Re:Hinduism

[Guest guest]

Namah Shivaya, Avinash,

 

I feel a little stupid now...I just sent you my email before reading my

newer daily digests, and have just caught up on your latest posts. Sorry

that my email is responding to your earlier one. Now it probably seems like

a completely irrelevant response...smile...the last few emails have been on

such a different track.

 

I do agree with Ravi...Len's post (while not fully informed...a sin of which

many may be pardoned, surely) didn't strike me as being very negative to

Hindus. Perhaps you should read it again.

 

A few observations:

 

1) Sanatana Dharma has survived many erroneous impressions and

less-than-fully-realized discussions, starting with ours. It will do so

again.

 

2) Also, I don't think Amma herself can be called Hindu...I do not mean to

anger you by saying this. It is true that she has emerged from the Hindu

tradition (I do know a little of what I am saying here...I did study

religion, philosophy and logic for some years, and am also a Malayali, for

my sins!), but she no longer "belongs" to Hindus, or Christians or anyone

else...she is the mother of the whole world. Or if she is Hindu, then she

is also Christian, Jewish, etc. So also, Ramakrishna Paramahansa, Ramana

Maharishi, Shirdi Sai Baba, etc. They cannot be Hindus, by definition of

being Self-realized...they are beyond ALL religion. As far as I know, Amma

herself does not go to any Hindu temple anymore. She has no need to. When

she institutes temples, she does so in the Hindu style, but only just. She

does them for reasons beyond our ken (probably to invest some of her cosmic

energy in places to maintain the balance of this crazy world). She doesn't

choose priests from the Brahmin sects, she doesn't bar devotees based on

religion (like Guruvayur Temple in Kerala who will not let "non-Hindus" in)

and she encourages women to serve as priests (as they did in Vedic times).

Amma has said herself in my hearing, and I didn't need a translator to

understand her, that all religions are like boats to cross the river, once

you get to the other side, you MUST let go in order to proceed. I don't

think Hinduism was singled out by her to be an amphibious vehicle, therefore

it follows that to get to where she wants us to go, we must not be too

invested in any one religion's claims to supremacy. What good does

proclaiming the greatness of our particular "boat" get us? War and

dissension with others doing the same.

 

3) As I said in my earlier post, I just moved back to live in India after

many years away. I am happy to say that I have set aside the rose-tinted

lenses of nostalgia, so I can try try to live again in my country as an

Indian and as an observer of current Indian values. I agree that there are

great things that Hinduism says. But Hinduism AS IT IS PRACTISED today, and

not by high-minded purists who have read up on Sanatana Dharma, is less than

glorious. True, the RITUAL of spirituality infuses daily life, but not

always the practice of compassion, honesty, charity, and love. Let us not

mistake the comparative simplicity of Indian life for an enlightened

rejection of the "material values of the West". Let me take just one

example. You said

 

>One more thing I am devotee of Kali, my approach of god in dual plane

> (dvaita plane) is feminine. I DON'T FIND NOTHING NOTE WORTHY IN

> ABRAHAMIC RELEGIONS ABOUT FEMININE. Instead god is Male scaring away

> people with primitive HELL and HEAVEN concepts. Its only Sanatana

> Dharma which gives total respect to women which they deseve, only

> religion where god is praised as woman"

 

Hinduism may praise God as woman, but it certainly kicks it around plenty in

real life. I see quite a lot of Hindu girls among the poorer people here in

Hyderabad (capital of Telegu-speaking Andhra Pradesh, for those of you who

don't know) getting married absurdly young...often as much as thirteen.

Many lower class (economically lower class, that is,... before I am jumped

all over for lack of democracy...smile...) Hindus have more than one wife

(so that particular backwardness cannot be laid in just the Muslim dish).

My maid is among them. She didn't know she was being married as a second

wife to her husband, who was much older...she was thirteen. She is

twenty-six now, and has a boy and a girl, 12 and 11. They are Hindu

Brahmins, interestingly enough. A very common story in the villages, so I

am told. And as for dowry...don't even get me started. The lower economic

class (and probably many of the wealthier ones) will not take a bride unless

she comes with a minimum of 20 tolas of gold (about 200 grams or about Rs.

100,000) plus the usual stuff for the house, and often a scooter/motorbike

for the "boy". And of course, demands for dowry lead to hardship for the

family and a less than enlightened view of women, and sometimes to misery

and, maybe death, for the bride. It is a fact of life for many Hindus

living in India today. And in Gujarat, in the NAME of Hinduism, thugs

looted and burned and killed fellow human beings, for the sin of being

Muslim, including, as reported by a UN observer (a saddened and shocked

Hindu, by the way) ripping open a pregnant Muslim woman, etc. The Vishwa

Hindu Parishad (The World Hindu Council) has dragged the name of Hinduism

through the mud, in my opinion. Whose Hinduism are they representing...not

mine, at any rate. Or yours, I think. But where do I stand up to say

this...where is the forum for religious toleration and the moderate

moralist? And where does the good and tolerant and devout Christian (the

non-charismatic kind!) or the similar Jew or Muslim get together to say

this? Probably around people like Amma.

 

Now, you will say none of these practises in Hinduism are endorsed by

Sanatana Dharma or by Sadgurus like the ones you listed, and I will agree.

Hinduism as it is preached by an enlightened soul is perfect. So is

Christianity as preached by Christ. Or, very likely, a score of other

beliefs. But when the ideal is codified and institutionalised in the sphere

of imperfect human activity, the resulting interpretation of religion

becomes less than perfect. It is human institution that corrupts and

taints, but the message is pure and perfect each time. So also is Amma's

Sanatana Dharma, and her message, perfectly followed, will restore purity to

Hinduism, as it will to any other religion. The rest of the mess is just a

result of historical evolution, regional beliefs, political convenience, and

human nature.

 

What do you think?

Usha

 

__________

<Original Message..>

 

Tue, 17 Dec 2002 17:55:09 -0000

> "avinash7_99 <avinash7_99" <avinash7_99

> Re: Curious...

>

> I dont understand your problem, I baffled by your ignorance. FOR

> YOUR KIND INFORMATION SANSKRIT IS NOT DEAD LANGUAGE. Most of the

> classic works in India are written in Sanskrit. Pantanjali Yoga

> sutras, Arthashastra,kama sutra, Upanishads, Vedas. Most of the

> Indian Languages are derived from Sanaskrit. Excuse me for your

> comment! that sanskrit has nothing to with Malayalam. More than 90%

> of Malayalam words are from Sanaskrit. Do you know that Hindi is the

> direct descent form Snaskrit with little bit of change in Devanagari

> script. Most of the Indian languages are updated versions of

> Sanskrit, which being prototype. Your argument is as absurd as

> claiming C language is dead, SINCE now days people only use Visual

> C++, SHOULD I ENLIGHTEN YOU that Visual c++ is derived from C++ and

> C++ from C. So what kind argument would be to claim C as the dead

> language.

> Now regarding to Hinduism, the very term is a misnomer. Coined

> by westners, who labled thier religion as Christianity. Did you find

> the bigotory here. Hindu'ism' is like other 'isms' like capitalism,

> Marxism, Communism which may be accepted or may not be accepted, in

> short it is not perfect. While Cristian'ity' is Like Gravity which

> exists, which is truth, that is Christianity is a perfect religion

> while Hinduism is not. Hinduism was coined after refering to river

> Indus. Everything India, Hindu, Hinduism, Sindh(now in Pakistan) have

> common origin. Its original inhabitants called it Sanatana Dharma,

> which is difficult to translate in English, the nearest meaning could

> be "Eternel rythm of cosmos".

> Now towards your utter contempt regarding Hindus. I really

> don't know what you mean by saying some Christains in New York asked

> Ammachi to give mantra but not to include Hindu stuff. Here is my

> advice to them: Not to use numbers (from 0 to 9) rather use Roman

> numerals(x,v,vi etc), since numbers (0 to 9) are origined in India

> hence Hindu(read heathens since you used 'mlecchas' in your letter)

> don't use them. Dont practice any kind of YOGA since it is from India

> hence Hindu. I want to enlighten those people not use any software

> are computer products because, Hindus did and are doing immense

> research in these feilds. Finally don't ever see Ammachi because she

> is Hindu, and I have a question here why should those Christians met

> Ammachi in first place, they can go for their Pope for a mantra, this

> I can neber understand.

> I am Hindu (I belive in Non-duality(advaita)), you must be

> Christian so I have some serious questions regarding Christians in

> general. Why do Christians bury their body not cremate. Even high

> School student knows that 80% of human body is composed of water,

> similarly blood is made from Haemoglobin, which is Iron. Bone from

> Phosphurus. Protiens from Amino acids which are basically NH2 groups,

> on the whole most of the human body is made from 4 primary building

> blocks carbon, hydrogen,oxygen,Nitrogen. So human body is MATTER,

> once body dies matter goes back to its nature. So why bury that body

> which does'nt make any sense, occupying huge tracts of land make it

> useless. Now they say soul goes to Heaven, if soul is not body

> (matter) it should be formless, ok something formless should be ALL

> PERVADING. IF SOMETHING IS ALL PERVADING where does it go are where

> does it come from. Hence soul going to Heaven is childish prank. One

> more thing is it possible that I can get a Hindu mantra from

> Christian guru say like pope? never, but Ammachi gave christian

> mantra.

> This shows how much Sanata Dharama is fexible unlike all

> ABRAHAMIC RELIGIONS (christianity, Islam, Judaism)arising from middle-

> eastern desert, everyone claiming that only their relgion is perfect.

> Sanatana Dharma never says that, because its appraoch is different

> one pays attention towards his Karma trying to attain perfection. One

> more thing I am devotee of Kali, my approach of god in dual plane

> (dvaita plane) is feminine. I DON'T FIND NOTHING NOTE WORTHY IN

> ABRAHAMIC RELEGIONS ABOUT FEMININE. Instead god is Male scaring away

> people with primitive HELL and HEAVEN concepts. Its only Sanatana

> Dharma which gives total respect to women which they deseve, only

> religion where god is praised as woman.

> I Know this forum is not for religious debate, any how if some

> body as prejudices and misconceptions with anything, its others duty

> to clear their prejudices.

> I AM EAGERLY AND EARNESTLY WAITING FOR REPLY FROM THE CHRISTIAN

> LET US HAVE SOME DEBATE, PLEASE DONT COME WITH BIBLICAL

> INTERPRETATIONS,I AM A COMUTER SCIENCE STUDENT I LIKE TO ARGUE WITH

> ISSUES THAT RELATES TO SCIENTIFIC FACTS AND COMMAN SENSE AND THAT

> CONVINCE ME, MOST OF THE TIME OUR DEBATE SHOULD INVOLVE ANALYSIS AND

> LOGIC, IT SHOULD'NT INCLUDE SOMETHING WRITTEN BY SOMEONE SOME 2000

> YEARS AGO.

>

> from a Hindu

> Avinash Ramidi

> Bridgeport, CT

> Om Namah shivaya!

>

>

>

>

> ______________________

> ______________________

>

> Message: 5

> Tue, 17 Dec 2002 10:26:54 -0800

> "Ravi Chivukula" <ravichivukula

> Re: Re: Curious...

>

> Dear Avinash

>

> Om Namah Shivaya

>

> You have completely misunderstood Len/ Kalipadma's e-mail. You have gotten

upset for no reason it seems. Though some of your concerns are genuine, I am

not sure what her e-mail has to do anything with that.

>

> Peace

> Ravi

> ______________________

>

> Message: 6

> Tue, 17 Dec 2002 11:09:19 -0800

> "Ravi Chivukula" <ravichivukula

> Re: Curious...

>

> Dear Len/Kalipadma

>

> Om Namah Shivaya

>

> Thanks for your e-mail, I enjoyed it. I was not upset by your e-mail, but

I can see why some people might.

>

> You seem to make statements on subjects on which you don't have complete

knowledge with so much confidence that I am surprised. To say that Malayalam

is unrelated language or any other Indian language is unrelated to Sanskrit

is factually incorrect. To say Sanskrit is dead is like saying God is dead,

Sanskrit permeates the daily life of an Indian just as God permeates the

whole existence.

>

> Om Namah Shivaya

> Ravi

> -

>

> Message: 7

> Tue, 17 Dec 2002 12:18:02 -0800 (PST)

> Jami Blakeley <jami108

> Re: Curious...

>

> Sanskrit permeates _my_ daily life, and I'm a good-ole

> Christian-raised lilly-white American.

>

> Jai Kaalii Maa!!!

> --Aravind

>

>

> Message: 11

> Wed, 18 Dec 2002 01:00:35 EST

> Black Lotus L Rosenberg <kalipadma

> Re: Re: Curious...

>

>

> Ravi -- Thank you for coming to my defense.

>

> (You got my gender wrong, however -- I'm a male.)

>

> -- Len (short for Leonard)/ Kalipadma

>

> ______________________

>

> Message: 12

> Wed, 18 Dec 2002 00:56:10 EST

> Black Lotus L Rosenberg <kalipadma

> Re: Re: Curious...

>

>

> Dear Avinash --

>

> Please continue to study Ammachi's teachings. You would especially

> benefit from reading what she says about anger.. Whee-ooo! What a

> temper you have!

>

> ______________________

>

> Message: 13

> Wed, 18 Dec 2002 08:26:52 -0000

> "avinash7_99 <avinash7_99" <avinash7_99

> Re: Curious...

>

> Dear Len! I didn't mean to hurt you, if I did I hope you will pardon

> me. But let me explain my views: IT SEEMS YOU ARE BACK TO SQUARE ONE

> WITH ARYAN AND DRAVIDIAN MYTHS.

> I am a South Indian, but my mother tongue is Telugu. Telugu is 75%

> sanskrit, any telugu person can understand almost every word if ones

> speaks in sanskrit. Infact sounds are so similar between the two

> languages that it is hard to say that they are unrelated. Aryan means

> is not a name of a race but "noble" person. For example all ancient

> seers name would end with arya: Shukrach'arya', shankarach'arya',

> vallabach'arya', Ramunjach'arya'. In fact a teacher is known as

> ach'arya'. Now in Telugu(south Indian language) we call our

> father 'ayyah' which is corrupted form of arya, similarly most of the

> Telugu names would end with ayya like Ramayya, sitaramayya etc. What

> I am trying to explain that south Indians like north would use the

> term arya very much. Now Dravidian if divsion exists it only permits

> to Tamil, which is Sangam. But calling Telugu a distinct language is

> totally baseless. And malayalam is more sanskritised than Telugu, its

> one of the modern languges developed some 1200 or 1400 years ago.

>

> Myth of Aryan invasion theory is long been disproved with

> findings of Harappa,mohenjadaro, Lothal etc. It was intoduced by

> German indologist Max Muller, who was sponsered by the then ruling

> British. Now it is toatally politicalised, so it is hard to shun it.

>

> But can you please explain what do you mean when you say

> that"narrow minded bramacharis travelling with ammachi" and you use

> the term "mlecchah". Who told you that brahmacharis are narrow minded

> and they view weterners as mlecchah. Had you ever been to Amritapuri,

> do you know that what kind of life brahamacharis lead, they have one

> of the tuffest and hardest life. They sleep on the floor, they sleep

> only 3 to 4 hours. Their food is devoid of any taste hardly edible.

> They are always engaged in some work or the other, most of them are

> fresh college graduates in early twenties. Most of them are un

> shaven, staying far away from their parents and relatives and the

> world, they are always working even if they are sick. Any westner who

> had not been to Amritapuri Ashram has no idea about the place. In

> United states amma is only accompanied with some senior swamis that's

> all, but the major chunk stay in India involved in service. For your

> kind information life in India is not as easy as life in United

> states, getting things done by bypassing the obstacles is very

> difficult. Do you have any idea how difficult it is to be a

> brahamachari, every second one should be vigilant of one's own

> thought's, with total detachment to anything in remaining part of

> one's life. Now 'mlecchah" which means "worst then untouchable" so

> according to you this is how renunciates view westeners, PLEASE GIVE

> ME A BREAK. Another intresting term used by you is "charismatic

> christians" can you please explain what kind of "Charisma" these

> people possess others lack.

> You said you are JEWISH. Let me explain something about Judaism

> in India. India is the only country which provided refugee for Jews,

> when both Jihadis and crusaders hated them. They were never tolerated

> from carpet of countries spreading from Morroco to Iran, not to

> forget former soviet republics especially Tajikistan( pariculary in

> Dushanbe its capital). In India they were given full freedom,

> particulary sanatana dharma has nothing that condems other's

> religion. In fact a Hindu Raja of kerela gave them huge tracts of

> land so that they practice their religion. If any damage was done it

> was due to invading portugese who were surprised to see Jews let go

> free. By 1947 , 25000 jews moved to Isreal. But still India has Jews

> (Baghdad(iraqi) jews) particulalry in Thane district of Maharashtra.

> Verily whatever one may say or what ever one may write Sanatana

> Dharma is most flexible, ever rejuvinating, most ancient at the same

> time ultra-modern enriched with incarinations of people like Ammachi,

> Anandmayi maa, Sarada Devi, Swami Vivekanada, Swami Dayananda(arya

> samaj), Ramana Mharshi,Swami Rama, Paramahamsa Yogananda, Sri

> Aurbindo, Sri Ramakrishna Paramahansa, Trilinga swami oh! the list is

> endless.

> Since you are a Jewish\Hindu, there is a beautiful website by a

> Jewish\Hindu yogi called Sankara Saranam (I am his great fan). His

> website is www.pranayama.org , i simply adore his weekly messages.

>

> Avinash Ramidi

> Om namah shivaya!

>

>

>

>

> ______________________

> ______________________

>

> Message: 14

> Wed, 18 Dec 2002 09:28:41 -0000

> "avinash7_99 <avinash7_99" <avinash7_99

> Re: The Myth of Hinduism

>

> Dear rasozoi! I will tell you essence of sanatana dharma in few

> words "realise your Self" your are not the body you are atman(sat-

> chit-ananda) that's it that all. Thanks for your reference, for your

> kind information dalitistan.com is a full fledged Hindu bashing

> website.

> You don't find anything pertaining to self realisation there,

> what you find are the views of a deranged ,hate monger. Those are not

> the views of Self-realised souls like Ammachi or Ramana Maharshi. A

> person is not Brahmin by his birth but by his conduct, is it possible

> to call a person doctor simply because his fathar is a doctor. A

> person is Brahmin if he realises Brahman( absolute), for example

> Ammachi is not born to Brahmin, but she is a realised soul. Similarly

> seer Valmiki was a high way robber ,a ferocious decoit eventually

> changed and written ramayana. Vyasa credited for compiling Vedas was

> born to SATYAVATI she was a daughter of fisherman. The seer of

> chandogya upanishad stya kama jabali,was a son of prostitute jabali.

> Angulimaan who later became monk was a high way robber, who use to

> chop people hands and use to hang them arround his neck, he changed

> after he met Budda. Similarly Tusli das of Ramcharit manas was a

> sensualist who was over attached to his wife,later was fed up of his

> behaviuor later he became staunch devotee of Rama. Radha was a

> devotee of krishna, she was from a shepard's family. Bakhta Kanappa

> the famous devotee of Shiva was a tribal man, the list is endless.

> These are all self realised people who enriched the religion of

> sanatana dharma, they don't come from brahmin's caste, but still they

> are brahmins because they realised brahman. Through out the ages

> Hinduism was seasoned by bakthas every body adding his divine

> flavour, so it does'nt have origin or a particular founder or a

> particular book.

> It is totally ridiculus to call siva was a south Indian god, in

> fact to many shiva temples are found in north india than south. The

> prominent being none other Kashi vishawanath. Amarnath is in Jammu,

> similarly mount kailas and Manas sarovar in Tibet. The biggest Hindu

> Temple in Nepal is Pahupathinath temple. There were numerous siva

> temples in Pakistan before partition, even few hundred hindu people

> still living in Afghanistan are devotees of siva. Entire stories with

> siva are connected with Ganges and Himalyas.

> HINDUISM IN GENERAL HAS NOTHING TO do WITH

> RACE,GENDER,PROFESSION,RELIGION,CASTE what matters is "does one

> relises his Self(atma) his true nature." all the talk besides that is

> grbage.

>

> IF SOME BODY WANT TO KNOW ABOUT HINDUISM PLEASE FOLLOW THE

> TEACHINGS OF A SELF REALIZED SOUL, NOT SOME HEAD STRONG DERANGED

> INTELLECTUAL who is mainly concerned with political,

> superficial,externel happenings.

>

>

> Avinash ramidi

> om namah sivaya.

>

[Guest guest]

Dear Usha, thanks for u mail. I totally agree with what ever you

said, My comparision of abrahamic religion with sanatana dharma was

my reaction to some of the articles posted here like "myth of

hinduism" and "genocide of woman in hinduism" and finally with some

of the utterances like "narrow minded brahmacharis travelling with

amma", thats it,nothing besides that. I had no intention of hurting

anybody.

I really approve to some of the points mentioned in your

posting,like female preists and people from different castes ordained

as preists. In fact I was brought up in such a tradition, Arya Samaj.

My family are followers of this refrom movement,most of my relative

weddings are performed by female priests and not by male preisis,

caste was totally shumnned by my family. As a matter of fact one of

the swamis of Amritapuri Ashram was muslim by birth, he had hard time

from his family for becoming a brahmachari, but with Ammachi's grace

he prevailed, fighting a long battle which took him to supreme court

too, he took the vows of sanatana dharama in an arya samaj temple.

Besides all injustices faced by Indian women in India, there are also

have some advantages like 33% reservation in all educational feilds,

unheard in west.The most important is the supreme executive ,can u

ever imagime a woman becoming United states president, i don't think

it will ever happen not in my life time. But India already had

firebrand prime minister Indra Gandhi, right now the opposition party

is led by Sonia Gandhi, if INC is going to win 2004 lok sabha

elections she will be the prime minister.

So much said why wont we stop here. let us talk about Ammachi and

Kali, specially ur experiences and would like to share my

experiences,without whom I can't imagine my self. The only thing I

really regret is that I had never been to calcutta, and ur brought up

there! U had also been to brahmastanam temple, which I did not hmm! I

envy you in this regard sister, I am just kidding. Did you receive

mantra diksha or not yet and what is your proffesion.

 

shanti shnati shanti

Avinash Ramidi.

[Guest guest]

Namaste dear Lights in Amma's Eyes,

 

 

> So much said why wont we stop here. let us talk about Ammachi and

> Kali,

 

This child has been so touched by what has been happening on our list in the

past several days. Believe the unfoldment has been a good example of

Amma/Kali blessing us all with Her divine leela. Have never seen this

before, where a conflict begins between the children and the grace of the

Mother flows through the children to transform the conflict into more

understanding and kindness.

 

I am at Her feet and your feet. Yes, Amma puts us all together to rub

against each other so that we can all grow spiritually. There are no sides

here. To borrow from a hymn we used to sing in church: In Amma there is no

East or west, in Her no North and South, but one great familyhood throughout

the whole wide earth.

 

We are not here to debate, but to dialogue. I feel so privileged to be able

to listen to the conversations between Avinash and Usha and Manesh, for

example. Such conversations are the gift of a list like ours. It is as if

Amma is teaching us through each other!

 

Just to echo a couple of points:

 

Being in the presence of Amma's brahmacharins at Amritapuri, or even on

tour, is indeed inspiring and humbling. It is like reading sacred text of

any tradition to watch them, and the images of their devotion remain with me

to urge me forward to the goal.

 

And...they are not perfect, have their own negative tendancies, etc.

 

Ignorance is everywhere. Amma tells us to develop right attitude toward

everything, including unkindness, etc. The more we grow in understanding,

the more patient and compassionate we must learn to be with ignorance and

all the edges that make up this world. This child really has to struggle

with that. So easy to develop spiritual ego. What helps me is to remember

how incredibly kind and patient Amma is with all of us, who cannot begin to

fathom what She sees.

 

Thank you all for this very inspiring satsang.

Wish we could figure out a way to sing together!

 

In Amma's grace,

premarupa

Aum Amriteshvaryai Namah

[Guest guest]

Ammachi, Kenna <kenna@m...> wrote:

> Namaste dear Lights in Amma's Eyes,

>

>

> > So much said why wont we stop here. let us talk about Ammachi and

> > Kali,

>

> This child has been so touched by what has been happening on our

list in the

> past several days. Believe the unfoldment has been a good example of

> Amma/Kali blessing us all with Her divine leela. Have never seen

this

> before, where a conflict begins between the children and the grace

of the

> Mother flows through the children to transform the conflict into

more

> understanding and kindness.

>

> I am at Her feet and your feet. Yes, Amma puts us all together to

rub

> against each other so that we can all grow spiritually. There are no

sides

> here. To borrow from a hymn we used to sing in church: In Amma there

is no

> East or west, in Her no North and South, but one great familyhood

throughout

> the whole wide earth.

>

> We are not here to debate, but to dialogue. I feel so privileged to

be able

> to listen to the conversations between Avinash and Usha and Manesh,

for

> example. Such conversations are the gift of a list like ours. It is

as if

> Amma is teaching us through each other!

>

> Just to echo a couple of points:

>

> Being in the presence of Amma's brahmacharins at Amritapuri, or

even on

> tour, is indeed inspiring and humbling. It is like reading sacred

text of

> any tradition to watch them, and the images of their devotion remain

with me

> to urge me forward to the goal.

>

> And...they are not perfect, have their own negative tendancies, etc.

>

> Ignorance is everywhere. Amma tells us to develop right attitude

toward

> everything, including unkindness, etc. The more we grow in

understanding,

> the more patient and compassionate we must learn to be with

ignorance and

> all the edges that make up this world. This child really has to

struggle

> with that. So easy to develop spiritual ego. What helps me is to

remember

> how incredibly kind and patient Amma is with all of us, who cannot

begin to

> fathom what She sees.

>

> Thank you all for this very inspiring satsang.

> Wish we could figure out a way to sing together!

>

> In Amma's grace,

> premarupa

> Aum Amriteshvaryai Namah

 

Kenna,

 

Your comments here are very touching and moving to read. Thanks!

 

Lisa

[Guest guest]

Namah Shivaya dear Lisa,

 

> Your comments here are very touching and moving to read. Thanks!

 

I've been very inspired by your messages as well. About a year ago watched

our list really close down due to a conflict that got us all confused. Of

course it was Amma's leela to teach us some good lessons. May Her grace

continue to guide us all to our precious Selves.

 

Jai Ma!

Aum Amriteshvaryai Namah