A question...

[Guest guest]

Nama Shivaya,

Dear friends,

Apropos the recent posting about "Bomb them with butter.."

 

....I wish very much they would alleviate the suffering of those people. I

had been desperately hoping they would even before this crisis happened.

There was enough information about what the Taliban was doing, how the women

were starving and badly treated (to say the least), how the mortality rate

among Afghani women in childbirth was the highest in the world, how one out

of every 5 kids under four died, the list is endless. Maybe God heard the

prayers of those starving mothers and brought them a powerful (though

somewhat scary perhaps!) ally to face down their oppressors. We conveniently

ignored this suffering (except to hand out money...$132 million in aid to

Afghan last year, and $3 billion in the years before that to search out,

organize and build up these same terrorists...) before it became to our

advantage to acknowledge it as a validation for war.

 

Be that as it may, America has suffered terribly herself in these last few

weeks...and Great Good (as the Native American seer said) may come out of

this yet.

 

The thing is that the govt. that causes this misery is so entrenched within

the fabric of the common suffering people, how do you bring comfort to one,

while trying to root out the other one? Kind of like when a mouth has some

teeth that are rotten and need to be removed, it's hard to feed the healthy

ones food while this operation is carried out. Rather a goofy example...but

the best I can think of.

 

I was reading the Bhagavad Gita recently, and was struck by Arjuna's words as

he rejects war as unworthy of him. He says that let them kill me, I will not

fight. Krishna urges him to war (this is the Lord!), saying that all these

people are already dead, Arjuna, you are merely my instrument. Act you must,

he says, but act with detachment. He also talks of the greatness of a just

war. My question (after rambling through all this...sorry, Peter, for the

political bit, I am really trying to understand my spirituality in the

context of recent events) is:

 

Is there a just war in this world anymore, and if so, how do we know that it

is one? While Bush is part of the Supreme Consciousness too ) , his word

that this is a just war doesn't rank with Krishna's...

 

Any thoughts?

Usha

[Guest guest]

Dear Usha,

 

Thank you for your words of wisdom. I always enjoy

your thoughtful posts. The only thing I can say is

that I think one has to decide if the horrible acts

of last Tuesday were "acts of war." I have to agree

with our president that they were.

 

So very, very sad this was done,

Jyotsna

 

 

--- DJUM wrote:

> Nama Shivaya,

> Dear friends,

> Apropos the recent posting about "Bomb them with

> butter.."

>

> ...I wish very much they would alleviate the

> suffering of those people. I

> had been desperately hoping they would even before

> this crisis happened.

> There was enough information about what the Taliban

> was doing, how the women

> were starving and badly treated (to say the least),

> how the mortality rate

> among Afghani women in childbirth was the highest in

> the world, how one out

> of every 5 kids under four died, the list is

> endless. Maybe God heard the

> prayers of those starving mothers and brought them a

> powerful (though

> somewhat scary perhaps!) ally to face down their

> oppressors. We conveniently

> ignored this suffering (except to hand out

> money...$132 million in aid to

> Afghan last year, and $3 billion in the years before

> that to search out,

> organize and build up these same terrorists...)

> before it became to our

> advantage to acknowledge it as a validation for war.

>

> Be that as it may, America has suffered terribly

> herself in these last few

> weeks...and Great Good (as the Native American seer

> said) may come out of

> this yet.

>

> The thing is that the govt. that causes this misery

> is so entrenched within

> the fabric of the common suffering people, how do

> you bring comfort to one,

> while trying to root out the other one? Kind of

> like when a mouth has some

> teeth that are rotten and need to be removed, it's

> hard to feed the healthy

> ones food while this operation is carried out.

> Rather a goofy example...but

> the best I can think of.

>

> I was reading the Bhagavad Gita recently, and was

> struck by Arjuna's words as

> he rejects war as unworthy of him. He says that let

> them kill me, I will not

> fight. Krishna urges him to war (this is the

> Lord!), saying that all these

> people are already dead, Arjuna, you are merely my

> instrument. Act you must,

> he says, but act with detachment. He also talks of

> the greatness of a just

> war. My question (after rambling through all

> this...sorry, Peter, for the

> political bit, I am really trying to understand my

> spirituality in the

> context of recent events) is:

>

> Is there a just war in this world anymore, and if

> so, how do we know that it

> is one? While Bush is part of the Supreme

> Consciousness too ) , his word

> that this is a just war doesn't rank with

> Krishna's...

>

> Any thoughts?

> Usha

>

 

 

 

 

Get email alerts & NEW webcam video instant messaging with Messenger.

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[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/21/01 12:26:17 PM Pacific Daylight Time,

jyotsna2 writes:

 

<< The only thing I can say is

that I think one has to decide if the horrible acts

of last Tuesday were "acts of war." I have to agree

with our president that they were. >>

******************************************************************************

 

********************

Satsang in Amritapuri Friday, 14 September 2001

Question and Answer session with Amma

 

Q: Worldly life has lost its attraction but spiritual joy is out of reach -

painful situation it is?

A: It is a positive sign of progressing spirituality when worldly life loses

its luster.

If you are not consumed with world - you will do things to help others with

seva and money.

 

When you try to overcome lust, anger etc… these efforts are taking us to the

Goal.

 

When attraction decreases its like tree dropping its leaves. Flowers will

come soon. Spiritual progress is very subtle but we are surely progressing.

Every good action is taking us ahead. We must have persistent efforts.

Don't think about progress, keep focused, do your best. Example: A man was

swimming in a river. The flow suddenly became fast because the nearby dam

was released. Man was frantically moving hands and legs to swim back but not

moving an inch. Slowly the flow became smooth and he swam to the bank. He

tried his best frantically and persistently and that saved his life.

Amma says with persistent effort surely we will reach our goal. We are not

subtle enough to gage our spiritual progress. It is like flying in a plane,

we can't feel how fast we are flying.

 

Q: We are worried about world crisis.

A: Amma is pained by recent developments where so many people lost their

lives. It is not only America that is affected - the whole world is

affected, all are pained by this. There was a feeling in US that not even a

fly could enter without their knowledge. The U.S. has been like the police of

the world. This shows that no place in the world is secure. We can never be

sure we are safe and secure. The next moment is not in our hands; only the

present moment is in our hands. Due to the criminal actions of some, many

innocent people are suffering. The seed of this vengeance has to go from

within. Even if hatred is only in a few, it can affect all. We can pray for

those people to learn respect and love - pray for all. Love to come into

them.

 

America tried to help invaded nations. This attitude caused hatred towards

America and now they are retaliating (the neighboring bigger countries are

hating America). We can only pray for them to gain right understanding. We

cannot blame any whole religion or community.

 

About the people who died - their prarabdha was for them to go like ripe

leaves on a tree - an eagle sits on tree and suddenly all leaves drop. The

falcon makes the leaves shed, but they were ready to fall. The soul left the

body but Atman is eternal. Amma is worrying about their near and dear ones

who are suffering. We can pray that at present all do good actions so nobody

suffers in the future.

 

"War is not a solution to any problem." In war so many innocent people are

killed. It will come back in one way or another. We cannot say this is

return Karma to America. Amma says the attitude of hatred and vengeance has

to go. It is never a solution to any problem. There are developments that

are happening which indicate a war might happen. So many innocent people

will lose their lives. It could culminate in a 3rd World War. We can pray

for all countries that nobody suffers anywhere.

 

There is a lot of anger boiling inside of the citizens of America because the

buildings attacked were their signs of prosperity. There is an intense fire

burning inside people. We can pray their fire inside dies down and pray

terrorism leaves forever. Amma says retaliation will not do anything

productive. Pray for Americans to get comfort and inner solace. If there is

any action from America, those on the receiving end will not sit quiet - they

will also try to do something in return. Amma is really worried at what will

happen. Since many nights Mother has not slept. We needn't blame a nation

or religion. Some people have fanatic attitudes. If a doctor gives medicine

that is wrong for the patient - you cannot blame the company that

manufactures the medicine - blame the doctor who gave the wrong prescription.

 

Q: Kali Yuga - Are we at the start or end?

A: Kali Yuga is in us; the cycle is in us. Amma says if you have right

attitude you can find time to think of God. People are one-pointed on the TV

these days or to buy tickets at the cinema. The goal is there - we can keep

our mind focused on God whatever age we are in. The attitude matters.

Suffering is only in this world because of "I" and "mine" - the ego - NO

SUFFERING in Gods world. We have become blind. In a village everyone wants

to be a king. What kind of village will this be? Take for example a child

crying for a doll and who has tantrums to get a doll. He or she goes on 10

hours like this and gets the doll. Now the child falls asleep and drops the

doll. When we find God the desires fall away. In deep sleep you don't think

about your family. When we transcend ego there is peace and harmony in the

world.

 

Amma says she cannot have any hatred towards any people. Mahatmas cannot do

it. Amma loves all. She cannot be otherwise. (One only thing we can do is

pray, Amma says.) Mahatmas are a gentle breeze that comforts all. Amma prays

the situation gets better for all.

 

Pray for peace in the world.

 

(Amma kept emphasizing to pray pray pray for the world.)

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/22/01 2:06:02 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

adarl52357 writes:

 

<< America tried to help invaded nations. This attitude caused hatred towards

America and now they are retaliating (the neighboring bigger countries are

hating America). We can only pray for them to gain right understanding. We

cannot blame any whole religion or community. >>

 

I read this and this sounds spooky...what neighboring countries? canada and

mexico?

Om Namaha Shivaya

malati

[Guest guest]

> Take for example a child

> crying for a doll and who has tantrums to get a doll. He or she goes on 10

> hours like this and gets the doll. Now the child falls asleep and drops

> the

> doll. When we find God the desires fall away.

Amma--you are so perfect! What a beautiful and childlike way to look at

Self-Realization. Om Amriteshwariye Namaha~

Love,

Across time and space,

Vandya

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

These are Amma's words, I assume She is referring the Middle eastern

countries.

[Guest guest]

Hi Colette:

 

> Is it ok to share Amma's words here on another list? I do not wish to,

> if they are private for devotees.

>

 

Whatever you feel will benefit someone, please share! If in doubt, check with

the author of the email you wish to quote.

 

Om Amrtesvaryai Namah.

 

Peter White

Alachua, Florida

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/25/01 1:21:45 PM Pacific Daylight Time,

colette writes:

 

<< Is it ok to share Amma's words here on another list? >>

I think it's fine

-Amalia-

[Guest guest]

Is it ok to share Amma's words here on another list? I do not wish to,

if they are private for devotees.

 

Love,

 

Colette

 

Ammachi, adarl52357@a... wrote:

 

> Satsang in Amritapuri Friday, 14 September 2001

> Question and Answer session with Amma

>

> Q: Worldly life has lost its attraction but spiritual joy is out of

reach -

> painful situation it is?

> A: It is a positive sign of progressing spirituality when worldly

life loses

> its luster.

> If you are not consumed with world - you will do things to help

others with

> seva and money.

>

> When you try to overcome lust, anger etc… these efforts are taking

us to the

> Goal.

>

> When attraction decreases its like tree dropping its leaves.

Flowers will

> come soon. Spiritual progress is very subtle but we are surely

progressing.

> Every good action is taking us ahead. We must have persistent

efforts.

> Don't think about progress, keep focused, do your best. Example: A

man was

> swimming in a river. The flow suddenly became fast because the

nearby dam

> was released. Man was frantically moving hands and legs to swim

back but not

> moving an inch. Slowly the flow became smooth and he swam to the

bank. He

> tried his best frantically and persistently and that saved his life.

 

> Amma says with persistent effort surely we will reach our goal. We

are not

> subtle enough to gage our spiritual progress. It is like flying in a

plane,

> we can't feel how fast we are flying.

>

> Q: We are worried about world crisis.

> A: Amma is pained by recent developments where so many people lost

their

> lives. It is not only America that is affected - the whole world is

> affected, all are pained by this. There was a feeling in US that

not even a

> fly could enter without their knowledge. The U.S. has been like the

police of

> the world. This shows that no place in the world is secure. We can

never be

> sure we are safe and secure. The next moment is not in our hands;

only the

> present moment is in our hands. Due to the criminal actions of

some, many

> innocent people are suffering. The seed of this vengeance has to go

from

> within. Even if hatred is only in a few, it can affect all. We can

pray for

> those people to learn respect and love - pray for all. Love to come

into

> them.

>

> America tried to help invaded nations. This attitude caused hatred

towards

> America and now they are retaliating (the neighboring bigger

countries are

> hating America). We can only pray for them to gain right

understanding. We

> cannot blame any whole religion or community.

>

> About the people who died - their prarabdha was for them to go like

ripe

> leaves on a tree - an eagle sits on tree and suddenly all leaves

drop. The

> falcon makes the leaves shed, but they were ready to fall. The soul

left the

> body but Atman is eternal. Amma is worrying about their near and

dear ones

> who are suffering. We can pray that at present all do good actions

so nobody

> suffers in the future.

>

> "War is not a solution to any problem." In war so many innocent

people are

> killed. It will come back in one way or another. We cannot say

this is

> return Karma to America. Amma says the attitude of hatred and

vengeance has

> to go. It is never a solution to any problem. There are

developments that

> are happening which indicate a war might happen. So many innocent

people

> will lose their lives. It could culminate in a 3rd World War. We

can pray

> for all countries that nobody suffers anywhere.

>

> There is a lot of anger boiling inside of the citizens of America

because the

> buildings attacked were their signs of prosperity. There is an

intense fire

> burning inside people. We can pray their fire inside dies down and

pray

> terrorism leaves forever. Amma says retaliation will not do

anything

> productive. Pray for Americans to get comfort and inner solace. If

there is

> any action from America, those on the receiving end will not sit

quiet - they

> will also try to do something in return. Amma is really worried at

what will

> happen. Since many nights Mother has not slept. We needn't blame a

nation

> or religion. Some people have fanatic attitudes. If a doctor gives

medicine

> that is wrong for the patient - you cannot blame the company that

> manufactures the medicine - blame the doctor who gave the wrong

prescription.

>

> Q: Kali Yuga - Are we at the start or end?

> A: Kali Yuga is in us; the cycle is in us. Amma says if you have

right

> attitude you can find time to think of God. People are one-pointed

on the TV

> these days or to buy tickets at the cinema. The goal is there - we

can keep

> our mind focused on God whatever age we are in. The attitude

matters.

> Suffering is only in this world because of "I" and "mine" - the ego

- NO

> SUFFERING in Gods world. We have become blind. In a village

everyone wants

> to be a king. What kind of village will this be? Take for example

a child

> crying for a doll and who has tantrums to get a doll. He or she goes

on 10

> hours like this and gets the doll. Now the child falls asleep and

drops the

> doll. When we find God the desires fall away. In deep sleep you

don't think

> about your family. When we transcend ego there is peace and harmony

in the

> world.

>

> Amma says she cannot have any hatred towards any people. Mahatmas

cannot do

> it. Amma loves all. She cannot be otherwise. (One only thing we

can do is

> pray, Amma says.) Mahatmas are a gentle breeze that comforts all.

Amma prays

> the situation gets better for all.

>

> Pray for peace in the world.

>

> (Amma kept emphasizing to pray pray pray for the world.)

[Guest guest]

Om Amriteshwariye Namah,

 

Amma doesn't say NO to anyone for a HUG and Kiss! So we should not

deny Amma's word but (personally) I won't post Amma's message on

different sites because it may offend some people who don't know Amma

well enough. If someone asks I won't hesitate in sharing.

 

We just gotta have intention of Love for all, not taking ownership

but an attitude of detachment towards our achievements/possesions -

just like Krishna told Arjuna in Geeta.

 

At Amma's Lotus Feets,

 

:ekanath

 

Ammachi, colette@b... wrote:

> Is it ok to share Amma's words here on another list? I do not wish

to,

> if they are private for devotees.

>

> Love,

>

> Colette

>

> Ammachi, adarl52357@a... wrote:

>

> > Satsang in Amritapuri Friday, 14 September 2001

> > Question and Answer session with Amma

> >

> > Q: Worldly life has lost its attraction but spiritual joy is out

of

> reach -

> > painful situation it is?

> > A: It is a positive sign of progressing spirituality when

worldly

> life loses

> > its luster.

> > If you are not consumed with world - you will do things to help

> others with

> > seva and money.

> >

> > When you try to overcome lust, anger etc… these efforts are

taking

> us to the

> > Goal.

> >

> > When attraction decreases its like tree dropping its leaves.

> Flowers will

> > come soon. Spiritual progress is very subtle but we are surely

> progressing.

> > Every good action is taking us ahead. We must have persistent

> efforts.

> > Don't think about progress, keep focused, do your best. Example:

A

> man was

> > swimming in a river. The flow suddenly became fast because the

> nearby dam

> > was released. Man was frantically moving hands and legs to swim

> back but not

> > moving an inch. Slowly the flow became smooth and he swam to the

> bank. He

> > tried his best frantically and persistently and that saved his

life.

>

> > Amma says with persistent effort surely we will reach our goal.

We

> are not

> > subtle enough to gage our spiritual progress. It is like flying

in a

> plane,

> > we can't feel how fast we are flying.

> >

> > Q: We are worried about world crisis.

> > A: Amma is pained by recent developments where so many people

lost

> their

> > lives. It is not only America that is affected - the whole world

is

> > affected, all are pained by this. There was a feeling in US that

> not even a

> > fly could enter without their knowledge. The U.S. has been like

the

> police of

> > the world. This shows that no place in the world is secure. We

can

> never be

> > sure we are safe and secure. The next moment is not in our

hands;

> only the

> > present moment is in our hands. Due to the criminal actions of

> some, many

> > innocent people are suffering. The seed of this vengeance has to

go

> from

> > within. Even if hatred is only in a few, it can affect all. We

can

> pray for

> > those people to learn respect and love - pray for all. Love to

come

> into

> > them.

> >

> > America tried to help invaded nations. This attitude caused

hatred

> towards

> > America and now they are retaliating (the neighboring bigger

> countries are

> > hating America). We can only pray for them to gain right

> understanding. We

> > cannot blame any whole religion or community.

> >

> > About the people who died - their prarabdha was for them to go

like

> ripe

> > leaves on a tree - an eagle sits on tree and suddenly all leaves

> drop. The

> > falcon makes the leaves shed, but they were ready to fall. The

soul

> left the

> > body but Atman is eternal. Amma is worrying about their near and

> dear ones

> > who are suffering. We can pray that at present all do good

actions

> so nobody

> > suffers in the future.

> >

> > "War is not a solution to any problem." In war so many innocent

> people are

> > killed. It will come back in one way or another. We cannot say

> this is

> > return Karma to America. Amma says the attitude of hatred and

> vengeance has

> > to go. It is never a solution to any problem. There are

> developments that

> > are happening which indicate a war might happen. So many

innocent

> people

> > will lose their lives. It could culminate in a 3rd World War.

We

> can pray

> > for all countries that nobody suffers anywhere.

> >

> > There is a lot of anger boiling inside of the citizens of America

> because the

> > buildings attacked were their signs of prosperity. There is an

> intense fire

> > burning inside people. We can pray their fire inside dies down

and

> pray

> > terrorism leaves forever. Amma says retaliation will not do

> anything

> > productive. Pray for Americans to get comfort and inner solace.

If

> there is

> > any action from America, those on the receiving end will not sit

> quiet - they

> > will also try to do something in return. Amma is really worried

at

> what will

> > happen. Since many nights Mother has not slept. We needn't

blame a

> nation

> > or religion. Some people have fanatic attitudes. If a doctor

gives

> medicine

> > that is wrong for the patient - you cannot blame the company that

> > manufactures the medicine - blame the doctor who gave the wrong

> prescription.

> >

> > Q: Kali Yuga - Are we at the start or end?

> > A: Kali Yuga is in us; the cycle is in us. Amma says if you

have

> right

> > attitude you can find time to think of God. People are one-

pointed

> on the TV

> > these days or to buy tickets at the cinema. The goal is there -

we

> can keep

> > our mind focused on God whatever age we are in. The attitude

> matters.

> > Suffering is only in this world because of "I" and "mine" - the

ego

> - NO

> > SUFFERING in Gods world. We have become blind. In a village

> everyone wants

> > to be a king. What kind of village will this be? Take for

example

> a child

> > crying for a doll and who has tantrums to get a doll. He or she

goes

> on 10

> > hours like this and gets the doll. Now the child falls asleep

and

> drops the

> > doll. When we find God the desires fall away. In deep sleep you

> don't think

> > about your family. When we transcend ego there is peace and

harmony

> in the

> > world.

> >

> > Amma says she cannot have any hatred towards any people.

Mahatmas

> cannot do

> > it. Amma loves all. She cannot be otherwise. (One only thing

we

> can do is

> > pray, Amma says.) Mahatmas are a gentle breeze that comforts

all.

> Amma prays

> > the situation gets better for all.

> >

> > Pray for peace in the world.

> >

> > (Amma kept emphasizing to pray pray pray for the world.)