffer. As far as continuing to identify as an alcoholic, I would have to ask one question; what would happen if Bruno Groening took a drink? I believe that no matter how beautifully God has removed the obsession with alcohol, no matter how many days, weeks or years it has been since the thought of drinking crossed my mind, if I have just one drink, I am back where I began or worse. I am, therefore, an alcoholic. Is it not grand to be able to disagree? I truly value your words and that you have taken the time to express your experience. Much love to you, Joan On Saturday, October 22, 2005, at 10:30 AM, kundalini_yoga wrote: > Sat Nam Joan, > > Thanks for asking further until my words are clear to you! > > In answer to your question that if you identify with a disease then > you are > not whole. No, you are still whole. > Because of your identification you can't feel the wholeness, you can > only > pretend to know it. It creates an inner conflict. There's a part of > you that > knows you are whole but it keeps receiving the message from > this other part of you that you are something other that whole. > This conflict creates another problem: shame, a sense of being less > than, or > something else, I don't know > for you what it might be. it depends on the individual. The real > problem is > that by identifying with > any disease we put our true self on hold until we are no longer > diseased. > This may be blunt, > or it may be subtle. We don't move forward freely with all our power. > > To answer the 2nd part of your message, I am not saying not to > practice the > 12 step program or any of > the principles. I suggest to practice them while holding your space of > wholeness as though you were > there to help a dear friend who needs help. > This friend is your personality and you humbly and innocently don't > know why > it is having its problems, so > you are there following the principles to retrain this personality to > see > things differently. Part of it is > to see that it is more whole than it thinks and to let or open up to > your > wholeness. But to do this you need > to be able to feel it so you can have a communication between the you > that > is whole and the personality > that doesn't think it is. > > A different perspective. I have been in touch with people who practice > a > form of healing which involves > letting the light stream of God flow through oneself at least twice a > day > for 5 or 10 minutes each time. > They call themselves the circle of friends of Bruno Groening. A man > who had > been abusing > alcohol for 20 some years chose to join the group to be healed from > alcoholism. These people learn not to > identify with the disease. They learn to think of the disease as > coming from > evil. We are not used to this. > But it works because they don't identify with it and so they can allow > it to > go away. What happens when people > practice this healing is that their bodies go through pain and aches > as the > toxins and the disease leave the body. > It is like an exorcism. It is an interesting phenomenon. So it was > with this > man. It took 3 full days of pain > in his throat (it felt to him like it was tightening up) so much that > he > asked God to still help him but to lessen the pain. He trusted that > this > pain was the release of the disease. During the whole time he had no > desire > for > alcohol due to his throat feeling the way it did and due to his > commitment > and his prayers. > The 4th day, the pain completely disappeared and never came back. He > found > himself a new man, as if his drinking habit > was from a previous life, a different existence. It's been a couple of > years > now and he has not felt any desire for alcohol whatsoever. > His personality is not even possessed by alcoholism anymore, it is > truly > healed. So I believe in AA principles > except for the one principle where they say that you have to think of > yourself as an alcoholic for the rest of your life. Experiences from > others > who chose to let it go prove that it just isn't true! > > I hope this clarifies what I am trying to convey. > > Deep blessings, may you be healed, completely! > Awtar > Rochester, NY > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 31, 2005 Report Share Posted October 31, 2005 >joan richards <joancarol >Kundaliniyoga >Kundaliniyoga >Re: Kundalini Yoga recovery! >Sun, 23 Oct 2005 11:39:42 -0700 > >Sat Nam, I have been reading the conversation and was interested. I know >that the practice of Sat Rayam oh , I am not sure how to say it. But it is >a sense of always remembering that you are perfect and whole, especially in >God's eyes. You can be at an AA meeting or cleaning your toilet or in my >case have a sick child puking on you all night! But to hold the sense of >stillness and the Godforce I am in these situations defines me only as >whole. It is a lesson I continually come home to and relearn. So thanks for >helping me back to remembrance. Your true self is whole and free of that >takes you from this, for it is truly your true nature. Elaine _______________ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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