Swami explains - The Blitz Interview (September - 1976) with Late Karanjia - Part I

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Swami explains - The Blitz Interview (September - 1976) with Late Karanjia - Part I

Fri, 7 Jun 2002 10:59:19 +0530

Om Sri Sai Ram

When in fear and doubt, pray to Me. Tune in to My Mighty Power, which, compared

to the power of the Sun, which I have placed in the Heavens, is what a baby's

breathing is to a typhoon.

- Baba

The Interview given by Bhagawan Sri Sathya Sai Baba to the Senior Editor, Late

K. Karanjia of Blitz News Magazine in September of 1976:

Sai Baba tells the interviewer that He comes from age to age, whenever strife

and discord threaten to overwhelm the world.

The Interview

R.K. Karanjia, Blitz Newsmagazine: At the outset, Swamiji, we would like to know

something about your triple incarnation -- past, present and future -- that is,

from Shirdi Sai Baba to Sathya Sai Baba and the Prema Sai Baba to come,

according to your prophecy.

Baba: First of all, you must grasp the complete oneness of the three

incarnations of contemporary times with those of the past like Rama and

Krishna. This is a difficult task. When people cannot understand the present,

how can they comprehend the past? Every incarnation is full and complete in

relation to the time, environment and the task. There is no distinction between

the various appearances of God as Rama, Krishna or Sai.

Rama came to feed the roots of truth and righteousness, Krishna followed to

foster the plant of peace and love. Now these sacred principles are in danger

of wholesale destruction by reason of human weakness under the onslaught of

evil forces. They are overcoming the good, the spiritual and the divine in man.

That is why the present Avatar has come invested with the totality of cosmic

power to save dharma (righteousness) from anti-dharma.

Why God Takes Human Form

Q: By the present Avatar, you mean Sai Baba?

Baba: Yes, I incarnate from age to age, time to time, to save dharma from

anti-dharma. Whenever strife, discord and disharmony overwhelm the world, God

incarnates in human form to show mankind the way to love, harmony and peace.

Q: That is understandable. But skeptics wonder why God should assume human form?

Baba: Because that is the only way to incarnate the God within man. The Avatar

takes the human form and behaves in a human way so that humanity can feel

kinship with divinity. At the same time he rises to godly heights so that

mankind also can aspire to reach God. The realization of the indwelling God as

the motivator of life is the task for which Avatars come in human form.

Previous Avatars like Rama and Krishna had to destroy a few individuals who

could be identified as enemies of the godly way of life and thus restore the

dharmic path. Today, however, wickedness has tainted so many that humanity

itself stands under the threat of destruction. Therefore, in My present Avatar,

I have come armed with the fullness of the power of formless God to correct

mankind, raise human consciousness and put people back on the right path of

truth, righteousness, peace and love to divinity.

Message of Triple Incarnation

Q: Why had this task to be divided into three separate incarnations of the

Shirdi, Sathya and Prema Baba?

Baba: They are not separate. I have already mentioned the complete oneness of

the three in the final objective of the mission. I will give you an example.

Take a kilo of gur (a sweet substance). The whole of it tastes sweet. Next

break it into small pieces. Each of them is sweet. Finally break them into

small grains. You find the same sweetness in them. So the difference is one of

quantity and not quality. It is the same with the Avatars. Their tasks and

powers requisite to them differ according to the time, the situation and the

environment. But they belong to, and derive from, one and the same dharma

swarup or divine body.

Let us take the example of fruit. It begins with the seed, which grows into the

tree and from it comes the fruit. Work can be compared to the seed, worship to

the tree and wisdom to the fruit.

The previous Avatar, Shirdi Baba, laid the base for secular integration and gave

mankind the message [that] duty is work. The mission of the present Avatar is to

make everybody realize that the same God or divinity resides in everyone. People

should respect, love and help each other irrespective of color or creed. Thus

all work can become a way of worship. Finally, Prema Sai, the third Avatar will

promote the evangel news that not only does God reside in everybody, but

everybody is God. That will be the final wisdom, which will enable every man

and woman to go to God. The three Avatars carry the triple message of work,

worship and wisdom.

Man Must Develop into Mankind

Q: So that is the holy mission and divine purpose of this triple incarnation?

Baba: To unite all mankind into one caste or family in the establishment of the

unity - that is, Atmic realization - in every man or woman, which is the basis

on which cosmic design rests. Once this is realized, the common divine heritage

that binds man to man to God will become apparent and love shall prevail as the

guiding light of the universe.

In the first place, man has to develop into mankind in the fullness of its

integrated potential. At present mankind as such is absent in the world. There

is no synthesis between thought, word and deed. Man today thinks one thing,

says something different, and acts quite the contrary. So what we have is the

individual man, confused, confounded and bombarded with contradictory thoughts.

What we do not see is mankind in him motivated by good thoughts, good words and

good deeds. We have to make him realize God within him to develop a synthesis

correlating thought, word and deed.

Evangel of Love and Devotion

Once this primary lesson is taught in the family, the school, the college, the

society, the cities, the states, the nations of the world, then man will become

conscious of the fact that all mankind belongs to one family. As Christ

preached, all are one, be alike to everyone. The vital issue is the oneness:

one caste, one class, one creed of humanity: and this can be achieved only by

the surrender of one's self or ego to pure, selfless, universal love and

devotion. Love is the basis, the common denominator, and devotion the divine

spark, the cementing, unifying, integrating factor between man and man, and man

and God.

Let Me give you an illustration. (Baba spreads his handkerchief on the ground

between us). Here is a piece of cloth. As you see, it is all made of threads.

Pull out the threads separately and the cloth becomes weak. Put them together

and it is firm and strong. It is the same with mankind. Love binds it like the

million, billion threads in cloth and devotion reunites it with God. I

therefore embody love and use it as My instrument to regenerate man and create

the brotherhood of mankind with the help of the latter's devotion. I always

say: Start the day with love. Fill the day with love. End the day with love.

This is the quickest way, the surest path to God.

Life is love, enjoy it

Life is a challenge, meet it

Life is a song, sing it

Life is a dream, realize it

Life is a game, play it.

Shirdi Baba Incarnate

Q: Did Shirdi Baba actually claim that he would be born eight years after his death in 1918?

Baba: Yes, he did. This has been recorded by Kaka Dixit as well as a number of

other devotees who were with Shirdi Baba.

Q: What makes you so sure that you are Shirdi Baba incarnate?

Baba: The knowledge of My own authentic experience, of course. Since no one who

knew Shirdi Baba is alive today, there is no evidence except My own knowledge

and experience. The very fact that I announced that I am Shirdi Baba 40 years

ago, when I was only 10 and when nobody in this part of the South had known or

even heard of Shirdi Baba proves this fact.

Dharma (Righteousness) Alone Can Save the World

Q: The existing situation driven by evil forces to destruction as you have

correctly analyzed it, appears to suggest the inevitability of another

Mahabharata-type (an epic relating to the battle of Kurukshetra) war. Does this

mean that the salvation for which you are working can be consummated only after

a destructive war?

Baba: The evil must and shall be removed before such a catastrophe takes place.

There will be minor wars and skirmishes, of course: these cannot be helped in

the existing state of affairs. The Mahabharata war was a different issue

altogether. Lord Krishna decreed it and, in fact, led Arjuna to the battlefield

in order to rid the world of evil men and ungodly forces.

Today, as I told you, the evil is so widespread that humanity itself would be

destroyed in a nuclear holocaust in the event of a world war. It is to prevent

such a catastrophe that this Avatar has come to raise human consciousness above

the existing syndrome of anger, hate, violence and war and save the world from

disaster. This can be achieved only by the reestablishment of the brotherhood

of mankind though the Vedas, Shastras and all religions with their evangel of

dharma to liberate the human race from the chains of karma (the cycle of birth

and death). I always say: Let the different faiths exist, let them flourish,

let the glory of God be sung in all the languages in a variety of tunes. They

should be the ideal. Respect the differences between the faiths and recognize

them as valid so far as they do not extinguish the flame of unity.

God is Man Minus Desire

Q: From what Baba has said, it seems that there is not much difference or

dichotomy between God and man. Am I right?

Baba: Quite right, God is man and man is God. All of us have something of God,

the divine spark, within us. All men are divine like Myself, but with the

spirit embodied in human flesh and bone. The only difference is that they are

unaware of this Godhood. They have come into this karmic prison through the

mistakes of many lives. I have taken this mortal form out of My own free will.

They are bound to the body, while I am free of this bondage. The main

difference is that they are shoved hither and thither by desire but I have no

desire except the supreme one to make them desireless.

Take paddy or rice by way of an illustration. Every grain of rice is enclosed in

a husk. You have to remove the husk to get the grain of rice. Now husk and rice,

both come from the same seed. Rice is the equivalent of God in man, while the

husk can be compared to desire which reduces God to man. Therefore, My formula

is:

LIFE + DESIRE = MAN

LIFE - DESIRE = GOD

To be contd.

 

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